What I want to know from Ron Paul – Part 1 - The Middle East

[New York Central]

What I want to know from Ron Paul – Part 1 - The Middle East

I want to hear more about Ron Paul's master plan regarding the entire Middle East. That area of the world is so complex and I need a little clarity in many areas. I want to know the general plans for every country in that region and see the big picture from the bottom up. I believe the next President will inherit the war with a troop level presence close to what we have today. I can only pray there are many successes, but there have been too many disappointments. The next administration will also inherit an exhausted military. The next president gets one big mess. What are the steps to take that mess and transform it to achieve your vision?

First, specifically, Bill O'Reilly brought up a very important question tonight while interviewing you on his show. The question was in regard to Iran and preventing a disaster emanating from that country in the next 5-10 years. The scenario is plausible and inferred a nuclear capable Iran (nearing military grade nuclear material) having a continued association with Hezbollah. Hezbollah for those that don't know are a Lebanon based group with headquarters in Pakistan and they are funded by Iran. The group's aim is to destroy Israel and to create a fundamentalist Islamic state in Lebanon. I want to hear more specifics from Dr. Paul on how he would manage the situation O’Reilly presented. Let’s not worry about what got us there in first place in this situation, we are we are. I think BillO gave you a great opportunity which you missed. How do you handle that threat? We won’t be able to leave that region entirely anytime soon and Hezbollah will go after whoever stands in their way. The next president will have this situation on his plate immediately. How will you keep me safe presented with that situation?

Iran in my opinion needs to be subject to complete transparency and compliance with all nuclear regulatory agencies, commissions, laws, treaties, everything. If Iran were to be a true immediate threaten to America, or our Ron Paul improved intelligence structure discovered such motive coupled with a near ability or if Iran cut back on one inspection of any nuclear related activity, I would like to know that Ron Paul would use the full power of our Air Force to send Iran's energy program back to 1776. At least I know it would be done legally and with the will of the people. The whole country wants to know that you will make them safe. The other candidates will try to make you look weak and unable to provide for our safety. Diplomacy and Peace are definitely what would make a better world, but when things get rough I want to know how strongly you will respond.

Also, I want to know the proposed relations with each of the countries. Iraq, Iran, Saudi Arabia, Syria, Lebanon, Jordan, Turkey, Kuwait, Afghanistan & Pakistan. How do we get to free trade with all and alliances with none? It's not going to happen overnight, the world would go into shock. Explain the process going from the mess you may inherit to the relations you envision. How do we proceed with achieving peace while reducing our military overseas?

Those that understand the framework guiding your principles get your big picture. Unfortunately many do not understand that framework or how it’s intended to manifest itself. At least people are beginning to realize that continued carnage and/or occupation over there will have consequences here. The enemy won’t forget. What measures will you implement to make me safe? That is the question everyone needs an answer to. I think I know the answers you would give, but America needs to hear it from you. A little Don’t Tread on Me emphasis on foreign policy is in order.

:)

[LibertyEagle]

Hi NYC. You understand that this is an independent grassroots forum, right? If you're wanting Ron Paul or his campaign to see what you wrote, you're going to need to send it to them.

[john_anderson_ii]

I'm shocked no one has responded yet. I'm not Dr. Paul, but I'll give some ideas of what a society mindful of it's liberty would do.

What I want to know from Ron Paul – Part 1 - The Middle East

I want to hear more about Ron Paul's master plan regarding the entire Middle East. That area of the world is so complex and I need a little clarity in many areas. I want to know the general plans for every country in that region and see the big picture from the bottom up.


Why would we be making plans for every country in that region from the bottom up? Why not let those countries choose for themselves how they live and die. If they harm or threaten us, we clean the floor with them. If they harm or threaten each other, it's none of our business.



I believe the next President will inherit the war with a troop level presence close to what we have today. I can only pray there are many successes, but there have been too many disappointments. The next administration will also inherit an exhausted military. The next president gets one big mess. What are the steps to take that mess and transform it to achieve your vision?


1.) Bring our exhausted military home.
2.) Allow our military time to re-organize and replenish.
3.) Protect our own soil, our own people, and our borders
4.) Stop stealing from the poor and middle class to finance an empire.



