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ryanduff
03-27-2009, 06:32 AM
http://www.kansascity.com/637/story/1109096.html


JEFFERSON CITY | The Missouri Highway Patrol this week retracted a controversial report on militia activity and will change how such reports are reviewed before being distributed to law enforcement agencies.

The Highway Patrol also will open an investigation into the origin of the report, which linked conservative groups with domestic terrorism and named former presidential candidates Ron Paul, Bob Barr and Chuck Baldwin.

The Highway Patrol’s announcement followed a news conference in which Lt. Gov. Peter Kinder, a Republican, suggested putting the director of public safety on administrative leave and investigating how the report was produced.

The uproar revolves around a report released last month by the Missouri Information Analysis Center, a “fusion center” for local, state and federal law enforcement agencies to collaborate on domestic security issues. The report concerned militia movements in Missouri and across the U.S., and described how they had evolved over the last several years.

But it suggested that domestic militias often subscribed to radical ideologies rooted in Christian views and opposition to immigration, abortion or federal taxes. The report also stated that it was “not uncommon” for militia members to support third-party political candidates.

The Highway Patrol’s superintendent, Col. James F. Keathley, released a memo saying the report did not meet the agency’s standard for quality and would not have been released if it had been seen by top officials.

“For that reason,” Keathley wrote, “I have ordered the MIAC to permanently cease distribution of the militia report.”

The memo noted the report was compiled by an employee of the information analysis center and reviewed only by the center director before being sent to law enforcement agencies across the state.

In the future, Keathley wrote, reports from the center will be reviewed by leaders of the Highway Patrol and the Department of Public Safety.

On Thursday, Gov. Jay Nixon, a Democrat, expressed support for Keathley’s order and distanced his administration from the process that allowed the report to be released.

“Under a previous system, MIAC would prepare and distribute these reports to law enforcement agencies without review or approval from the colonel of the Highway Patrol or the director of Public Safety,” Nixon said. “That’s simply not acceptable.”

Conservatives in Missouri and nationally have criticized the report for lumping people with conservative political views in with domestic terrorists and potentially opening them to harassment from law enforcement.

Before Keathley’s memo was released Wednesday, Kinder criticized the report for suggesting that only issues championed by conservatives motivated domestic terrorists. The report “slanders” opponents of abortion and critics of illegal immigration, he said.

“Under the guidance of the present director, who apparently must think it is Nixon’s secret service, the Department of Public Safety has taken on the new and sinister role of political profiling,” Kinder said.

Also troubling Kinder said, the report makes no mention of Islamic terrorists or those who might subscribe to ideologies associated with liberals, such as environmental radicals.

The state’s response to the conservative outcry over the report evolved over the last few weeks. In one early response, the information analysis center released a statement reaffirming its “regard for the Constitutions of the United States and Missouri” and expressing regret that “any citizens or groups were unintentionally offended by the content of the document.”

Then earlier this week, Department of Public Safety Director John M. Britt retracted the portions that noted third party and Republican presidential candidates by name and sent letters of apology to the politicians.

But even with the retraction and the investigation announced Wednesday, Britt should be suspended and the General Assembly should investigate how the report was prepared, Kinder said.

“Director Britt has still not answered any of the questions about what other reports may have been developed and the procedure behind these memos,” Kinder’s spokesman, Gary McElyea, said in a statement. “Until those questions are answered Mr. Britt should be placed on immediate leave.”

Britt had no comment.

Deborah K
03-27-2009, 07:17 AM
You know, this has gotten me wondering, are there other states who are doing this same sort of 'militia watch' / 'political profiling' that we just don't know about?

acptulsa
03-27-2009, 07:19 AM
You know, this has gotten me wondering, are there other states who are doing this same sort of 'militia watch' / 'political profiling' that we just don't know about?

If we knew about it we could answer. But many of us feel that there are--probably about forty-nine of them, and a few territories too.

Original_Intent
03-27-2009, 07:25 AM
It's a virtual certainty. I would be surprised if there are ANY states that have not gotten similar reports.

OK, maybe Hawaii, because they hang loose. :)

Deborah K
03-27-2009, 07:26 AM
If we knew about it we could answer. But many of us feel that there are--probably about forty-nine of them, and a few territories too.

Well, hopefully they got wind of this blunder. If I or my husband and kids (all grown - most RP supporters) were to get profiled, I'm not sure how I would respond to that. Should I keep a copy of that ridiculous document from MO in my glove box and whip it out to let the 'profiler' know that I'm on to them? Should I also keep the number of a high profile civil rights attorney in my cell phone directory?

I mean, how do we use this information to our advantage?

Bison
03-27-2009, 07:30 AM
Alex Jones claims he has been contacted by police in more than one state that says they received similar reports.

Whether its true or not I have no way to tell.

Bison

acptulsa
03-27-2009, 07:40 AM
I mean, how do we use this information to our advantage?

