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paulitics
09-12-2007, 06:58 PM
We need to get on the ball ASAP. Polls are showing 5% in NH, which realistically translates between 10 and 15%. There have been several articles in various blogs elaborating why the true support lies somewhere between 2 to 3 times what a telephone poll suggests. The ground troops taking general polls seem to reflect the same thing...that 5% is not even close. If any NH member is experiencing something different, I'd like to know.


Now, what this means is that we can win NH! A win in NH, is huge, especially considering the main objection we hear is "he can't win". Rememeber Stephonolopus taunting us? This would be headline news immediately catapulting the campaign into top tier, dramatically increasing Paul's polling numbers across the country including Iowa and South Carolina. It would energize the entire campaign to get out the vote in huge numbers. Every state would benefit in huge mainstream media news equaling millions of dollars.

The NH meetup members are doing a good job for their state. However, due to the importance of this event, this should be a national grassroots effort.

What I would like is maybe a plan for each marketing idea, and perhaps a sticky thread for some of them where we can hash out ideas. Right now there is no coherent strategy, to meet our goals, and duplication of efforts will occur. There are very few threads on NH when there should be dozens and we are getting very close to the deadline for registration in the state. So we should be hashing out some marketing strategies and communicating the progress being made.

What are we going to do for the following?:


1) Mail out program. Are the headquarters going to be sending us a list this time and when? How many people are we targeting? Will we send out to independents and democrats? Do we have any effective flyers to send out?
2) TV and radio ads? How many people working on this? I think there should be several different ones, not just a couple.
3) TV and Radio appearances. Do meetup groups need help contacting tv and radio? Any progress getting RP to appear, or is it a campaign headquarters issue.
4) Newspaper articles. Is anyone gifted in writing that can write editorials, do we know anyone on the inside that can publish RP articles for us?
5) Newspaper ads.
6) DVDs
7) Financing.


If you have any talent any any of these areas, or have ideas please take initiative. Or maybe pick one of these that you can devote some time to and motivate people to hop on board with it. Put up a sticky thread and lead.
I think we need to saturate NH with the message of liberty. The message is still not penetrating enough, esp RPs stance on taxes, 2nd amendment, immigration, national ID, etc. I would like to concentrate more on these issues than just the war.

I would also like to say this. This is not some grand centralized power scheme to take control over your life.... a month ago some people poo pood any strategy plan as collectivism and since then not much is getting done.

Some things work better as a group working together to promote freedom, than many individuals that work apart. The founding fathers would have never defeated the British if the couldn't figure this out. In a political campaign, in business, in anything there must be goals, strategies, and plans. I'm a pro market guy, and as libertarian as they come, but do you think a business can compete in the real world without goals and strategies to implement them? I would argue it is the same with a political campaign, and perhaps libertarians do to much infighting to compete with our collectivist competitiors. But this is the future.

What is effective as individuals at a local level are the things we should be doing already, like handing out flyers, knocking on doors, etc. Matter of fact, they work better as individuals than with a group. Even the internet works best this way. One creative person can make a youtube video or write a digg article and make a huge difference. Total freedom of speech. But due to the overwhelming barriers the OLD MEDIA presents, it takes many people with $$ working together to break through.

Like the Iowa straw poll, the NH primary needs to be a national effort, with hundreds or thousands of volunteers, if we are to stand a chance. We do not have the media as our friends like Rudy McRomson. The stakes on this one are a hundred times higher than the Iowa straw poll. It will literally make or break the campaign. Unfortunately I do not see the national campaign, or even Ron Paul himself putting enough effort into NH. It is going to be up to us to deliver the message for him.

If we want to use this board as primarily a current events board, fine, but time is running out. We all know how high the stakes are.

JosephTheLibertarian
09-12-2007, 07:00 PM
My plan for NH is to basically sit back and see what you all do. I will, however, be donating $100...

wgadget
09-12-2007, 07:35 PM
Someone over at the Daily Paul is thinking about this very same issue. I hope the link works properly.

http://dailypaul.com/node/1978

quickmike
09-12-2007, 07:57 PM
This question should have been asked back in May sometime. By the end of September all the RP supporters in NH will be freaking out saying "ok guys were almost out of time, we gotta start taking this serious." I know some NH supporters are working their asses off to make things happen and spread the word, but I would guess an even larger number are doing nothing except maybe a bumper sticker on the car, maybe a t-shirt and a yard sign. Every single able bodied RP supporter in NH should have been out in their respective neighborhoods handing out flyers a long time ago. They wait till now to do something? Imagine the thousands and thousands of people who dont know who Ron Paul is, who would have known about him by now if this was done 2 months ago.


