English Only Language for Government?

[Matt Collins]

So my city is considering passing a law making English the mandatory language of the municipal government (with an exclusion for health/safety situations).


Thoughts?

[Brian4Liberty]

So my city is considering passing a law making English the mandatory language of the municipal government (with an exclusion for health/safety situations).


Thoughts?

Should save money on translation and printing costs...

[Conza88]

So my city is considering passing a law making English the mandatory language of the municipal government (with an exclusion for health/safety situations).


Thoughts?

I totally reject this notion.

The official language should be latin. To run you must be able to speak it. Every document must be in latin, there are to be NO TRANSLATIONS. etc.

Then the populace will really see how fken retarded government is, and the absolute no need for it. :)

[Matt Collins]

Should save money on translation and printing costs...That is one argument for it.

[Minlawc]

I totally reject this notion.

The official language should be latin. To run you must be able to speak it. Every document must be in latin, there are to be NO TRANSLATIONS. etc.

Then the populace will really see how fken retarded government is, and the absolute no need for it. :)

I wouldn't mind that...

We don't speak English anyway, we speak American.:D

[Kludge]

FFS, just translate my damned sheet music! WTF would you want to write instructions in a dead language for?

[Conza88]

FFS, just translate my damned sheet music! WTF would you want to write instructions in a dead language for?

So the instructions cannot be read. Obviously... :rolleyes:

What happens then? ;)

Because you can't deal with the government.. you head to the: private sector. :D

[Lord Xar]

naaaaaaaaaaah, no need for it.

You are basing your assumption on a majorities declaration.

I think ENGLISH ONLY most certainly must and should be instantiated in a legal and binding way. Balkanization is splintering up all across the United States because we are no longer considered the "melting pot" as the years go by.

Los Angeles is a cesspool and california is following suit and nobody seems to give a shit that American taxpayers are putting tens of millions of dollars for translators.

this idea of "dual" citizenship and dual whatever totally sucks. I am italian, but I would never be rude enough to speak my language around others and EXPECT my language to ever take precendent over english BUT that is not the case for "other" nationalities.. Being american is NOW considered 'secondary' to 'other' countries. This cannot be tolerated. I am all for representing your own culture, but do it in your own home otherwise.... we loose ourselves.

Be an american first and the thought of english only is most certainly a good idea. If you don't consider yourself an "american" first then you probably do not believe in english only.

[Grandson of Liberty]

You are basing your assumption on a majorities declaration.

I think ENGLISH ONLY most certainly must and should be instantiated in a legal and binding way. Balkanization is splintering up all across the United States because we are no longer considered the "melting pot" as the years go by.

Los Angeles is a cesspool and california is following suit and nobody seems to give a shit that American taxpayers are putting tens of millions of dollars for translators.

this idea of "dual" citizenship and dual whatever totally sucks. I am italian, but I would never be rude enough to speak my language around others and EXPECT my language to ever take precendent over english BUT that is not the case for "other" nationalities.. Being american is NOW considered 'secondary' to 'other' countries. This cannot be tolerated. I am all for representing your own culture, but do it in your own home otherwise.... we loose ourselves.

Be an american first and the thought of english only is most certainly a good idea. If you don't consider yourself an "american" first then you probably do not believe in english only.

yup, what he said.

[rockandrollsouls]

I'm pretty sure Ron co-sponsored a bill declaring English the official language...check Ontheissues.com I'm sure it's on there.

Update: found it. http://www.issues2000.org/tx/Ron_Paul_Immigration.htm very bottom. Plank 5 seems to be a very logical reason for the bill. Overall it's fairly well thought out.

[yongrel]

I would prefer we make Latin the official language of government. Perhaps it would weed out some of the dumber bureaucrats.

quis custodiet ipsos custodes?

[Joseph Hart]

If you can not speak english, there should only be 1 government form translated. Private Translator listings.

[jkr]

1 tounge per nation, anything else is a bonus but we must share a language to survive as a nation

[acptulsa]

Oh, you're talking about as opposed to Spanish. I thought this was one of those old fashioned anti-bureaucratese bills for a minute there. Always did like the idea, but they never seemed to work as intended...

[NolanLawson]

The thing is, no matter how well-intentioned language reform laws are, they rarely work. It's like trying to legislate against gravity. California made English their official language in the 80's, and you can see how well that worked for them - the percentage of Spanish speakers has been rising anyway. Many government offices in California still issue documents in both Spanish and English, because they prefer to deal with reality rather than government fiat.