I assume you mean on a personal level, as we certainly are using it to expose, embarass and discredit them now. I don't know how to use it on a personal level, unless the knowledge enables us to talk to the cop (most cops are conservatives) get on a subject you're pretty sure he agrees with you on, and convince him you're human. Nothing calms a cop down and/or makes him want to give you a break like stating a view he wholeheartedly agrees with.

I see a lot of attitude around these forums like anyone in one of those uniforms is something other than human. This is an attitude that will get you nowhere with them as surely as it will get them nowhere with you. Cops have hearts and minds and we are much, much better off winning them over than convincing them we are what they say we are.

Cops, soldiers, whatever--they are humans, they have mamas, they may do 'their' dirty work but they are, in fact, of 'us'. They don't get in on the champaigne, those disco lights aren't mounted on the roofs of Bentleys. As soon as we forget that, the cops will too. Guaranteed.

Deborah K
03-27-2009, 07:58 AM
I assume you mean on a personal level, as we certainly are using it to expose, embarass and discredit them now. I don't know how to use it on a personal level, unless the knowledge enables us to talk to the cop (most cops are conservatives) get on a subject you're pretty sure he agrees with you on, and convince him you're human. Nothing calms a cop down and/or makes him want to give you a break like stating a view he wholeheartedly agrees with.

I see a lot of attitude around these forums like anyone in one of those uniforms is something other than human. This is an attitude that will get you nowhere with them as surely as it will get them nowhere with you. Cops have hearts and minds and we are much, much better off winning them over than convincing them we are what they say we are.

Cops, soldiers, whatever--they are humans, they have mamas, they may do 'their' dirty work but they are, in fact, of 'us'. They don't get in on the champaigne, those disco lights aren't mounted on the roofs of Bentleys. As soon as we forget that, the cops will too. Guaranteed.

I agree that there are those on this forum and elsewhere that view all cops as the enemy and that doesn't help matters. But I am of the opinion, from personal experience, and the experience of others close to me, that there is a "cop" mentality that is very hard to penetrate.

Dmitry Orlov puts it this way:


The police in the United States are a troubled group. Many of them lose all touch with people who are not "on the force" and most of them develop an us-versus-them mentality.

acptulsa
03-27-2009, 08:06 AM
I agree that there are those on this forum and elsewhere that view all cops as the enemy and that doesn't help matters. But I am of the opinion, from personal experience, and the experience of others close to me, that there is a "cop" mentality that is very hard to penetrate.

And their bosses encourage the 'us vs. them' mentality, as the MIAC report proves beyond a shadow of a doubt. This esoteric part of the whole incident will be harder to make hay out of, but if we can find a way to do it that could lead to the greatest victories of all. Here they are trying to get conservative cops to profile conservatives as the enemy. Surely we can find a way to make that backfire.

Yes, cops come into 'most any situation with their game faces on. What choice do they have? Yet, if you look not at their badge but at their eyes, and speak to them not as if they wrote the goofy laws but as if they have the very unenviable task of enforcing stupid and unpopular laws, you can get past that very quickly--and often have an interesting conversation.

Works for me. Again, it's all about attitude. I highly recommend an attitude of, "you may be working for 'them' but you're still one of 'us'". One, it will make all our lives much, much easier in the end. Two, it's the gospel truth.

Try this, the next time you're having a too heated encounter with a cop: "Why are you all over me like this? I notice the rich bastard who wrote this dumb law didn't put those disco lights on his Bentley for you." Make them laugh and redirect their frustration all at once, and see if your life doesn't get immediately better.

Deborah K
03-27-2009, 08:33 AM
In my situtation, I was very respectful, and fearful. I was very young, 20 at the time and was on my way to work. I was a waitress in my uniform. It was a male and female cop who pulled me over. They made me get out of the car and then laughed at my uniform, gruffly pushed me aside, I guess to get me out of the way of passing cars, and then never even ticketed me. They were very condescending toward me.

On another occasion, a few years ago, I "rolled" through a stop sign, cop pulls me over, another cop car comes, they both stand at the back of my car staring at it, then he comes up and asks me for my phone number. Dumbass that I was, I gave it to him and he wrote it on the palm of his hand, and then let me go.

My daughter had a cop who demanded that she let him in her apt. Luckily she knew her rights and told him no. He began to swear and threatened her with arrest, etc. She respectfully stood her ground, and he left. Never to return. It was over a disgruntled x-roommate who claimed she still had belongings in the apt. which she didn't.

acptulsa
03-27-2009, 08:37 AM
Yeah, they're only human and power corrupts. When you can't bring out the human in them, you must definitely stand your ground. That's what the Consitution is for--to ensure there's no absolute power to corrupt absolutely. And, no, not all cops will let you tickle their humanity--and some will make you wonder if they have any at all. But I've always considered it worth trying--and it usually has indeed been worth it.

As for fear, that's natural. But, one, fear makes them nervous as well, as frightened people are unpredictable, and two, they smell fear (like a dog) and while it makes the smarter ones suspicious at first and probably more compassionate if you don't really have good reason to be afraid (like a few pounds of contraband under the back seat), the dumb ones will (like a dog) just smell the fear and instinctively press their advantage...

