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Anti Federalist
07-11-2009, 08:40 PM
Police chief denounces 'cowardly' iPhone users monitoring speed traps

http://www.washingtonexaminer.com/local/Devices-that-warn-drivers-of-speed_-red-light-cameras-draw-police-ire-7930619-50074717.html

By: Hayley Peterson
Examiner Staff
July 7, 2009

Area drivers looking to outwit police speed traps and traffic cameras are using an iPhone application and other global positioning system devices that pinpoint the location of the cameras.

That has irked D.C. police chief Cathy Lanier, who promised her officers would pick up their game to counteract the devices, which can also help drivers dodge sobriety checkpoints.

"I think that's the whole point of this program," she told The Examiner. "It's designed to circumvent law enforcement -- law enforcement that is designed specifically to save lives."

The new technology streams to i-Phones and global positioning system devices, sounding off an alarm as drivers approach speed or red-light cameras.

Lanier said the technology is a "cowardly tactic" and "people who overly rely on those and break the law anyway are going to get caught" in one way or another.

The greater D.C. area has 290 red-light and speed cameras -- comprising nearly 10 percent of all traffic cameras in the U.S., according to estimates by a camera-tracking database called the POI Factory.

Lanier said the cameras have decreased traffic deaths. Red-light and speed cameras have been a hot topic in Montgomery County since Maryland Gov. Martin O'Malley signed a bill in May allowing local governments to place speed cameras in school and highway construction zones.

Montgomery County police did not respond to calls and e-mails for this story.

Ralph Ganoe of Silver Spring said he uses detection software from a Washington-based company, PhantomAlert, to avoid speed traps and crowded intersections.

"Well, my pocket has money in it," Ganoe quipped, when asked about the software's impact on his driving record. "Everybody's got a heavy foot. ... Now I don't have to worry about where [the cameras] are at."

PhantomAlert mimics radar detectors — which are outlawed in D.C. and Virginia — by alerting drivers of nearby enforcement "points of interest" via global positioning system devices. PhantomAlert keeps up to date on traffic enforcement through its users, who contribute information online.

Founder and CEO of PhantomAlert Joe Scott claimed nine out of 10 police departments across the country support his software.

"If police come against us, it's going to make them look like they are only [after] revenue" from the camera-generated citations, he said.

Photo radar tickets generated nearly $1 billion in revenues for D.C. during fiscal years 2005 to 2008.

In the current fiscal year, Montgomery County expects to make $29 million from its red light and speed cameras. Lanier said efforts to outlaw the software would be too difficult.

She said, "with the Internet and all the new technology, it's almost impossible to stop the flow of information."

Anti Federalist
07-11-2009, 08:42 PM
For your in car GPS

http://www.phantomalert.com/?idev_id=3883&idev_username=waves731

For iphones

http://reviews.cnet.com/8301-19512_7-10115803-233.html

devil21
07-11-2009, 08:51 PM
Dont they know that technology is only positive when it's used to tax you?

FSP-Rebel
07-11-2009, 08:52 PM
Sorry Cathy, that's a good thing.

Conservative Christian
07-11-2009, 08:55 PM
The D.C. police chief is a jerk.

If the application alerts drivers to a traffic camera or speed trap ahead, causing them to slow down to the speed limit, then what's the problem?

Apparently, the chief wants them to KEEP speeding UNTIL they get to the speed trap or traffic cam. However, what if they slam into somebody BEFORE they get to the speed trap or cam?

It seems the application is actually providing a public service, because the drivers using it are actually slowing down SOONER than they would have if they weren't using it.

The D.C. police and Virginia Highway Patrol are quite simply grubbing for revenue here, with no genuine interest in public safety.

devil21
07-11-2009, 09:03 PM
The D.C. police chief is a jerk.

If the application alerts drivers to a traffic camera or speed trap ahead, causing them to slow down to the speed limit, then what's the problem?

