Marijuana Public Protest Today!

[mport1]

Today Andrew Carroll will protest absurd drug laws by holding a piece of marijuana in his hand in public after having publicized his protest. Andrew has never even used marijuana and never plans to. I think he is a hero and I hope we see more of this peaceful protest in the future. More great things happening because of the Free State Project (http://www.freestateproject.org)!

Check out what he is doing here (http://freekeene.com/2008/12/13/the-heroic-andrew-carroll/#comments) and here (http://freekeene.com/2008/12/08/activist-to-possess-marijuana-in-public/#comments)is the press release for the event.

What is everybody's thoughts on this and peaceful acts of civil disobedience in general? I will keep this thread updated with information on what happens. Will he get arrested or will the cops selectively enforce the law and do nothing?

[powerofreason]

Man I can't wait to get up there. If the police arrest him they will be making a big mistake and accelerate decrim in NH imo.

The great thing about this protest is that he's holding a bud in his hand, harming absolutely no one, INCLUDING himself, highlighting the absurdity of a law banning a person to possess a plant.

[powerofreason]

Who will be the first right winger on this forum to disparage Andrew? The suspense builds!

[Uriel999]

Good luck to him.

[roho76]

I think it's great that people who don't even use the drug are sticking up for the decriminalization of it. More need to follow in these types of protest.

[mport1]

I think it's great that people who don't even use the drug are sticking up for the decriminalization of it. More need to follow in these types of protest.

Yes, this is excellent! I think the most powerful type of protest is standing up for the rights of others.

[JoshLowry]

I wish him the best outcome as possible!

I'll be looking forward to Ridley's video.

[mport1]

Man I can't wait to get up there. If the police arrest him they will be making a big mistake and accelerate decrim in NH imo.

The great thing about this protest is that he's holding a bud in his hand, harming absolutely no one, INCLUDING himself, highlighting the absurdity of a law banning a person to possess a plant.

It is a win-win situation. If he gets arrested, it will further highlight the absurdity of drug laws. The guy is not even smoking marijuana. He is just holding a small bit of plant matter in his hand.

If he is not arrested, we have again shown how the cops are selectively enforcing their laws and this is not right. Also, that we can beat the state if enough people stick up for their rights.

[Pennsylvania]

Andrew Carroll is an American hero

[humanic]

Andrew Carroll is an American hero

+1

[Oyate]

Who will be the first right winger on this forum to disparage Andrew? The suspense builds!

Well I guess the job falls to me. You want me to do the whole flame thing? OK, note that I use the proper FLAME STYLE also known as caps.

*ahem*

THIS LITTLE PAULTARD ISN'T WORTH THE SKIN HE LIVES IN. HE DOESN'T EVEN SMOKE POT!!!!! A REAL PATRIOT WOULD TOKE IT UP!!! I HEARD IT'S MEXICAN WEED TOO!!!! WHAT'S WRONG WITH OUR AMERICAN WEED MR. OSAMA-BEEN-SMOKIN???

How was that? I'm not really warmed up. Ain't got my whole troll on yet.

[mport1]

Live stream of events here if it keeps working - http://www.stickam.com/gloriouscoco

Check it out!

[Oyate]

Live stream of events here if it keeps working - http://www.stickam.com/gloriouscoco

Check it out!

OK, I'm checking out what appears to be the inside of an independent coffee shop and I can hear a Grateful Dead bootleg playing in the background. This is definitely the right channel.

[mport1]

Apparently the power outside in the city isn't working well for this live stream, so he might not be able to get it up and going for the protest.

[mport1]

He was just arrested by two cops!

[Oyate]

He was just arrested!

Whoa! That was fast!

[Oyate]

So he was arrested for "touching a controlled substance"? Did he touch it in an inappropriate place? Is this about having violated the rights of the controlled substance?

[mport1]

Whoa! That was fast!

Yeah, they walked up to him and took the tiny piece of marijuana from his hand. They asked him if was real and he said yes. Then they said that he was under arrested and put him in cuffs in front of a ton of angry people asking who was being hurt by what Andrew was doing.

[Pennsylvania]

http://remiq.net/static/img/remiq.net_4528.jpg

[Oyate]

So that was about 1:13 PM EST?

[powerofreason]

Well I guess the job falls to me. You want me to do the whole flame thing? OK, note that I use the proper FLAME STYLE also known as caps.

*ahem*

THIS LITTLE PAULTARD ISN'T WORTH THE SKIN HE LIVES IN. HE DOESN'T EVEN SMOKE POT!!!!! A REAL PATRIOT WOULD TOKE IT UP!!! I HEARD IT'S MEXICAN WEED TOO!!!! WHAT'S WRONG WITH OUR AMERICAN WEED MR. OSAMA-BEEN-SMOKIN???

