How isn't Telecom immunity an ex post facto law??

[socialize_me]

Seriously...I don't get it...then I've read in places where a law is passed that isn't ex post facto but "has the ex post facto-effect"--whatever the heck that means!! So there's a middle ground between passing laws affecting the present and those of ex post? What the hell?? This is shit only lawyers could think up...

[RideTheDirt]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ex_post_facto_law
From wiki:
An ex post facto law (from the Latin for "after the fact") or retroactive law, is a law that retroactively changes the legal consequences of acts committed or the legal status of facts and relationships that existed prior to the enactment of the law. In reference to criminal law, it may criminalize actions that were legal when committed; or it may aggravate a crime by bringing it into a more severe category than it was in at the time it was committed; or it may change or increase the punishment prescribed for a crime, such as by adding new penalties or extending terms; or it may alter the rules of evidence in order to make conviction for a crime more likely than it would have been at the time of the action for which a defendant is prosecuted. Conversely, a form of ex post facto law commonly known as an amnesty law may decriminalize certain acts or alleviate possible punishments (for example by replacing the death sentence with life-long imprisonment) retroactively.

A law may have an ex post facto effect without being technically ex post facto. For example, when a law repeals a previous law, the repealed legislation no longer applies to the situations it once did, even if such situations arose before the law was repealed. The principle of prohibiting the continued application of these kinds of laws is also known as Nullum crimen, nulla poena sine praevia lege poenali.

Generally speaking, ex post facto penal laws are seen as a violation of the rule of law as it applies in a free and democratic society. Most common law jurisdictions do not permit retroactive criminal legislation, though some have suggested that judge-made law is retroactive as a new precedent applies to events that occurred prior to the judicial decision. In some nations that follow the Westminster system of government, such as the United Kingdom, ex post facto laws are technically possible as the doctrine of parliamentary supremacy allows parliament to pass any law it wishes. However, in a nation with an entrenched bill of rights or a written constitution, ex post facto legislation may be prohibited.
emphasis mine

[Danke]

Well, when talking about changing a law (like the recent FISA amendment) to be now a crime of of lesser punishment (or no crime at all), it really isn't in the spirit of ex post facto.

The framers were more concerned with later on, increasing punishment and applying that to which actions were previously less severe crimes or no crimes at all.


There are similarities, as Ron Paul has pointed out. As the victim is now without recourse.

[hotbrownsauce]

Ex Post Facto laws were used in Europe and god knows the USA didn't want those.

As they said above, say today it was legal to bath outside. The next day a new law was passed that said no bath's outside then they would arrest you for yesterday when it wasn't a crime. Do you see why this is unacceptable?

The situation your talking about.... say you took a bath today and you knew it was risky and probably against the law of being naked in public. But since no one could get to you in time to file a lawsuit nothing happened to you (yet). So you decide to make a law that says the time when you took that bath isn't punishable by law to you. This means others who did the same exact thing as you can still be punished.
This is still just as unacceptable as ex post facto laws!!! and it is called Retroactive Immunity! this should be outlawed also. It is a way to do illegal things and get away with them. WHY ELSE WOULD THEY DO IT IF THEY DIDN'T THINK IT WAS PUNISHABLE UNDER THE LAW! It is an admission of guilt.

Bush is quoted as saying, "It's particularly important for Congress to provide meaningful liability protection to those companies now facing multibillion-dollar lawsuits only because they are believed to have assisted in efforts to defend our nation, following the 9/11 attacks."

[Matt Collins]

Who pays attention to that "quiant" little document anymore?

[Brooklyn Red Leg]

Ex post facto is one of the MOST abused aspects of the Constitution in my opinion. The Federal War on Drugs is a great example of that.

[Matt Collins]

Ex post facto is one of the MOST abused aspects of the Constitution in my opinion. The Federal War on Drugs is a great example of that.Explain?