Are you an Oppressor or a Free Person?

[mczerone]

Just to see who makes up the forums, I thought I'd post a poll.

I believe that I am a free person that may voluntarily associate as he pleases, but it seems that there are some members intent on praising some piece of paper that claims to give a group of people the power to determine my associations, my security, my roads, my morality, my money, my stance on torture, my stance on abortion, my funding of R&D projects, etc.

I don't think we disagree that order and stability are needed, but those who rely on some "Constitution" to give this are inevitably playing into the hands of Oppression by governments that rule by force derived from fraud.

[heavenlyboy34]

Just to see who makes up the forums, I thought I'd post a poll.

I believe that I am a free person that may voluntarily associate as he pleases, but it seems that there are some members intent on praising some piece of paper that claims to give a group of people the power to determine my associations, my security, my roads, my morality, my money, my stance on torture, my stance on abortion, my funding of R&D projects, etc.

I don't think we disagree that order and stability are needed, but those who rely on some "Constitution" to give this are inevitably playing into the hands of Oppression by governments that rule by force derived from fraud.

I agree with you. :cool:

[Minarchy4Sale]

Is Lewrockwell.com spamming us today?

[LittleLightShining]

I also agree with the second option. I hate to say it but there are people who are not responsible for their actions. So "I believe that chaining down the powers of government is an effective way to limit its power" is also acceptable.

[mczerone]

Is Lewrockwell.com spamming us today?

I don't work for lew, but I certainly visit his site often.

Should I go to the other poll thread and ask if we are being spammed by ChuckBaldwin.com?

[ARealConservative]

loaded poll options

[mczerone]

I also agree with the second option. I hate to say it but there are people who are not responsible for their actions. So "I believe that chaining down the powers of government is an effective way to limit its power" is also acceptable.

Wouldn't the best way to make them be responsible to expect them to be responsible be by pulling out the "social safety net?"

The Constitution, and abiding by it in any form, would be a welcome compromise from today's empire - but it is the Constitution that allowed us to get here. It acted as a floor for government power and hurdles which smart men had to use contorted reason and "mental gymnastics" to jump, expanding the government to today's proportions.

Without government, the irresponsible wouldn't have shelter from creditors. They wouldn't be able to join the police to satisfy their desires to beat and maim - they would have to find willing participants for their sadism or face the consequences of retribution.

[mczerone]

loaded poll options

Just trying to mimic the other poll, did you not notice the bias there?

Maybe that's the whole point of this thread...

[Dr.3D]

Just trying to mimic the other poll, did you not notice the bias there?

Maybe that's the whole point of this thread...

Please explain the bias found in the other thread.

[ARealConservative]

Just trying to mimic the other poll, did you not notice the bias there?

Maybe that's the whole point of this thread...

I'm not sure what the other poll in question is......sorry

[LibertyEagle]

I choose 2 options:


I believe that chaining down the powers of government is an effective way to limit its power

I am the best judge of running my own life, responsible for my actions and entitled to the benefits

This poll seems to suppose that those of us who are constitutionalists, want to keep the complete BS that our government has become. We don't. We want to reinstate the founders' intent of the Constitution, which would do none of the things that you insinuate that it would do.

[Indy Vidual]

Criminal gangs will always exist, might as well create a limited government for them to run.

Criminal gangs thrive because of the government.

[mczerone]

I choose 2 options:



This poll seems to suppose that those of us who are constitutionalists, want to keep the complete BS that our government has become. We don't. We want to reinstate the founders' intent of the Constitution, which would do none of the things that you insinuate that it would do.

And the other thread (Constitutionalist vs. Anarchist (http://www.ronpaulforums.com/showthread.php?t=197986)) painted anyone that wasn't a "Constitutionalist" as some chaos-loving, violent, hate-filled thug.


I realize the desires of the self professed "Constitutionalist" is to keep the government controlled, and I applaud that. However, there is no real reason to think that any kind of reset to a limited federal power will not just expand just as happened.

Until I'm convinced that there is some mechanism for (1) controlling government to a very limited role while (2) not favoring any individual member or group over another and (3) allowing any person to opt out when they disagree, I'm remaining a free person.

You might want to label that "anarchy", but please be careful with the connotations that accompany the term.

[LittleLightShining]

I choose 2 options:



This poll seems to suppose that those of us who are constitutionalists, want to keep the complete BS that our government has become. We don't. We want to reinstate the founders' intent of the Constitution, which would do none of the things that you insinuate that it would do.Exactly!

[TGGRV]

Why are you on this forum? It would be like me going to Obama's forums and keep yapping about how welfare is bad.

EDIT:Anarchy doesn't provide the latter.