Sad to even think about.

skiingff
09-12-2007, 08:00 PM
We all know what I'm trying to do.

I can head up the TV commercial part with Xar and others. In 5 days from NOW, our TV ads actually start airing in NH.

skiingff
09-12-2007, 08:02 PM
Here is the schedule for the Merrimack / Londonderry areas of NH:


http://www.operationnh.com/cost.JPG

http://www.operationnh.com/spots.JPG


It's a start.

Geronimo
09-12-2007, 08:06 PM
Sorry, but I don't like knocking on people's doors, or walking up to strangers handing out literature.

Although, I did email NHPR (http://www.nhpr.org/), begging them to have Ron Paul on their show called "The Exchange". If they can have Duncan Hunter on for an hour they can certainly accommodate Ron Paul.

http://www.nhpr.org

wgadget
09-12-2007, 08:08 PM
Give me a list of NH voters (I'll take Dems, Indys, Repubs, anything) and I'll start writing them handwritten letters.

Bring it on....

wgadget
09-12-2007, 08:09 PM
Sorry, but I don't like knocking on people's doors, or walking up to strangers handing out literature.

Although, I did email NHPR (http://www.nhpr.org/), begging them to have Ron Paul on their show called "The Exchange". If they can have Duncan Hunter on for an hour they can certainly accommodate Ron Paul.

http://www.nhpr.org

LOL. I didn't think I would either, and handing out literature is out of my comfort zone, but ya do what ya gotta do for RP!! It gets easier with practice, and it can be VERY rewarding.

:D

quickmike
09-12-2007, 08:11 PM
Here is the schedule for the Merrimack / Londonderry areas of NH:


http://www.operationnh.com/cost.JPG

http://www.operationnh.com/spots.JPG


It's a start.

thats awesome...................way to go!!!

quickmike
09-12-2007, 08:15 PM
Sorry, but I don't like knocking on people's doors, or walking up to strangers handing out literature.

Although, I did email NHPR (http://www.nhpr.org/), begging them to have Ron Paul on their show called "The Exchange". If they can have Duncan Hunter on for an hour they can certainly accommodate Ron Paul.

http://www.nhpr.org

True, but Having Hillary Clinton or any of those other shills in the whitehouse shoud be even MORE outside of your comfort zone than a simple flyer handout. Give it a try and I bet you will find that its not so bad once youve done about 10 of them. Youll probably find that it makes you feel good knowing that you just educated someone. I know it does alot for me knowing someone who would have never known who Ron Paul is, now knows exactly who he is.

paulitics
09-12-2007, 08:15 PM
This question should have been asked back in May sometime. By the end of September all the RP supporters in NH will be freaking out saying "ok guys were almost out of time, we gotta start taking this serious." I know some NH supporters are working their asses off to make things happen and spread the word, but I would guess an even larger number are doing nothing except maybe a bumper sticker on the car, maybe a t-shirt and a yard sign. Every single able bodied RP supporter in NH should have been out in their respective neighborhoods handing out flyers a long time ago. They wait till now to do something? Imagine the thousands and thousands of people who dont know who Ron Paul is, who would have known about him by now if this was done 2 months ago.


Sad to even think about.

True, but that is the nature of people. 10% of the people do 90% of the work will never change. Thats why we know NH is going to take a hell of alot more work than the meetup groups can handle. I think this state will need to be flooded with a media campaign. And we are going to have to work smart not just hard. We need talent, and coordinated effort on each strategy. I think we should all pick one idea that we believe in, that we can do, and put the time and energy into it. I think our results will improve dramatically.

wgadget
09-12-2007, 08:18 PM
WOW, skiing, those NH'ers will be saturated with RP! Great!

paulitics
09-12-2007, 08:24 PM
Give me a list of NH voters (I'll take Dems, Indys, Repubs, anything) and I'll start writing them handwritten letters.

Bring it on....