So I guess the question is: what's the reality in your city? Does a large part of the population speak a language other than English, monolingually? If so, then making English the only official language is probably a bad idea, since it will just lead to government inefficiency. If everyone in your city already speaks English, though, then it won't hurt, but it won't help either.


Los Angeles is a cesspool and california is following suit and nobody seems to give a shit that American taxpayers are putting tens of millions of dollars for translators.

I see your point, but the alternative seems way more costly. If your city has 30% Russian speakers but the city government only prints documents in English, isn't that government automatically only 70% as effective as it would be if they just hired a translator? The other alternative - re-education of the entire 30% population to speak English - seems even more expensive.

The linguist and humorist Geoffrey Pullum wrote a pretty good article about the English-only movement called "Here Come the Linguistic Fascists." Can't find a link to the article anywhere, but it's in this book: http://www.amazon.com/Eskimo-Vocabulary-Irreverent-Essays-Language/dp/0226685349

[jrich4rpaul]

I've actually seen increasing amounts of signs where the main text was in Spanish, with English subtitles.

It's sad, really. I say we all go to another country and try to make them change their language to accomodate us, and see how that goes.

[Matt Collins]

I am italian, but I would never be rude enough to speak my language around others and EXPECT my language to ever take precendent over english And for that I commend you!

[brandon]

So my city is considering passing a law making English the mandatory language of the municipal government (with an exclusion for health/safety situations).


Thoughts?

NPR had some coverage of this the other day. Apparently the guy who introduced the legislation introduced it in Japanese. lol

[Matt Collins]

I have to vote on this today and I am trying to make up my mind.

[Matt Collins]

NPR had some coverage of this the other day. Apparently the guy who introduced the legislation introduced it in Japanese. lol
Yes... Councilman Eric Crafton. I met him at a small townhall meeting 2 months ago while he was discussing this. He was in the Navy and learned Japenese himself when he lived in Japan.

He thought it was lunacy that there was no official language of the government so to make a point he introduced this bill in a language foreign to everyone on the Council... Japanese.

[ChaosControl]

I'm sick of having to press 1. In 10 years we're going to have to press 2. :(

But seriously, I do think English should be the language for government. It wasn't necessary in the past, but I think it is now.

[socialize_me]

Legalize competing currencies, why not competing languages??

Nahh, the official language should be English. I don't give a shit if people are "offended". Get the fuck out if you can't speak English and are complaining about it. When I go to Mexico, I speak Spanish and I don't get offended. When people come to America, they better damn speak English. If they don't, that's fine--but they shouldn't be whining about everything being in English as it should be.

Sorry, I don't like being a Switzerland where we have 4 different official languages, and everything looks like a damn TV manual where it has twelve different language translations.

[Lord Xar]

English only is a good thing. It creates a common and seamless communication vehicle. Remember, language is most often cited as bridging gaps. This idea of splintering languages competing is very very destructive - see, california. To me, its a no brainer. Like i said earlier, if you consider yourself an American, then English only is of no consequence and should be embraced. And this doesn't mean its "assumed", but rather made into law. This political correctness has got to end, and end fast.

[angelatc]

So my city is considering passing a law making English the mandatory language of the municipal government (with an exclusion for health/safety situations).


Thoughts?

Yes. Saves millions in bi-lingual related costs.

[SnappleLlama]

I'm completely down with making English the official language.

[demolama]

When we incorporated the Louisiana Territory into the nation we never forced them to speak English.. the same with Spanish California. The people in those territories learned English or they didn't survive. Today however we have government that caters to these languages so they don't have to sink or swim because its handed to them. (They cater to them in order to get their vote of course)

But forced English only laws are not the answer... the society must dictate. No one forced Martin Van Buren to speak English even though his native language was Dutch... again he made himself learn in order to survive in a predominately English settlement. Thus another reason that National laws forcing alternate languages on billboards, packages, official documents, etc. contradict the will of the people at local levels.

[jkr]

i these matters it is hard enough to trust someone you understand.

[eOs]

Please tell me you voted for it..

