AMERICAN car? buy a piece of crap?

[sarahgop]

with the unions now in charge of GM and chrysler along with obama there is no incentinve for a good product to be produced. buy american and buy crap.

[FSP-Rebel]

If I was to buy Amerikan, I would buy a Ford. Though, even they are on shaky ground. But, the new Taurus that comes out later this year/early next looks like a nice whip.

[nobody's_hero]

My 2003 dodge is likely to be the last American vehicle I will ever buy. That is, unless the government comes in and forces us at gunpoint to buy American vehicles, which is probably going to happen now that the taxpayers own 60% of it, unfortunately. Washington will need to find a way to break-even somehow.

(Except for Harley-Davidsons. I would like to get one of those in my lifetime.)

[Cowlesy]

I will only buy cars by non-government owned entities out of protest. Luckily, I've always had good experiences with Fords, though I think Bill Ford is a douchebag.

[Objectivist]

Boycott Government Motor Company (GMC)

I find it odd that Obama comes out to tell us what GM will be doing, instead of the CEO.... oh I get it, HE is the CEO now.

I guess those idiots at ELF won't be burning SUVs anymore.
http://www.societyofcontrol.com/library/_a-e/earth_liberation_front_hammers_hummers.txt
http://www.elmerfudd.us/burnsuvs.htm

[muh_roads]

Foreign car manufacturers have no incentive to succeed either because their governments also bail them out.

[Danke]

Lifetime Ford owner here. Just replaced my gf's starter on her 1995 Buick LeSabre. Cost, $75.

[forsmant]

Many of these cars and trucks are already made. I hope there will be discounts because GM is still a good vehicle.

[JohnnyRebel]

I like Dodge trucks

[sarahgop]

i will purchase a honda.

[FindLiberty]

Most likely gonna' be a piece of crap...

Grew up under the hood of GM cars... I even re-built an automatic transmission or two. BUT, the last straw was the pathetic EFI module on our 1976 Eldorado...

Then I bought a new top-of-the-line Toyota that changed everything for me. I even took it all apart to see the guts up close - what a fine machine it was (early 80's)! It only required oil and filter changes - NO TROUBLES. (no more weekends tinkering with the GM automatic choke unloader, funky GM crankshaft ign timing sensors, you name it, etc.)

THREE DECADES later, it's still only high-end Toyota's for me. I can never go back to GM*. American union labor / Auto's have no chance at all IMO. Of course there will be laws and funny money "help" for them to match the competition that's already at a disadvantage 'cause it's shipped over here from the other side of the world (or snapped together here from sub-assy's sent from over-seas), but American cars will still come up short(er), possibly even made worse by all the new "help".

Toyota (or Honda) had/have much better engineering and QC compared to either GM or Ford. Maybe they should "buy" GM and then run the new company.

*I don't wish to come across as negative, I just don't want to witness the embarrassment of another American car even if I don't own it, or to personally make the mistake of buying one and then having to cope with all its shortcomings.

[RonPaulCentral]

I will never buy another NEW car from GM or Chrysler .... EVER.

My friends and I have all made an agreement that we (our families as a whole) will never buy anything again from a company that was bailed out. We have also all agreed to no longer do business with any bank that has taken bailout money.

1) I have already closed two accounts with Bank of America (checking and visa)
2) I have already closed my checking/savings accounts with JPMorgan (was WAMU)
3) I have closed my WAMU (now JPMorgan) visa account
4) I have closed all credit cards (Home Depot, etc) that were Citi issued cards.
5) I have moved all my funds to a local credit union.

This represents a few things I have done.

A friend of mine went and closed his Bank of America checking account. This was his PRIMARY checking account (unlike mine which was just an account to have around) and had a significant amount in it. They obviously didn't want him to leave and they asked him why he was leaving.

His answer:

I WILL NEVER EVER AGAIN DEAL WITH A BANK THAT HAS TAKEN BAILOUT FUNDS FROM THE UNITED STATES GOVERNMENT.

He said the agent (asst manager) turned white and then red.

He walked out of the bank with a six figure bank check and went to..... you guessed it... the same credit union I joined.

There are a lot of people doing stuff like we are doing.

[angelatc]

Lifetime Ford owner here. Just replaced my gf's starter on her 1995 Buick LeSabre. Cost, $75.