How was that? I'm not really warmed up. Ain't got my whole troll on yet.

Right wing "libertarians" all have a little hand book issued by bob barr to make fun of people who have principles and aren't gradualists. After finding one on the side of the road I will read you some excerpts from the sections on how to make fun of/chastise people who smoke pot and how to make fun of/chastise people who break the law.


You're giving libertarians a bad name!

Why can't we just ask for lower taxes!

You're not helping the cause!

Breaking the law is wrong! We need to vote!

If you want to change the laws run for office!

We just need to elect the right people!

Smoking weed is bad for you!

You're just a pot smoking hippy who wants to hang around and get stoned all day!

There's more important things we need to protest!


There are more but I'll spare you guys.

[mport1]

So that was about 1:13 PM EST?

Yep, about then.

[powerofreason]

They arrested him eh? Beautiful. Should get lots of press!

[mport1]

They arrested him eh? Beautiful. Should get lots of press!

Hopefully. Everyone please spread this story around, especially when all the great video of the event comes out. I've already contacted Lew Rockwell and Tom Woods about this. If others would do the same, maybe we could get this story on LewRockwell.com and other places.

I think he is going to push for a jury trial and hopefully the jury will use jury nullification to not convict him.

[Oyate]

The live stream was almost hilarious. Yeah a couple of shouts of support but the cops were pretty ceremonial about the whole thing. Andrew looked like he could have taken some questions, but the whole line of supporters just started trudging away across the snow. It was basically like a hand-off: "here, you take him, see you later".

You can tell by the sound of the snow it was pretty cold.

[mport1]

The live stream was almost hilarious. Yeah a couple of shouts of support but the cops were pretty ceremonial about the whole thing. Andrew looked like he could have taken some questions, but the whole line of supporters just started trudging away across the snow. It was basically like a hand-off: "here, you take him, see you later".

You can tell by the sound of the snow it was pretty cold.

Apparently the crowd followed the cops to the jail and are protesting outside.

[Oyate]

Right wing "libertarians" all have a little hand book issued by bob barr to make fun of people who have principles and aren't gradualists.

Gradualists? Is that what we're calling them? That is charitable indeed. I can think of a lot more names for them but certainly not as refined as your postulation. Gradualists implies they'd actually honor our rights if only their pet rights are restored. Bob Barr would himself have made this arrest, I guarantee you.

LPUS didn't gradulasitically do anything in the last elections. They fell from grace, they fell hard and they will never get up from it. Poor Shane Corey, spending years building up what Bob Barr took down in a couple short months.

The boat left the dock leaving LPUS straddling dock and deck. They never made it across the Hudson, they got soaked in it.

[Jordan]

So wait, what?


What happened to him, anyone doing any live reporting?

[powerofreason]

Gradualists? Is that what we're calling them? That is charitable indeed. I can think of a lot more names for them but certainly not as refined as your postulation. Gradualists implies they'd actually honor our rights if only their pet rights are restored. Bob Barr would himself have made this arrest, I guarantee you.

LPUS didn't gradulasitically do anything in the last elections. They fell from grace, they fell hard and they will never get up from it. Poor Shane Corey, spending years building up what Bob Barr took down in a couple short months.

The boat left the dock leaving LPUS straddling dock and deck. They never made it across the Hudson, they got soaked in it.

The way I see a gradualist is a person who does not understand the moral principles behind libertarianism so they are perfectly content with little steps and do not keep the end goal in sight. They would not have wanted an immediate end to slavery in the South, they would have wanted little steps toward freeing the slaves and as a result it would have never happened.

"Gradualism in theory is perpetuity in practice."

Maybe I should call them "dirty utilitarians" is that insulting enough?

[Oyate]

You wanted help getting the word out?

http://freedomsphoenix.com/Feature-Article.htm?InfoNo=043848

[mediahasyou]

dont forget about this: http://optionism.blogspot.com/2009/01/puff-heard-round-world.html

[Working Poor]

Sounds like a true right wing action to me.

[LibertyEagle]

The way I see a gradualist is a person who does not understand the moral principles behind libertarianism so they are perfectly content with little steps and do not keep the end goal in sight. They would not have wanted an immediate end to slavery in the South, they would have wanted little steps toward freeing the slaves and as a result it would have never happened.

"Gradualism in theory is perpetuity in practice."

Maybe I should call them "dirty utilitarians" is that insulting enough?

Does this mean you are pro Civil War and think it was warranted because it may have resulted in the slaves being freed faster? Please explain.

