CNN: Children Forced Into Cell-like School Seclusion Rooms

[danberkeley]

Children forced into cell-like school seclusion rooms
By Ashley Fantz
CNN

MURRAYVILLE, Georgia (CNN) -- A few weeks before 13-year-old Jonathan King killed himself, he told his parents that his teachers had put him in "time-out."

Read the rest: http://edition.cnn.com/2008/US/12/17/seclusion.rooms/index.html

[Dr.3D]

The local "school" here wanted to do that to my son, but I told them their job was education and I didn't consider that to be educational. I told them I would sue them if they did what they were proposing. Instead, they decided to send him home. Just how much education do they expect a kid to get in a little room all by himself?

[FindLiberty]

...Just how much education do they expect a kid to get in a little room all by himself?

Give 'em a computer and a FPS video game and run away while their back is turned.

Seriously, good luck - it sounds like a tough battle on both fronts.

[Agent CSL]

:mad:

[wd4freedom]

While our public school system is a national disgrace, most of these issues are the result of parents who are incompetent, irresponsible and unwilling to take on the most basic responsibility of being parents.

[angelatc]

While our public school system is a national disgrace, most of these issues are the result of parents who are incompetent, irresponsible and unwilling to take on the most basic responsibility of being parents.

Did you even read the article?
Seclusion rooms, sometimes called time-out rooms, are used across the nation, generally for special needs children.

Parents of these kids have to provide far more than the basics.

At first I thought this might be the beginning of a left-wing diatribe about the cruelty of sending kids to their rooms as punishment, but it isn't.

This is what happens when the state tries to manage anything. One-size fits all rarely fits anybody.

[Kludge]

More of the blame belongs to the school itself, IMO. The public school I went to hired "personal assistants" for kids with special needs who were able to attend "normal" classes. The especially special ed. class was more of a job. They had the kids clean the floors/tables/windows and at all other times kept them together in a room with an overseer right next to their lockers and an exit so that contact between "normal" and "special" kids was kept to a minimum. The especially special and violent kids were sent to the school's former high school from 20+ years ago and called it the "options" program, where they tried to get the kids to graduate as early as possible.

[HOLLYWOOD]

Children forced into cell-like school seclusion rooms
By Ashley Fantz
CNN

MURRAYVILLE, Georgia (CNN) -- A few weeks before 13-year-old Jonathan King killed himself, he told his parents that his teachers had put him in "time-out."

Read the rest: http://edition.cnn.com/2008/US/12/17/seclusion.rooms/index.html

I think this was a private school... but ask ANY psychologist/sociologist and 90% would agree this is absolutely the WRONG thing to do.

There's school's across the nation doing this... and it's VERY WRONG!

to leave a child in solitary confinement in a padded room, "ALONE" should be FASLE IMPRISONMENT against the schools/community.

But we all are realizing the "NEW DOCTRINE" in America...

The land of Totalitarian Rule in the Land of Law... aka ... THE POLICE STATE

You know it bad in America when the GERMANS are calling America the "NEW NAZI POLIZEI" !

Aslo the land of Hipocrisy... Minor, unknowing of the laws, have no rights, yet if they commit a felony... are charged as an adult. Who in public government and public education has informed, taught, schooled, children both; Public & Private Laws @ local, state, federal levels?

ANSWER: NO ONE

[yongrel]

The root of this problem is, I think, the public education system's nonsensical special education programs. Children with severe disabilities are forced upon the school system under the threat of lawsuits from their parents, and are then put in the care of often-unqualified teachers. As someone who has worked closely with special education programs in past, I can tell you that the people taking care of these kids do not know what they're doing, and it's not their fault.

Special needs children consume far more resources than an average student, and every day more lawsuits from parents raise the spending ceiling higher. The average student may cost 9,000 bucks per annum, while it's not unusual for a special needs child to require upwards of 20,000, often radically more. In order for public schools to deal with these costs, they try to reduce their spending elsewhere. In the school district I have experience with, most of the people working with special needs children were mothers trying to get back into the workforce after staying at home to raise children. These women were working for just above minimum wage, and were tasked with what amounted to babysitting a whole cast of special needs children. For every 1 certified special education teacher, there were 10 untrained caregivers, and the teachers essentially became supervisors.

Despite the bulk of care being their responsibility though, the para-assistants, as they were called, were not allowed to know anything more than the minimum about the needs and situations of children. For "privacy purposes," the school would not even tell them which children had downs syndrome, or cerebral palsy, or manic depression, or Huntington's, or any number of other disorders. It was off-limits to ask what a child had, and information came only in the form of spontaneous need-to-know moments from the supervising teachers. The overwhelming majority of the people working with the children had no idea what the needs of the children were (only the actual teachers were allowed to know that) and so could not adequately care for them properly, despite their best intentions.

I think this article is another example of what happens when the government acts as the nanny state. The seclusion rooms mentioned in the article are, at best, a low-cost way of handling a kid that the school has no idea how to handle.

"Little Johnny is flipping out! What do we do?"

"Uh... we could put him in that room by himself for a while. Maybe that will help? I dunno."

