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mediahasyou
11-03-2008, 03:38 PM
Voting is simply wrong because simply it does not leave me alone. If you elect your candidate to office in the name of self-defense, his power will not be restricted to you and to those who voted for him. He will have power over me and others like me as well.

When you enter the voting booth, you are committing an act of enormous presumption. You presume that you have the right to appoint a political guardian over me - a benevolent one, you claim, but a guardian nonetheless.

Where did you get such a right? You have no special authority over me. Where, then, did you obtain the right to appoint an agent with this authority? Where do you get the nerve to advocate that Chuck Baldwin (or anyone else) should have the power of life and death over me and millions of other Americans? Voting is no self-defense. Voting extends far beyond the legitimate boundaries of self-defense.


Forget the electoral rhetoric. Go with your feeling at heart. Make the right decision.

RevolutionSD
11-03-2008, 03:42 PM
Voting is simply wrong because simply it does not leave me alone. If you elect your candidate to office in the name of self-defense, his power will not be restricted to you and to those who voted for him. He will have power over me and others like me as well.

When you enter the voting booth, you are committing an act of enormous presumption. You presume that you have the right to appoint a political guardian over me - a benevolent one, you claim, but a guardian nonetheless.

Where did you get such a right? You have no special authority over me. Where, then, did you obtain the right to appoint an agent with this authority? Where do you get the nerve to advocate that Chuck Baldwin (or anyone else) should have the power of life and death over me and millions of other Americans? Voting is no self-defense. Voting extends far beyond the legitimate boundaries of self-defense.


Forget the electoral rhetoric. Go with your feeling at heart. Make the right decision.

Exactly! Which is why my decision is firm in NOT VOTING.

bluto20
11-03-2008, 03:45 PM
thank you. good day.

mediahasyou
11-03-2008, 03:53 PM
http://americanstill.com/jb/web/wesley_bocxe/wb_1.jpg

mediahasyou
11-03-2008, 04:30 PM
Any leader you vote for will tax me. They will steal money from others coercively.

You have no right to steal from others. Therefore, you have no right to vote.

Voting is a violation of my right of self ownership. If you vote you are imposing a leader onto me, you are making others slaves.

http://www.4uth.gov.ua/usa/english/facts/afrhist/images/outrage.jpg

free.alive
11-03-2008, 04:35 PM
mediahasyou is right, I think. Yet 99.9% of us are going to participate in the consent and cultivation of evil tomorrow. I know I am!

(and then a long shower...)

Theocrat
11-03-2008, 04:40 PM
I think you're looking at it from the wrong angle. When we cast our ballots, we are voting for certain men (hopefully of moral integrity and religious character) to represent us on a national level as servants of our country. They are not our masters, for they can only do what is enumerated by us for them to do. They have an oath to take by which they bind themselves to a document, sealed by their own words, as they promise to perform their public duties with the utmost honor and in the best interests of God and the American people. In a sense, they enter into a covenant with our nation, and if they break their covenant vows, then it is the duty of those represented to break ties with them and vote another servant into office. Never forget that.

CUnknown
11-03-2008, 04:42 PM
The Constitution gives all American citizens the right to vote. Do you believe this should be changed and our Republic abolished?

As long as we're voting for candidates who will uphold the Constitution, we have done nothing wrong. We've done something right, in fact. We have to stand up and use whatever channels we have to change our government back to the way it ought to be. Voting is one of those channels. I believe that voting could be effective if enough people voted 3rd party. Voting for one of the two main parties is a complete waste, and even worse, I agree with you, it could be considered an act of enslavement and violence.

hopeforamerica
11-03-2008, 05:29 PM
Funny, if Ron Paul were the repub. nominee, would you feel the same way?

ronpaulhawaii
11-03-2008, 06:45 PM
I think if we restore our constitutional republic to its intended bounds, many of the anarchists would realize it is not that bad. Yes, gov't is an evil, but history has shown it to be a necessary evil. The OP is a bit out there because humans are , for the most part, pack animals. The lone wolf is the exception to the rule. Voting for our leaders is a time honored tradition which, when done honorably, has led to the most civilized and productive societies throughout history. Your milage may vary...

yongrel
11-03-2008, 06:47 PM
*cough* social contract *cough*

JoshLowry
11-03-2008, 06:50 PM
*cough* gobble gobble gobble *cough*

AbolishTheGovt
11-03-2008, 06:52 PM
I'm a Rothbardian, rights-based anarcho-capitalist myself, but voting for someone like Chuck Baldwin is, in my opinion, a bite out of the shackles and burden that the state has placed upon you, and myself. If Chuck Baldwin or someone like him were actually elected President, yours and my liberty would be returned to us in enormous proportions.

Secondly, there are many things we can and should vote for. I intend to go in the voting booth tomorrow and vote No on every expansion of government power and on every single proposed tax or levy. If you don't help to vote down those things, you can thank only yourself for the loss of liberty and wealth you suffer when those things pass.

heavenlyboy34
11-03-2008, 06:57 PM
Voting is simply wrong because simply it does not leave me alone. If you elect your candidate to office in the name of self-defense, his power will not be restricted to you and to those who voted for him. He will have power over me and others like me as well.