[powerofreason]

Does this mean you are pro Civil War and think it was warranted because it may have resulted in the slaves being freed faster? Please explain.

Uhh no, because the ends can never morally justify the means. However good the outcome.

[LibertyEagle]

Uhh no, because the ends can never morally justify the means. However good the outcome.

Well, that's good, because that little spiel about ending slavery immediately, was kinda sounding like it.

[powerofreason]

Well, that's good, because that little spiel about ending slavery immediately, was kinda sounding like it.

I have no idea how. The Civil War had little to do with slavery until the emancipation proclamation well into the war. It was more about a ridiculous tariff and a tyrannical president's personal little war.

[mediahasyou]

Live stream of events here if it keeps working - http://www.stickam.com/gloriouscoco

Check it out!

what time?

[powerofreason]

what time?

Tune into free talk live at 7pm est, the protest will be the first topic of the night for sure.

http://www.freetalklive.com/tunein.php

[Pennsylvania]

Tune into free talk live at 7pm est, the protest will be the first topic of the night for sure.

http://www.freetalklive.com/tunein.php

Tuned in now :)

[Pennsylvania]

Nice he's on!

[mport1]

Here is some footage. I'm sure there is more, better quality video to come. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=svr4kFEgT2Q&eurl=http://nhunderground.com/forum/index.php?topic=16319.msg281335

And here is a video interview of Andrew before the event from Anarchy In Your Head (http://www.anarchyinyourhead.com) - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xsPCbaUkBPQ&feature=channel_page

[sratiug]

Next time they should make a citizen's arrest of the cop when he takes the weed. Illegal is illegal.

[steve005]

Next time they should make a citizen's arrest of the cop when he takes the weed. Illegal is illegal.

lolololololololol

[Oyate]

The way I see a gradualist is a person who does not understand the moral principles behind libertarianism so they are perfectly content with little steps and do not keep the end goal in sight.
(SNIP)
Maybe I should call them "dirty utilitarians" is that insulting enough?

The way I see them is exactly how the liberals see them: selfish bastards. Like the Cato creeps or the Reagan Conservatives. Their concept of freedom and liberty is limited to limited taxation and government interference with their business interests.

They actually LOVE telling people they can't smoke pot or listen to the music of their choice and they don't particularly care when people's rights are abused here or abroad. They are all set, screw everybody else.

Yeah, "dirty utilitarian" still doesn't do it for me. For now I'll stick with selfish bastards.

[powerofreason]

Next time they should make a citizen's arrest of the cop when he takes the weed. Illegal is illegal.

Yea if you want to get tazed or shot thats a good route to go. Violence is what the State does best. They will meet violence with violence every time.

The local paper will read: A crazed man approached a police officer yesterday, apparently angry that another man was arrested for illegal marijuana possession. The officer repeatedly told him to back away, but the man would not and the officer was forced to fire 6 rounds of his service weapon into the man's head. An investigation has cleared the officer of wrongdoing.

[ghengis86]

http://www.lewrockwell.com/blog/lewrw/archives/024793.html

you made the LRC blog

[phill4paul]

http://www.lewrockwell.com/blog/lewrw/archives/024793.html

you made the LRC blog


Thanks for the link. I really enjoyed the interview. Andrew Cooper is one great American.

[speciallyblend]

Move to Colorado:)

[powerofreason]

Move to Colorado:)

Someone's feeling left out ;)

Move to NH :)

[torchbearer]

Someone's feeling left out ;)

Move to NH :)

Denver has great marijuana laws(or lack of).

[powerofreason]

Denver has great marijuana laws(or lack of).

Yea I know but what smart person gets caught anyways? I'd rather get a misdemeanor and be backed up by at least 30 activists in court then get a ticket. Get a jury trial and all that.

[torchbearer]

Yea I know but what smart person gets caught anyways? I'd rather get a misdemeanor and be backed up by at least 30 activists in court then get a ticket. Get a jury trial and all that.

Marijuana is legal to use even recreationally in Denver as a "safer alternative to alcohol" as their resolution states.
I like the way they think.

[Call Me V]

Call me a rip off but i'm thinking about doing this in my town.

It'd be cool if we could pick a day where hundreds of people nation wide would do the same thing and all get arrested.

I am not a pot smoker though, so I have no clue where to get weed from. I'll just head up to centre college.

[OferNave]

It'd be cool if we could pick a day where hundreds of people nation wide would do the same thing and all get arrested.

Uh... you mean like April 20?

[Call Me V]

Uh... you mean like April 20?

I'm not that patient.

Haha.

[OferNave]

I'm not that patient.

Haha.

So... Jan 20, then? It's all good with me, man, I toke daily.