The school system forces incompetence on its schools, and is surprised when the ignorance that they mandate produces poor results.

And then there's the subject I touched on earlier of the exorbitant costs of special education programs in schools...

[WRellim]

Children forced into cell-like school seclusion rooms
By Ashley Fantz
CNN

MURRAYVILLE, Georgia (CNN) -- A few weeks before 13-year-old Jonathan King killed himself, he told his parents that his teachers had put him in "time-out."

Read the rest: http://edition.cnn.com/2008/US/12/17/seclusion.rooms/index.html


This is illegal on so many levels. I would be certain that the existence of that room (with no means of opening the door from inside) is a violation of fire codes. That the violation led to the death of a child they had legal responsibility to ensure the welfare of makes it into, at a minimum, a case of involuntary manslaughter (and possibly a higher charge of murder if the element of "intent" can be proven regarding the construction/rigging of the external locks/latches on that room).

And of course there are also laws against illegal confinement; child endangerment, child abuse, etc.

The problem is that the local district attorney has and almost certainly will continue to choose NOT to prosecute and will instead to simply IGNORE the laws and the host of violations.

Unlike other posters, for that reason alone, I would therefore believe that this most certainly was a PUBLIC school. (The judicial system would not hesitate for even a minute to charge people at a private school).

BTW, this is just the tip of the iceberg... just like we will see a lot more "Bernie Madoff" type ponzi schemes exposed, we will see an INCREASE in these types of crimes by "public" organizations (and a decrease in prosecutions of them).

[angelatc]

I think this was a private school... but ask ANY psychologist/sociologist and 90% would agree this is absolutely the WRONG thing to do.

Actually, that makes it more acceptable in my book. Psychology isn't a real science - it's just a big experiment that usually contra-indicates common sense.

[Uriel999]

:eek:

Man, that shit is terrifying. And I felt imprisoned in my high school that was a fairly open campus.

[Natalie]

They're getting the kids ready so when they won't complain as much as adults when they are put into cells for asinine reasons.

[M House]

I got put in a seclusion room in grade school for not paying attention. Other than being bored shitless and getting even less work done, it just made me take a nap and wish I got to go back to the classroom and interact with the other kids. I blame female teachers they always are usually atleast 200 percent more retentive, fixated on note taking, and inflexible. Until you get those 1 or 2 male teachers that will put even them to shame. Anything bad women do there's always those one or two men who will do it much much worse. Well that was only for one grade, my grades improved the next year and I for awhile was doing really well at most everything until high school.

[pinkmandy]

Absolutely disgusting. I whittled away quite a few hours serving inschool detention- small room, no windows...but I wasn't high/special needs. I didn't pull out my hair or wet myself. I smoked and listened to music, very content to be away from the crap they were shoveling my way. ;)

Here's a thought- what would the state do if a PARENT was locking a high needs child in a freaking closet for hours on end or all day? While the child was in her own urine and pulling all of her hair out, crying to be let out? Can you imagine? Why is it any more acceptable if done by the state and ignorant teachers/administration? I can't believe people can be so cruel to children. Especially people are who are supposedly "trained" to help children and entered a profession where they are surrounded by them 9 months/year? Freaking sickos imho.

:mad::mad::mad::mad::mad::mad:

[akihabro]

I thought this kid was normal until I read the whole article. I could personally attest to this. I was undiciplined as a kid. My 5th grade teacher would constantly kick me out of the classroom for being disruptive. Sometimes I would ask something of a fellow student or days where he would just kick me out. I didn't want to do the work I was sent. I eventually complained to my parents and moved to another school. I did way better after.
Let's isolate the student and prescribe heavy medication for ADD/ADHD. Is this still the plan being enforced also? Horrible.

[asimplegirl]

In order for public schools to deal with these costs, they try to reduce their spending elsewhere. In the school district I have experience with, most of the people working with special needs children were mothers trying to get back into the workforce after staying at home to raise children. These women were working for just above minimum wage, and were tasked with what amounted to babysitting a whole cast of special needs children. For every 1 certified special education teacher, there were 10 untrained caregivers, and the teachers essentially became supervisors.

Despite the bulk of care being their responsibility though, the para-assistants, as they were called, were not allowed to know anything more than the minimum about the needs and situations of children. For "privacy purposes," the school would not even tell them which children had downs syndrome, or cerebral palsy, or manic depression, or Huntington's, or any number of other disorders. It was off-limits to ask what a child had, and information came only in the form of spontaneous need-to-know moments from the supervising teachers. The overwhelming majority of the people working with the children had no idea what the needs of the children were (only the actual teachers were allowed to know that) and so could not adequately care for them properly, despite their best intentions.

Though my mom was a complete disgrace as a parent in private, she was a good paraprofessional. She had to have a degree and go to the local private college during the summer after every school year for training. She was not allowed to work without this training. The schools pay for it.

She only worked with high needs kids(autism, metal retardation, downs, blind, deaf, violent), she has older kids that were in diapers she had to change and rock to sleep. They would come home with her sometimes, their parents would call her at home and ask how to handle situations.

