List of Just Demands With Regards to Illegal Immigration

[Chosen]

List of just demands with regards to illegal immigration.


*No Amnesty.
*Deportation.
*Penalize workplaces that hire illegal aliens.
*Building of a border fence/wall.
*Enforcement at the Border. Adequate Border Patrol Agents and Equipment.
*National Guard at the border. Allowed to make arrests in defense of the border.
*Felony prosecution of illegal offenders.
*Current enforcement of existing immigration laws (as of May 17th 2007)
*No “anchor babies.”
*No “chain migration.”
*Mexican consulates are not allowed to interfere with investigations.
*Mexican consulates are not allowed to interfere with American School children and their education.
*Mexican special interest groups are not allowed to lobby for laws in the United States.
*Compensation given to all American citizens victimized by Illegal Aliens.
*Pardoning of Agent Hernandez.
*End to Sanctuary cities.
*States and Municipalities are responsible for enforcing Federal Immigration Laws.
*Illegal Alien Hiring Centers should be closed down.
*Any crime committed by an Illegal Alien is automatically a felony.
*Harboring, aiding and providing sanctuary to illegal aliens is a felony.
*Seperation of church and state. Santuary churches are violating this division by practicing political adventurism. This should be a felony.
*Senators and Congressmen should be forced, under penalty of perjury to attest to reading all legislation. They must also provide breifs on the items which are made available to the public.
*Illegal alien records should be made public as an accessible offender registry.
*Information about workplaces that hire illegals should be made public as an offender registry.
*Violation of the rule of law with the intention to create new political configurations is treason.

[constitutional]

Allow me to paraphrase that for you: protectionism.

I don't understand, if immigrants are illegal-- they can't practice the so called "chain migration". And does "violation of the rule of law with the intention to create new political configurations is treason" apply to legal immigration too?

[MRoCkEd]

* eliminate welfare, free-medical care, free public schooling, etc.
* AIGHT!

[misterx]

This country died when protectionism became a bad word.

[micahnelson]

This country died when protectionism became a bad word.

The Economy dies when it becomes a good word.



"Give me your tired, your poor,

Your huddled masses yearning to breathe free,

The wretched refuse of your teeming shore.

Send these, the homeless, tempest-tost to me,

I lift my lamp beside the golden door!"

Certainly end the social safety net, but people coming for a better life through hard work shouldn't be turned away. There is a limit to how many people the government can subsidize, but there is no limit to how much wealth can be created within a country.

Those who come to work and create- we should welcome with open arms.

[muzzled dogg]

end the welfare state and open the boarders

[micahnelson]

end the welfare state and open the boarders

here here huzzah.

[Chosen]

Quite often communists, socialists and other "roach on the porch" collectivists come out of the woodworks with support for amnesty and illegal aliens from Mexico. Most of the time with enough prodding, the supporter really exposes itself as racist. At the end of the day the open borders advocate generally supports illegal immigration from Mexico because they are the same race. It really is nothing more than Ethnic National Socialism masked with Marxist rhetoric. The only other supporters are global corporatists. The Amistad's comment is proof that, although the illegal alien immigration enforcement initiative and the rule of law are important to free Americans and the debate has been won time and time again,we will have to take time to re-educate.


Allow me to paraphrase that for you: protectionism.

I don't understand, if immigrants are illegal-- they can't practice the so called "chain migration". And does "violation of the rule of law with the intention to create new political configurations is treason" apply to legal immigration too?


Chain migration contributes to illegal immigration by further incentivising it. The chance of amnesty, lack of enforcement and special treatment by the law contribute in unison.

Committee report on H.R. 2202, p. 134.

The availability of "chain migration" not only distorts the selection criteria for legal immigrants, but may add additional incentive for people to attempt illegal immigration to the U.S. There is growing evidence that some families overseas pool their resources to pay the smuggling fee for one family member to illegally enter the U.S., in the hope that this family member will eventually gain legal status, and be able to petition for other family members.