[ToyBoat]

I have to vote on this today and I am trying to make up my mind.
I can't even believe you have to think about it. ENGLISH

[Pennsylvania]

Governments are to be Irish-Gaelic only. I deliberated at length about what the status of Scots-Gaelic and Manx should be, and concluded they belong in the dungheap of linguistic history for not living up to the unprecedented beauty established by teanga na n-Eireannach.

English is completely out of the question.

[Xenophage]

This is the sort of thing people should vote on. Either way it goes, in a popular vote, nobody's rights are infringed.

[idiom]

Oh, so no klingon speaking then?

Also, south americans already converted to Spanish. Spanish is a far more noble language than english. If they can convert, why can't we?

[Matt Collins]

Please tell me you voted for it..I am not going to say which way I voted. Why? Because as I'm "climbing the greasy pole" of local politics I don't want my vote to come back against me later on. Besides ballots are supposed to be secret for a reason.

There have already been, political threats, financial threats, and even death threats in the city of Nashville over this amendment. So it behooves me to keep my mouth closed about it especially since it's not that important of an issue to me; meaning that it's not really a big vs small government dichotomy.

[heavenlyboy34]

So my city is considering passing a law making English the mandatory language of the municipal government (with an exclusion for health/safety situations).


Thoughts?

We did it in Phoenix, and it works nice. :)

[heavenlyboy34]

Oh, so no klingon speaking then?

Also, south americans already converted to Spanish. Spanish is a far more noble language than english. If they can convert, why can't we?

They don't speak Spanish (as spoken in Spain)-they speak local dialects of Spanish (Mexican, Salvadoran, etc). What's this "more noble" business? :confused: Sounds like bleeding heart liberal rhetoric to me. :p

[Matt Collins]

I can't even believe you have to think about it. ENGLISHAlthough I'm a conservative I'm also a libertarian. That means although I usually support conservative measures I also have to look at it from an objective / libertarian angle. Libertarianism and modern day conservatism doesn't always align. In other words... I had to ask myself questions like is this going to cost the taxpayers more money? Is this going to infringe or abridge anyone's liberty or ability to live free? Is this within the scope of the government's charter?


So there is more to any issue than left vs right and specifically here it is more than just "English gooood.... Spanish baaaaad...."

[Lord Xar]

Oh, so no klingon speaking then?

Also, south americans already converted to Spanish. Spanish is a far more noble language than english. If they can convert, why can't we?

Rewarding the balkanization of america via unprecedented law breaking and rewarding of such behaviour thru government handouts is not a wise way to go. Infact, if you are talking about European Spanish, that is much different than what is spoken in mexico. Plus, I and about 300million americans might think different. In addition, English is the international language of business and travel. Italian is a much more noble language than spanish and you don't see me heralding its need.

Matt, if you are receiving threats - well, that could be from Americans who are just fed up over this political correctness and a literal take-over of our country. Also, what the pro-illegal supporters are now doing is calling up and 'pretending' to be FOR the other side but very vitriol.. thus creating the illusion for the recipient to realize "wow, I was gonna support this english only but these truly racist americans are so not like me.... I think I will vote against it.". How do I know this? Lets say I know. So, when hearing about these threats -- keep in mind, there is a fair chance its just the opposing side manipulating the mindset.

[Lord Xar]

Although I'm a conservative I'm also a libertarian. That means although I usually support conservative measures I also have to look at it from an objective / libertarian angle. Libertarianism and modern day conservatism doesn't always align. In other words... I had to ask myself questions like is this going to cost the taxpayers more money? Is this going to infringe or abridge anyone's liberty or ability to live free? Is this within the scope of the government's charter?


So there is more to any issue than left vs right and specifically here it is more than just "English gooood.... Spanish baaaaad...."

I think many libertarians are trying to fix their square thoughts into realities circle. If you try to abide by EVERYONES' liberty, then you will ultimately create an anarchic environment. As a leader, you have to lead. Sometimes leading is not contingent on trying to make everyone happy. Its not possible. When I am in a courthouse and I hear spanish speakers, I get deeply offended. Why? How do i know if what they are talking about doesn't infringe upon my ability to live free? How do I know there is no nepotism going on? The constitution is written in English for a reason. A common language shares a common understanding. There is no coincidence that with the huge influx of illegals, spanish is being catered to. The immigrants are not learnng english and that creates alot of animosity with americans. It creates balkanization. Language is the glue that binds. Remember that.