Does anyone have access to a list here? And will this list target independents? I think we should go after them too, not just republicans being that they are our largest demographic. 2nd. Does anyone have an effective mailout or letter that worked well in Iowa? If not, I think we should come up with one this time, and get this rollin.

Eric21ND
09-12-2007, 08:33 PM
I was just going to start this thread. I'm starting to get concerned about exactly what the heck is going on in NH. NH is so damn important to us it really makes or breaks the campaign. The efforts to get Ron Paul's name out in our local communities is great, but we really need to priortize and saturate NH and the early primary states with EVERYTHING we got.

For people that don't like going up to others, just place your Ron Paul handouts in local newspapers or school newspapers, flier cars in the parking lot, flier houses and apartments. We should also provide people with voter registration forms with envelopes with stamps on them ready to mail!

Are we taking our eye off the ball here????

paulitics
09-12-2007, 08:38 PM
I was just going to start this thread. I'm starting to get concerned about exactly what the heck is going on in NH. NH is so damn important to us it really makes or breaks the campaign. The efforts to get Ron Paul's name out in our local communities is great, but we really need to priortize and saturate NH and the early primary states with EVERYTHING we got.

For people that don't like going up to others, just place your Ron Paul handouts in local newspapers or school newspapers, flier cars in the parking lot, flier houses and apartments. We should also provide people with voter registration forms with envelopes with stamps on them ready to mail!

Are we taking our eye off the ball here????

Im not sure I follow. Voter registration forms when we send a ROn Paul mailout? Maybe to independents, Is that what you mean?

abstrusezincate
09-12-2007, 08:45 PM
Let me tell you where things stand. People are doing things.

1) An alliance of northeastern meetups is coming together to provide support to both the grassroots effort and the national campaign in New Hampshire. We've begun having conversations and discussing issues, and Jim Forsythe (he heads NHHQ, basically) is already aware of our support and drawing upon that. We hope this alliance will be able to undertake many projects and work in conjunction with the efforts to put advertising up there as well.

2) Two weeks ago, the suggestion was made to the campaign as well as the grassroots to implement a mailing program such as was successful in Iowa. They already have the voter lists with the national campaign and they're taking steps to put this together. I don't know what the timing on this will, but I suspect they'll time to launch with the September 29th event.

3) We are beginning to make preparations throughout Pennsylvania to provide material support from our whole state for whatever is needed up there, and we expect to get help. Other states and organizers are coming on board this effort, letting the New Hampshire people know we are here and delivering suggestions of ways we can be useful.

4) We are starting to plan and conserve money such that we hope (and I hope I can deliver this) that we can afford to send anyone within 500 or even more miles to New Hampshire for the week of the primary to help in whatever way the campaign so chooses. This is what I spend the bulk of my time working on here in Pittsburgh, and I hope very badly that it becomes a reality. We're on target.

5) I'm the one who posted that strategy bit on the Daily Paul. ;) I feel very strongly about this, and started orienting this way about a month ago.

So, many of these suggestions are being implemented, and as they are, I hope that we can put more out there and begin to let one another know what everyone is doing so we can better work together and know what each others efforts will be. I don't think you need just one effort, but it's useful to share that information.

Eric21ND
09-12-2007, 08:52 PM
Im not sure I follow. Voter registration forms when we send a ROn Paul mailout? Maybe to independents, Is that what you mean?


I thought someone said you have to have voter registration or republican party registration 90 days before you can vote. I don't know what the rules are in your state. I'm 1000 miles away and my state is easy..we have no voter registration AT ALL...just show our license or a utility bill and you're good. :) I don't know what hoops you guys have to jump through in other states.

itsnobody
09-12-2007, 09:07 PM
1) Mail out program. Are the headquarters going to be sending us a list this time and when? How many people are we targeting? Will we send out to independents and democrats? Do we have any effective flyers to send out?
2) TV and radio ads? How many people working on this? I think there should be several different ones, not just a couple.
3) TV and Radio appearances. Do meetup groups need help contacting tv and radio? Any progress getting RP to appear, or is it a campaign headquarters issue.
4) Newspaper articles. Is anyone gifted in writing that can write editorials, do we know anyone on the inside that can publish RP articles for us?
5) Newspaper ads.
6) DVDs
7) Financing.