First, specifically, Bill O'Reilly brought up a very important question tonight while interviewing you on his show. The question was in regard to Iran and preventing a disaster emanating from that country in the next 5-10 years. The scenario is plausible and inferred a nuclear capable Iran (nearing military grade nuclear material) having a continued association with Hezbollah. Hezbollah for those that don't know are a Lebanon based group with headquarters in Pakistan and they are funded by Iran. The group's aim is to destroy Israel and to create a fundamentalist Islamic state in Lebanon. I want to hear more specifics from Dr. Paul on how he would manage the situation O’Reilly presented. Let’s not worry about what got us there in first place in this situation, we are we are. I think BillO gave you a great opportunity which you missed. How do you handle that threat?


Bill O'Reilly gives people only the opportunity to be talked at, talked over, and cut off. Nothing more. He's afraid of real debate because he has nothing but emotions and sound bytes with which to argue his case.

Why is it up to the U.S., and the pocket book of her taxpayers to manage these situations?

No one wants a nuclear Iran, but on the other side of that you talk as if Israel is a small helpless puppy that needs protecting. Israel is perfectly capable of protecting itself, without U.S. help. We have given them all the weapons and training they need. They have hundreds of Nukes with which they will keep Iran in check. It doesn't take a full scale invasion and all sorts of war to keep Iran in check. Look at N. Korea. I'm so pissed off at how these neocons just decide it's ok to skip the whole diplomatic stage and jump straight to the "drop the bomb" stage.



We won’t be able to leave that region entirely anytime soon and Hezbollah will go after whoever stands in their way. The next president will have this situation on his plate immediately. How will you keep me safe presented with that situation?


We can too leave the region, and be safer in the process, if and only if we properly protect our borders. What makes you safer with the troops over there? Absolutely nothing! It's like the "gun free zone" laws around schools. It's a "feel good" situation that does nothing to keep you safer.



Also, I want to know the proposed relations with each of the countries. Iraq, Iran, Saudi Arabia, Syria, Lebanon, Jordan, Turkey, Kuwait, Afghanistan & Pakistan. How do we get to free trade with all and alliances with none? It's not going to happen overnight, the world would go into shock. Explain the process going from the mess you may inherit to the relations you envision. How do we proceed with achieving peace while reducing our military overseas?


I'm glad you accept the principle that it's regulations that screw up our relations in the Middle East. Going from A to B is actually easier than going from B to A. All the government has to step out. Stop regulating private industry, and trying to use political pressure on behalf of our corporations. Let the corporations fend for themselves and compete like they should be doing. The process is simple. When the oil lobby goes to Washington to ask for some pressure to be put on U.A.E. because they want to cut production. Washington should just say "No, you deal with it."

Then the radical muslims cannot blame America, they can blame Exxon or whoever, but not America in a political way. That makes us safer.



Those that understand the framework guiding your principles get your big picture. Unfortunately many do not understand that framework or how it’s intended to manifest itself. At least people are beginning to realize that continued carnage and/or occupation over there will have consequences here. The enemy won’t forget. What measures will you implement to make me safe? That is the question everyone needs an answer to. I think I know the answers you would give, but America needs to hear it from you. A little Don’t Tread on Me emphasis on foreign policy is in order.
:)

Why do you keep asking people to make you safe? You want to be safe? If you don't own a gun, buy one. Then learn to use it. Then protect you and your from family from the things you can protect them from.

Trust me: If Iran gets the bomb, the fight will be between Israel and Iran. Then, under a Ron Paul presidency, the issue of U.S. involvement will be :

A.) Transparently discussed and debated with the representatives of the people.
B.) Weighed and measured based on risks and assessments.
C.) Executed according to the will of the people at large.

See how that works? That's a free society, a Republic, in action. See the way the neocons that O'Reilly supports did it in Iraq? That's how a fascist dictatorship handles a war.

[FrankRep]

New York Central,

This Video will answer many of your questions.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yCM_wQy4YVg

[derdy]

I'm not Ron Paul, but it sounds like you're gobbling up a lot of the propaganda against Iran. Iran is a signatory nation under the NNPT (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nuclear_Non-Proliferation_Treaty#Parties_to_the_treaty) and as such has the right to peaceful use of nuclear energy (see pillar three).

Also, recall that when we carried out Operation Ajax (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Operation_Ajax) and installed the Shah, we supplied him with a 5-megawatt nuclear research reactor (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nuclear_program_of_Iran#U.S.-Iran_nuclear_co-operation_in_the_1950s_and_60s). In March 1974, the Shah envisioned a time when the world's oil supply would run out, and declared, "Petroleum is a noble material, much too valuable to burn... We envision producing, as soon as possible, 23 000 megawatts of electricity using nuclear plants."
(http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nuclear_program_of_Iran#U.S.-Iran_nuclear_co-operation_in_the_1970s)

Bottom line, Iran is entitled to nuclear energy as a signatory to the NNPT, no matter what neoconservative nonsense they spew to the contrary.

