What is the next step for the Revolution

[micahnelson]

We are between elections there seems to be a lack of organized activity. That leads me to believe that people are looking to the electoral process for change.

What sentiment best represents your thinking on how we should proceed.




We can work within the political structure. We influence small local elections, slowly taking root and building into a larger movement.

We can work within the political structure. We influence the GOP to reflect our views.

We can work within the political structure. We work with a third party.

We can work within our own political structure. We become involved in free state type projects, moving to a few locations and impact rapid change in a limited area.

Political solutions are no longer possible. We should have education campaigns and try to inform the population directly- within legal bounds.

Political solutions are no longer possible. We should encourage nonviolent civil disobedience.

Political solutions are no longer possible. I am eating popcorn and watching it burn.

[pcosmar]

I am on this end.


Political solutions are no longer possible. We should have education campaigns and try to inform the population directly- within legal bounds.

Political solutions are no longer possible. We should encourage nonviolent civil disobedience.

Political solutions are no longer possible. I am eating popcorn and watching it burn.

[Anti Federalist]

Fixed.

I'm in this group as well.


Political solutions are no longer possible. We should have education campaigns and try to inform the population directly- within legal bounds.

Political solutions are no longer possible. We should encourage nonviolent civil disobedience.

Political solutions are no longer possible. I am arming to the teeth.

[Matt Collins]

In Nashville it looks like we're going to take over our local Republican Party

[Athan]

We can work within the political structure. We influence small local elections, slowly taking root and building into a larger movement.

We can work within the political structure. We influence the GOP to reflect our views.

We can work within the political structure. We work with a third party.

We can work within our own political structure. We become involved in free state type projects, moving to a few locations and impact rapid change in a limited area.

Political solutions are no longer possible. We should have education campaigns and try to inform the population directly- within legal bounds.

Political solutions are no longer possible. We should encourage nonviolent civil disobedience.

Political solutions are no longer possible. I am eating popcorn and watching it burn.

We must secure our asset value and become an organized national community that can trade between each other and have rally points in case SHTF.

We should start organizations that help us separate from a failed economic state.

We start campaigning now for Ron 2012.

We discredit the neo-con leadership now.

Example:
Your using the term "Dire." You need to convince the American people the economy is in bad shape, and the war is lost, and its all based on a lie. That's not true."
Hannity on Economy Collapse 9/10/08

[xd9fan]

The next step?? notice people are buying guns and ammo?? hmmm

[Warrior_of_Freedom]

I am on this end.

Ditto, doesn't it say on the DOI we have the right to replace a wayward gov? Why should we wait?

[micahnelson]

Well, you guys are talking about armed rebellion in not so many words. I thought the fruitlessness of that was obvious, but...

Do you plan on taking the "militia" down to DC and ousting the government? Are you just going to defend your own property? Who are you going to be shooting? Police, Military? When the chips are down, do you really wanna bet on your personal cache against the government?

I don't think we are shooting our way out of this one folks, it may have worked when everyone had muskets- but times have changed. Its the information age and I think we fight this with information. Ive said it before, a violent revolution in the streets is meaningless, save that it is proceeded by a revolution in the mind- unless you plan on building a government of the people on the same vacant minds that established our current system.

[LittleLightShining]

Well, you guys are talking about armed rebellion in not so many words. I thought the fruitlessness of that was obvious, but...

Do you plan on taking the "militia" down to DC and ousting the government? Are you just going to defend your own property? Who are you going to be shooting? Police, Military? When the chips are down, do you really wanna bet on your personal cache against the government?

I don't think we are shooting our way out of this one folks, it may have worked when everyone had muskets- but times have changed. Its the information age and I think we fight this with information. Ive said it before, a violent revolution in the streets is meaningless, save that it is proceeded by a revolution in the mind- unless you plan on building a government of the people on the same vacant minds that established our current system.I agree but I sense less armed rebellion and more self-defense.

This is where I'm at right now:




We can work within the political structure. We influence small local elections, slowly taking root and building into a larger movement. Absolutely.

We can work within the political structure. We influence the GOP to reflect our views.

We can work within the political structure. We work with a third party.

Whatever party people feel comfortable with they should become actively engaged.


Political solutions are no longer possible. We should have education campaigns and try to inform the population directly- within legal bounds. Disagree on the first point agree on the second.

We should encourage nonviolent civil disobedience. I like what some folks in NH were doing-- finding ridiculous laws and breaking them in a very public manner.

I am eating popcorn and watching it burn. I think to some extent we're all in this camp.

[Andromeda]

I believe it's a mixture of things really.

We should never stop trying to change things through every political facet. But when the military comes knocking on my door, armed, wanting to take my guns from me. . . that's when it's time to take that revolutionary stand. When the government tells me that I can no longer have the right to free speech, then I have a SERIOUS problem with them. In my opinion, we're on the express train to Socialism and Censorship and that scares me.