Thats a good list...Ron Paul's campaign has to get a lot better ads...don't forget traditional grassroots:
- Flyers
- T-shirts
- Bumper stickers
- Signs
- Talk to people
- Email
- Phone calls
- Groups
- Donate

10thAmendmentMan
09-12-2007, 09:18 PM
http://www.operationnh.com/spots.JPG

Not trying to be excessively crass or obnoxious, but why even bother pay for adds at 5 AM? I haven't done any research (so I could very well be wrong), but it seems to me that by getting ads in primetime -- even if you got far fewer for the same amount of money -- would be more effective.

wgadget
09-12-2007, 09:20 PM
Second- and third-shifters.

itsnobody
09-12-2007, 09:21 PM
Not trying to be excessively crass or obnoxious, but why even bother pay for adds at 5 AM? I haven't done any research (so I could very well be wrong), but it seems to me that by getting ads in primetime -- even if you got far fewer for the same amount of money -- would be more effective.

I think it would also be effective to target younger people....they love Ron Paul's message...

We just need around 35,000 votes in Iowa...so we should target other states also...in NH we need around what, 100,000 votes?

Badger Paul
09-12-2007, 10:02 PM
Henry Cabot Lodge was able to win the New Hampshire GOP primary of 1964 as a write-in candidate by with constant mailings of postcards to NH voters. Postcards and letter are cheaper and I feel more effective than phone calls.

wgadget
09-12-2007, 10:04 PM
With a postcard, they can even read it on the way back from the mailbox. Nothing to open!

abstrusezincate
09-13-2007, 05:31 AM
The truth is radio is more effective than tv for cost-effectiveness and also for targeting. Talk radio is a highly politicized crowd.

LibertyEagle
09-13-2007, 06:14 AM
Beyond the family walk, I sure wish we knew what the campaign was planning to do for New Hampshire. So we could could more effectively plan our attack.

abstrusezincate
09-13-2007, 06:44 AM
It's more effective, I think, to begin planning our own initiatives. This campaign will get nowhere if we simply wait and expect things to happen. Collectively, you have to remember that the grassroots probably have more resources than the national campaign. We are just diffuse and poorly organized.

wgadget
09-13-2007, 06:47 AM
The truth is radio is more effective than tv for cost-effectiveness and also for targeting. Talk radio is a highly politicized crowd.

I agree 1000%! Talk radio ads would be super-effective.

We need a NH Tallk Radio czar.

sunny
09-13-2007, 07:16 AM
My plan for NH is to basically sit back and see what you all do. I will, however, be donating $100...

ok, joe then what the heck are you doing here then?

just sit back and donate???

paulitics
09-13-2007, 08:25 AM
Come on guys, start a thread on something you can contribute to. Im going to focus on mailouts to NH and just started a thread for feedback.

I think we should really saturate the airwaves with radio ads. Anyone creative want to take initiative on this? The time to do this is NOW! We can't wait for orders from headquarters. We are the campaign. Registration deadlines are fast approaching.

ksuguy
09-13-2007, 08:55 AM
Not trying to be excessively crass or obnoxious, but why even bother pay for adds at 5 AM? I haven't done any research (so I could very well be wrong), but it seems to me that by getting ads in primetime -- even if you got far fewer for the same amount of money -- would be more effective.


That schedule isn't bad for retired people. A lot of people are at work during the day, but my grandparents are usually watching tv at those times.

wgadget
09-13-2007, 09:47 AM
Here's a NH talk radio station with a poll, and MITT R. is winning!

Please go vote. We need to hit this station up with RP ads!

http://www.wntk.com/newsite/content/index.php

billm317
09-13-2007, 12:52 PM
Henry Cabot Lodge was able to win the New Hampshire GOP primary of 1964 as a write-in candidate by with constant mailings of postcards to NH voters. Postcards and letter are cheaper and I feel more effective than phone calls.

I like the postcard idea. Where can I get some? And how would I go about getting a mailing list?

edit: I live in Kentucky, but I will buy and mail out stuff to NH, as that's definitely more important. Or are the meetup groups already on top of the NH mailings?

Badger Paul
09-13-2007, 01:02 PM
The New Hampshire meet-ups have a website www.newhampshirehq.com. You can probably find out from them if they have mailing lists and postcards avaialble to you.

paulitics
09-13-2007, 01:07 PM
The New Hampshire meet-ups have a website www.newhampshirehq.com. You can probably find out from them if they have mailing lists and postcards avaialble to you.

this url does not work, do you have another one i want to contact them ASAP.

tiznow
09-13-2007, 01:09 PM
Sorry, but I don't like knocking on people's doors, or walking up to strangers handing out literature.

