Libertarianism is The Next Step

[revolutionman]

I believe that libertarianism, and general progress toward a workable society in which each individual governs himself responsibly with consideration for his fellow man, is the natural next step in humanities social evolution.

The collectists believe the opposite, they believe that socialism and communism are the next step in human social evolution. I reject that simply because marxism goes against everything we know about humanity.

They like to point to mans social nature as evidence that marxism is natural, but they fail to acknowledge that mans social nature was evolved out of necessity, because man benefited from being a pack animal. Up until recently, those who could not pull their weight in society were discarded. The social relationship was no longer beneficial, and the disabled or uncooperative parties were left to fend for themselves and usually died, IF they were not killed outright as was the practice in certain times and places among certain peoples.

Tribalism evolved out of necessity first and foremost, for safety, and to alleviate the pressure of survival by sharing the burden with others. Mans social nature has outlived their original purpose, hence the rise of individualism and concepts of self reliance, natural human rights, and self determination.

Government in my opinion, is like organized religion, it is the human apendix of social constructs, once it was as important as any social construct, but evolution is slowly edging it out of existence.

Turning to bigger government now is backwards progress to the days of despots and monarchs, who taxed too much and controlled every aspect of society.

I declare that it is libertarianism with the ultimate goal of anarchy, perhaps in the distant future, that is the progressive forward thinking, logical next step in humanity.

It is big government ideology that is a throwback to the time of early man, where savage men with no written language or mathematics, needed to be directed in his every endeavor by Chiefs and Shamen.

The Individual, the Self, the Freudian Id, that is the future. The helplessly codependent community is the past.

in your romantic life, you would not continue a relationship with a person who was unaffectionate, unresponsive and did not want the same things from life as yourself?

So why should we as a society foster this same sort of relationship with strangers, who want everything and offer very little of any value?

The on reason i have been presented with is "To Keep the poor from revolting."

I'm as poor as anyone in America, and I am clamoring for libertarianism, because with government regulation out of my way, I can run a successful business, without worrying that one day the IRS will kick in my door and terrorize my family because i did not pay tribute.

Compliance with government bureaucracy, in my experience is the most expensive part of any small business venture. permits, licenses, insurance, certificates, taxation, all of it amounts to shackles on every human being regardless of class.

You could start a small business with $50 well spent dollars, IF the government didn't insist that it be paid thousands of dollars in tribute, just for you to be able to operate. Nevermind the money you spend complying with in shop regulation.

[diggronpaul]

Say NO to all "isms"!

YouTube - Cartoon predicts the future 50 years ago. This is amazing insight! (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WB6p5QPVhPI)

[Kraig]

I declare that it is libertarianism with the ultimate goal of anarchy, perhaps in the distant future, that is the progressive forward thinking, logical next step in humanity.

I agree completely!

[shenlu54]

I don't totally agree with you.I think the future of mankind,the future of our civilization is in the hands of man himself. From this point of view,socialism/destructionism is also a possible future,but it's the road to hell.

[RedStripe]

The Enlightenment failed insofar as it did not get us to true freedom. The paradigm was simply shifted from "God = power to rule" to "Democracy = power to rule".

I cannot imagine a truly advanced human civilization wherein there is still a state. States are primitive creations, based on violence and the "spook" of "authority" that is far more absurd than believing in a supernatural creator of the universe (yet many atheists are statists, :rolleyes:).

The key thing to remember about the state is that although they have enough firepower to fend off other states (think: criminal gangs in a turf war) and enough to suppress a partial violent revolution, the vast majority of their power comes from the masses belief that the state has a legitimate right to rule. In the age of priests and Big Religion Inc., it was relatively easy for the ruling class to incorporate the Church into the indoctrination of the people. People were helpless without the printing press, a middle class, etc. But of course every state is fundamentally founded on violence, although they prefer to to conceal that aspect as much as possible and rely on ideological control. Like the peasant's inability to compete with the ideological indoctrination of the Church and "divine rule" prior to the introduction of the printing press, they were also relatively defenseless against the state's superior brute force prior to the invention of personal firearms (technology promoting individual autonomy - but not always, look at Nazi Germany, Military Industrial Complex, Big Pharma, etc -> that's science co-opted by the state).

