Liberty Activism With BALLS

[powerofreason]

Check out this youtube video of activism in Keene, NH (they are part of the free state project). Its a speech made to the local town bureaucrats at a town meeting.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Y-f8kM2SDtY&eurl=http%3A%2F%2Ffreekeene.com%2F&feature=player_embedded

Just imagine how uncomfortable Sam made the statists and bureaucrats present at the meeting. In another thread I mentioned wanting to run for town council so I could just constantly embarrass all the non-liberty supporters present by exposing what government is all about. This video shows what I was talking about.

[tremendoustie]

Check out this youtube video of activism in Keene, NH (they are part of the free state project). Its a speech made to the local town bureaucrats at a town meeting.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Y-f8kM2SDtY&eurl=http%3A%2F%2Ffreekeene.com%2F&feature=player_embedded

Just imagine how uncomfortable Sam made the statists and bureaucrats present at the meeting. In another thread I mentioned wanting to run for town council so I could just constantly embarrass all the non-liberty supporters present by exposing what government is all about. This video shows what I was talking about.

I saw this -- soo cool.

I hope to be moving to NH in the near future.

[FreeMama]

NICE.

Love the title of this thread too hehe :D

[fedup100]

Those bloated pasty faced tyrants are where the real power is in this country.

When will we wake up and take back the city councils nationwide, then the real fun will begin.

[malkusm]

I visited Free Keane's website a lot back during the primary season. They have some interesting stuff on there, it's worth a watch. Abstaining from paying income tax was the focus of one of their videos. There was also a series of videos where cops repeatedly harassed the guy who was filming outside the town hall, with no real legal impetus for it. They know their rights! :D

[ItsTime]

My Ron Paul meet up group has gotten word that Free Staters have been put on watch lists. We have not got hold of the list yet, but I am sure it looks like the Mo list.

People have been pulled over by NH state police and have been being asked "are you a free stater" or "are you part of the free state project"

I am sure others here could elaborate on this.


And we need MORE people showing up at town meetings and speaking out. A plan to get 20 or 30 people at a meeting is needed.

[powerofreason]

My Ron Paul meet up group has gotten word that Free Staters have been put on watch lists. We have not got hold of the list yet, but I am sure it looks like the Mo list.

People have been pulled over by NH state police and have been being asked "are you a free stater" or "are you part of the free state project"

I am sure others here could elaborate on this.


And we need MORE people showing up at town meetings and speaking out. A plan to get 20 or 30 people at a meeting is needed.

Yep thats not surprising. Just the other day Free Talk Live (a pro-liberty internationally syndicated radio show with FSP member hosts) host Ian Freeman advocated pro-liberty government employees sabotage whatever they could in their offices. Hide an AC adaptor, screw up the copy machine, fun stuff like that. Bet that pissed off some statists lmao!

[ItsTime]

Yep thats not surprising. Just the other day Free Talk Live (a pro-liberty internationally syndicated radio show with FSP member hosts) host Ian Freeman advocated pro-liberty government employees sabotage whatever they could in their offices. Hide an AC adaptor, screw up the copy machine, fun stuff like that. Bet that pissed off some statists lmao!

Well to be honest thats just fucking stupid. There are better things we should be doing.

[powerofreason]

Well to be honest thats just fucking stupid. There are better things we should be doing.

Nah man you're just a pussy. You gotta fight back any way you can.

[ItsTime]

Nah man you're just a pussy. You gotta fight back any way you can.

No I just have a brain.

[tremendoustie]

Yep thats not surprising. Just the other day Free Talk Live (a pro-liberty internationally syndicated radio show with FSP member hosts) host Ian Freeman advocated pro-liberty government employees sabotage whatever they could in their offices. Hide an AC adaptor, screw up the copy machine, fun stuff like that. Bet that pissed off some statists lmao!

I heard that, I thought it was pretty moronic, as well as immoral.

The only justifiable reason to sabotage government equipment is if it's directly used to attack people. That is, breaking it should prevent violence against someone. Your average ac adapter or copier doesn't come even close to fitting that description.

[powerofreason]

No I just have a brain.

Well why don't you use it and tell me why sabotaging the government is a bad idea.

[ItsTime]

Well why don't you use it and tell me why sabotaging the government is a bad idea.

Blowback is a two way street so you must choose your activism wisely.

[powerofreason]

I heard that, I thought it was pretty moronic, as well as immoral.

The only justifiable reason to sabotage government equipment is if it's directly used to attack people. That is, breaking it should prevent violence against someone. Your average ac adapter or copier doesn't come even close to fitting that description.

I disagree. The property that we are referring to is stolen. The government is a criminal organization, a looting and killing machine. There is absolutely nothing wrong with taking revenge against them in this way.

[powerofreason]

Blowback is a two way street so you must choose your activism wisely.

Obviously the trick is to not get caught but I don't see why that would be so difficult.

[ItsTime]

I disagree. The property that we are referring to is stolen. The government is a criminal organization, a looting and killing machine. There is absolutely nothing wrong with taking revenge against them in this way.