I believe education is the most important method we will ever have. Educating young soon-to-be voters should be a top priority.

Lets keep trying to change the system from within while also physically standing up for our rights when the time comes.

[Pennsylvania]

Aren't most of us just waiting to see whether Dr. Paul will run in 2012? I would think the first step is just finding that out, so we can begin preparing for that, getting the word out.

[Mini-Me]

Well, you guys are talking about armed rebellion in not so many words. I thought the fruitlessness of that was obvious, but...

Do you plan on taking the "militia" down to DC and ousting the government? Are you just going to defend your own property? Who are you going to be shooting? Police, Military? When the chips are down, do you really wanna bet on your personal cache against the government?

I don't think we are shooting our way out of this one folks, it may have worked when everyone had muskets- but times have changed. Its the information age and I think we fight this with information. Ive said it before, a violent revolution in the streets is meaningless, save that it is proceeded by a revolution in the mind- unless you plan on building a government of the people on the same vacant minds that established our current system.

I'm starting to think the practical solution is probably a combination of education, civil disobedience, and the state-level electoral process.

[zach]

I'm thinking for the time being, we need to focus on a combination of stimulating education (appealing visual, audio for the masses), local elections to gain even more ground in various political arenas, and heavy support for a presidential candidate once he/she announces their run.

When SHTF, that's when we take a stronger turn against the tyranny through means of civil disobedience, forming liberty-minded communities, etc.

I think these two contrasting ideas are more intertwined than anything else, and in my opinion, they're definitely as important as any of the other choices.

Edit: I agree with Mini-Me.

[Anti Federalist]

Just as I am equally convinced we are not talking our way out of this.

Every rebellion had it's doubters...

"No, the English are too many! We will run...and we will live. Aye...Run, and you will live...for a little while." You know the rest of that speech, I'm sure.

Hell, if the "prags" had their way, we'd still be an English Colony.


Well, you guys are talking about armed rebellion in not so many words. I thought the fruitlessness of that was obvious, but...

Do you plan on taking the "militia" down to DC and ousting the government? Are you just going to defend your own property? Who are you going to be shooting? Police, Military? When the chips are down, do you really wanna bet on your personal cache against the government?

I don't think we are shooting our way out of this one folks, it may have worked when everyone had muskets- but times have changed. Its the information age and I think we fight this with information. Ive said it before, a violent revolution in the streets is meaningless, save that it is proceeded by a revolution in the mind- unless you plan on building a government of the people on the same vacant minds that established our current system.

[Andromeda]

I agree that media is the way to go.

Although, covering the streets in signs and putting paper advertisements all over power-line poles is hurting the environment and turning people off to the cause. Originally, I didn't even want to know more about Ron Paul because I saw so many of those "Revolution" with "evol" turned into "love" all over busy intersections in my city. I couldn't look anywhere along the side of the road without seeing some kind of Ron Paul advertisement. And no one came around to pick them up, they just gradually decayed on the side of the road.

YouTube and paying for local advertising on cable are probably the best ways at this point. A few signs or billboards here and there don't hurt anything either.

[constituent]

What sentiment best represents your thinking on how we should proceed.




We can work within our own political structure. We influence small local elections...

Political solutions are no longer possible. We should have education campaigns and try to inform the population directly- within legal bounds.

Political solutions are no longer possible. We should encourage nonviolent civil disobedience.

Political solutions are no longer possible. I am pouring gasoline and watching it burn.

Somewhere in the middle of the above (as amended, of course).

Right now my primary focus is local newspaper message boards for cities with populations < 100,000

[raystone]

Right now my primary focus is local newspaper message boards for cities with populations < 100,000


Please elaborate.

[constituent]

Please elaborate.


In response to posts made regarding an article about a mother whose home was being stolen for her son selling marijuana...


Comment From: exresident (Report this comment as a violation)

Mon Feb 16, 2009 20:32:49 CST
The comments on this page make me hang my head in disgust (not necessarily shame, but something close) knowing that I once called so many of you "neighbor."



Forget your opinions on this lady's social standing, forget about her son, and most importantly abandon your boot-licking love affair with "law" and "order." What is at issue here is self-ownership, nothing more and nothing less.



Sadly, judging by the comments so many of you have posted, it is clear that >90% of you view others (though certainly not yourselves, of that I have little doubt) as mere wards of the state, subject universally to the irrational whims of this schizophrenic demobocracy.



You have acquiesced to the ugliest, most vile of all human vices, the desire to control others through use of force and undue coercion as expressed through threats of violence and theft of property for those refusing to obey.



You have ceded the power once held by your fore bearers to positively shape your community and the lives of those around you through the positive example set by yourself.



and as society disintegrates...



