ATF sends same letter to Montana gun dealers

[Anti Federalist]

http://www.examiner.com/x-1417-Gun-Rights-Examiner~y2009m7d19-ATF-to-Montana-You-will-respect-our-authoritah

This is form letter, same as the one sent to TN gun dealers.

[torchbearer]

HAHAHAHAHA!
If I was a state legislator in Montana, I'd call a press conference just to publicly laugh at the ATF.

[Sandman33]

Im buying a high powered Bow and Arrow set.

Worked great for the indians...

[torchbearer]

Im buying a high powered Bow and Arrow set.

Worked great for the indians...

crossbows work great too.
if you are mechanical- ballistas will stop most police vehicles and armor.
http://cdn-write.demandstudios.com/upload//0000/800/50/1/70851.jpg

[Matt Collins]

I have been in contact with Senator Mae Beavers the lady who introduced the bill in TN. She said they are working on the next move.

[torchbearer]

I have been in contact with Senator Mae Beavers the lady who introduced the bill in TN. She said they are working on the next move.

you are all over the place.

[Standing Like A Rock]

I have been in contact with Senator Mae Beavers the lady who introduced the bill in TN. She said they are working on the next move.

Keep up the good work man, you are awesome.

[Kotin]

I have been in contact with Senator Mae Beavers the lady who introduced the bill in TN. She said they are working on the next move.

do alert us to any updates..

[RideTheDirt]

HAHAHAHAHA!
If I was a state legislator in Montana, I'd call a press conference just to publicly laugh at the ATF.
I would do the same, and add that any ATF agents will be arrested if they step foot in Montana.

[Endgame]

Can you imagine the local SWAT ninjas in one of these states arresting ATF JBT's? That would be a sight.

[Sandman33]

Can you imagine the local SWAT ninjas in one of these states arresting ATF JBT's? That would be a sight.

Can you imagine the day Texas Police storm the Bush families home and throw them in jail for war crimes and treason?

[catdd]

I hope Mae knows that there are millions of people behind her.

[Cowlesy]

It'd sure be a scene if ATF guys came in and tried to arrest a FFL holder, and the FFL Holder called the county SHERIFF and had the ATF guys locked up lol

[inibo]

It will be interesting to see how this goes. Are they really going to test the 10th with this?

Governor Brian Schweitzer is a Democrat, right? Wasn't he one of the first ones to kick up a fuss about REAL ID? I'll take a friend where I can find one.


"It's a gun bill, but it's another way of demonstrating the sovereignty of the state of Montana," said Democratic Gov. Brian Schweitzer, who signed the bill.
http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?f=/c/a/2009/05/10/MN4V17BCF2.DTL

[tpreitzel]

Wasn't the BATF's predecessor, Bureau of Prohibition, supposed to disappear with repeal of prohibition, i.e. the 18th amendment, through ratification of the 21st amendment? With the passage of the Gun Control Act of 1968 even more illegal functions were attached to this renegade bureaucratic nightmare.

[Cowlesy]

It will be interesting to see how this goes. Are they really going to test the 10th with this?

Governor Brian Schweitzer is a Democrat, right? Wasn't he one of the first ones to kick up a fuss about REAL ID? I'll take a friend where I can find one.

My guess is it'll go like this. Law Enforcement will side with the Feds. FFL Holders, so not to lose their livelihood, will comply with the ATF so they can continue to operate their business and feed their families.

[Stary Hickory]

Federal Law cannot override State Law. Kick the ATF out of the state.

[SL89]

My guess is it'll go like this. Law Enforcement will side with the Feds. FFL Holders, so not to lose their livelihood, will comply with the ATF so they can continue to operate their business and feed their families.

I am not so sure... We have a Great independent radio station, that has interviewed Law enforcement. Heavily pro-2nd around here.
Montana has found a local manufacturer to produce .22 youth model rifles without applying for BATF approval.(pre- BATF chain letter) This was at the request of the State. Their goal was to bring a challenge from D.C.. They have assembled a pre-prepared legal team, led by the Sec. of State, to challenge all the way to the Supreme Court. (with what I feel is a good use of my tax $). It will be interesting but, MT citizens will be pushed around no longer.
The Governor, Brian Schweitzer, is a liberal through and through. But, He has shown some propensity toward Montana values. He has done more than his republican predecessors. By signing some of the most un-Democratic, pro-state, legislation; he has shown that he is not an Obama worshiper.

[Rael]

Montana will back down.