I drive a '94 F150 van. Coming up on 200,000 miles, and coincidentally I just replaced my starter too.

The '93 Escort lost the transmission about 6 months ago, so we bought a 2001 Escape.

[Danke]

I drive a '94 F150 van. Coming up on 200,000 miles, and coincidentally I just replaced my starter too.

The '93 Escort lost the transmission about 6 months ago, so we bought a 2001 Escape.

yep, easy and relatively inexpensive to work on.

[specsaregood]

//

[Danke]

I'm happy to report that my Honda was completely assembled by American workers in Ohio. First foreign-company car I have ever owned and I couldn't be happier.

Exactly which portions were assembled in America? And where did the profits go?

[sarahgop]

I'm happy to report that my Honda was completely assembled by American workers in Ohio. First foreign-company car I have ever owned and I couldn't be happier.

i will find a nice used one.

[Minarchy4Sale]

There are many good reasons to buy a Ford. Although their cars look like bars of soap on wheels now just like everyone else. So sad.

Long live the Crown Vic Panther.

And here I was looking forward to buying an STS-V someday. sigh.

[Derek Johnson]

YouTube - Giving GM, UAW, & Obama the Metaphorical Finger on the Michael Medved Show 6-1-09 (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oQMMrGSFymY)

It's still uploading, but check it out when it's done. I call it my Austrian free-market one finger salute to Obama Motors and UAW.

[nobody's_hero]

Excellent video.

I'm looking at this the same way I looked at the approximately $4 Billion Suntrust Bank got at the end of last year:

If these companies can go to the federal government and take my tax dollars by force, why should I voluntarily continue to support them?

The answer is: I shouldn't support them, and I won't.

Earlier I said that I wouldn't buy another American car, but I have heard that Ford has not sought federal assistance (yet). Is that true? It is going to become a lot harder for Ford to compete with GM and Chrysler. Rest assured that the federal government will make up any number of new restrictions and regulations on what safety and environment-friendly features must be incorporated into automotive engineering, with the goal being to stay one step ahead of the competition.

Help save capitalism. Boycott Government Motors.

[Monolithic]

i never bought shitty american cars in the first place

[nullvalu]

I've really had nothing but problems with GM's. I own 2 Fords right now and have been very happy with them so far. Although I have been thinking about trading one in for an '08 Charger. Anyone own one? I've talked to some other owners who mostly like them.

[acptulsa]

i never bought shitty american cars in the first place

My first car was a 1969 Charger. It's a damned shame that building and selling a new one of those today would be illegal, isn't it?

[JaylieWoW]

My husband has been fretting ever since his daughter turned 16 on buying her a car. Now, this may sound like "spoiling a child" but our situation is unique. Rather than bore you with the details of our life, both my husband's ex-wife & my husband's son have cancer. My husband's daughter really plays with a stacked deck balancing school work with having to take care of her mother (she is the SOLE caretaker for her mother at the young age of 17). In other words, she deserves and NEEDS a reliable car.

I own a 2000 Saturn that has been paid off for a couple of years now. Recently, my husband's income increased dramatically. So, once again, my husband started looking around for a car for his daughter. Because neither of us like having a car payment our intent was to put a substantial down-payment on a new car for me and to give my Saturn to his daughter.

I, however, was very reluctant to give up my Saturn (evil me lol ). So, my husband, knowing my particular affinity for sports cars, decides to see what he can find on Craig's List for me.

We ended up paying $3,000 cash for a 1990 Nissan 300ZX (OMG it is so sweet and almost in mint condition, even still smelled slightly new) that we found on Craig's List with 78,000 original miles :eek: . I am now the proud owner of a "classic" AND a proud owner of the ALL TIME best selling sports car EVER. Matter of fact, according to my car's VIN number, it was number 867th off the assembly line (the first 1,000 of the new Z32 body style ever made).

My point being (other than to brag about my new cool ride), is that I bet, unless you purchased it from a "collector" (mine was purchased from a college kid), you would be hard pressed to find a 20 year old American made sports car in such good condition. I think "best selling sports model of all time" puts it into perspective as to what we had coming for the American auto industry. Nissan did a remarkable job with the 280/300 series because they produced a sporty RELIABLE automobile at an affordable price.