Although, I did email NHPR (http://www.nhpr.org/), begging them to have Ron Paul on their show called "The Exchange". If they can have Duncan Hunter on for an hour they can certainly accommodate Ron Paul.

http://www.nhpr.org

I initially had my reservations i'm kind of a shy guy but once i got to doing it, it's not so bad

I just knock on their door, if they don't answer stick the literature in the door crack, if they do answer I just say hi my name is _______ i'm a volunteer supporting ron paul for president and i just stopped by to give you some information about him. Almost everybody takes it and are happy you aren't selling something. If they don't seem to interested i just go on my way, if they seem interested then i continue talking more. It's really not that bad and I have yet to have one very negative experience.

austin356
09-13-2007, 01:10 PM
If you are a state that does not have a January/February primary....... you should consider pumping all your financial efforts into NH instead of your local area.

Green Mountain Boy
09-13-2007, 01:11 PM
this url does not work, do you have another one i want to contact them ASAP.

You can contact Jim Forsythe of HQNH at this email: jimforsythe(at)metrocast(dot)net

paulitics
09-13-2007, 01:38 PM
I think the meetup groups in NH have enough on their hands putting up signs canvasing neighborhoods, and rolling up their sleeves knocking on doors. If they are doing tedious like licking envolopes than they can't be face to face closing people.

We should all be helping them do extra things that can be done outside the state. Like mailouts., Radio, TV commercials, and newspaper articles. A couple of the guys are really talented with this media stuff, but they may need more help. Contact them if you can get involved. If you can't contribute time, contribute money.

The rest of us (the majority), should focus on the mailout program. First we need to devise a strategy. Who is our target? Do we want to include independents and democrats? How many people can we count on to do this? How wany mail outs total? Where can we get the leads? How will they be distributed? and who can we count on with good organizational skills to distribute them out to helpers?

We need to start doing. The campaign headquarters will likely wait until its too late to send us out a list. By then, it may be too late for democrats and libertarians to switch and their votes will not count. This is something we need to wake up to today not tomorrow.

From what I heard, the Iowan program was effective, yet we only reached a tiny portion of the total voters becaue we were late getting started.

paulitics
09-13-2007, 01:39 PM
You can contact Jim Forsythe of HQNH at this email: jimforsythe(at)metrocast(dot)net

Thanks I will contact him.

abstrusezincate
09-13-2007, 01:58 PM
By the way, there are a number of bulletins going around where the campaign is begging people to get up to New Hamsphire for September 29th to help make the Paul Family Walk a success. Let your meetups know and if you can help out, get up their yourself. You can RSVP on the campaign site, and are asked to do so.

Geronimo
09-13-2007, 04:30 PM
These are two of NH's more popular talk radio channels.

http://www.wgiram.com/main.html
http://www.wtplfm.com/

billm317
09-13-2007, 04:47 PM
Thanks I will contact him.

I already did and he'll tell you there isn't much you can do right now, which is unfortunate. I joined the NH meetup groups, to maybe catch wind of something I can help work on from far away.

Time is a wastin!

paulitics
09-13-2007, 05:23 PM
I already did and he'll tell you there isn't much you can do right now, which is unfortunate. I joined the NH meetup groups, to maybe catch wind of something I can help work on from far away.

Time is a wastin!

Maybe they are overwhelmed. Why don't we start the inititative here and collaberate with them on it as time goes on. I think these meetup groups are better utilized for organizing local events, not 1000s of mailouts, etc. Matter of fact,those that live up there should be on the streets. Who else is going to do that but them?

The Iowan mailouts was done by us here, but the problem is we waited for HQ to send us a list, which was about 2 months too late. I have zero faith that any of this gets done, unless several of us volunteer to get this project organized.

ItsTime
09-13-2007, 06:16 PM
Ron Paul Freedom Rally in West Lebanon: The sign wave will begin at 12 noon and last until we are tired and longer!! It will be held at the intersection of I-89 and Rt 12-A (Exit 20) Please forward this and/or visit the meetup group http://ronpaul.meetup.com/950

Thanks!