[catdd]

I hope not. Tennessee is using Montana as a test case and 16 other states are working on the same bill. A defeat in Montana could ruin it all.

[tpreitzel]

A view after the passing HB 246 :

http://www.cnsnews.com/public/content/article.aspx?RsrcID=47369

Personally, Montana is likely serious about taking this case all the way to the Supreme Court. Although I can't find it now, Schweitzer has previously implied that the "unabridged" right to bear arms in Montana was a condition of its entry into the union or words to that effect. Let the Supreme Court rule H 246 illegal and give Montanans a legitimate reason to secede from the union.

[puppetmaster]

I am not so sure... We have a Great independent radio station, that has interviewed Law enforcement. Heavily pro-2nd around here.
Montana has found a local manufacturer to produce .22 youth model rifles without applying for BATF approval.(pre- BATF chain letter) This was at the request of the State. Their goal was to bring a challenge from D.C.. They have assembled a pre-prepared legal team, led by the Sec. of State, to challenge all the way to the Supreme Court. (with what I feel is a good use of my tax $). It will be interesting but, MT citizens will be pushed around no longer.
The Governor, Brian Schweitzer, is a liberal through and through. But, He has shown some propensity toward Montana values. He has done more than his republican predecessors. By signing some of the most un-Democratic, pro-state, legislation; he has shown that he is not an Obama worshiper.

HOW in the hell did you guys vote a liberal in to be Gov????

[t0rnado]

HOW in the hell did you guys vote a liberal in to be Gov????

Schweitzer seems like a libertarian really. He's against gun control and real ID, but wants to remove all troops from Iraq and Afghanistan. Wyoming, which votes 70% Republican during Presidential elections, has a Democratic governor too who won in a land slide. I guess that the parties really don't matter there.

[Matt Collins]

Keep up the good work man, you are awesome.Thank you for the compliments.

[Matt Collins]

do alert us to any updates..I am going to the Tennessee Firearms Association (http://www.tfaonline.org/) tonight to see what they have to say. It'll be the major topic of discussion.

[Matt Collins]

If I was a state legislator in Montana, I'd call a press conference just to publicly laugh at the ATF.Yeah it's ashame we have a Governor in TN (Bredesen) who has refused to sign this bill. He just let it sit on his desk and it automatically became law anyway.

But if we had a governor who actually cared about the rule of law and federalism he would take a stand against the federal government and not allow them to trample the citizens of TN.

[Matt Collins]

I hope not. Tennessee is using Montana as the test state and 16 other states are working on the same bill. A defeat in Montana could ruin it all.
TN modeled their bill after the MT bill. I dont think anyone thought TN would end up being the "test case" but it looks like it just might.

[Matt Collins]

Constitutional Scholar Kevin Gutzman (http://www.facebook.com/kevin.gutzman) posted the following on my Facebook page (http://www.facebook.com/LibertyMatt)yesterday regarding this discussion:



Alas, this is what I said would happen when I discussed it with Judge Napolitano on the Glenn Beck Program: the Federal Government's position is that it is a national, not a federal, government: that it has unlimited legislative power.

It comes down to this: the Federal Government will use force to implement its unconstitutional position, and TN doesn't have force to counteract that. Some executive branch official could attract a lot of media attention by risking or enduring jail for his valid constitutional position, but in the end, the Federal Government will have its way.

... Read MoreThis is why I suggest a recourse to non-cooperation of congressional usurpation pursued via the spending power. I've suggested that multiple states might adopt laws saying that once x of them (10, 15, 20) adopted such legislation, they would all cease accepting No Child Left behind (or some other unconstitutional federal program's) money. A state could actually implement such a policy. It wouldn't involve a military confrontation.

My idea is more radical than that: since most of Congress's mandates to the states take the form of "Do this or we won't give you your share of these funds, which we'll still tax you to help distribute among the other states," the states should cooperate in refusing this kind of funding. I propose that when some number of states agree to do so, ... Read Morethey all stop accepting funding of a particular unpopular program. No Child Left Behind comes to mind because teachers and state legislators across America hate it, yet state legislators are loth to turn down the funds so long as the other states will receive them anyway.

[EastWindRain]

Go guys go.

[tangent4ronpaul]

How about ignoring ALL unfunded mandates, and revising the state tax code so that the percentage of tax sent to the federal government and gotten back for various programs would be deducted from federal taxes and added to state taxes. What could the IRS do? - go after a whole state worth of taxpayers? Several states worth?