The paraprofessionals are trained. Substitute replacements, however, are just like regular substitutes. No training needed.

Now, after all this what bad I could say is that she worked for the public school system and made less than $700 a month. That I never saw as fair, as she did much more than the teacher with 20 good, quite kids (they were separated in our parish by learning level and level of behavior, those with more needs got more aides) and an aide, who constantly took breaks, while the aide and paraprofessional were left in charge of the class.

I HATE public school.

[slothman]

...
Despite the bulk of care being their responsibility though, the para-assistants, as they were called, were not allowed to know anything more than the minimum about the needs and situations of children. ...


Offtopic: When you said para-assistants I was thinking of teachers skydiving.
Ontopic: I don't like this either.
I doubt it will help the student in both the short and long runs.
Just like jail won't help all criminals.

[asimplegirl]

I don't think jail or this is supposed to "help". Its just a way to get those which you prefer no contact out of your hair and not getting their own way. And I support prisons for really bad crimes, my hubby= corrections officer.

It's just that not many will admit this, as they want to have a REALLY good reason to keep people locked down, when the truth is enough when it comes to really heinous crimes you'd think.

[SimpleName]

While our public school system is a national disgrace, most of these issues are the result of parents who are incompetent, irresponsible and unwilling to take on the most basic responsibility of being parents.

100%! That was to be my response. Public schools are just the result of self-interested parents. They don't want to have to deal the children they bore, so they dump them in school as well as daycare and other b/s activities to keep them away. I believe this dumping of responsibility is the great cause of disrespect that elders complain about (not the lack of physical punishment). Instead of getting a true discipline at home, they receive pseudo-punishments such as detention or in school suspensions. They don't lose anything, they don't feel anything. They just sit and formulate personal plots on how they could kill the supervising "authority" and how long they could get away with murdering other faculty members before they were stopped. At least that is, if they were imaginative. :D

So, in this case, punishment should be up to the parent. Why do people allow these outright insane ideas to be put into the making. Seclusion rooms? Holy hell! The government restraining a human being from receiving the compulsory schooling that forced the kid there in the first place. Parents that agree with this disgusting process should be shot or at least be continually scolded by John Taylor Gatto for the rest of their lives via compulsory attendance at Gatto's household. Sounds like a plan.

[angelatc]

100%! That was to be my response. Public schools are just the result of self-interested parents. .

Do you have kids?

[pinkmandy]

100%! That was to be my response. Public schools are just the result of self-interested parents. They don't want to have to deal the children they bore, so they dump them in school as well as daycare and other b/s activities to keep them away. I believe this dumping of responsibility is the great cause of disrespect that elders complain about (not the lack of physical punishment). Instead of getting a true discipline at home, they receive pseudo-punishments such as detention or in school suspensions. They don't lose anything, they don't feel anything. They just sit and formulate personal plots on how they could kill the supervising "authority" and how long they could get away with murdering other faculty members before they were stopped. At least that is, if they were imaginative. :D

So, in this case, punishment should be up to the parent. Why do people allow these outright insane ideas to be put into the making. Seclusion rooms? Holy hell! The government restraining a human being from receiving the compulsory schooling that forced the kid there in the first place. Parents that agree with this disgusting process should be shot or at least be continually scolded by John Taylor Gatto for the rest of their lives via compulsory attendance at Gatto's household. Sounds like a plan.

+ 1000 and well said. Except for the shooting part. Not a fan of shooting the parents but if all parents read Gatto our schools wouldn't be what they are right now. They simply wouldn't stand for it.

[Brassmouth]

Children forced into cell-like school seclusion rooms
By Ashley Fantz
CNN

MURRAYVILLE, Georgia (CNN) -- A few weeks before 13-year-old Jonathan King killed himself, he told his parents that his teachers had put him in "time-out."

Read the rest: http://edition.cnn.com/2008/US/12/17/seclusion.rooms/index.html

Hang all those responsible.

Public schools are gulags.

[DanielF17]

At my middle school, there was "in school suspension." It was a small room about the size of a walk in closet with no windows and one door. they did leave the door open at all times and there was always a staff member sitting outside the room. When a student was sent there, they were there for a minimum of one full school day.

[ronpaulfollower999]

Bumping an old topic, but because a friend posted this video on FB and the seclusion rooms had me disgusted.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NYzG-AOBQ6U

What happened to no cruel or unusual punishment?

[catfeathers]

I think I would have preferred the seclusion room to the paddlings and humiliation I received almost daily when I was in 5th grade because I couldn't write fast enough to keep up with the rest of the class. I have a cousin that got a broken arm during a paddling. I'm glad they have done away with paddles for the most part.

The shocking and the restraint for kids that don't look like they're hurting anybody are over the top. They might be needed in some cases but if they're going to use those methods they need to be trained better and only use them in extreme instances. The seclusion room might give an overly stimulated and violent child a chance to calm down without hurting somebody but I don't think it should be used for more than a few minutes. None of these things should be used routinely and without trying other things first and getting permission from the parents, if possible.

Edited to add: Home school if at all possible!

[libertygold]

Sickening. Public schooling really is training for totalitarianism.