So this shift brought about by an ability of the people to break free of state control (both ideological and physical -> e.g. American revolution) forced the ruling class to develop a more complex system of control. They shifted to "democracy" and "constitutions" as a method of re-convincing the masses that the state was legitimate. This is the new divine rule.

Even today, however, the vast majority of the state's power comes from either people's faith in state authority, or their resigned belief that they may as well accept it for what it is. If everyone in the United States woke up tomorrow believing that the state had no 'authority' over them, and that police officers were just regular people dressed in funny outfits with a round piece of metal attached, the system would collapse instantly. It's held together by a collective belief system - the violence is primarily reserved for the deviant individuals or petty criminals, and, of course, other governments that stand in the way of our own. We are enslaved, not by force of arms, but by a belief system! The challenge is simply to chip away at this belief system bit by bit. Already 'democracy' can be viewed as a failure - it has not produced much better results than monarchy (100+ million dead in World Wars, nationalism, terrible laws, elites still run the show, etc).

The future of humanity is a free society. I'm not against collectivism per se, depending on how you define the term. I like social organizations, cooperatives, consumer unions, action groups, mutual aid societies, and a plethora of other voluntary collectives that spontaneous and essential to a functioning free society where individual freedom and creativity are maximized. We are, to some degree, a social creature. At the same time, we are highly intelligent problem-solvers with the capacity to reason for ourselves. Human society, comprised of individuals who may or may not participate in collective institutions, is not the result of genetic pre-programming like an ant colony, but rather is the result of billions of individuals making choices for themselves. It cannot be planned. Our imagination - a great blessing - can also become a great curse when we confuse ideology with reality and hold on to superstitious beliefs (statism) that crumble under a rational examination. Technology allowed us to throw off the yoke of feudalism, and it will once again give us the tools we need to rid ourselves of the oppressive state.

[heavenlyboy34]

The Enlightenment failed insofar as it did not get us to true freedom. The paradigm was simply shifted from "God = power to rule" to "Democracy = power to rule".

I cannot imagine a truly advanced human civilization wherein there is still a state. States are primitive creations, based on violence and the "spook" of "authority" that is far more absurd than believing in a supernatural creator of the universe (yet many atheists are statists, :rolleyes:).

The key thing to remember about the state is that although they have enough firepower to fend off other states (think: criminal gangs in a turf war) and enough to suppress a partial violent revolution, the vast majority of their power comes from the masses belief that the state has a legitimate right to rule. In the age of priests and Big Religion Inc., it was relatively easy for the ruling class to incorporate the Church into the indoctrination of the people. People were helpless without the printing press, a middle class, etc. But of course every state is fundamentally founded on violence, although they prefer to to conceal that aspect as much as possible and rely on ideological control. Like the peasant's inability to compete with the ideological indoctrination of the Church and "divine rule" prior to the introduction of the printing press, they were also relatively defenseless against the state's superior brute force prior to the invention of personal firearms (technology promoting individual autonomy - but not always, look at Nazi Germany, Military Industrial Complex, Big Pharma, etc -> that's science co-opted by the state).

So this shift brought about by an ability of the people to break free of state control (both ideological and physical -> e.g. American revolution) forced the ruling class to develop a more complex system of control. They shifted to "democracy" and "constitutions" as a method of re-convincing the masses that the state was legitimate. This is the new divine rule.

Even today, however, the vast majority of the state's power comes from either people's faith in state authority, or their resigned belief that they may as well accept it for what it is. If everyone in the United States woke up tomorrow believing that the state had no 'authority' over them, and that police officers were just regular people dressed in funny outfits with a round piece of metal attached, the system would collapse instantly. It's held together by a collective belief system - the violence is primarily reserved for the deviant individuals or petty criminals, and, of course, other governments that stand in the way of our own. We are enslaved, not by force of arms, but by a belief system! The challenge is simply to chip away at this belief system bit by bit. Already 'democracy' can be viewed as a failure - it has not produced much better results than monarchy (100+ million dead in World Wars, nationalism, terrible laws, elites still run the show, etc).

