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View Full Version : A libertarian laughed at and Ron Paul given respect today in MD




jdmyprez_deo_vindice
10-28-2008, 09:31 PM
Tonight on the campus of Chesapeake College on the Eastern Shore of Maryland there was held a debate between three candidates for the first Congressional district of Maryland. Frank Kratovil (D), Andy Harris (R) and Richard James Davis (L) all had a chance to speak to the crowd of about 200 who were in attendence. There were many interesting developments throughout the debate which may be of interest to fellow Ron Paul Republicans, libertarians and freedom lovers in Maryland and throughout the country.

Richard James Davis

Davis was NOT well spoken at all. He had a lot of pauses between words and it did not seem as if he had rehearsed at all. His answers were very short and provided little to no explanation at all. On many questions he leaned into the microphone and said "I do not have an answer to this question". The only time he seemed fired up was during the brief time he was able to mention Ron Paul. After the debate, he left the stage and I attempted to talk to him but was kind of blown off. The other two stuck around and talked with supporters and answered questions for the audience and media but Davis just left. He put up no resistance when the other candidates would not even acknowledge him as a candidate (Kratovil was especially bad at this) and many of his statements brought laughter from the audience and he never even attempted to explain his position which made the audience laugh even harder. To those in this movement who are running for office currently or who will be running in the future, this is NOT the way to win people to our side at all.

Frank Kratovil

Frank Kratovil is a very well spoken younger guy but he is extremely liberal and he thinks the bailout was a good thing. He avoided answering a lot of questions and instead attacked Harris for his advertising campaign. I had the chance to confront Kratovil after the debate and I asked about his stance regarding the Federal Reserve. He gave me a look like a deer caught in the headlights and said "I do not know what to think about that". I honestly believe that he does not really know what the Federal Reserve is. I also introduced myself as a "proud Ron Paul Republican" and he looked at me as if I were crazy. I also managed to catch a confrontation he had with another voter who questioned him about his stance on gambling. Kratovil avoided questions about his religion and his belief in the bible during that discussion. I know many of you will think that this is not an important issue anyway (and I agree with you) but some people believe that a candidates religious belief is an important issue so this is why I mentioned it.

Andy Harris

Andy Harris explained his answers well and really stuck to the issues. There was one question during the debate (I forget the exact question but it had to do with Harris being called a libertarian in the past) to which harris responded "we have marginalized the libertarian wing of our party and we did so at our own peril". After the debate I had the chance to confront Andy Harris with a question about the legality of the Federal Reserve. He was well informed and said that Paulson should be fired and tried for treason. I asked him if he meant what he said about the libertarian wing of the party and he said "absolutely, one of the first people I want to meet when I get to D.C. is Ron Paul, he is a wise man and we could learn a lot from him". When I told him that I was a Ron Paul Republican he gave me a big smile and said "That is fantastic and thank you for being so involved".

So what to take from this? Harris seemed like a good candidate but this is the first I have heard of his respect for our side of the party or his positions regarding the issues that are so vital to us. I will look into it more before making my final decision but I know for sure that I will not be voting for Kratovil. If anyone knows anything more about Harris than please respond and let me know. One other note of interest came when a man in the audience stood up and challenged Kratovil to stick to the issues and to ask Obama to provide his birth certificate. Security quickly rushed the man but he went out screaming "The man is taking our money yet you kick me out for daring to ask a question of your savior?" The sad thing was that the audience (myself excluded) laughed and riduculed the man as some type of conspiracy theorist.

Athan
10-29-2008, 11:06 AM
I say go with Harris.

The libertarian blew any chance from what I hear and Harris said enough to make him electable.

Minlawc
10-29-2008, 11:34 AM
Looks like Harris will have a good chance of winning. He seems to be for staying in Iraq, though I'd probably vote for him if I were in your position. We need as many anti socialist candidates in Congress as we can get, especially with Obama as president.

tekkierich
10-29-2008, 11:39 AM
I wish you were in the Second District.

Badger Paul
10-29-2008, 11:55 AM
Politicians are like free agents. They want to be with a winning teams or this case find a formula that will work for them and be popular. If Harris is open to Ron Paul's ideas and is willing to work for them and work with Ron Paul supporters instead of attacking them, by all means support him.

acptulsa
10-29-2008, 12:05 PM
Politicians are like free agents. They want to be with a winning teams or this case find a formula that will work for them and be popular. If Harris is open to Ron Paul's ideas and is willing to work for them and work with Ron Paul supporters instead of attacking them, by all means support him...