They would just have to loot and kill more to replace the items that you sabotaged. And your the actions of sabotage produced no productive outcome.

[powerofreason]

They would just have to loot and kill more to replace the items that you sabotaged. And your the actions of sabotage produced no productive outcome.

Oh yea? Would you tell the Nazi resistance not to harm any government property either? Get real man. If they want to commit more criminal acts thats their prerogative. No one else is responsible for their crimes. If you're not fighting them, you're helping them.

[tremendoustie]

I disagree. The property that we are referring to is stolen. The government is a criminal organization, a looting and killing machine. There is absolutely nothing wrong with taking revenge against them in this way.

It's not productive, they will just tax people more to replace those items, and it doesn't even serve a useful protest role.

Plus, many government functions actually do help people, they are just funded immorally.

For example, suppose Al Capone had a road repaving program, which he funded by extortion. I don't think it would be productive to break his road repaving gear - once the money is already stolen, people may as well get their roads paved.

You have to think, "what practical purpose will this serve", and hiding an AC adapter does absolutely nothing useful. No one's going to even perceive it as a protest against the state.

What Sam & Patrick did is far more effective.

[powerofreason]

And the productive outcome is that you have made the commission of their crimes just a little bit harder. They may have a tighter budget as a result of the sabotage and may have to do less harm than they originally planned. Raising taxes is a process its not just done automatically.

[tremendoustie]

Oh yea? Would you tell the Nazi resistance not to harm any government property either? Get real man. If they want to commit more criminal acts thats their prerogative. No one else is responsible for their crimes. If you're not fighting them, you're helping them.

There is a difference. While both the Nazis and our government are funded immorally, the use which the Nazis put the money to after it was stolen was predominantly violent and immoral as well, which is not true of our government -- especially local government.

[powerofreason]

It's not productive, they will just tax people more to replace those items, and it doesn't even serve a useful protest role.

Plus, many government functions actually do help people, they are just funded immorally.

For example, suppose Al Capone had a road repaving program, which he funded by extortion. I don't think it would be productive to break his road repaving gear - once the money is already stolen, people may as well get their roads paved.

You have to think, "what practical purpose will this serve", and hiding an AC adapter does absolutely nothing useful. No one's going to even perceive it as a protest against the state.

What Sam & Patrick did is far more effective.

If it only made someone feel a little bit less oppressed then I would still support that person's actions. Its not immoral to gum up the works of an immoral organization.

[powerofreason]

There is a difference. While both the Nazis and our government are funded immorally, the use which the Nazis put the money to after it was stolen was predominantly violent and immoral as well, which is not true of our government -- especially local government.

Of course there is a difference, but less of a difference than you seem to think.

[He Who Pawns]

Property taxes are should be abolished across the board. Otherwise, there is no "owning" of a home or property, you are simply leasing from the government.

BTW, trying to take over NH is a losing battle. All you free staters should move out west here to nevada, where you could actually succeed in forming large communities and taking over towns and municipalities.

[OferNave]

Property taxes are should be abolished across the board. Otherwise, there is no "owning" of a home or property, you are simply leasing from the government.

BTW, trying to take over NH is a losing battle. All you free staters should move out west here to nevada, where you could actually succeed in forming large communities and taking over towns and municipalities.

You're the millionth person to make the same suggestion/counter-argument against the FSP since it was founded seven years ago. Congrats.

How's your Nevada plan working out for you? Or are you just a talker, trying to diss the walkers?

[mczerone]

I heard that, I thought it was pretty moronic, as well as immoral.

The only justifiable reason to sabotage government equipment is if it's directly used to attack people. That is, breaking it should prevent violence against someone. Your average ac adapter or copier doesn't come even close to fitting that description.

I agree. To sabotage an administrative agency or to harm the services of security or justice ON WHICH WE ALL ARE FORCED TO RELY AND PAY INTO is WORSE THEFT than the taxation the government takes to (poorly) provide those services.

If you work for the IRS, DEA, ICE, DoD, please make the job harder to do and make your departments look as pathetic and expendable as you can (I could understand keeping the DoD, if it was actually limited to Defense - as the security service referenced above).

[tremendoustie]

Property taxes are should be abolished across the board. Otherwise, there is no "owning" of a home or property, you are simply leasing from the government.

BTW, trying to take over NH is a losing battle. All you free staters should move out west here to nevada, where you could actually succeed in forming large communities and taking over towns and municipalities.

Everyone wants the FSP to come to them. Unfortunately, that's not possible. I think NH is a great opportunity, and a beautiful state -- and progress is already being made. Perhaps you could visit sometime to see what's going on. If you like what you see, perhaps you could get your affairs in order and make a plan to move :).

[OferNave]

Everyone wants the FSP to come to them. Unfortunately, that's not possible. I think NH is a great opportunity, and a beautiful state -- and progress is already being made. Perhaps you could visit sometime to see what's going on. If you like what you see, perhaps you could get your affairs in order and make a plan to move :).