PS: Picture below is EXACTLY what my car looks like

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/5/51/300ZX.jpg
:D:D

[Brian4Liberty]

I kinda like the new Camaro. Won't buy one, but it's an eye-catcher.

Erin Burnett was just on CNBC making fun of the Camaro and anyone who might buy it. Elitist sl*t. Chevy dealers can't keep them in stock, and they can't build them fast enough.

[angelatc]

yep, easy and relatively inexpensive to work on.

I don't think there's anything wrong with driving newer cars, but I always sort of wonder when people say things like "I bought my first <insert manufacturer here> and it is the only car I've ever owned since! I have never had any trouble with them," and I think "Gee - I'm still driving the same Ford that I bought around the same time you bought your first <insert model here> though!"

Plus my insurance is cheaper than dirt. :) That's reason alone not to drive a car you have to carry full coverage on.

[angelatc]

Earlier I said that I wouldn't buy another American car, but I have heard that Ford has not sought federal assistance (yet). Is that true? It is going to become a lot harder for Ford to compete with GM and Chrysler. Rest assured that the federal government will make up any number of new restrictions and regulations on what safety and environment-friendly features must be incorporated into automotive engineering, with the goal being to stay one step ahead of the competition.

Help save capitalism. Boycott Government Motors.

Yes it is true that Ford has not taken any TARP money. It is also true that being forced to compete with the government will certainly take its toll on Ford.

We can boycott all we want, but I suspect the military and government will soon be ordering fleets.

[Dreamofunity]

I buy used.

[Derek Johnson]

Excellent video.

I'm looking at this the same way I looked at the approximately $4 Billion Suntrust Bank got at the end of last year:

If these companies can go to the federal government and take my tax dollars by force, why should I voluntarily continue to support them?

The answer is: I shouldn't support them, and I won't.



That makes two of us




Earlier I said that I wouldn't buy another American car, but I have heard that Ford has not sought federal assistance (yet). Is that true? It is going to become a lot harder for Ford to compete with GM and Chrysler. Rest assured that the federal government will make up any number of new restrictions and regulations on what safety and environment-friendly features must be incorporated into automotive engineering, with the goal being to stay one step ahead of the competition.

Help save capitalism. Boycott Government Motors.

The government needs to knock it off with the environmental this and that, and they need to keep the "regulatory standards" completely out of the executive and legislative machine [yeah right]. Pollution can be solved by lawsuits, but now we have a retarded supreme court deciding that CO2 is a pollutant. Give me a break, show me the science.

Btw, my 1990 F250 w/a 7.3 International Diesel is still running strong at 200k miles w/no overhauls...only an occasional battery, alternator, filters, plugs etc. If American cars were built like American trucks [UAW aside], they would not be in this mess. Big ups to Ford, if they prove themselves against Honda/Toyota at the 150k-200k litmus test...I'll buy new Fords, no problem there. Chryslers still seem like total garbage to me, if they want to survive, they had better step it up.

[PatriotLegion]

I just bought an '09 Malibu. Car is awesome, I had an '04. I got a great deal on the car BTW and they need to sell there cars so deals and discounts are great. I never had any problems with our Malibu I have owned 2 and my parents have one. All still running and they are around great cars, in my opinion of course. What hurt GM is they over-sized POS's and the UAW. But UAW has been hurting the US car industry in whole because for Honda and Nissan to have factories in the US and pay there workers $30 an hour (no union) but Ford or Chevy to pay there workers $80 an hour (UAW).

That is why they are f**ked!

I stand by my American car. - For now till they out-source.

[FindLiberty]

Maybe US automakers just need to spice up their advertising (in the USA) to better compete with fine Japanese steel:

This is a Ford Venezuela Ad
http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3208/2982102544_943cdcf00d_o.jpg

[ceakins]

It will be so nice for our military to have to get parts for the hummer from a Chinese company.

http://www.time.com/time/business/article/0,8599,1902478,00.html

[chadhb]

Most likely gonna' be a piece of crap...

Grew up under the hood of GM cars... I even re-built an automatic transmission or two. BUT, the last straw was the pathetic EFI module on our 1976 Eldorado...