...unless and until he sells out. Then make a stark example of him.

jdmyprez_deo_vindice
10-29-2008, 02:12 PM
I told Harris that I was considering a vote for him over my initial desire to vote for the Libertarian candidate. I also told him to check out the campaign for liberty and basically told him that we would be watching. I am not crazy over his positions on Iraq either as he is committed to the "we must fight them there or we will fight them here" rhetoric. So while I am leaning towards Harris I am still not totally sure because I do not want blood on my hands if and when he votes for more needless war. My only hope is that he was sincere in his desire to meet Ron Paul and to stand up for our wing of the party. So I will probably make my decision in the voting booth.

jdmyprez_deo_vindice
10-29-2008, 02:50 PM
http://www.hometownannapolis.com/video/12252847201stCongressionalDistrictCandidatesDebate

This is a link for a video showing some of last night's debate. If you are interested than take a look.:)

zadrock
10-30-2008, 03:44 PM
Andy Harris is full of crap. We had Ron Paul come to MD earlier this month and endorse five Republican candidates for Congress in the state, and we invited all eight. The only campaign to not show up was Andy Harris. (Roscoe Bartlett could not attend either, but sent a representative.)

The MD GOP threw all their support behind Harris and McCain. To them, it's more important to kill Iraqis than promote liberty, so I say screw 'em. They have FIVE liberty candidates in the state and they ignored us, didn't give us any money, volunteers, or support of any kind. As late as August, when people called the MD GOP to ask who was running in the 7th District on the Republican side, their answer was "no one"

I'd vote Kratovil before Harris, just like I'd vote Obama before McCain. But the lesser of two evils is still evil, right? Vote for the Libertarian, IMO.

ingrid
10-31-2008, 06:25 PM
I say go with Harris.

The libertarian blew any chance from what I hear and Harris said enough to make him electable.

Maryland's district map is gerrymandered to put as many Republicans as possible in Districts 1 and 6 in order to keep the rest of the districts Dem. Andy Harris won the closed Republican primary, because the Republicans wanted to get rid of an "anti-war Rhino." However, what should be a "safe" seat for the Republicans, is now a competitive one....

Zadrock is right that the MD GOP focuses almost all of its attention on McCain/Harris. On one hand, it's understandable, if they lose the 1st, all they have left is the 6th. But they should be helping out more for all the districts.

jdmyprez_deo_vindice
10-31-2008, 08:59 PM
Andy Harris is full of crap. We had Ron Paul come to MD earlier this month and endorse five Republican candidates for Congress in the state, and we invited all eight. The only campaign to not show up was Andy Harris. (Roscoe Bartlett could not attend either, but sent a representative.)

The MD GOP threw all their support behind Harris and McCain. To them, it's more important to kill Iraqis than promote liberty, so I say screw 'em. They have FIVE liberty candidates in the state and they ignored us, didn't give us any money, volunteers, or support of any kind. As late as August, when people called the MD GOP to ask who was running in the 7th District on the Republican side, their answer was "no one"

I'd vote Kratovil before Harris, just like I'd vote Obama before McCain. But the lesser of two evils is still evil, right? Vote for the Libertarian, IMO.

Thank you for the information on this.

zadrock
10-31-2008, 09:18 PM
Thank you for the information on this.

Sure, no problem. I'm kind of ticked at the MD GOP right now, in case you couldn't tell... ;)

Mike had a dinner the other night with some GOP bigwigs. It was in the 7th District. Andy Harris was on stage and got to speak. Mike had to pay for his own table and was just introduced to the crowd. That's what the MD GOP thinks of Ron Paul and his candidates.

Z

tangent4ronpaul
11-04-2008, 09:39 PM
We are getting our asses kicked in EVERY MD race... :(

-t

jdmyprez_deo_vindice
11-04-2008, 09:41 PM
yeah... looks like Kratovil will win.

inibo
11-04-2008, 11:09 PM
We are getting our asses kicked in EVERY MD race... :(

-t

Are you really surprised? When I saw the primary results I knew that all our candidates were going to get clobbered. Maryland is like 3 to 1 Democrat. I'm not the biggest fan of Roscoe Bartlett, but I'm glad to see he is still invulnerable in the 6th district.

ALICIA21
11-05-2008, 04:17 PM
Tonight on the campus of Chesapeake College on the Eastern Shore of Maryland there was held a debate between three candidates for the first Congressional district of Maryland. Frank Kratovil (D), Andy Harris (R) and Richard James Davis (L) all had a chance to speak to the crowd of about 200 who were in attendence. There were many interesting developments throughout the debate which may be of interest to fellow Ron Paul Republicans, libertarians and freedom lovers in Maryland and throughout the country.