Apparently, the chief wants them to KEEP speeding UNTIL they get to the speed trap or traffic cam. However, what if they slam into somebody BEFORE they get to the speed trap or cam?

It seems the application is actually providing a public service, because the drivers using it are actually slowing down SOONER than they would have if they weren't using it.

The D.C. police and Virginia Highway Patrol are quite simply grubbing for revenue here, with no genuine interest in public safety.

I spent the first 30 years of my life in that area and I can assure you that truer words were never spoken. It's a real live police state in action there. If it's not cameras, then it's troopers radaring every .5 mile for anybody going 10mph, if not the troopers then the local cops parking outside of bars on Friday nights and following people home hoping they forget to use a turn signal and go fishing for a DWI. I don't regret leaving that area for a minute.

Matt Collins
07-11-2009, 09:10 PM
Now they are going to move to outlaw it

FindLiberty
07-11-2009, 09:21 PM
That "cowardly technology" does improve safety, but it also reduces
the local "revenue" extracted via fines. No wonder they hate it so.

Revenue cameras are just an awful idea. They should all be banned.

Next thing ya' know they'll wanna bring back troll bridges.

Conservative Christian
07-11-2009, 09:29 PM
Now they are going to move to outlaw it

^Source?

In the article, the D.C. police chief states that efforts to outlaw the software would be too difficult.

RSLudlum
07-11-2009, 09:32 PM
LOL...Once again the free market wins against gov't; the immortal battle continues on the streets!!! :p

Anti Federalist
07-11-2009, 09:33 PM
^Source?

In the article, the D.C. police chief states that efforts to outlaw the software would be too difficult.

I agree with Matt.

Source:

Thirty years of dealing with government and knowing how the bastards work.

Conservative Christian
07-11-2009, 09:35 PM
From the article:

"Lanier said the technology is a "cowardly tactic" and "people who overly rely on those and break the law anyway are going to get caught" in one way or another."

So what's Chief Lanier whining about? If they're going to be caught even if they use the technology, she really doesn't have a legitimate complaint.

What she's REALLY worried about isn't public safety, but REDUCED revenue for the government.

Anti Federalist
07-11-2009, 09:37 PM
From the article:

"Lanier said the technology is a "cowardly tactic" and "people who overly rely on those and break the law anyway are going to get caught" in one way or another."

So what's Chief Lanier whining about? If they're going to be caught even if they use the technology, she really doesn't have a legitimate complaint.

What she's REALLY worried about isn't public safety, but REDUCED revenue for the government.

Revenue and control.

HOLLYWOOD
07-11-2009, 09:47 PM
I spent the first 30 years of my life in that area and I can assure you that truer words were never spoken. It's a real live police state in action there. If it's not cameras, then it's troopers radaring every .5 mile for anybody going 10mph, if not the troopers then the local cops parking outside of bars on Friday nights and following people home hoping they forget to use a turn signal and go fishing for a DWI. I don't regret leaving that area for a minute.

Everything is related towards MONEY... the government Electronic "SLOT MACHINES" are legal to steal from the people, but if the people know how to stop the tyranny of stealing... then you're labeled as terrorist, felon, anti-sociable, anti-establishment, anti-American.

love the ANTIs label by the propaganda?

Maybe these tyranny tentacles of the JackBoot brown shirt corrupt judicial branch of government... are the minions just smart enough to follow orders and dumb enough to accept any marching orders.

Domo Arigato Mr. Roboto

lynnf
07-11-2009, 09:54 PM
for every measure there is a countermeasure, and for every countermeasure, a counter-countermeasure.


they're forgetting the original cowards, here - the police departments that don't put a real person out there to enforce the laws.

lynn

specialkornflake
07-11-2009, 09:59 PM
I listened to the interview on NPR. The police chief clarified that she found it unacceptable when people would use the application to avoid DUI checks so that they could drink and drive.

People shouldn't drive while impaired.

devil21
07-11-2009, 10:02 PM
I listened to the interview on NPR. The police chief clarified that she found it unacceptable when people would use the application to avoid DUI checks so that they could drink and drive.