Then I bought a new top-of-the-line Toyota that changed everything for me. I even took it all apart to see the guts up close - what a fine machine it was (early 80's)! It only required oil and filter changes - NO TROUBLES. (no more weekends tinkering with the GM automatic choke unloader, funky GM crankshaft ign timing sensors, you name it, etc.)

THREE DECADES later, it's still only high-end Toyota's for me. I can never go back to GM*. American union labor / Auto's have no chance at all IMO. Of course there will be laws and funny money "help" for them to match the competition that's already at a disadvantage 'cause it's shipped over here from the other side of the world (or snapped together here from sub-assy's sent from over-seas), but American cars will still come up short(er), possibly even made worse by all the new "help".

Toyota (or Honda) had/have much better engineering and QC compared to either GM or Ford. Maybe they should "buy" GM and then run the new company.

*I don't wish to come across as negative, I just don't want to witness the embarrassment of another American car even if I don't own it, or to personally make the mistake of buying one and then having to cope with all its shortcomings.


You lost me at 1976 eldorado. You old fart, you don't know crap!

[anaconda]

I would love to have the 2009 Jetta Diesel:

YouTube - 2009 Volkswagen Jetta TDI Full Test (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=A2M2STh3JT4)

[Kludge]

Maybe US automakers just need to spice up their advertising (in the USA) to better compete with fine Japanese steel:

This is a Ford Venezuela Ad

Nothing is quite as erotic as breast cancer awareness organizations.

[Sandman33]

BASH American cars all you like. But here's the facts,

GM cheap models - are CHEAPER than civics or corollas and absolutely run WELL past their warranties but not as long as the japs.....but they ARE much cheaper to begin with!

The cheapest new Corollas and Civics are 20k...while the competing U.S. markets are at 13-16k.

As a consumer purchasing a USED vehicle I would surely aim for the japanese market.....untill I saw how much used japanese cars go for....its ridiculous. Yeah the U.S. product is going to need a little more work at 90k but SO WHAT! Its CHEAP! and the car is HALF the price. The powertrains themelves are still running just as well...its the littel bullhshit maintenance that the U.S. cars need...sensors, etc.

And lets step aside from cheap ass transportation to power and fun.

There's NO better sports car for the money than the Corvette...NONE....not even CLOSE. The Corvettes power and handling are seriously unmatched by any competitor anywhere NEAR its price range. And guess what...compared to other sports cars the Corvette is unbelievably reliable and cheap to maintain! It truly is a daily driver....while others trying to best it are twice its price and rarely driven daily.

And the Ford Mustang is build incredibly well. Try and find another car thats as fun to drive with over 300hp and rear wheel drive anywhere NEAR its price...you cant. And it's also quite cheap and easy to raise that 300 hp to 340 with just a few bolt ons...and 550 plus with a supercharger......and yes, still driven daily.

[acptulsa]

You lost me at 1976 eldorado. You old fart, you don't know crap!

Well now. Let's conduct a thought experiment, shall we? It's 2013, civilization as we know it has failed completely, and you can't get an engine control computer at any price to save your life. Furthermore, little oil is available, and you have your choice of vegetable oil and pure grain alchohol. Hell of a deal. Now, your car's injectors probably can't handle the alchohol and your computer won't last forever. Are you going to call someone who knows what 'rejet a carburetor' means and can rig up a points-and-condenser distributor with both centrifugal and vacuum advance an old fart and tell him he doesn't know shit? Because if you do, he's liable to drive away and let you continue on your nice, long walk...

Ya insolent little whipper snapper.

[angelatc]

It will be so nice for our military to have to get parts for the hummer from a Chinese company.

http://www.time.com/time/business/article/0,8599,1902478,00.html

THey're not selling the military HumVees - those aren't even made by Chrysler or GM.

[angelatc]

What hurt GM is they over-sized POS's and the UAW.

People keep saying that, but the big vehicles are the money makers. If people were buying itty bitty weenie cars, they'd sell them.

[JohnnyRebel]

http://www.autotrends.org/images/dodge-ram-laramie.jpg

http://www.ridelust.com/wp-content/uploads/2009_dodge_challenger.jpg

[angelatc]

http://www.ridelust.com/wp-content/uploads/2009_dodge_challenger.jpg

We *almost* bought a Challenger, but the view from the windshield was funky. Plus the interior just felt cheap. It was very cool to look at on the outside, but it seems like they cut a lot of costs on the interior.