LibertyEagle
09-13-2007, 06:22 PM
Ron Paul Freedom Rally in West Lebanon: The sign wave will begin at 12 noon and last until we are tired and longer!! It will be held at the intersection of I-89 and Rt 12-A (Exit 20) Please forward this and/or visit the meetup group http://ronpaul.meetup.com/950

Thanks!

Don't we need to do more than sign wave? I mean that's great and everything, but how are we going to get them information about Ron Paul? Aren't we going to have to do that in order to have any hope of them voting for him? :confused:

ItsTime
09-13-2007, 06:33 PM
Don't we need to do more than sign wave? I mean that's great and everything, but how are we going to get them information about Ron Paul? Aren't we going to have to do that in order to have any hope of them voting for him? :confused:

We have hand outs to give. The rally is next to many strip malls and we (a core group and anyone else who wants to join) will be visiting their parking lots before and after the wave.

We have decided to do it on this weekend as a follow up to the Manchester family walk. We feel this will help push anyone who watched the buzz about the Paul walk on the local news towards wanting to learn more.

Any other ideas are welcome.

LibertyEagle
09-19-2007, 07:47 PM
bump

Geronimo
09-19-2007, 08:02 PM
I don't have any dough to shell out for wire stand signs, so if anybody would like to donate some to the NH cause I'd be more than happy to plant them.

LibertyEagle
09-19-2007, 08:07 PM
I don't have any dough to shell out for wire stand signs, so if anybody would like to donate some to the NH cause I'd be more than happy to plant them.

Can't you get them from the New Hampshire campaign office for free? I would imagine you could.

ItsTime
09-19-2007, 08:08 PM
I don't have any dough to shell out for wire stand signs, so if anybody would like to donate some to the NH cause I'd be more than happy to plant them.

will you be at the 29th? Where are you from? I can help you get some. Private Message me

Geronimo
09-19-2007, 08:08 PM
To be honest, I haven't looked into that yet.

Rivington Essex
09-19-2007, 08:14 PM
Skiingff,

As you post an ad, willl you try to combine it with other mediums. This way, an ad becomes a campaign. If you do Londonerry, can we ask the MeetUp there to put up tons of signs that week and drop a diret mail piece. That will 10x your effectiveness.

Rivingtonessex@gmail.com

Some basic Marketing Strategy:
The first thing a candidate needs is name recognition. Several people who have worked on campaigns before say that a voter must hear a name 5 times before he remembers the name.

The best way to get name recognition is to use 3-5 advertising mediums in 3-5 days. A medium is simply the way you communicate (newspaper, tv, radio, phone call, e-mail, banner add, op-ed, letter, street fair etc. )If you could put up a billboard, drop a direct mail, and do phone calls all in a week, that would improve name recognition. Some studies say one message has only a 2% effectiveness, but when a consumer is hit with 3 messages from 3 sources in 3 days, the effectiveness increases to 30-50%.

So think about that when you do events. You can make your event 10 times more effective by communicating 3 times in 3 days. Put up signs all at once in your neighborhood, drop them a direct mail piece the next day, and then try to call them the following. 2 messages via 2 sources is better. 3 messages via 3 sources is better. You get the point.

paulitics
09-19-2007, 08:14 PM
Its a week later, any developments on the mailout? I would like to reiterate that this group may want to take the initiative instead of waiting for NH or headquarters for who are both overwhelmed. We need to get to the libertarians and democrats ASAP and its going to take a huge effort. Relying on them to do it will be a missed opportunity. NH is a major player on this chess board.

abstrusezincate
09-19-2007, 10:36 PM
I'm actually hoping we'll be able to do a radio blitz. I don't want to talk about this and create a false sense of optimism, but we're working on some good stuff.

DrNoZone
09-28-2007, 07:45 PM
So I know the fundraising meter is devouring most of our time right now (sometimes I think it's a good thing they put that up there, sometimes I think it's a bad think), but what's the latest news out there on tomorrow's NH Family Walk???

ItsTime
09-28-2007, 07:48 PM
So I know the fundraising meter is devouring most of our time right now (sometimes I think it's a good thing they put that up there, sometimes I think it's a bad think), but what's the latest news out there on tomorrow's NH Family Walk???

from what I have gathered there are people coming from all over the New England and other parts of the country. I see meet up people from a few hundred miles away going!