That would actually save money - what's wasted in administering collecting and dispersing these fed taxes back to the states.

Then there is the issue of earmarks, which also brings money back to the states. Well, take that off too and let the state decide how to spend it.

Has anyone ever done a study of what unfunded mandates cost states?

-t

[MyLibertyStuff]

Wow this could escalate really quickly lol

[literatim]

They just need to kick the ATF out of the State.

They need to kick the whole federal government out, call up the militia, and make it illegal for the federal government to tax their citizens. Any federal law enforcement within the State would be given the boot.

[MyLibertyStuff]

They just need to kick the ATF out of the State.

They need to kick the whole federal government out, call up the militia, and make it illegal for the federal government to tax their citizens. Any federal law enforcement within the State would be given the boot.

I feel as if this wouldnt work out too well :)

[literatim]

I feel as if this wouldnt work out too well :)

What are they going to do? It is like leaving the Union without actually leaving the Union. The most they could do would be cut off federal funding. I don't think there would be too many complaints from the people, seeing as there is an extra 30% of paychecks coming back to the citizens. If Montana needs money to make up for the loss of federal funding in highways and such, they could easily just increase taxes accordingly.

Not to mention all the SWAT which could be called forth. The federal government militarized our police, now the States can use them.

[MyLibertyStuff]

What are they going to do? It is like leaving the Union without actually leaving the Union. The most they could do would be cut off federal funding. I don't think there would be too many complaints from the people, seeing as there is an extra 30% of paychecks coming back to the citizens. If Montana needs money to make up for the loss of federal funding in highways and such, they could easily just increase taxes accordingly.

Not to mention all the SWAT which could be called forth. The federal government militarized our police, now the States can use them.

Im just thinking the Federal Government wouldnt go for it, especially when you have a much too powerful executive branch who is quoted on wanting to be like Lincoln.

[american.swan]

I hope not. Tennessee is using Montana as the test state and 16 other states are working on the same bill. A defeat in Montana could ruin it all.

No, it is very important to get many states on this. Then multiple federal appeals courts will rule. We need the Federal courts to be confused. We would love all of them to rule on our side, but will they? We can´t rely on just a handful of judges.

[american.swan]

What are they going to do? It is like leaving the Union without actually leaving the Union. The most they could do would be cut off federal funding. I don't think there would be too many complaints from the people, seeing as there is an extra 30% of paychecks coming back to the citizens. If Montana needs money to make up for the loss of federal funding in highways and such, they could easily just increase taxes accordingly.

Not to mention all the SWAT which could be called forth. The federal government militarized our police, now the States can use them.

If there was a serious problem, the state could order their citizens to not pay taxes and order the sheriff to protect them. Then raise taxes a bit to take the federal funds for themselves.

[Stary Hickory]

Im just thinking the Federal Government wouldnt go for it, especially when you have a much too powerful executive branch who is quoted on wanting to be like Lincoln.

So what if the Federal Government wants to behave like a tyrant let it's true colors shine through. I am tired of liberals/statists/neocons acting as if this is a free country.

I want the truth to be out there for all to see. This time around there is no slavery issue which can be used to muddy the reasons for the aggression. It will simply be an overbearing unconstitutional federal government oppressing free people.

And if they want to do this, then let us see them for what they really are. Maybe people will wake up.

[pcosmar]

So what if the Federal Government wants to behave like a tyrant let it's true colors shine through. I am tired of liberals/statists/neocons acting as if this is a free country.

I want the truth to be out there for all to see. This time around there is no slavery issue which can be used to muddy the reasons for the aggression. It will simply be an overbearing unconstitutional federal government oppressing free people.

And if they want to do this, then let us see them for what they really are. Maybe people will wake up.

This.+1


Wow this could escalate really quickly lol
One could only hope.

I feel as if this wouldnt work out too well :)
As opposed to,,,? waiting till we are disarmed and herded into slave camps?

Im just thinking the Federal Government wouldnt go for it, especially when you have a much too powerful executive branch who is quoted on wanting to be like Lincoln.

Do you love slavery more than freedom? Just how much abuse are you willing to endure?

[Pericles]

Constitutional Scholar Kevin Gutzman (http://www.facebook.com/kevin.gutzman) posted the following on my Facebook page (http://www.facebook.com/LibertyMatt)yesterday regarding this discussion:

This is why the Constitution placed the militias under state control.

[t0rnado]

More states need to join in this battle against the federal government. A lot of the mountain west and southern states have state legislatures that would pass this bill.