History does not backup the assertion that Iran will go on to conquer the rest of the Middle East. They have NEVER said they want to "wipe Israel off the map" (http://www.prisonplanet.com/articles/january2007/260107offthemap.htm), it was a mistranslation.

Further, the most interesting aspect of this whole thing is, here is the United States, preparing for more pre-emptive war against a country that in it's history has not engaged another nation pre-emptively, while it is the United States that has the history of military barbarism, inhumanity, double-deals and treachery. It's completey mindless and hypocritical to even engage a country such as Iran on such false pretenses given the United States history of interventionism in the world.

Here are a few discpicable examples: The CIA backed coup in Chile (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/U.S._intervention_in_Chile), installing Pinochet, Operation Condor, (http://www.gwu.edu/~nsarchiv/news/20010306/), supporting the Contras, who slaughtered villages of women and children, against Nicaragua, (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nicaragua_v._United_States), and the list goes on and on and on....

So it seems to me we should be much more fearful of OUR government as it has shown itself in the past and present to support known terrorist organizations, to sell armaments to our sworn "enemies", to befriend nation-states and arm them, only to declare war on them later, and to do as they please when they please with no regard to human life whatsoever. Even against it's own citizens as in Operation Northwoods (http://abcnews.go.com/US/story?id=92662)

[Slugg]

Please understand that if you're looking for Ron's view, you should ask the campaign. Anything we say here are our own thoughts, not Ron Paul's.

Here is my two cents...


In the last debate that question was asked to Ron..almost exactly. His basic standpoint is "Isreal can take care of herself and doesn't need the United States."

Moreover, all the people who are saying that Iran will dominate the middle east if we leave are the same people who have been wrong about Iraq every step of the way. I think that's important. Why DON'T we turn to those who were right back in 2002 and ask them to lead us? They obviously would have avoided this situation and found ANOTHER way of solving the same problem.

Lastly. Our military is stuck in Iraq. Our borders are open. We are told that anyone is a potential terrorist. So, if someone has a meager passport, some cash, and a desire to do harm. They can simply walk accross our border, strap a bomb to their chest, and get us. Do you think this guy, with a passport and money, is going to go to Iraq to fight our military?

No, if people want to kill american civilians they will not make a stop in Iraq and fight our troops first. So, it seems to me, let's secure our borders. Let's get our military agile again. Let's have a military that is ready to pounce onto the bad guys as we find them. Getting out of the middle east is the easiest way to keep our military agile and ready to go. And at the same time it prevents terrorists from breeding new generations to hate us. If we leave and trade with people' we'll have less enemies. If we somehow get a 'working' government in Iraq that can 'defend itself' it's still only a matter of time before the extremeists take over and come back for us. Much like Iran did in the 70's because of our actions in the 50's. So, the point is, if we want to leave a safer world for our kids. We need to stop fighting all the time and find other solutions.

And while sometimes fighting is inevitable, it is very much avoidable.

[saku39]

john_anderson_ii sums it up very well.

The bottom line is that our intervention only brings about violent reactions and hatred towards us.

A country like say. . . Switzerland hasn't been in a war since 1815. They have a high standard of living and have one of the most stable governments and economies in the world. Think about this: They survived 2 World Wars, while being located right next to Germany! They are neutral in EVERY conflict. And because of this policy, they have NO ENEMIES intent on bringing down their country.

We need to leave the region and tell all the oil companies to fend for themselves. I guarantee you that if oil companies knew that they couldn't lobby congress anymore, they would look for oil elsewhere-- as well as change their products and look for forms of alternative energy.

If you are scared for your safety, do something about it. Take self defense courses, buy some guns, and keep your eyes open. But DO NOT expect the government to help you as it will do nothing but DOOM you. You CANNOT trust them. Think of everything they've screwed up in the past 7 years: the shredding of the bill of rights, illegal wiretapping, illegal prisons, torture, the end of habeus corpus, the end of posse cometatus, $9 trillion debt, the total disaster of FEMA, the firing of federal employees for stupid political reasons, and last and most importantly-- getting into a horrific and stupid war with fake intelligence which has cost us 3700+ lives.

The government should do as little as possible and hold a non-interventionist foreign policy. As it stands now, they are blocking the way to peace.

[saku39]

derdy and Slugg also have very good posts.