The future of humanity is a free society. I'm not against collectivism per se, depending on how you define the term. I like social organizations, cooperatives, consumer unions, action groups, mutual aid societies, and a plethora of other voluntary collectives that spontaneous and essential to a functioning free society where individual freedom and creativity are maximized. We are, to some degree, a social creature. At the same time, we are highly intelligent problem-solvers with the capacity to reason for ourselves. Human society, comprised of individuals who may or may not participate in collective institutions, is not the result of genetic pre-programming like an ant colony, but rather is the result of billions of individuals making choices for themselves. It cannot be planned. Our imagination - a great blessing - can also become a great curse when we confuse ideology with reality and hold on to superstitious beliefs (statism) that crumble under a rational examination. Technology allowed us to throw off the yoke of feudalism, and it will once again give us the tools we need to rid ourselves of the oppressive state.

BRAVO, good sir! I congratulate you on an excellent post! I hope all the rpf statists read it and learn from it. :D:):cool:

[MPN]

I honestly do not understand the anarchist views that so many members on this forum hold so dearly.

[heavenlyboy34]

I honestly do not understand the anarchist views that so many members on this forum hold so dearly.

Have you taken the time to read about it? :confused: Knowledge tends to help confused people. ;):)

[MPN]

Have you taken the time to read about it? :confused: Knowledge tends to help confused people. ;):)

Admittedly, my knowledge is modest. However, if you told me to read about communism I would still be confused as to how anyone could think that it could work.

(I know there is a bit of a discrepancy in the antonym use there (communism-anarachism), but it was the best I could do at the moment)

[heavenlyboy34]

Admittedly, my knowledge is modest. However, if you told me to read about communism I would still be confused as to how anyone could think that it could work.

(I know there is a bit of a discrepancy in the antonym use there (communism-anarachism), but it was the best I could do at the moment)

"True news (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DZNG-53P8Zg)" is a great ongoing youtube series about modern anarchist philosophy. I've included a few articles here for you as well. Also, check out the excellent book suggestions in the RPF book forum, such as "The Market For Liberty".
What Is Anarchy? (http://www.lewrockwell.com/shaffer/shaffer60.html)

Libertarian Anarchism: Responses to Ten Objections (http://www.lewrockwell.com/long/long11.html)

What It Means To Be an Anarcho-Capitalist (http://www.lewrockwell.com/kinsella/kinsella15.html)


(http://www.lewrockwell.com/alston/alston36.html)Anarchy, Anarchy – Wherefore Art Thou? (http://www.lewrockwell.com/alston/alston36.html)

[revolutionman]

to the hunter gatherers of prehistory such a thing as a republic or a democracy was unfathomable, they did not have the prerequisite knowledge to imagine such things. They still operated in the mode of most pack animals, the leader was the leader until he was over thrown by another. Man was still in the primal habit of fulfilling needs as they arised, with no forethought or foresight, only biological urges and habits inherited from generations past.

When i say anarchy in the distant future, I mean DISTANT future, when man is free of the ridiculous overemotional responses that make him a murderer, a rapist, a thief, a liar, and a cheater.

I'm not saying that emotion is our enemy, I'm saying there is a level of emotional response that most people are beholden to, that is clearly detrimental to the individual and therefore society as a whole. When emotion ceases to surpass reason in the human mindscape, individuals will no longer need an external system of governance to dictate and reprimand.

I'm not an advocate of anarchy in the here and now. Most people could not handle the responsibility of determining right and wrong on their own. But i think optimum freedom should be the ultimate goal of our species in socio political terms, and that means the end result would be anarchy, whenever we as a species could handle it.

For now, I advocate individualism over collectivism, and libertarianism over socialism. "Conservatism" over grossly misguided Liberalism.