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View Full Version : Tories 'winning across England' -Is this a sign of things to come in the U.S.?




torchbearer
06-05-2009, 03:26 PM
An article with more details: http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/uk_news/politics/8081729.stm



Party +/- Total +/- Total
CON +217 1330 +7 29
LD -8 439 -1 1
LAB -250 159 -4 0
OTH +34 159 0 0
NOC - - -2 3


Does anyone know if Daniel Hannan won re-election?


Will we have a backlash against socialism in a few years?

iddo
06-05-2009, 03:59 PM
You're quoting the local councils election results, the EU results are kept secret until Sunday (after other European countries voted).
And EU elections are for parties, not individuals, so Hannan will keep his seat because the Tories are strongest in his region. The interesting question is whether UKIP will be 2nd, they're the most libertarian party...

torchbearer
06-05-2009, 04:00 PM
You're quoting the local councils election results, the EU results are kept secret until Sunday (after other European countries voted).
And EU elections are for parties, not individuals, so Hannan will keep his seat because the Tories are strongest in his region. The interesting question is whether UKIP will be 2nd, they're the most libertarian party...

So the info I have in the OP is for British Parliament.
European Parliament isn't released yet?

nate895
06-05-2009, 04:01 PM
So the info I have in the OP is for British Parliament.
European Parliament isn't released yet?

No, it is for local council elections. Labour is holding out for the maximum 5 year term instead of the traditional election every 4 years.

torchbearer
06-05-2009, 04:01 PM
Do you foresee Britain breaking down its socialist institutions?

torchbearer
06-05-2009, 04:02 PM
No, it is for local council elections. Labour is holding out for the maximum 5 year term instead of the traditional election every 4 years.

ah- but this is a good sign.

Young Paleocon
06-05-2009, 04:05 PM
Do you foresee Britain breaking down its socialist institutions?

No, the Tories are basically blue labour. Ukip is where it's at, and it will be interesting to see how UKIP does in the general next year. But yes Labour got annihilated and they will be trounced again on Sunday when the EU numbers come out.

nate895
06-05-2009, 04:05 PM
ah- but this is a good sign.

Very good, but I am hoping that a libertarian party gets a lot of seats in the next parliament, and the Tories are forced to compromise with them to get a coalition government. Probably won't happen, but I can hope and pray.

iddo
06-05-2009, 04:20 PM
UKIP doesn't have much chance in the general elections because it's winner-takes-all for each MP and it's hard to break through the traditional votes for the major parties (like Republicans/Democrats).
But the EU elections are proportional respresentation, so it will be interesting to see if UKIP manages to get 2nd nationwide on Sunday. And if Labour is 4th behind Tories/UKIP/LibDems then they might be pressured to have general elections now, instead of waiting another year.

nate895
06-05-2009, 04:24 PM
UKIP doesn't have much chance in the general elections because it's winner-takes-all for each MP and it's hard to break through the traditional votes for the major parties (like Republicans/Democrats).
But the EU elections are proportional respresentation, so it will be interesting to see if UKIP manages to get 2nd nationwide on Sunday. And if Labour is 4th behind Tories/UKIP/LibDems then they might be pressured to have general elections now, instead of waiting another year.

However, your districts are a lot smaller than ours. Also, there is a strong tradition of at least one third party that has the possibility of winning enough seats to prevent a majority, as per the Lib-Dems.

Young Paleocon
06-05-2009, 04:31 PM
UKIP doesn't have much chance in the general elections because it's winner-takes-all for each MP and it's hard to break through the traditional votes for the major parties (like Republicans/Democrats).
But the EU elections are proportional respresentation, so it will be interesting to see if UKIP manages to get 2nd nationwide on Sunday. And if Labour is 4th behind Tories/UKIP/LibDems then they might be pressured to have general elections now, instead of waiting another year.