When you enter the voting booth, you are committing an act of enormous presumption. You presume that you have the right to appoint a political guardian over me - a benevolent one, you claim, but a guardian nonetheless.

Where did you get such a right? You have no special authority over me. Where, then, did you obtain the right to appoint an agent with this authority? Where do you get the nerve to advocate that Chuck Baldwin (or anyone else) should have the power of life and death over me and millions of other Americans? Voting is no self-defense. Voting extends far beyond the legitimate boundaries of self-defense.


Forget the electoral rhetoric. Go with your feeling at heart. Make the right decision.

I like your attitude! :D

Andrew-Austin
11-03-2008, 07:14 PM
I think you're looking at it from the wrong angle. When we cast our ballots, we are voting for certain men (hopefully of moral integrity and religious character) I sometimes get the impression you wouldn't even be here if Ron Paul didn't call himself a Christian. That is probably too harsh, sorry.




to represent us on a national level as servants of our country. They are not our masters, for they can only do what is enumerated by us for them to do.We've all read the government provided text books. That is how its supposed to work in theory, but that is not how it is today. People in this movement wouldn't say "restore the republic" if things worked the way they were supposed to. Today the majority of the time voting someone into office is seen as giving them a mandate to do whatever they want so long as they pretend its in the greater public's interest. That is what this thread seems to be addressing.



They have an oath to take by which they bind themselves to a document, sealed by their own words, as they promise to perform their public duties with the utmost honor and in the best interests of God and the American people.

What a nice little ceremony that is, I bet we'll see Obama grin when he swears on the bible to protect the constitution. There was probably a time when Christian's thought one would burst in to flames if they lied while swearing by God's name or by the bible.

Its completely subjective what God's interests are, since God does not seem to have a voice. The bible does not count, it was written by men and there is no evidence to the contrary.



In a sense, they enter into a covenant with our nation, and if they break their covenant vows, then it is the duty of those represented to break ties with them and vote another servant into office. Never forget that.

Agreed. Since the constitution seems to be null and void now however, and we have yet to achieve the power to hold elected officials accountable... ..Some people argue mass non-voting (if achieved to a great enough scale) would end the air of legitimacy the government clings to today.

Also some people say, since the majority of federal officials seem to be corrupt servants of special interests, it is immoral to vote. But yeah I haven't seen these people address votes for men like Ron Paul, if voting for a libertarian/constitution minded person is immoral.

powerofreason
11-03-2008, 07:16 PM
*cough* social contract *cough*

*cough* nonsense *cough*

mediahasyou
11-04-2008, 03:34 PM
I think you're looking at it from the wrong angle. When we cast our ballots, we are voting for certain men (hopefully of moral integrity and religious character) to represent us on a national level as servants of our country. They are not our masters, for they can only do what is enumerated by us for them to do. They have an oath to take by which they bind themselves to a document, sealed by their own words, as they promise to perform their public duties with the utmost honor and in the best interests of God and the American people. In a sense, they enter into a covenant with our nation, and if they break their covenant vows, then it is the duty of those represented to break ties with them and vote another servant into office. Never forget that.

http://tbn0.google.com/images?q=tbn:pb2FUUO2rxjNQM:http://www.amcgltd.com/archives/Socialism_by_miniamericanflags.jpg

No servant demands: "Give me money or go to jail."

mediahasyou
11-04-2008, 03:40 PM
I think if we restore our constitutional republic to its intended bounds, many of the anarchists would realize it is not that bad. Yes, gov't is an evil, but history has shown it to be a necessary evil. The OP is a bit out there because humans are , for the most part, pack animals. The lone wolf is the exception to the rule. Voting for our leaders is a time honored tradition which, when done honorably, has led to the most civilized and productive societies throughout history. Your milage may vary...

Limited government may be tolerable. However:

What government has ever voted successfully their way to libertarian society? none.

How many libertarians have been elected to the house? none.

How many libertarians have been elected to the senate? none.

How many libertarians have been elected to the presidency? none.


The fact is revolution is far better for achieving a "libertarian society". The founders knew this. When Americans had the chance, they did not participate in English Parliament to Vote their way to a libertarian society. They chose Revolution.
http://ns.netmcr.com/~ambro/bm2.jpg
Take advice from your fathers.

Truth Warrior
11-04-2008, 03:44 PM
Voting is simply wrong because simply it does not leave me alone. If you elect your candidate to office in the name of self-defense, his power will not be restricted to you and to those who voted for him. He will have power over me and others like me as well.

When you enter the voting booth, you are committing an act of enormous presumption. You presume that you have the right to appoint a political guardian over me - a benevolent one, you claim, but a guardian nonetheless.

Where did you get such a right? You have no special authority over me. Where, then, did you obtain the right to appoint an agent with this authority? Where do you get the nerve to advocate that Chuck Baldwin (or anyone else) should have the power of life and death over me and millions of other Americans? Voting is no self-defense. Voting extends far beyond the legitimate boundaries of self-defense.


Forget the electoral rhetoric. Go with your feeling at heart. Make the right decision.

+ several bazillion

QFT!!!