Center For Immigration Studies:

Related to the build-up of immigration expectations, an entitlement mentality, and technical eligibility for a visa is chain migration. Chain migration of extended family members and vast backlogs lead to impatience and illegality. Though still keeping nuclear families of some permanent resident aliens apart for years, distant family members may cut in line and await their turn for an immigrant visa in the United States. The Jordan Commission recommended eliminating the distant relative categories in part to reunite LPRs' nuclear families more quickly, as well as acknowledgement that the national interest is not served by the chain migration categories. The very fact chain migration is an option, coupled with past mass amnesties and the ongoing proposals of mass legalization by prominent policymakers, stimulates illegal immigration.


Your second comment is by far one of the least intelligent I have yet to encounter on a public message board. I am not sure if you are attempting a comparative analogy or something of that nature, where you just forgot to tie the two together... My guess is you are spinning things. The comment is in regards to illegal immigration, why? Because they are not legal. They cannot influence the American political system because they are not citizens. I don't know if that can be made any simpler.

Amnesty defeats the rule of law by making the simple deceleration that an individual, not of a nations origin or citizen status can violate the current laws, then lobby that government to change the laws in their favor.


Further education on Amnesty:

Vernon Briggs, a Cornell University labor economics professor stated:

"The toleration of illegal immigration undermines all of our labor; it rips at the social fabric. It's a race to the bottom. The one who plays by the rules is penalized... a guest worker program guarantees wages will never go up, and there is no way American citizens can compete with guest workers."

An amnesty for illegal aliens forgives their act of illegal immigration and implicitly forgives other related illegal acts such as driving and working using false documents. The result of an amnesty is that large numbers of foreigners who illegally gained entry into the United States are rewarded with legal status for their breaking the law. In January, 2004 President Bush Proposed an earned legalization program for illegal aliens. This is an amnesty under another name.

Tidal wave of illegal immigration


For over 200 years, the United states only granted amnesty in individual cases and had never given amnesty to large numbers of illegal aliens. Then in 1986, Congress passed the Immigration Reform and Control Act (IRCA) which gave amnesty to all illegal aliens who had evaded law enforcement for at least four years or who were working illegally in agriculture. This resulted in 2.8 million illegal aliens being admitted as legal immigrants to the United States.

Because of chain migration, those granted amnesty have brought in an additional 142,000 dependents - relatives brought in to the United States to join their family members.

The amnesty of 1986 was supposed to be a "one time only" amnesty. Yet since 1986, Congress passed a total of 7 amnesties for illegal aliens:

1. The Immigration and Reform Control Act (IRCA) Amnesty of 1986 - the "one-time only" blanket amnesty for some 2.8 million illegal aliens.
2. Section 245(i) The Amnesty of 1994 - a temporary rolling amnesty for 578,000 illegal aliens.
3. Section 245(i) The Extension Amnesty of 1997 - an extension of the rolling amnesty created in 1994.
4. The Nicaraguan Adjustment and Central American Relief Act (NACARA) Amnesty of 1997 - an amnesty for nearly one million illegal aliens from Central America.
5. The Haitian Refugee Immigration Fairness Act Amnesty (HRIFA) of 1998 - an amnesty for 125,000 illegal aliens from Haiti.
6. The Late Amnesty of 2000 - an amnesty for approximately 400,000 illegal aliens who claimed they should have been amnestied under the 1986 IRCA amnesty.
7. The LIFE Act Amnesty of 2000 - a reinstatement of the rolling Section 245(i) amnesty to an estimated 900,000 illegal aliens.

An amnesty is a reward to those breaking the law. Issuing an amnesty to illegal aliens only encourages more illegal immigration into the United States. After the 1986 amnesty, illegal immigration increased significantly. Census Bureau 2000 data indicate that 700,000 to 800,000 illegal aliens settle in the U.S. each year, with approximately 8-11 million illegal aliens now currently living in the United States (up to 12 million, according to Department of Homeland Security Director Tom Ridge).

Yet an amnesty benefits neither our society nor those being amnestied. An Immigration and Naturalization Service study found that after living in the United States for 10 years, the average amnestied illegal alien had only a seventh grade education and earned less than $9,000 a year. Amnestied illegal aliens have no sponsor to support them financially. Instead, by enacting an amnesty, Congress places a staggering financial burden on American taxpayers to support those amnestied.