[Xenophage]

I think many libertarians are trying to fix their square thoughts into realities circle. If you try to abide by EVERYONES' liberty, then you will ultimately create an anarchic environment. As a leader, you have to lead. Sometimes leading is not contingent on trying to make everyone happy. Its not possible. When I am in a courthouse and I hear spanish speakers, I get deeply offended. Why? How do i know if what they are talking about doesn't infringe upon my ability to live free? How do I know there is no nepotism going on? The constitution is written in English for a reason. A common language shares a common understanding. There is no coincidence that with the huge influx of illegals, spanish is being catered to. The immigrants are not learnng english and that creates alot of animosity with americans. It creates balkanization. Language is the glue that binds. Remember that.

Define "anarchic environment" and why this is a bad thing. I'm not an anarchist, but I am a libertarian and I do abide by everyone's liberty. Anarchy is bad, in my estimation, because it would lead to tyranny in any present day society. I can see anarchy working just fine in a society composed mostly of libertarians, though. Anyway, you don't need anarchy to see freedom through to its ultimate conclusion.

Someone talking about something never infringes upon your ability to live freely, so that's how you know. Somebody DOING something is a different story.

The language issue in government is not a moral issue: its an issue of what works best to aid the political process.

[Gosmokesome]

YES one language only! And it should be Esperanto! One world language! One world culture! One world government?! Forced homogenization is wrong guise

Funny how some of you talk about others 'forcing' you to speak their language but here you are thinking you can force them, really force them at gunpoint, with the iron fist of government.

[Matt Collins]

Matt, if you are receiving threats - well, that could be from Americans who are just fed up over this political correctness and a literal take-over of our country. Not me, but people I know.




Also, what the pro-illegal supporters are now doing is calling up and 'pretending' to be FOR the other side but very vitriol.. thus creating the illusion for the recipient to realize "wow, I was gonna support this english only but these truly racist americans are so not like me.... I think I will vote against it.". How do I know this? Lets say I know. So, when hearing about these threats -- keep in mind, there is a fair chance its just the opposing side manipulating the mindset.A gent provocateur is the term I believe.

[Matt Collins]

When I am in a courthouse and I hear spanish speakers, I get deeply offended. Why? How do i know if what they are talking about doesn't infringe upon my ability to live free? How do I know there is no nepotism going on? The constitution is written in English for a reason. A common language shares a common understanding. There is no coincidence that with the huge influx of illegals, spanish is being catered to. The immigrants are not learnng english and that creates alot of animosity with americans. It creates balkanization. Language is the glue that binds. Remember that.I absolutely agree with this. My question was if this specific amendment would put any undur burden on the taxpayers or infringe on the rights of others.

But I'm pretty sure I arrived at the correct conclusion. ;)

[phill4paul]

Before you decide on the correct conclusion.....

What about making "international sign" the official language?

P.C. for everyone.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/International_Sign_Language

[eOs]

asdf

[FunkBuddha]

I think engrish should be the official language.

http://www.engrish.com/wp-content/uploads/2009/01/step-in-a-head.jpg

http://www.engrish.com//wp-content/uploads/2008/10/in-case-of-emergency.jpg


http://www.engrish.com/wp-content/uploads//2008/09/every-heart-will-be-attacked.jpg

[FunkBuddha]

http://www.engrish.com/2008/11/waiter-this-tastes-like-oh-never-mind/

[Matt Collins]

www.Engrish.com is AWESOME!

[Matt Collins]

I voted on this today.


It failed by a margin of 41k against to 32k for.

http://www.nashville.gov/vote/ElectionReturns/

[Lord Xar]

I voted on this today.


It failed by a margin of 41k against to 32k for.

http://www.nashville.gov/vote/ElectionReturns/

I am not sure how that would be loosing. Americans, it seems, are overwhelmingly in favor of English only. what gives?

[coyote_sprit]

When they rewrite the Constitution and the Declaration of Independence it should be in Spanish.

[Matt Collins]

I am not sure how that would be loosing. Americans, it seems, are overwhelmingly in favor of English only. what gives?Nashville is a very liberal city (as are most). There are a lot of illegal and even legal immigrants. A HUGE Muslim population, lots of foreign business (think Nissan), and something like 12 or 13 places of higher education within the city. Not to mention it's kind of the cultural / artistic center of the South.