Exactly. Another way of saying it would be 678 birds in the hand (http://www.freestateproject.org/about/membership.php) is worth more than none in the bush.

As for sabotage, that's retarded. The only way to win this in the end is to convince the majority of people. It's a battle of philosophy. When it comes to life and death - when they're trying to get you on to the cattle cars - then sure, do what you gotta do, but until then, if you're trying to win the war, use your fingers and tongue.

[powerofreason]

Exactly. Another way of saying it would be 678 birds in the hand (http://www.freestateproject.org/about/membership.php) is worth more than none in the bush.

As for sabotage, that's retarded. The only way to win this in the end is to convince the majority of people. It's a battle of philosophy. When it comes to life and death - when they're trying to get you on to the cattle cars - then sure, do what you gotta do, but until then, if you're trying to win the war, use your fingers and tongue.

I say fight back in any way you can. Its definitely not IMMORAL, whatever you think of it.

[UnReconstructed]

What more are you doing?

[LittleLightShining]

Well to be honest thats just fucking stupid. There are better things we should be doing.+1


Nah man you're just a pussy. You gotta fight back any way you can.This is kinda immature, don't you think? Honestly, who's going to listen to someone spewing "liberty this" and "freedom that" while they're playing adolescent games like that?

[OferNave]

Exactly. Another way of saying it would be 678 birds in the hand (http://www.freestateproject.org/about/membership.php) is worth more than none in the bush.

Update: 679 birds in the hand

[mediahasyou]

HA. They were speechless.

[He Who Pawns]

You're the millionth person to make the same suggestion/counter-argument against the FSP since it was founded seven years ago. Congrats.

How's your Nevada plan working out for you? Or are you just a talker, trying to diss the walkers?

How is your NH plan working out?? Not very well. Ron Paul got humiliated in NH. You're in a tiny, freezing state infested with liberals and socialists... a place no one who lives in a state with decent weather wants to move to. Period. Why do you think your project is failing?

Wake up.

Pick a place like Nevada or New Mexico or whatever, where the weather is nice, the land is abundant and cheap, and much of the population is already libertarian. Remember, RP did quite well in Nevada... unlike NH.

IN NV, you could actually take over counties and eventually the state.

[tremendoustie]

How is your NH plan working out?? Not very well. Ron Paul got humiliated in NH. You're in a tiny, freezing state infested with liberals and socialists... a place no one who lives in a state with decent weather wants to move to. Period. Why do you think your project is failing?

Wake up.

Pick a place like Nevada or New Mexico or whatever, where the weather is nice, the land is abundant and cheap, and much of the population is already libertarian. Remember, RP did quite well in Nevada... unlike NH.

IN NV, you could actually take over counties and eventually the state.

http://www.freestateproject.org/files/101-Reasons-to-Move-to-NH.pdf

Enjoy :)

I've been to almost all of the lower 48 states, including those you mention, and lived in California, Illinois, and NH. NH is one of the most, if not the most beautiful place I've been to, seriously -- have you ever visited?

No seasons gets tiresome after a while, at least for me. I'd rather have four real seasons in NH -- a real spring with flowers and melting snow, a real summer with green trees and grass (with temps averaging in the 80s and 90s), a real fall with colors people come from europe to see, and yes, a real winter with snow and skiing.

The project is certainly not failing, there have been a great number of successes already. In no other state is it as easy to get political power -- there is a seat in the legislature for every 3000 people! I suggest you visit sometime, and see what 's going on -- maybe for PorcFest. It's cool if you can't move obviously, but at least you'd know what's up and what NH is like.

[He Who Pawns]

http://www.freestateproject.org/files/101-Reasons-to-Move-to-NH.pdf

Enjoy :)

I've been to almost all of the lower 48 states, including those you mention, and lived in California, Illinois, and NH. NH is one of the most, if not the most beautiful place I've been to, seriously -- have you ever visited?

No seasons gets tiresome after a while, at least for me. I'd rather have four real seasons in NH -- a real spring with flowers and melting snow, a real summer with green trees and grass (with temps averaging in the 80s and 90s), a real fall with colors people come from europe to see, and yes, a real winter with snow and skiing.

The project is certainly not failing, there have been a great number of successes already. In no other state is it as easy to get political power -- there is a seat in the legislature for every 3000 people! I suggest you visit sometime, and see what 's going on -- maybe for PorcFest. It's cool if you can't move obviously, but at least you'd know what's up and what NH is like.

Again, you can talk it up until the cows come home, but I am not moving to some tiny, freezing-balls state. And again, why did Ron Paul get humiliated in NH if things are going so well? We put a ton of effort into that state.

One of the toughest things for people to do is change course. But when you get on the wrong bus, the best thing to do is step off, change direction, and get on the right bus. And that bus is heading to .... Nevada! ;)

[CatherineBleish]

check out this youtube video of activism in keene, nh (they are part of the free state project). Its a speech made to the local town bureaucrats at a town meeting.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=y-f8km2sdty&eurl=http%3a%2f%2ffreekeene.com%2f&feature=player_embedded

just imagine how uncomfortable sam made the statists and bureaucrats present at the meeting. In another thread i mentioned wanting to run for town council so i could just constantly embarrass all the non-liberty supporters present by exposing what government is all about. This video shows what i was talking about.

gaaaaaaaaaaaaahhhh that is patrick from missouri! He helped set up www.libertyrestorationproject.org!! Patrick, i am so proud of you!!!!!!