[Call Me V]

So... Jan 20, then? It's all good with me, man, I toke daily.

Possibly. May to be soon though. I'd like to have at least 20 people do it (including me).

[mport1]

Here is an interview Andrew did with Free Talk Live (http://www.freetalklive.com) after the event - http://freetalklive.com/files/carroll.mp3

[mport1]

A lot more good video of the event - http://freekeene.com/2009/01/11/loads-more-andrew-carroll-video/

Please spread these videos around.

[wizardwatson]

It's great and all but I still don't like the idea of giving perfectly good weed to a cop.

[Grimnir Wotansvolk]

Call me a rip off but i'm thinking about doing this in my town.

It'd be cool if we could pick a day where hundreds of people nation wide would do the same thing and all get arrested.

I am not a pot smoker though, so I have no clue where to get weed from. I'll just head up to centre college.Same here, though I'd rather use the strategy of 20+ people spread around, doing it simultaneously

[tggroo7]

To everyone for legalization of marijuana, I don't know much about it except you can't overdose and generally, it is a little safer than alcohol, but if it's legal what do you do about people who get high and drive somewhere? Police cannot test you like a breathalyzer does.

[torchbearer]

To everyone for legalization of marijuana, I don't know much about it except you can't overdose and generally, it is a little safer than alcohol, but if it's legal what do you do about people who get high and drive somewhere? Police cannot test you like a breathalyzer does.

If you are swirving on the road, or driving dangerously, you can get a ticket for that in itself.
In fact, the cop, if he thinks you are intoxicated, can detain you, or get you to call someone to pick you up.
The cop is suppose to have cause to pull you over. That cause will most likely be your ticket.

[dannno]

To everyone for legalization of marijuana, I don't know much about it except you can't overdose and generally, it is a little safer than alcohol, but if it's legal what do you do about people who get high and drive somewhere? Police cannot test you like a breathalyzer does.

First of all, if you have ever had alcohol you know that sometimes you feel "Ok", or "fine to drive", but are actually messed up and falling all over the place. This is why there is such a big problem with driving drunk, because alcohol impairs your judgment. This does not happen with cannabis, in fact it is the opposite. You actually "feel" more messed up than you actually are.. so when people get too stoned, they generally don't want to drive because they don't feel like they could do it.. however the reality of many of these situations is that if they actually got behind the wheel of a car and drove they would be just fine. That doesn't mean they should, they should follow their own judgment, I'm just speaking from experience.

There are many studies that have been done in Australia and Britain that have shown that smoking moderate amounts of cannabis can actually make a person drive more safely than when they are sober. This is partly because of what I explained above, the driver "feels" more impaired than they actually are, so they drive cautiously and defensive.

Most people over the age of 16 who are playing video games are stoned, cannabis does not negatively impact your reaction time. I've seen stoners beat Need for Speed: Underground, there are plenty of sober people who wouldn't be able to beat that game to save their life. Many surfers smoke herb before surfing, even in dangerous, big heavy conditions. It helps you relax, because if you don't relax you hyperventilate and when you get held under water by a wave you would be out of breath.. Surfing takes a lot of balance.. you have to dodge people, you have to identify and anticipate changes in the face of the wave as you make decisions on where to carve or be on the wave. Cannabis does not seem to impair the abilities of these individuals.

Anywho, when I take road trips with my friends, we make it a point to smoke the entire way.. driver included, BUT, the driver can refuse tokes no questions asked. Everybody else has to smoke ;) I can tell you that this is very common. There are stoners driving everywhere everyday, yet there is not a proportional problem with dangerous stoned drivers. My main point is that you don't have to worry about them.

But, to answer YOUR question about what the cops should do, if you don't want to go with torchbearer's solution of simply getting a ticket for the infraction they caused, then they should give them a field sobriety test... If my reaction time is within range of a normal person, and my balance is within range of a normal person, which it generally is after toking, and always is if I am actually driving a car, then why should I or the person being tested receive a violation unless they were doing something wrong? Same goes for people who are driving drunk. Give them a field sobriety test and cite them if they are too impaired to drive.

[tggroo7]

First of all, if you have ever had alcohol you know that sometimes you feel "Ok", or "fine to drive", but are actually messed up and falling all over the place. This is why there is such a big problem with driving drunk, because alcohol impairs your judgment. This does not happen with cannabis, in fact it is the opposite. You actually "feel" more messed up than you actually are.. so when people get too stoned, they generally don't want to drive because they don't feel like they could do it.. however the reality of many of these situations is that if they actually got behind the wheel of a car and drove they would be just fine. That doesn't mean they should, they should follow their own judgment, I'm just speaking from experience.