[sickmint79]

american view of israeli events is extremely filtered by israel's massive control in washington and media. they have been called the 2nd most powerful lobbyist group many times and are far more often than not the aggressors and more brutal in regards to conflicts in the region.

[micahnelson]

http://www.micahnelson.com/?p=115

My response to Bill O'Reilly's show should suffice for your issues with Iran. Disengagement is the answer.

[Elwar]

Bill O'Reilly and the neo-cons sell fear. Many people buy it up like it's the greatest thing in the world to live in fear.

Ron Paul is selling hope.

[Captain Shays]

Let me answer as a Christian to those who understand things from a strictly Christian perspective.
First of all, many evengelicals today feel a connection to the state of Israel as if it were our mother nation. There is good reason for this as mentioned in the bible.

But it goes too far sometimes. many preachers make a huge leap from "those who bless Israel will be blessed, and those who curse Israel will be cursed" to advocating for the United States of America to use our money, and military to protect Israel. Using our military to protect Israel is not "blessing Israel" according to the bible any more than not using our military or weapons transfered to Israel is cursing her. In fact, Ron Paul has made a very good case to indicate that our "support" ie giving Israel money is actually making them less safe because on many occassions we have prevented them from acting in their own best interest to provide for our own best interest.

But as Christians or Jews to assume that the USA is Israel's protector is borderline if not outright blasphemy for according to the bible that Jews and Christians share, ONLY GOD protects Israel.

If you as a Christian or a Jew believes in the sovereignty of God, and that He is all powerful then you also must believe that He doesn't need the USA to protect His people.

I just wanted to ad this element because I understand that Christians and Jews are both very influencial voting groups in America and they both view Middle Eastern affairs from a uniquely religious perspective.

As an American and a student of history, I totally agree with the posts that preceded my own relative to our policy of neutrality and non interventionism which was initially based upon the Swiss as a model.

[ChooseLiberty]

I dub thee - Troll Central.
;)

What I want to know from Ron Paul – Part 1 - The Middle East

I want to hear more about Ron Paul's master plan regarding the entire Middle East. That area of the world is so complex and I need a little clarity in many areas. I want to know the general plans for every country in that region and see the big picture from the bottom up. I believe the next President will inherit the war with a troop level presence close to what we have today. I can only pray there are many successes, but there have been too many disappointments. The next administration will also inherit an exhausted military. The next president gets one big mess. What are the steps to take that mess and transform it to achieve your vision?

First, specifically, Bill O'Reilly brought up a very important question tonight while interviewing you on his show. The question was in regard to Iran and preventing a disaster emanating from that country in the next 5-10 years. The scenario is plausible and inferred a nuclear capable Iran (nearing military grade nuclear material) having a continued association with Hezbollah. Hezbollah for those that don't know are a Lebanon based group with headquarters in Pakistan and they are funded by Iran. The group's aim is to destroy Israel and to create a fundamentalist Islamic state in Lebanon. I want to hear more specifics from Dr. Paul on how he would manage the situation O’Reilly presented. Let’s not worry about what got us there in first place in this situation, we are we are. I think BillO gave you a great opportunity which you missed. How do you handle that threat? We won’t be able to leave that region entirely anytime soon and Hezbollah will go after whoever stands in their way. The next president will have this situation on his plate immediately. How will you keep me safe presented with that situation?

Iran in my opinion needs to be subject to complete transparency and compliance with all nuclear regulatory agencies, commissions, laws, treaties, everything. If Iran were to be a true immediate threaten to America, or our Ron Paul improved intelligence structure discovered such motive coupled with a near ability or if Iran cut back on one inspection of any nuclear related activity, I would like to know that Ron Paul would use the full power of our Air Force to send Iran's energy program back to 1776. At least I know it would be done legally and with the will of the people. The whole country wants to know that you will make them safe. The other candidates will try to make you look weak and unable to provide for our safety. Diplomacy and Peace are definitely what would make a better world, but when things get rough I want to know how strongly you will respond.

Also, I want to know the proposed relations with each of the countries. Iraq, Iran, Saudi Arabia, Syria, Lebanon, Jordan, Turkey, Kuwait, Afghanistan & Pakistan. How do we get to free trade with all and alliances with none? It's not going to happen overnight, the world would go into shock. Explain the process going from the mess you may inherit to the relations you envision. How do we proceed with achieving peace while reducing our military overseas?