[tremendoustie]

Again, you can talk it up until the cows come home, but I am not moving to some tiny, freezing-balls state. And again, why did Ron Paul get humiliated in NH if things are going so well? We put a ton of effort into that state.

One of the toughest things for people to do is change course. But when you get on the wrong bus, the best thing to do is step off, change direction, and get on the right bus. And that bus is heading to .... Nevada! ;)

1. Tiny is good, because activists can make it from one side of the state to the other for events. And I, for one, would rather deal with cold weather, where I can turn on the heat and wear a jacket outside, than roast in 110 degree plus weather and not be able to go outside comfortably at all.

2. NH is a primary state that had over 50% turnout, and NV is a caucus state that had under 10% turnout -- there's the difference.

[powerofreason]

That Sam guy is one ballsy man. Check out his other amazing videos at YouTube.com/obscuredtruth

[nbhadja]

How is your NH plan working out?? Not very well. Ron Paul got humiliated in NH. You're in a tiny, freezing state infested with liberals and socialists... a place no one who lives in a state with decent weather wants to move to. Period. Why do you think your project is failing?

Wake up.

Pick a place like Nevada or New Mexico or whatever, where the weather is nice, the land is abundant and cheap, and much of the population is already libertarian. Remember, RP did quite well in Nevada... unlike NH.

IN NV, you could actually take over counties and eventually the state.

I agree. I was very disappointed that the FSP picked NH as its location. The entire NE region is full of socialists, NH included. That is the reason they are making no progress.

There are so many better states they could have chosen like Montana or Nevada. Why the hell did they choose NH???

[RCA]

A++++++

[He Who Pawns]

1. Tiny is good, because activists can make it from one side of the state to the other for events. And I, for one, would rather deal with cold weather, where I can turn on the heat and wear a jacket outside, than roast in 110 degree plus weather and not be able to go outside comfortably at all.

2. NH is a primary state that had over 50% turnout, and NV is a caucus state that had under 10% turnout -- there's the difference.

Nevada has 2.6 million people and 110,567 square miles of land.

New Hampshire has 1.3 million people and 9,351 square miles of land.

Do the math.

Nevada is much less populated, and land is dirt cheap. You could buy up entire counties almost, and give everyone 40 acres and a mule. The people who live on those lands right now are more conservative, and tend to just want to be left alone. They will be ten times more open to our message and cause than the pinkos in the Northeast.

Also, Nevada is not "roasting"... it is not Arizona. I think you are confused about Nevada's climate. Did you see the snowfall in Vegas this year? The northern parts of the state don't get that hot.

And BTW, I am planning to buy some land there as early as next year.

[nayjevin]

Ron Paul got humiliated in NH.

Don't trust the primary numbers. I talked to several thousand people in New Hampshire during the primary season - and less than 10 admitted to being McCain supporters. Less Than Ten

[He Who Pawns]

Don't trust the primary numbers. I talked to several thousand people in New Hampshire during the primary season - and less than 10 admitted to being McCain supporters. Less Than Ten

:rolleyes::rolleyes:

You are deluding yourself, I'm afraid.

All of the people who think they can do anything significant in NH are deluding themselves. Face reality. Get off the wrong bus, and step onto the right one.

Use logic and reason.

[nayjevin]

I was very disappointed that the FSP picked NH as its location. The entire NE region is full of socialists, NH included. That is the reason they are making no progress.

There are so many better states they could have chosen like Montana or Nevada. Why the hell did they choose NH???

just read http://www.freestateproject.com this has been rehashed numerous times.

To say FSP is making no progress is absurdity... John Stossel mentioning liberty once on television in 1972 makes a difference.

[powerofreason]

+1

This is kinda immature, don't you think? Honestly, who's going to listen to someone spewing "liberty this" and "freedom that" while they're playing adolescent games like that?

He said "thats fucking stupid."

Funny how you don't manage to see why I responded that way.

[nayjevin]

All of the people who think they can do anything significant in NH are deluding themselves.

and do you think what you are doing here is significant? I say it is counter-productive. there is a free state Wyoming project you could be supporting, I believe.

[powerofreason]

I'd like to point out that the FSP has been very successful for the amount of people they have. They only have early movers right now, imagine what will happen when 20,000 sign-ups are reached! No other activism like this is being done anywhere else in the country. NH was picked for a lot of good reasons, and it was the right choice in my view. Some people don't like the fact that the best activists are moving to a state they don't like (or maybe there is some irrational hate of New England going on).

[nayjevin]

All of the people who think they can do anything significant in NH are deluding themselves. Face reality. Get off the wrong bus, and step onto the right one.