According to a study by the Center for Immigration Studies, the total net cost of the 1986 IRCA amnesty (direct and indirect costs of services and benefits to the former illegal aliens, less their tax contributions) amounted to over $78 billion in the ten years following the amnesty.

Congress has paved the way for more amnesties. In 2001, Mexico's President Vicente Fox began to lobby the United States to "regularize" the status of millions of illegal aliens from Mexico living in the United States. Both U.S. political parties, in attempts to pander to the Hispanic vote, speak of amnesties in various forms for illegal aliens.

By granting amnesties, Congress has set a dangerous precedent that threatens homeland security. Our normal immigration process involves screening to block potential criminals and terrorists from entering the United States. Yet millions of illegal aliens have avoided this screening and an amnesty would allow them to permanently bypass such screening.

Illegal immigration from Mexico is invasion.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0Y721T9nX0k

What is illegal immigration REALLY about?:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GIW-BZ8oLrk

More examples of ethnic national socialism from Mexico:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JCCVUot-hBo

Terrorists who support open borders:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=69wFvlZBB0o

By November 2006, 12 Americans were murdered by illegal aliens daily. (http://www.wnd.com/news/article.asp?ARTICLE_ID=53103)
Murder:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-Pbh_iiv7cE
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VVoWxUfC9Lo

Mayor of Los Angeles is a member of an extremist terrorist group called MeCha:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3TMwLq8tMfs

You cannot open the borders without being a soveriegnty and nation of laws. It isn't sufficient to say end the welfare state (with which I agree) and then say open the borders. They will not end the welfare state as you know, they are increasing it and furthering illegal immigration from Mexico.

So you enforce the laws, end the welfare state and then protect the borders.

[Chosen]

The Economy dies when it becomes a good word.



Certainly end the social safety net, but people coming for a better life through hard work shouldn't be turned away. There is a limit to how many people the government can subsidize, but there is no limit to how much wealth can be created within a country.

Those who come to work and create- we should welcome with open arms.Are you a socialist? Why would you be on a Ron Paul forum? The economy dies when it becomes a good word?! Are you kidding me? That is no longer worth a comment.

Most of what you just said is collectivist regurgitation. The point here is ILLEGAL immigration not legal. We cannot even sustain LEGAL immigration.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1pgz6ZCqhtg

[constitutional]

Chosen

I asked two honest questions, expecting two honest answers. I did not ask you to judge my intelligence. You are the one spinning my two questions into statements.

First of all, when you say "No chain migration" -- it means just that. How the fuck am I suppose to know you are only talking about extended families?

The second question had several reasons for me to ask. But now that I think about it, "violation of the rule of law with the intention to create new political configurations is treason" is one of the most extreme statement I have ever heard.

And if they won't end the Welfare system like you believe, forgot about your delusional "just demands with regards to illegal immigration" phobia list.

[nate895]

Are you a socialist? Why would you be on a Ron Paul forum? The economy dies when it becomes a good word?! Are you kidding me? That is no longer worth a comment.

Most of what you just said is collectivist regurgitation. The point here is ILLEGAL immigration not legal. We cannot even sustain LEGAL immigration.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1pgz6ZCqhtg

Economic protectionism (i.e., high tariffs) is bad for the economy because it raises prices on the consumer because it restricts supply; it is good for US corporations. However, open borders are good for producers and bad for the individual because people can flow across the border, and since our country would be better off in a laissez-faire system, there will be great incentives to cross the border.

We shouldn't allow the free flow of immigrants into this country because it is damaging to liberty at home. Because everyone will want to come here because we are so much better off, wages will be driven down and that will lead to the demand from the lower classes to set minimum wages which will destroy our economy and liberty.

[Kalifornia]

I am tired of this ancap nonsense.

open borders = globalism => we are the suckers in the prisoners dilema => devolution to economic feudalism => loss of liberty

the problem is that in order to play the non protectionism game, so that everyone profits, everyone has to play by the same rules. In order to make everyone play by the same rules, we need world government. Once we have world government, we lose sovereignty, and no longer have control of the rules.

the reason why nonprotectionism between the US states works is that the Feds keep states from cheating. Considering the serious problems we already have with that level of power centralization, I cant even begin to contemplate allowing for a wider game.

trade is good when it serves our national interest. it only serves our national interest when our trading partners markets are as open to us as our are to them. right now that isnt happening.