You will have no one to blame but yourselves for abandoning both your natural (God given) rights and those of others in exchange for the privileges (selectively) bestowed upon you by the "authorities" you so eagerly serve and adore.



And for what?



So that the children of those you incarcerate today can, through sheer economic necessity (in addition to lack of any semblance of a family structure), become the pimps and pushers tempting your children tomorrow.



Shame on you, all of you, and "may your chains rest lightly..."


from a letter to the editor thread about the drinking age in the military


Comment From: exresident (Report this comment as a violation)

Mon Feb 16, 2009 21:51:35 CST
Correspondent wrote:

You know, when I read the opinions in the paper, I see a lot of people asking, "If we can die for our country at 18, why can't we drink a beer?"

....

IIRC, this phrase has its origins in an earlier era of American History when soldiers, many of whom were conscripted into service, asked similarly, "If we are are old enough to die for our country at 18, why are we not old enough to vote?" Now, setting aside what this phrase's modern incarnation says about our nation and society as a whole, take a moment to consider how different the world might be were we to ask instead "If we are old enough to kill for our country..."

Maybe then we wouldn't have to ask at all.

[RCA]

I agree that media is the way to go.

Although, covering the streets in signs and putting paper advertisements all over power-line poles is hurting the environment and turning people off to the cause. Originally, I didn't even want to know more about Ron Paul because I saw so many of those "Revolution" with "evol" turned into "love" all over busy intersections in my city. I couldn't look anywhere along the side of the road without seeing some kind of Ron Paul advertisement. And no one came around to pick them up, they just gradually decayed on the side of the road.

YouTube and paying for local advertising on cable are probably the best ways at this point. A few signs or billboards here and there don't hurt anything either.

Well it's a good thing you finally were converted! Also, welcome to the forums!

:D

[micahnelson]

Just as I am equally convinced we are not talking our way out of this.

Every rebellion had it's doubters...

"No, the English are too many! We will run...and we will live. Aye...Run, and you will live...for a little while." You know the rest of that speech, I'm sure.

Hell, if the "prags" had their way, we'd still be an English Colony.

Men with swords against men with swords.
Men with muskets against men with muskets.
Men with rifles against attack helicopters.

I think things are different this time, but thats not even really the point.

Are you planning on marching a militia to DC, or just defending your home? Well obviously if you try to defend your home, you'll get waco'd. If you try to get everyone together, you become an easy target.

And who do you shoot? Politicians? We elected them! The population is responsible for this. Take out the traitors, give the people back the government, and unless they are educated- they will elect more traitors.

My two cents at least, I'm not doubting your intentions at all. I just don't know if thats a road to liberty for us right now.

[benhaskins]

opportunity for change will be slow unless the economy becomes alot worse.

also, consider that the majority of voting americans considered obama change.
also, we are up against the influence of the msm (remember Y2k?).

I believe that education is the first priority.

[pcosmar]

Men with swords against men with swords.
Men with muskets against men with muskets.
Men with rifles against attack helicopters.

I think things are different this time, but thats not even really the point.

Are you planning on marching a militia to DC, or just defending your home? Well obviously if you try to defend your home, you'll get waco'd. If you try to get everyone together, you become an easy target.

And who do you shoot? Politicians? We elected them! The population is responsible for this. Take out the traitors, give the people back the government, and unless they are educated- they will elect more traitors.

My two cents at least, I'm not doubting your intentions at all. I just don't know if thats a road to liberty for us right now.

Well I have had about enough of naysayers. This kind of blantant ignorance does no one any good.

Men with rifles against attack helicopters.
Lets start there.
i have watched news video of children, uneducated and untrained take out helicopters with improvised munitions.
In Viet Nam we won a few battles, but lost a lot of men and never won against the village boys.

The Soviet Union spent years in Afghanistan, only to leave with their tail between their legs.
Modern armies have been beaten by primitive weapons and tactics.

I would rather Die standing for some thing, than live bowing to them.
I had great hope in Ron Paul and the movement that was sparked. I had hoped that the madness could be stopped peacefully.

I don't see that happening at this point. I do not expect to see another election, and if I do , i expect it will be just another show for the masses with no real substance.

I do not know if it is possible to win our liberty, but I will not accept slavery without resistance.

[micahnelson]

I do not know if it is possible to win our liberty, but I will not accept slavery without resistance.

Like I said... Thats not even the point.

Let's say you fight and win. (Assuming you know who the enemy is, and what victory means.)

Would a new government be established? Who would set it up? The people?

We have a government of the people right now, and 95% of those who even bothered to vote, voted for McCain or Obama. So where does that leave you?

A revolution must be won in the minds before it is fought in the streets- otherwise what do you have to show for your bloody revolution?

[pcosmar]

otherwise what do you have to show for your bloody revolution?