Use logic and reason.

lol

this really should go in the FSP forums dood. you should have tried to change people's minds when the decision was being made - not trying to change what you cannot.

start FSP Nevada and if you are correct the idea will float in the free market - I don't see the big deal.

[He Who Pawns]

and do you think what you are doing here is significant? I say it is counter-productive. there is a free state Wyoming project you could be supporting, I believe.

you can bang your head against a wall for ten years, or you can move over five feet and walk through the door. which makes more sense?

NH is the wrong place to try this. it's a clear mistake, IMO, and i am simply pointing this out.

like i said, i do plan to buy a significant amount of land in nevada as early as next year, and i will do a lot of research into the various counties before doing so. i have already been out there last year looking at land.

Wyoming is better than NH, but it's still balls cold up there in the winter, and people might not like that. nevada is much more mild, climate wise. but if i had to choose between Wyoming and NH, Wyoming makes much, much more sense. a lot of the Wyoming land is owned in massive blocks by extremely wealthy people - which i guess might be a good thing for us.

[powerofreason]

:rolleyes::rolleyes:

You are deluding yourself, I'm afraid.

All of the people who think they can do anything significant in NH are deluding themselves. Face reality. Get off the wrong bus, and step onto the right one.

Use logic and reason.

Well you can go mope in your state while we all have fun in NH. The logic and reason that applies here is that things have been set in motion for NH. Thats where its happening, so you can join us or stay behind. Thats all.

[He Who Pawns]

Well you can go mope in your state while we all have fun in NH. The logic and reason that applies here is that things have been set in motion for NH. Thats where its happening, so you can join us or stay behind. Thats all.

Yeah, you had a lot of fun chasing Hannity through the streets, and I applaud that, but you have made no real progress, because you picked the wrong damn state. Wake up.

[powerofreason]

Yeah, you had a lot of fun chasing Hannity through the streets, and I applaud that, but you have made no real progress, because you picked the wrong damn state. Wake up.

You're totally unaware of what has been happening in NH. Nevada is too big and has too many people. End of story. If you don't like cold weather enough not to come to New England then you're obviously not dedicated and I don't want you here anyways. There are 6 hardcore libertarian free staters in the NH state house. How many true libertarians are in the Nevada state house? My guess? None.

[CatherineBleish]

Yeah, you had a lot of fun chasing Hannity through the streets, and I applaud that, but you have made no real progress, because you picked the wrong damn state. Wake up.

All of our states are the right place - they have the ball rolling there - and Missouri has it rolling here - sounds like Oklahoma has it rolling, and a few others. If you want to get involved with folks you think are making a difference, just look around they aren't just confined to NH! I applaud what the folks in NH are doing - and in every state that is finding success in their efforts!

[nayjevin]

Yeah, you had a lot of fun chasing Hannity through the streets

may I suggest a url for you

http://www.angelfire.com/freepagesforu/HeWhoPawnsComplaintBlog/ButthurtNevada.info

[powerofreason]

may I suggest a url for you

http://www.angelfire.com/freepagesforu/HeWhoPawnsComplaintBlog/ButthurtNevada.info

404 error

[He Who Pawns]

Wow, the New Hampshire people are really in denial.

While NV has more people than NH, it also has VASTLY more land. It would be easy to buy up nearly entire counties and take them over. This could be done in a short period of time.

New Hampshire...

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/8/85/New_Hampshire_population_map.png

Nevada....

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/b/b0/Nevada_population_map.png

[powerofreason]

Wow, the New Hampshire people are really in denial.

While NV has more people than NH, it also has VASTLY more land. It would be easy to buy up nearly entire counties and take them over. This could be done in a short period of time.

New Hampshire...

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/8/85/New_Hampshire_population_map.png

Nevada....

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/b/b0/Nevada_population_map.png

Lots of land is a problem. And many of the people in the FSP are young and can't afford to buy land and build their own houses. I'm 18 years old. When I get to NH I'm going to rent, obviously. Nevada just has too many people and FSP members would end up being too spread out and diluted to do effective activism. Why don't you read the 100 reasons to move?

And most people in NH live in southern NH making everyone even closer together.

[powerofreason]

Besides, this is a pointless debate. The decision has been made. If you are dedicated, you will come to NH, otherwise you will stay all comfy in NV. Totally your choice.

[nayjevin]

and nevada has no income tax and excellent incorporation laws.

new hampshire has no seatbelt, helmet, or income tax, but has state run licquor stores.

nevada is dry and hot, though areas are mild and wonderful.

New Hampshire is cold most the year - but people are warm and gun ownership is high.

nevada has las vegas and reno within reasonable range.

new hampshire has boston and new york city.

There are pluses and minuses. They were hashed years ago at a MORE RELEVANT FORUM :)

off topic here.

where are the videos of Nevada activists? (I know they are around - I met some great RP supporters there).

Good work being done by many folks all over the place.