People shouldn't drive while impaired.

It also never occurs to her that maybe people value their 4th amendment right to not be stopped without reasonable suspicion of illegal activity. Being on the road at 2am is not suspicious nor illegal.

Anti Federalist
07-11-2009, 10:03 PM
I listened to the interview on NPR. The police chief clarified that she found it unacceptable when people would use the application to avoid DUI checks so that they could drink and drive.

People shouldn't drive while impaired.

But it's perfectly OK with her if they use them to run red lights and speed?

She's crawfishing.

specialkornflake
07-11-2009, 10:08 PM
We've got more important things to do than worry about the opinion of the Washington DC police chief. Our time might be better spent downloading this application. :)

Anti Federalist
07-11-2009, 10:10 PM
We've got more important things to do than worry about the opinion of the Washington DC police chief. Our time might be better spent downloading this application. :)

Now you're talking...;)

Volitzer
07-11-2009, 10:14 PM
Cops are in it only for the money. Write tickets or else... instead of to protect and serve.

Conservative Christian
07-11-2009, 10:22 PM
I listened to the interview on NPR. The police chief clarified that she found it unacceptable when people would use the application to avoid DUI checks so that they could drink and drive.

People shouldn't drive while impaired.

If they're too impaired to drive, it logically follows that they're too impaired to use their GPS or cellphone. If they're inebriated enough to get in a wreck, they're most likely in a mental state where they aren't even THINKING about using their GPS or cellphone.

Can the chief or yourself provide any credible evidence that a significant number of impaired drivers getting in wrecks are using this technology?

Bottom line---the chief is worried about losing revenue.

Matt Collins
07-12-2009, 01:44 AM
Well if the cops weren't running radar then people wouldn't have to devise ways to beat it. Duh...

BudhaStalin
07-12-2009, 01:54 AM
"Photo radar tickets generated nearly $1 billion in revenues for D.C. during fiscal years 2005 to 2008."

And people still have the audacity to claim that these radars are for the public good, to stop the speeding, and make streets safer?

1 billion in revenues is a lot

tangent4ronpaul
07-12-2009, 02:09 AM
http://www.poi-factory.com/

-t

speciallyblend
07-12-2009, 02:26 AM
I spent the first 30 years of my life in that area and I can assure you that truer words were never spoken. It's a real live police state in action there. If it's not cameras, then it's troopers radaring every .5 mile for anybody going 10mph, if not the troopers then the local cops parking outside of bars on Friday nights and following people home hoping they forget to use a turn signal and go fishing for a DWI. I don't regret leaving that area for a minute.

originally from virginia myself. it is pretty much a police state and i use to call it the communistwealth of virginia!!

devil21
07-12-2009, 03:39 AM
originally from virginia myself. it is pretty much a police state and i use to call it the communistwealth of virginia!!

I had to laugh about the reports Ive read about VA closing rest areas along interstates due to tight finances. That's gotta be a joke considering how much revenue is squeezed from the citizens and business. How much does it cost to run a rest area? Seriously?

idiom
07-12-2009, 07:13 AM
Well at least you have the ability to elect people who may reverse these policies.

Imagine if the roads were private and you just got tracked by your payments and billed for being half a mile an hour over the speed limit... *shudder*

ChaosControl
07-12-2009, 07:19 AM
Sounds like I need an iPhone... :P

I used to have a radar detector, but then I don't really speed and I rarely drive so it isn't worth getting one. But if I had to drive/commute a lot or something, I'd definitely have one.

Speed traps are such b.s. We spend money so cops can sit in their damn car at some hidden location just waiting to ticket some guy who may be driving 10/mph over the limit but is no real threat. Now if cops are on route to somewhere and happen to spot a guy going 40 in a 20, I got no problem with them pulling him over, however when they are just sitting in a speed trap all day it is such a waste of taxpayer money.