[slothman]

P.S. I don't actuall have a opinion on how to treat illegal immigrants but I do disagree with some of the rules.


List of just demands with regards to illegal immigration.
1 *Building of a border fence/wall.
2 *Enforcement at the Border. Adequate Border Patrol Agents and Equipment.
3 *National Guard at the border. Allowed to make arrests in defense of the border.
4 *Current enforcement of existing immigration laws (as of May 17th 2007)
5 *Pardoning of Agent Hernandez.
6 *States and Municipalities are responsible for enforcing Federal Immigration Laws.
7 *Any crime committed by an Illegal Alien is automatically a felony.
8 *Illegal alien records should be made public as an accessible offender registry.
9 *Information about workplaces that hire illegals should be made public as an offender registry.


1,2,3. I don't think there should be a fence.
It is too expensive and reminds me of fenced communities which I abhore because of elitism.
4.What is special of May 17th 2007?
5.If he is who I think he is then keep him in jail.
I heard about him a while ago but can't find him on google.

6. What if they don't enforce them?
They get no federal money?
They shouldn't anyways; it is for the national gov't to enforce national gov't laws.
7.Jaywalking should be a minor, if illegal at all, crime.
8,9. I don't like registries of any crimes.

Shouldn't we get rid of the Statue of Liberty?
It was made to welcome immigrants which I assume you want a plethora of via making illegals legal.

[AutoDas]

You're in Seattle. What kind of illegal immigrants do we get here? These lowlife workers all come for the welfare state.

[angelatc]

Free trade is an ideology. Fair trade is attainable. Its really stupid to open the borders to nations who don't give us the same courtesy. Trade deficits are worse for the country than protectionism.

[micahnelson]

Are you a socialist? Why would you be on a Ron Paul forum? The economy dies when it becomes a good word?! Are you kidding me? That is no longer worth a comment.

Most of what you just said is collectivist regurgitation. The point here is ILLEGAL immigration not legal. We cannot even sustain LEGAL immigration.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1pgz6ZCqhtg

Yes. Youve outed me. I am a socialist. Damn you chosen. Damn you straight to your capitalist hell.

Protectionism is market manipulation, and as supporter of the free market, I oppose protectionism. The consumer, the individual, should have the right to do what he or she feels is best with the money they have. If the government closes markets, including the labor market, to bolster any particular industry or region they limit the rights of the individual.

"Buy American" patriotism may help the company, but in the long run it doesn't help us. The best thing a consumer can do is get the best price possible for the money they earn.

If people want to come to this country and work, I support them. Americans don't have to be white. If you want to lock the border to people seeking a better life- then by all means advocate it. If you don't call me a socialist, I won't call you a blind racist bigot. Deal?

[micahnelson]

Free trade is an ideology. Fair trade is attainable. Its really stupid to open the borders to nations who don't give us the same courtesy. Trade deficits are worse for the country than protectionism.

The trade deficit with China is working in our favor. We give them pieces of paper, they give us products. Yeah, the system will all come crashing down- but when it does they will be holding paper and we will be holding cell phones.

[Kalifornia]

The trade deficit with China is working in our favor. We give them pieces of paper, they give us products. Yeah, the system will all come crashing down- but when it does they will be holding paper and we will be holding cell phones.

those pieces of paper will entitle them to our homes....

[micahnelson]

those pieces of paper will entitle them to our homes....

Its either china through currency manipulation or the federal government with this "Bad Bank" idea.

Nobody wants to take possession of your home. What they want is for you to pay them a cut for the right to live there. It's like being a serf. The baron doesn't need all that land- and is better off if its being used. You just have to pay lip service to the baron, send him his cut, and if your teenage daughter comes out attractive, or your son seems like he would be good in a fight, they want your children too.

If I have to send tribute Id rather it go to China, at least the check will take longer in the mail.

I'm saying that in jest- of course. I don't own land or a home. I'm paying the mortgage for my landlord.