[He Who Pawns]

Lots of land is a problem. And many of the people in the FSP are young and can't afford to buy land and build their own houses. I'm 18 years old. When I get to NH I'm going to rent, obviously. Nevada just has too many people and FSP members would end up being too spread out and diluted to do effective activism. Why don't you read the 100 reasons to move?

And most people in NH live in southern NH making everyone even closer together.

Well guess what, a young person could actually afford a home or land in Nevada. Do you seriously think people are going to pack their homes up in California or Texas or Florida and and move to a tiny, frozen state like NH that is already overrun with socialists, liberals and communists?

That is delusional.

Again, I will point out that it is extremely difficult for people to realize and admit mistakes.. even when to others the mistake is obvious. It's especially tough if they are invested in it. You can bang your head against a brick wall in NH for the next 20 years, or you could pick up, turn around, and choose a better, more logical state... and actually take it over in half that time. Which makes more sense?

And I ask again, if things are going so well in NH, why did Ron Paul get humiliated there in 2008, despite a massive effort from all of the rest of us across the country at the time? And don't give me that BS about "voter fraud".... that's just a bunch of nonsense.

Wake up and smell the coffee. NH is, strategically, a loser.

[Chase]

That Sam guy is one ballsy man. Check out his other amazing videos at YouTube.com/obscuredtruth

Wow, I live in Plano... haha, this video rocks:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Vz1rC52Q2YE&feature=PlayList&p=69F71B6E1EE71E65&index=0

Does he post around here? I'd love to buy this guy a beer.

[ItsTime]

How is your NH plan working out?? Not very well. Ron Paul got humiliated in NH. You're in a tiny, freezing state infested with liberals and socialists... a place no one who lives in a state with decent weather wants to move to. Period. Why do you think your project is failing?

Wake up.

Pick a place like Nevada or New Mexico or whatever, where the weather is nice, the land is abundant and cheap, and much of the population is already libertarian. Remember, RP did quite well in Nevada... unlike NH.

IN NV, you could actually take over counties and eventually the state.

I have to agree. NH is lost to the liberals in most areas. My area however got 20+% for Ron Paul.

Nevada, New Mexico and Montana would have been better states. A lot of free staters fell for the New Hampshire moto "Live Free or Die" but to be honest most of NH is to the left and more people from Mass are moving in than free staters.

[politicsNproverbs]

Ouch. Looks like "Peter Schiff" above just isn't going to give NH any slack, lol.

For me, I'd be happy to be in either NH or NV, and out of hot sweaty Florida where you have to run the A/C just about all year long.

Maybe a "snowbird" arrangement would work... like the Canadians do... live in one place half the year, and the other state for the other half.

Either way, I appreciate the details re: the two states... I drove across Nevada once, Hwy 50, and it dang sure WAS ONE BIG GIANT EMPTY PLACE... but I liked it... it was the first time I ever saw guys in trucks with cowboy hats and rifles... Spent the night in Ely on the way to the Red State/Colorado. And that was back in 1975. From the big green map above, it still looks quite empty, as described by "Peter."

One of these days... outta here. Give me snow and seasons and fall leaves, which I think you can get in either NH or NV.

Now to go watch the videos...

[tremendoustie]

Well guess what, a young person could actually afford a home or land in Nevada. Do you seriously think people are going to pack their homes up in California or Texas or Florida and and move to a tiny, frozen state like NH that is already overrun with socialists, liberals and communists?

That is delusional.

Again, I will point out that it is extremely difficult for people to realize and admit mistakes.. even when to others the mistake is obvious. It's especially tough if they are invested in it. You can bang your head against a brick wall in NH for the next 20 years, or you could pick up, turn around, and choose a better, more logical state... and actually take it over in half that time. Which makes more sense?

And I ask again, if things are going so well in NH, why did Ron Paul get humiliated there in 2008, despite a massive effort from all of the rest of us across the country at the time? And don't give me that BS about "voter fraud".... that's just a bunch of nonsense.

Wake up and smell the coffee. NH is, strategically, a loser.

Did you ignore my post? NH is a primary state with over 50% turnout, NV is a caucus state with under 10% turnout. It's apples and oranges.

By the way, I live in California, and am preparting to do just that. NH is absolutely gorgeous, far more so than anything I've seen in CA and NV.

And, NH is not frozen, it is quite comfortable most of the year, and the rest of the time you just wear a jacket and hat. You might as well say NV is fried.

Look, you don't have to take part, but it's not going to change. The one beating his head against the wall is you, honestly. Have you ever been to NH? Did you read the 101 reasons?

Do you think it's just a coincidence that you think the best place in the country to move is the state you live in? ;) Almost everyone thinks their area is best, it's just the truth. I have heard people pitch for montana, west virginia, alabama, as well as several midwestern states, and alaska too.

By some remarkable coincidence, they all happened to be pitching the state they live in ...

Heck, for family meetings, my brother used to pitch the couch he was already sitting on, but that didn't make it the best. Many people, from many different places, voted to determine the free state, and NH won. These people were not irrational, I suggest you check out the reasons they decided the way they did.