So yay, we pay money so that our chances of being ticketed and paying even more money is increased. What a dang great deal. **** speed traps. Go radar detection!

james1906
07-12-2009, 07:25 AM
"Photo radar tickets generated nearly $1 billion in revenues for D.C. during fiscal years 2005 to 2008."

And people still have the audacity to claim that these radars are for the public good, to stop the speeding, and make streets safer?

1 billion in revenues is a lot

Marion Berry can buy a lot of crack and hookers with that money.

Rael
07-16-2009, 09:50 PM
Police chief denounces 'cowardly' iPhone users monitoring speed traps
By: Hayley Peterson
Examiner Staff
July 7, 2009
Apple iPhone (file photo) (Getty Images file photo)

Area drivers looking to outwit police speed traps and traffic cameras are using an iPhone application and other global positioning system devices that pinpoint the location of the cameras.

That has irked D.C. police chief Cathy Lanier, who promised her officers would pick up their game to counteract the devices, which can also help drivers dodge sobriety checkpoints.

"I think that's the whole point of this program," she told The Examiner. "It's designed to circumvent law enforcement -- law enforcement that is designed specifically to save lives."

The new technology streams to iPhones and global positioning system devices, sounding off an alarm as drivers approach speed or red-light cameras.

Lanier said the technology is a "cowardly tactic" and "people who overly rely on those and break the law anyway are going to get caught" in one way or another.

The greater D.C. area has 290 red-light and speed cameras -- comprising nearly 10 percent of all traffic cameras in the U.S., according to estimates by a camera-tracking database called the POI Factory.

Lanier said the cameras have decreased traffic deaths. Red-light and speed cameras have been a hot topic in Montgomery County since Maryland Gov. Martin O'Malley signed a bill in May allowing local governments to place speed cameras in school and highway construction zones.

Montgomery County police did not respond to calls and e-mails for this story.

Ralph Ganoe of Silver Spring said he uses detection software from a Washington-based company, PhantomAlert, to avoid speed traps and crowded intersections.

"Well, my pocket has money in it," Ganoe quipped, when asked about the software's impact on his driving record. "Everybody's got a heavy foot. ... Now I don't have to worry about where [the cameras] are at."

PhantomAlert mimics radar detectors — which are outlawed in D.C. and Virginia — by alerting drivers of nearby enforcement "points of interest" via global positioning system devices. PhantomAlert keeps up to date on traffic enforcement through its users, who contribute information online.

Founder and CEO of PhantomAlert Joe Scott claimed nine out of 10 police departments across the country support his software.

"If police come against us, it's going to make them look like they are only [after] revenue" from the camera-generated citations, he said.

Photo radar tickets generated nearly $1 billion in revenues for D.C. during fiscal years 2005 to 2008.

In the current fiscal year, Montgomery County expects to make $29 million from its red light and speed cameras. Lanier said efforts to outlaw the software would be too difficult.

She said, "with the Internet and all the new technology, it's almost impossible to stop the flow of information."

Reason
07-16-2009, 09:52 PM
http://www.ronpaulforums.com/showthread.php?t=199416

Mandrik
07-16-2009, 09:55 PM
I use Trapster on my iPhone all the time, especially when I'm in unfamiliar territory. I usually just follow the speed limit anyway to limit my encounters with law enforcement, but it doesn't hurt to know where they are hiding.

andrewh817
12-06-2009, 01:59 PM
Police chief calls it cowardly..... I call it fiscally responsible. Not as fiscally responsible as not speeding but still

tangent4ronpaul
12-06-2009, 02:09 PM
aaawwww!!! - poor fascist.

LOL!

catdd
12-06-2009, 04:55 PM
They call everyone "cowardly' who fights back. Brave individuals are suppose to "take it like a man."