There are many studies that have been done in Australia and Britain that have shown that smoking moderate amounts of cannabis can actually make a person drive more safely than when they are sober. This is partly because of what I explained above, the driver "feels" more impaired than they actually are, so they drive cautiously and defensive.

Most people over the age of 16 who are playing video games are stoned, cannabis does not negatively impact your reaction time. I've seen stoners beat Need for Speed: Underground, there are plenty of sober people who wouldn't be able to beat that game to save their life. Many surfers smoke herb before surfing, even in dangerous, big heavy conditions. It helps you relax, because if you don't relax you hyperventilate and when you get held under water by a wave you would be out of breath.. Surfing takes a lot of balance.. you have to dodge people, you have to identify and anticipate changes in the face of the wave as you make decisions on where to carve or be on the wave. Cannabis does not seem to impair the abilities of these individuals.

Anywho, when I take road trips with my friends, we make it a point to smoke the entire way.. driver included, BUT, the driver can refuse tokes no questions asked. Everybody else has to smoke ;) I can tell you that this is very common. There are stoners driving everywhere everyday, yet there is not a proportional problem with dangerous stoned drivers. My main point is that you don't have to worry about them.

But, to answer YOUR question about what the cops should do, if you don't want to go with torchbearer's solution of simply getting a ticket for the infraction they caused, then they should give them a field sobriety test... If my reaction time is within range of a normal person, and my balance is within range of a normal person, which it generally is after toking, and always is if I am actually driving a car, then why should I or the person being tested receive a violation unless they were doing something wrong? Same goes for people who are driving drunk. Give them a field sobriety test and cite them if they are too impaired to drive.

Cool, thanks for the reply! Pretty much answered my question dead on.

[ghengis86]

First of all, if you have ever had alcohol you know that sometimes you feel "Ok", or "fine to drive", but are actually messed up and falling all over the place. This is why there is such a big problem with driving drunk, because alcohol impairs your judgment. This does not happen with cannabis, in fact it is the opposite. You actually "feel" more messed up than you actually are.. so when people get too stoned, they generally don't want to drive because they don't feel like they could do it.. however the reality of many of these situations is that if they actually got behind the wheel of a car and drove they would be just fine. That doesn't mean they should, they should follow their own judgment, I'm just speaking from experience.

There are many studies that have been done in Australia and Britain that have shown that smoking moderate amounts of cannabis can actually make a person drive more safely than when they are sober. This is partly because of what I explained above, the driver "feels" more impaired than they actually are, so they drive cautiously and defensive.

Most people over the age of 16 who are playing video games are stoned, cannabis does not negatively impact your reaction time. I've seen stoners beat Need for Speed: Underground, there are plenty of sober people who wouldn't be able to beat that game to save their life. Many surfers smoke herb before surfing, even in dangerous, big heavy conditions. It helps you relax, because if you don't relax you hyperventilate and when you get held under water by a wave you would be out of breath.. Surfing takes a lot of balance.. you have to dodge people, you have to identify and anticipate changes in the face of the wave as you make decisions on where to carve or be on the wave. Cannabis does not seem to impair the abilities of these individuals.

Anywho, when I take road trips with my friends, we make it a point to smoke the entire way.. driver included, BUT, the driver can refuse tokes no questions asked. Everybody else has to smoke ;) I can tell you that this is very common. There are stoners driving everywhere everyday, yet there is not a proportional problem with dangerous stoned drivers. My main point is that you don't have to worry about them.

But, to answer YOUR question about what the cops should do, if you don't want to go with torchbearer's solution of simply getting a ticket for the infraction they caused, then they should give them a field sobriety test... If my reaction time is within range of a normal person, and my balance is within range of a normal person, which it generally is after toking, and always is if I am actually driving a car, then why should I or the person being tested receive a violation unless they were doing something wrong? Same goes for people who are driving drunk. Give them a field sobriety test and cite them if they are too impaired to drive.

one should never, ever, ever submit to a field sobriety tests. they're completely subjective to the officer's perception, are not mandatory and are difficult to do when you're sober. if they ask for a breath test, most states require compliance or you lose your license. also you can refuse a breath test, but most likely they will take you to the station and get a warrant for your blood.

but never, ever, ever submit to a field sobriety test.

[mport1]

To everyone for legalization of marijuana, I don't know much about it except you can't overdose and generally, it is a little safer than alcohol, but if it's legal what do you do about people who get high and drive somewhere? Police cannot test you like a breathalyzer does.

I need to find the source, but I heard that a study showed that there are only about 17 directly marijuana related fatal accidents a year. That is A LOT safer than alcohol.