First , It is not my "Bloody revolution". It is my line in the sand. This far and no farther.
Second , we are reaching hearts and minds. What develops is yet to be seen.
I expect that TPTB would hold some areas, Large cities most likely.
Other areas would be ruled by warlords, the common result of anarchy, and other areas would be held by communities that can form some kind of working relationship with each other. Hopefully something not unlike our Constitution.

I would hope some good leaders would emerge.
that said , I see no hope for the continued system of corruption that we presently have. And there is no point in preserving it.

[mediahasyou]

Whatever we choose, we must have the media on our side first.

[pcosmar]

Whatever we choose, we must have the media on our side first.

The media is owned and controlled by the globalists, I doubt we can expect anything from them but trouble.

[micahnelson]

The media is owned and controlled by the globalists, I doubt we can expect anything from them but trouble.

I think a free internet provides us with the things the media should provide, but doesn't.

[The Dan]

First , It is not my "Bloody revolution". It is my line in the sand. This far and no farther.
Second , we are reaching hearts and minds. What develops is yet to be seen.
I expect that TPTB would hold some areas, Large cities most likely.
Other areas would be ruled by warlords, the common result of anarchy, and other areas would be held by communities that can form some kind of working relationship with each other. Hopefully something not unlike our Constitution.

I would hope some good leaders would emerge.
that said , I see no hope for the continued system of corruption that we presently have. And there is no point in preserving it.

I'd like to hear your response to Micahnelson's questions. It seems to me you're skipping many, many steps in the process. The situation is not nearly as bad as it needs to be to allow your scenario any viability. You also seem to be dismissing some very promising ideas which could bring about a peaceful victory in our country, or some peaceful victories, as irrelevant or standing no chance of success and therefore a waste of everyone's time. You sound like you've already been beaten.

[TER]

A great Russian saint once said, "Acquire the Spirit of Peace and a thousand souls around you will be saved."

[heavenlyboy34]

A great Russian saint once said, "Acquire the Spirit of Peace and a thousand souls around you will be saved."

Nice! Was it Saint Cyrill? :confused:

[TER]

Nice! Was it Saint Cyrill? :confused:

St. Seraphim of Sarov (http://orthodoxwiki.org/Seraphim_of_Sarov). One of the greatest saints in modern history. :)

[pcosmar]

I'd like to hear your response to Micahnelson's questions. It seems to me you're skipping many, many steps in the process. The situation is not nearly as bad as it needs to be to allow your scenario any viability. You also seem to be dismissing some very promising ideas which could bring about a peaceful victory in our country, or some peaceful victories, as irrelevant or standing no chance of success and therefore a waste of everyone's time. You sound like you've already been beaten.

What questions? All I heard was pessimism and passivity. Assuming we win? Who?
For some that means more welfare, and free ride socialism, Some are Fascists that would love to gain power.

I would like to see the Constitution restored. That is not going to happen. Fabian Socialists have controlled this country for over 70 years. We have been living under an occupation. They continue to exert their will and are destroying the fabric of this country.
I don't expect to "Win". I expect them to destroy this country.
I expect that when they succeed to cause an economic collapse or civil unrest by playing racial fears against each other, that there will be a breakdown. I expect after their caused collapse they will impose martial law and try to gain total control.
I expect that they will bring all this about. I need to do no more than survive and resist.
In my area there are a lot of like minded individuals, They have always been poor, but tough. hardened by harsh winters and skilled in survival.
I pity those in cities, those addicted to comforts.
they will have the hardest time adjusting.

[raystone]

In response to posts made regarding an article about a mother whose home was being stolen for her son selling marijuana...




from a letter to the editor thread about the drinking age in the military



Great, thanks..I'm engaged in same education technique in my local on-line paper comments. Most successful so far are my comments on the false dichotomy of the 2 party system. It seems to be validating other people's thinking, and opening a few eyes.

[Anti Federalist]

I'll expand more on this later, when I have some time.

Pete's already done a good job on touching on some of the issues here, that is to say, there will come a time, fast approaching, when it is on, this and no more, I will not be moved, I will not be swayed, I will resist.

That is a political version of a barroom fight. No holds barred, you don't really know what's going to happen, you are not planning or thinking or mapping your "strategic punches": you're throwing whatever you can, hoping to get out of it less bloodied than the other guy, and bail out before the cops show up or somebody starts shooting.

The larger question of widespread rebellion and what the goals are has little to do with the above scenario.

Briefly, my ideal world would have a "crack up", a dissolution of control at the fedgov level: states, or groups of states, free to form new alliances within the old boundaries of the US, much like what happened after the fall of the USSR. (most of which was peaceful btw)

I see the, now 30 states, legislation that has been introduced to formally declare the states sovereign and independent under the 10th amendment as a good start.

[Live_Free_Or_Die]

nt