Sounds like you raised your daughter well!

Deborah K
03-27-2009, 08:40 AM
Yeah, they're only human and power corrupts. When you can't bring out the human in them, you must definitely stand your ground. That's what the Consitution is for--to ensure there's no absolute power to corrupt absolutely. And, no, not all cops will let you tickle their humanity--and some will make you wonder if they have any at all. But I've always considered it worth trying--and it usually has indeed been worth it.

I agree. Always be respectful, try if you can to relate to them on a personal level, but know your rights.

acptulsa
03-27-2009, 08:42 AM
I agree. Always be respectful, try if you can to relate to them on a personal level, but know your rights.

Know your rights, have confidence in them, and so non-verbally remind the cop that his or her power is not absolute. And fight for the Constitution, so you can continue to have confidence in your rights!!

He Who Pawns
03-27-2009, 08:47 AM
All I can say is LAWL. :)

Reason
03-27-2009, 10:24 AM
already posted

http://www.ronpaulforums.com/showthread.php?t=185280

ronpaulhawaii
03-27-2009, 10:56 AM
I'd say we could do exactly what LRP did in every state; file FOI requests, and deliver lobby packs to all parties who may be involved, get our state legislators involved and passing laws to protect us from fanatical lobbying groups in DC/etc., get our federal reps to initiate/support a full federal investigation into the source/purpose of this document. And mainly, use this opportunity to begin to reverse the negative impression of the term militia, that groups such as ADL and SPLC have been creating for years. This can be a great opportunity for a national debate on the best way to provide for our common defense. The present course of militarizing/federalizing Law Enforcement is full of dangers and waste. A well regulated MILITIA, is necessary for our security in a free country. The vilification of the term Militia is at the heart of this document and that is where I think we can take some ground from the tyrants...

Further, this firestorm is giving notice to SPTB that RP supporters are a force to be reckoned with and to be treated with respect. Remember that the cops are not the enemy and that it is cops who leaked this. The document seems intended to further distance citizens from LEO, I'd like to see the opposite come true

Kill em wit kindness, and remember RP's prime directive to the grassroots; Have Fun.

acptulsa
03-27-2009, 10:59 AM
Mainly, we need to maintain momentum on this subject. Sure would help if there were a good source to link to on that strange partisan budget amendment vote in the Missouri House yesterday...

brandon
03-27-2009, 11:00 AM
already posted

http://www.ronpaulforums.com/showthread.php?t=185280

No this appears to be something new. The thread you linked only claimed MO was removing the references to BB RP and CB.

This news story says the entire report has been retracted, the directed has been put on leave, and an investigation into the origins of the report is starting.


This is a victory for us. Granted, it's a battle we should have never had to fight in the first place, but it's still a victory.

Deborah K
03-27-2009, 11:05 AM
i'd say we could do exactly what lrp did in every state; file foi requests, and deliver lobby packs to all parties who may be involved, get our state legislators involved and passing laws to protect us from fanatical lobbying groups in dc/etc., get our federal reps to initiate/support a full federal investigation into the source/purpose of this document. And mainly, use this opportunity to begin to reverse the negative impression of the term militia, that groups such as adl and splc have been creating for years. This can be a great opportunity for a national debate on the best way to provide for our common defense. The present course of militarizing/federalizing law enforcement is full of dangers and waste. A well regulated militia, is necessary for our security in a free country. The vilification of the term militia is at the heart of this document and that is where i think we can take some ground from the tyrants...

Further, this firestorm is giving notice to sptb that rp supporters are a force to be reckoned with and to be treated with respect. Remember that the cops are not the enemy and that it is cops who leaked this. The document seems intended to further distance citizens from leo, i'd like to see the opposite come true

kill em wit kindness, and remember rp's prime directive to the grassroots; have fun.


+1776

ShowMeLiberty
03-27-2009, 09:56 PM
I'd say we could do exactly what LRP did in every state; file FOI requests, and deliver lobby packs to all parties who may be involved, get our state legislators involved and passing laws to protect us from fanatical lobbying groups in DC/etc., get our federal reps to initiate/support a full federal investigation into the source/purpose of this document. And mainly, use this opportunity to begin to reverse the negative impression of the term militia, that groups such as ADL and SPLC have been creating for years. This can be a great opportunity for a national debate on the best way to provide for our common defense. The present course of militarizing/federalizing Law Enforcement is full of dangers and waste. A well regulated MILITIA, is necessary for our security in a free country. The vilification of the term Militia is at the heart of this document and that is where I think we can take some ground from the tyrants...

Further, this firestorm is giving notice to SPTB that RP supporters are a force to be reckoned with and to be treated with respect. Remember that the cops are not the enemy and that it is cops who leaked this. The document seems intended to further distance citizens from LEO, I'd like to see the opposite come true

Kill em wit kindness, and remember RP's prime directive to the grassroots; Have Fun.

This.