I am glad that we didn't. Bailout seeking leeches that they are....

[acptulsa]

We *almost* bought a Challenger, but the view from the windshield was funky. Plus the interior just felt cheap. It was very cool to look at on the outside, but it seems like they cut a lot of costs on the interior.

I am glad that we didn't. Bailout seeking leeches that they are....

Well, that cheap interior is what enables them to make the Mercedes E-class mechanicals affordable--those and the pushrods in the pickup truck engines. I suppose it all comes down to whether you want your sophistication inside or underneath. I'm leadfoot enough to prefer the latter.

As for the leech part, well, I wish it was so simple. The government trashed Chrysler. They got loan guarantees before and paid those loans back, but by then they had forcibly been required to compete with two larger and richer corporations during a time of unprecedented regulation which cost them all millions in engineering investments, they were forced to cease all efforts to be a multinational at that time as part of their bankruptcy, they had to give up such profitable divisions as Chrysler Defense (General Dynamics got the M1 Abrams for a song), they had to get out of the heavy truck business because they couldn't afford to keep up with the unprecedented truck regulations and still keep their cars legal, and they got saddled with Iacocca trying to turn them into a second-rate imitation of Ford...

And all of this benefitted GM and Ford, but they didn't reinvest properly. Though Ford woke up and smelled the coffee after almost collapsing themselves.

I'd have a lot less patience with these two for taking bailouts if they had been able to operate in a free market. But they weren't. I have a lot less patience with GM than Chrysler because the former bribed a bunch of politicians to pass those automobile-ruining regulations in an obvious effort to kill Chrysler, and now they're hoisted on their own petard. Poetic justice, there. That said, I can tell you this. I'm not going to let these bailouts drive me to just any import brand, because the vast majority of them are much more heavily subsidized than any of ours.

Meanwhile, I want to start a car company. Only thing is, I want to build automobiles, and that's pretty much illegal. So, what I really want to do is to start a motorcycle company that builds enclosed motorcycles. Anyone want to invest?

[angelatc]

No, we're still buying Fords.

[acptulsa]

No, we're still buying Fords.

Fair enough. And I must admit, the one Mazda designed is a pretty damned nice little car. Toyo Kogyo ftw!

[silverhawks]

Also, figured this out this morning...remember the huge amount of pork set aside to remake the federal automobile fleet as "green" vehicles? Wonder who will get the contract to do that?

How many members of Congress own shares in the Big Three, I wonder?

It's all about the $$$.

[libertarian4321]

I will never buy another NEW car from GM or Chrysler .... EVER.

My friends and I have all made an agreement that we (our families as a whole) will never buy anything again from a company that was bailed out. We have also all agreed to no longer do business with any bank that has taken bailout money.



I'll buy from whomever gives me the best deal for my money- whether they got "bailed out" or not.

I'm not going to screw myself over just to make some pointless "statement" - I'll make the best deal I can.

[anaconda]

The cheapest new Corollas and Civics are 20k...while the competing U.S. markets are at 13-16k.


New Corollas start at $15,350

http://www.toyota.com/corolla/trims-prices.html

New Civics start at $15,305

http://automobiles.honda.com/civic/

[chadhb]

Well now. Let's conduct a thought experiment, shall we? It's 2013, civilization as we know it has failed completely, and you can't get an engine control computer at any price to save your life. Furthermore, little oil is available, and you have your choice of vegetable oil and pure grain alchohol. Hell of a deal. Now, your car's injectors probably can't handle the alchohol and your computer won't last forever. Are you going to call someone who knows what 'rejet a carburetor' means and can rig up a points-and-condenser distributor with both centrifugal and vacuum advance an old fart and tell him he doesn't know shit? Because if you do, he's liable to drive away and let you continue on your nice, long walk...

Ya insolent little whipper snapper.

No i'm referring to the comments about American Cars, i was using sarcasism about the 76. I personally don't know shit about carbs, but i can assure you i grew up building/racing EFi Mustangs. It's effing child's play to build a EFI car, 302 pushrod, Americans cars were ( pre-overhead cam) very easy to work on and great cars. There is an art to carbs, no doubt. Good post Grampa.