[powerofreason]

Well guess what, a young person could actually afford a home or land in Nevada. Do you seriously think people are going to pack their homes up in California or Texas or Florida and and move to a tiny, frozen state like NH that is already overrun with socialists, liberals and communists?

That is delusional.

Again, I will point out that it is extremely difficult for people to realize and admit mistakes.. even when to others the mistake is obvious. It's especially tough if they are invested in it. You can bang your head against a brick wall in NH for the next 20 years, or you could pick up, turn around, and choose a better, more logical state... and actually take it over in half that time. Which makes more sense?

And I ask again, if things are going so well in NH, why did Ron Paul get humiliated there in 2008, despite a massive effort from all of the rest of us across the country at the time? And don't give me that BS about "voter fraud".... that's just a bunch of nonsense.

Wake up and smell the coffee. NH is, strategically, a loser.

NH is not full of socialists or communists. It does have a fair amount of conservatives and liberals though. Get real bud.

NH is not a "frozen state." If NH is a freezing state then NV is a boiling state. RP was humiliated in NH because he didn't do nearly enough events and there was very high turnout which is not good for libertarians.

NH is the place to go, its already been decided, people are moving, successes are being made, the Liberty Forum was a great success, and Porc Fest will be a ton of fun too.

If you want to stay angry and bitter in boiling NV thats your choice, the rest of us will get along just fine without your sparkling personality.

[nbhadja]

Did you ignore my post? NH is a primary state with over 50% turnout, NV is a caucus state with under 10% turnout. It's apples and oranges.

Exactly. This is why NV is much better than NH. In NV, less people vote so the free staters would make a much bigger difference in NV then they do in NH.

By the way, I live in California, and am preparting to do just that. NH is absolutely gorgeous, far more so than anything I've seen in CA and NV.


Do you think it's just a coincidence that you think the best place in the country to move is the state you live in? ;) Almost everyone thinks their area is best, it's just the truth. I have heard people pitch for montana, west virginia, alabama, as well as several midwestern states.

This has nothing to do with that though. Its pretty clear that Nevada, NM, Montana etc are MUCH better for free staters than NH. NH just has a whole lot more freedom hating liberals than those other states do. It is just the way it is and the election showed it. Ron Paul did so much better in other states like Montana then he did in liberal infested NH. I think the reason NH was chosen was because some of the freestaters did not want to live in a empty quiet area like Montana or NM and preferred the more lively NE scene.


__

[nayjevin]

Free State Project: http://tinyurl.com/atgkjc

[tremendoustie]

A few pictures of the "frozen state" just for reference:

http://tripcart.typepad.com/tripcart_the_blog/images/2007/09/11/sawyer_pond_by_cruadinx_at_flickr.jpg

http://www.newhampshiremainerealestate.com/m/blogs/nhmaine/Portsmouth%20Harbor%20Lighthouse%20-%20Coast%20Guard.jpg

http://www.saugus.net/Photos/new_hampshire/Hampton_Beach/new_hampshire_stock.jpg

http://www.sunapeegetaways.com/wp-content/uploads/2008/06/aerial-view-of-sunapee.jpg

http://techelectronicsstl.com/pikepond/wp-content/uploads/image/iStock_000004144833Small.jpg

http://www.dskendall.com/images/nh_bondcliff.jpg

http://hikethewhites.com/pemi/p07.jpg

http://www.cosmos.com/Common/Images/Destinations/autumn%20colors-white%20mountains-new%20hampshire.jpg

[powerofreason]

A few pictures of the "frozen state" just for reference:

http://tripcart.typepad.com/tripcart_the_blog/images/2007/09/11/sawyer_pond_by_cruadinx_at_flickr.jpg

http://www.newhampshiremainerealestate.com/m/blogs/nhmaine/Portsmouth%20Harbor%20Lighthouse%20-%20Coast%20Guard.jpg

http://www.saugus.net/Photos/new_hampshire/Hampton_Beach/new_hampshire_stock.jpg

http://www.sunapeegetaways.com/wp-content/uploads/2008/06/aerial-view-of-sunapee.jpg

http://techelectronicsstl.com/pikepond/wp-content/uploads/image/iStock_000004144833Small.jpg

Is that you on the canoe? Nice picture.

[nayjevin]

http://www.dskendall.com/images/nh_bondcliff.jpg

...

[tremendoustie]

Is that you on the canoe? Nice picture.

Not me, I'm a guy :p. It is a nice picture though.

[tremendoustie]

Here's a couple others of this frozen iceblock :D:

http://www.hamptonbeach.org/images/img-about.jpg

http://cozybeach.com/newhampshire/hamptonbeach.jpg

http://www.windweaver.com/sandcastles/liberty100103.jpg

http://www.hamptonbeachguide.com/img/Beaches.jpg

[powerofreason]

Not me, I'm a guy :p. It is a nice picture though.

Oh haha

[He Who Pawns]

NH is not full of socialists or communists. It does have a fair amount of conservatives and liberals though. Get real bud.

NH is not a "frozen state." If NH is a freezing state then NV is a boiling state. RP was humiliated in NH because he didn't do nearly enough events and there was very high turnout which is not good for libertarians.