Those that understand the framework guiding your principles get your big picture. Unfortunately many do not understand that framework or how it’s intended to manifest itself. At least people are beginning to realize that continued carnage and/or occupation over there will have consequences here. The enemy won’t forget. What measures will you implement to make me safe? That is the question everyone needs an answer to. I think I know the answers you would give, but America needs to hear it from you. A little Don’t Tread on Me emphasis on foreign policy is in order.

:)

[mesler]

Here is the simple answer to the Iran paranoia:

If a country attacks us, we have the moral right to attack them. This includes organizations that attack us through proxy.

The fear being sold is that Iran can give TERRORISTS nuclear weapons, but if they did this it would be almost as dumb as if they did it themselves.

Afghanistan showed that we are willing to go into any nation to attack our attackers (Well, except Pakistan I guess.)

[CasualApathy]

I dub thee - Troll Central.
;)

That was uncalled for.

He asks questions that many people would ask.

Trying to gain a better understanding of Ron Pauls vision is not a crime you know.

[Cindy]

This is something NEVER talked about ( wish it would come up in a GOP debate). I also learned that it is the number 2 censored story of 2007.

Haliburton is the company that recently sold Iran the key nuclear power components it has.

http://knowyourbfee.blogspot.com/2006_05_01_archive.html

Dick Cheney was involved with a lot of the preliminary negotiations leading up to that sale, when he was CEO of Haliburton in the 90s.

Poor Iran. We sell them the stuff to become more energy efficient and then, threaten to bomb them for having it, calling them terrorist.

[Nefertiti]

The original poster is getting his information from a very dubious source it seems. He believes Hizbollah is headquartered in Pakistan!!! :p

Let's see, Hizbollah is Shi'a, and Pakistan is a Sunni country...That's about as hairbrained as saying that Iran (A Shi'a country) has any relationship to al Qaeda (a Sunni group).

[nexalacer]

ChooseLiberty has a lot of posts talking about trolls it seems.... maybe the story of the troll under the bridge collecting toll for his road (seems like an anti-capitalist story, doesn't it?) really scared the crap outta him when he was a child... OH NOES! THE TROLLS ARE ATTACKING!

Calling people a troll is ridiculous... if their goal is to waste your time, then by responding you let them win! It's like taking away freedom's when terrorists attack to make yourself safer from the terrorists!

This is a good link for those of you who don't understand trolls. (http://c2.com/cgi/wiki?TrollDefinition)

[ChooseLiberty]

Yeah. I have this knee jerk reaction to call people that reference Hannity, Savage, Oreally, etc. low IQ trolls.

I wonder how long those shills will last after W is gone? Assuming he goes.

[Cindy]

Yeah. I have this knee jerk reaction to call people that reference Hannity, Savage, Oreally, etc. low IQ trolls.

I wonder how long those shills will last after W is gone? Assuming he goes.

They are reporters spreading news trying to discredit Paul. Seems almost expected that people will come here looking for clarification and Pauls side of things.

Lots of great responces came up that many will learn more from.

I was thinking a 20 minute infomercial based on the informative responces of this thread would be awesome to get out to the American public.

America does need a history lesson, to cut through the BS of the propaganda being slung at us.

[ChooseLiberty]

True dat. My bad.


They are reporters spreading news trying to discredit Paul. Seems almost expected that people will come here looking for clarification and Pauls side of things.

Lots of great responces came up that many will learn more from.

I was thinking a 20 minute infomercial based on the informative responces of this thread would be awesome to get out to the American public.

America does need a history lesson, to cut through the BS of the propaganda being slung at us.

[Nefertiti]

Hmmm, you gave me an idea...a book entitled the Middle East for Dummies.

[Nefertiti]

Oops, I see it has already been written!

[Cindy]

"Ayatollah Ali Khamenei said, "We have no problem with the world. We are not a threat whatsoever to the world, and the world knows it. We will never start a war. We have no intention of going to war with any state."

Taken from- http://www.informationclearinghouse.info/article16218.htm


This guy seems to be getting railroaded into something he's not about. He just sympathizes with the displaced Palestinians and all of his sympathetic comments are being distorted and misinterpreted.


I recently watched a documentary about that group and no doubt, they were living in deplorable conditions as a result of being displaced from their homes by Isrealis.

Make of it what you will and perhaps do your own further research.

[Kregener]

Non-intervention and open and free trade.

[Cindy]

These are two MUST watch videos if you are going to begin to understand Paul on Iran and the nature of our interference with that country since the 1950


shttp://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ldgbOxDX6DE&mode=related&search=

( a PBS documentary kicks in soon on the link above that is VERY eye openning)




http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=q_Xvhg3DxQE