LibForestPaul
12-06-2009, 05:05 PM
If government truly wanted to prevent needless deaths from unsafe excessive speed, a federal mandated governor chips in auto manufacturers computers. Force every auto to travel 65mph or less.

tremendoustie
12-06-2009, 05:37 PM
I think the DC Police chief is a cowardly thug, who either has no moral convictions, or refuses to follow them

So, I guess we're even.

jclay2
12-06-2009, 05:39 PM
"Photo radar tickets generated nearly $1 billion in revenues for D.C. during fiscal years 2005 to 2008."

And people still have the audacity to claim that these radars are for the public good, to stop the speeding, and make streets safer?

1 billion in revenues is a lot

That is what really jumped out to me. These thugs are pulling in 250 million dollars a year in photo radar tickets alone! They probably use the money to "invest" in more photo radar. I personally hate these things with a passion. In illinois, I was going 71 on a highway that was normally 65. It was one of those super long 45 mph construction zones that last miles and miles. I was going just as fast as all the other drivers and there was NO CONSTRUCTION going on that day. So I pull around a slight curve and see a flash come from a van. I was never pulled over and never saw any cop. If that is not cowardly, than I don't know what is. Little did I know, that this would cost me $600. It still kills me to this day to know that $600 of my precious earned money went to pay for some stupid thug police enforcement.

Matt Collins
12-06-2009, 09:36 PM
They call everyone "cowardly' who fights back. Brave individuals are suppose to "take it like a man."Didn't the Nazi's say the same thing about those they were shipping off to concentration camps? :(:rolleyes:

Matt Collins
12-06-2009, 09:37 PM
If government truly wanted to prevent needless deaths from unsafe excessive speed, a federal mandated governor chips in auto manufacturers computers. Force every auto to travel 65mph or less.
The federal government is not authorized to do that per the Constitution. Also speeding in and of itself is not dangerous.

Anti Federalist
12-06-2009, 09:40 PM
The federal government is not authorized to do that per the Constitution. Also speeding in and of itself is not dangerous.

They're not allowed to do a lot of things, but do it anyway.

Governor chips, yeah, I could see that in the next few years. I imagine OnStar could already do it.

Matt Collins
12-06-2009, 10:04 PM
Governor chips, yeah, I could see that in the next few years. I imagine OnStar could already do it.The idea was seriously considered in Oregan (just research for vehicle GPS) but for mileage for taxes. However an ancillary benefit was of course to automatically ticket someone if they had sped at one point. :mad:

getch36
12-06-2009, 10:05 PM
They're not allowed to do a lot of things, but do it anyway.

Governor chips, yeah, I could see that in the next few years. I imagine OnStar could already do it.

Onstar has many abilities,one is tracking and remote shutoff of stolen cars .The government owns GM(onstar).How long till they start using this for other things besides stolen cars.I think I will pass on any GM products.

risk_reward
12-06-2009, 10:55 PM
LOL...Once again the free market wins against gov't; the immortal battle continues on the streets!!! :p

This seems to be a good place to tell a speeding story of a guy I know.

He was heading home, about five miles away, on an access controlled divided highway. Traffic was light. He sees a cop has someone pulled over on the shoulder. He decides, this is the best time to speed, this cop is busy. So, he passes another car just a little over the limit. This car is now in between him and the cop still parked behind the pulled over car. So, he floors it.

As he is approaching his exit, and preparing to slow down he notices the cop accelerating behind him like a bat out of hell. He takes his exit and starts driving the speed limit. The cop follows him a few blocks and then moves on as he enters his neighborhood. Too bad that cop was too busy to know for sure how fast the driver was going.

I don't recommend doing this, but it sounds like fun. I wonder how pissed the cop is that he couldn't nail this guy?

I didn't do this. It's not me. No really, its a guy I know. ;)

LibForestPaul
12-07-2009, 02:52 PM
They're not allowed to do a lot of things, but do it anyway.

Governor chips, yeah, I could see that in the next few years. I imagine OnStar could already do it.

Exactly. But they did not...This would cost government $$$. But timing people on turnpikes, GPS taxing, that they will do.