NH is the place to go, its already been decided, people are moving, successes are being made, the Liberty Forum was a great success, and Porc Fest will be a ton of fun too.

If you want to stay angry and bitter in boiling NV thats your choice, the rest of us will get along just fine without your sparkling personality.

You're right... look at that Nevada water... I think I can see the water boiling from here!

http://farm1.static.flickr.com/35/122997492_151b9cf39c.jpg

http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3363/3251843013_21c8fdf504.jpg

Meanwhile, while you guys in NH are crammed 5 to an apartment huddled around a space heater, the Nevada Free Staters will be relaxing at our Lake Mead pads... just a short drive from Vegas. ;)

http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3118/2744345633_20cd0e7857.jpg

[nayjevin]

Meanwhile, while you guys in NH are crammed 5 to an apartment huddled around a space heater, the Nevada Free Staters will be relaxing at our Lake Mead pads... just a short drive from Vegas. ;)

competition drives the free market lol :)

[powerofreason]

Meanwhile, while you guys in NH are crammed 5 to an apartment huddled around a space heater, the Nevada Free Staters will be relaxing at our Lake Mead pads... just a short drive from Vegas. ;)

Yea, all 4 of you.

gl

[He Who Pawns]

Yea, all 4 of you.

gl

Pot, say hello to Kettle.

[nbhadja]

Yea, all 4 of you.

gl

That is a good thing that there is barely anyone there. It makes it easier to take over.

[nbhadja]

Here's a couple others of this frozen iceblock :D:

http://www.hamptonbeach.org/images/img-about.jpg

http://cozybeach.com/newhampshire/hamptonbeach.jpg

http://www.windweaver.com/sandcastles/liberty100103.jpg

http://www.hamptonbeachguide.com/img/Beaches.jpg

NH has many things, but beaches aren't much of a selling point for NH. Their water is freezing cold year round and very murky unclear water.

[tremendoustie]

NH has many things, but beaches aren't much of a selling point for NH. Their water is freezing cold year round and very murky unclear water.

Not true! I've swum in lake Winnepesaukee many times, for example, and the water was cristal clear and quite comfortable, at least May-September.

Perhaps the fresh water beaches may be be better than the ocean, I never spent much time at the ocean.

[powerofreason]

Pot, say hello to Kettle.

NH is where the action is bud. But I'm sure there's some nice Libertarian Party meetings in NV where you can argue with old men about bylaws, though.

[He Who Pawns]

NH is where the action is bud. But I'm sure there's some nice Libertarian Party meetings in NV where you can argue with old men about bylaws, though.

When we get Penn Gillette elected governor of Nevada, maybe you guys will finally wake up, throw in the towel, and move to a real Free state. ;)

[nbhadja]

Not true! I've swum in lake Winnepesaukee many times, for example, and the water was cristal clear and quite comfortable, at least May-September.

Perhaps the fresh water beaches may be be better than the ocean, I never spent much time at the ocean.

The lakes do look clear but they are still cold, but their salt water beaches are terrible.
Down here in Florida, it is the opposite- the beaches are amazing and warm, while the lakes are muddy and murky, plus they are infested with alligators so you will die if you swim in it.

[nbhadja]

NH is where the action is bud. But I'm sure there's some nice Libertarian Party meetings in NV where you can argue with old men about bylaws, though.

Actually Montana is. How the FSP picked NH over Montana is beyond me!


http://www.lewrockwell.com/blog/lewrw/archives/025957.html


Montana's Sound Money Bill
Posted by Karen DeCoster at March 22, 2009 05:10 PM

I heard from a member of Bob Wagner's family - the state rep who introduced the sound money bill in Montana. He writes: "There were no opponents. I was told this morning (trying to verify now) that the bill passed the house on a unanimous vote. The concept is being promoted as an "insurance" policy against dollar devaluation." Indeed, here's the YouTube of the hearings. I posted Part 10 because it has Wagner's closing statements and it verifies that there was no opposition to the bill.

Look at that, their sound money bill had NO OPPOSITION. Imagine if the FSP was there, it would do so much good.

No way in hell a sound money bill would have no opposition in NH.

[powerofreason]

Montana is big and empty. What the hell is there to do? Watch cattle eat grass?

[nbhadja]

Montana is big and empty. What the hell is there to do? Watch cattle eat grass?

Big and empty makes it a easier state to take over.
The FSP is supposed to be about FREEING A STATE, not enjoying the state. And the fact is that Montana is MUCH more liberty friendly than NH is.

The FSP dropped the ball by picking NH over Montana.

[dr. hfn]

What about NH's money bill?

[He Who Pawns]

Montana is big and empty. What the hell is there to do? Watch cattle eat grass?

You could watch the libertarians smoking the grass....

[powerofreason]

You could watch the libertarians smoking the grass....


Lmao

[literatim]

New Hampshire was listed as the freest state in the Union by a study.

http://www.mercatus.org/PublicationDetails.aspx?id=26154