What if Lab loses to the Greens too :). I'm also interested how well the SNP and Plaid Cymru do, and if UKIP can pick up a seat in either Wales or Scotland.

nate895
06-05-2009, 04:33 PM
What if Lab loses to the Greens too :). I'm also interested how well the SNP and Plaid Cymru do, and if UKIP can pick up a seat in either Wales or Scotland.

SNP and Plaid Cymru are both socialist.

Young Paleocon
06-05-2009, 04:38 PM
SNP and Plaid Cymru are both socialist.

Yea, and they are both the nationalist parties, still interested on how bad Labor gets flogged in the also.

nate895
06-05-2009, 04:40 PM
Yea, and they are both the nationalist parties, still interested on how bad Labor get flogged in the also.

When the word "nationalist" is used to mean a group seeking independence, I do not necessarily have a problem with them. It is when they are for big, central government that I have a problem with them.

Young Paleocon
06-05-2009, 04:42 PM
When the word "nationalist" is used to mean a group seeking independence, I do not necessarily have a problem with them. It is when they are for big, central government that I have a problem with them.

I most certainly don't support SNP or PC, but their gaining in votes in the EUP might indicated how many of their MP's will be sitting in Westminister after the general.

nate895
06-05-2009, 04:51 PM
I most certainly don't support SNP or PC, but their gaining in votes in the EUP might indicated how many of their MP's will be sitting in Westminister after the general.

The PC ones probably won't be sitting because, last I heard at least, they refuse to take an oath of allegiance to the Queen.

JK/SEA
06-05-2009, 05:18 PM
Interesting thread on this forum.

http://forums.armageddononline.org/stuart-varney-t20373.html?

torchbearer
06-07-2009, 07:50 AM
any updates?

Young Paleocon
06-07-2009, 04:15 PM
Well, three regions have reported in so far and it's 1. Con, 2. UKIP, 3. Lab, 4. Libdem, 5. Green. Notable things, UKIP picked up a seat in Wales and the BNP picked up it's first seat ever. BNP got it's first seat in Yorks and Humber. Labour is getting destroyed in it's strongholds.

Young Paleocon
06-07-2009, 04:30 PM
Correction that was four regions reporting.

american.swan
06-07-2009, 04:47 PM
No, the Tories are basically blue labour. Ukip is where it's at, and it will be interesting to see how UKIP does in the general next year. But yes Labour got annihilated and they will be trounced again on Sunday when the EU numbers come out.

How popular are the UKIP over the last 5 years? Huge growth? How many seats in UK's Parliament do they have now or recent history? In the local election results posted here, which abbreviation is UKIP? Do they go by other names/initials? How many UKIP from England are in the EU parliament?

Young Paleocon
06-07-2009, 04:53 PM
UKIP currently has 9 sitting members in the EU parliament. 12 were elected in 2004 but due to infighting and scandals the number is at 9. They go by UKIP or UK Independence Party and from originally having 0 local councilors they got 7 elected on Thursday. UKIP had 2-3 MEP's from the 1999 election then it ballooned to 12 MEP's in 2004 with 16% of the vote and the third largest vote total beating the LibDems. Tonight they will probably get even more than that, currently with the four regions reporting they are in second behind the tories. They have 0 MPs in Parliament but that might change within a year when the general comes around.

american.swan
06-07-2009, 05:01 PM
Thanks.

So in UK Parliament they have 0 but chances are that will change in the next election.

The people have sent some UKIP to the EU Parliment and that is increasing. Fantastic.

How close to US libertarians are UKIP??

Young Paleocon
06-07-2009, 05:11 PM
UKIP's main issues are ending British involvement in the EU and replacing it with a free trade agreement. They want to freeze immigration for five years to find out who has come into the country due to the millions of immigrants that have come in through the open borders of the EU. They would like to replace the open borders with a worker permit system. They are for cutting the income tax and local taxes and most taxes across the board, ending the smoking ban so pubs can open up again.

http://www.ukip.org/home