Richard James Davis

Davis was NOT well spoken at all. He had a lot of pauses between words and it did not seem as if he had rehearsed at all. His answers were very short and provided little to no explanation at all. On many questions he leaned into the microphone and said "I do not have an answer to this question". The only time he seemed fired up was during the brief time he was able to mention Ron Paul. After the debate, he left the stage and I attempted to talk to him but was kind of blown off. The other two stuck around and talked with supporters and answered questions for the audience and media but Davis just left. He put up no resistance when the other candidates would not even acknowledge him as a candidate (Kratovil was especially bad at this) and many of his statements brought laughter from the audience and he never even attempted to explain his position which made the audience laugh even harder. To those in this movement who are running for office currently or who will be running in the future, this is NOT the way to win people to our side at all.

Frank Kratovil

Frank Kratovil is a very well spoken younger guy but he is extremely liberal and he thinks the bailout was a good thing. He avoided answering a lot of questions and instead attacked Harris for his advertising campaign. I had the chance to confront Kratovil after the debate and I asked about his stance regarding the Federal Reserve. He gave me a look like a deer caught in the headlights and said "I do not know what to think about that". I honestly believe that he does not really know what the Federal Reserve is. I also introduced myself as a "proud Ron Paul Republican" and he looked at me as if I were crazy. I also managed to catch a confrontation he had with another voter who questioned him about his stance on gambling. Kratovil avoided questions about his religion and his belief in the bible during that discussion. I know many of you will think that this is not an important issue anyway (and I agree with you) but some people believe that a candidates religious belief is an important issue so this is why I mentioned it.

Andy Harris

Andy Harris clep study guide (http://www.degreeforum.net/) his answers well and really stuck to the issues. There was one question during the debate (I forget the exact question but it had to do with Harris being called a libertarian in the past) to which harris responded "we have marginalized the libertarian wing of our party and we did so at our own peril". After the debate I had the chance to confront Andy Harris with a question about the legality of the Federal Reserve. He was well informed and said that Paulson should be fired and tried for treason. I asked him if he meant what he said about the libertarian wing of the party and he said "absolutely, one of the first people I want to meet when I get to D.C. is Ron Paul, he is a wise man and we could learn a lot from him". When I told him that I was a Ron Paul Republican he gave me a big smile and said "That is fantastic and thank you for being so involved".

So what to take from this? Harris seemed like a good candidate but this is the first I have heard of his respect for our side of the party or his positions regarding the issues that are so vital to us. I will look into it more before making my final decision but I know for sure that I will not be voting for Kratovil. If anyone knows anything more about Harris than please respond and let me know. One other note of interest came when a man in the audience stood up and challenged Kratovil to stick to the issues and to ask Obama to provide his birth certificate. Security quickly rushed the man but he went out screaming "The man is taking our money yet you kick me out for daring to ask a question of your savior?" The sad thing was that the audience (myself excluded) laughed and riduculed the man as some type of conspiracy theorist.


So what to take from this? Harris seemed like a good candidate but this is the first I have heard of his respect for our side of the party or his positions regarding the issues that are so vital to us.

ingrid
11-05-2008, 09:08 PM
So what to take from this? Harris seemed like a good candidate but this is the first I have heard of his respect for our side of the party or his positions regarding the issues that are so vital to us.


So what to take from this? Harris seemed like a good candidate but this is the first I have heard of his respect for our side of the party or his positions regarding the issues that are so vital to us.

hmm

jdmyprez_deo_vindice
11-05-2008, 10:51 PM
yeah... what was the point of that?

jdmyprez_deo_vindice
11-05-2008, 10:53 PM
btw, for those who are interested, Kratovil won the race though Harris came very close. Davis had like 2.5% or so the last time I checked but that is more than I figured he would get.

zadrock
11-06-2008, 12:09 AM
btw, for those who are interested, Kratovil won the race though Harris came very close. Davis had like 2.5% or so the last time I checked but that is more than I figured he would get.

Baltimore Sun reports that the race won't be decided until next week. They have to count 25000 absentee ballots. Only 900 votes separate the candidates, with Kratovil leading. Davis got almost 8000 votes so far, so he's definitely the spoiler.

http://www.baltimoresun.com/news/local/politics/bal-first1105,0,807251.story

Z

ingrid
11-06-2008, 08:24 AM
Baltimore Sun reports that the race won't be decided until next week. They have to count 25000 absentee ballots. Only 900 votes separate the candidates, with Kratovil leading. Davis got almost 8000 votes so far, so he's definitely the spoiler.

http://www.baltimoresun.com/news/local/politics/bal-first1105,0,807251.story

Z

It's probably likely Harris is going to win, since they were saying a lot of the absentee ballots are military ones.

zadrock
11-06-2008, 09:10 AM
Of the returned ballots, 11,371 came from Democrats, 10,924 from Republicans and 3,244 from independents and others. Three out of five, meanwhile, came from the Eastern Shore -- a ratio that could favor Kratovil, a Stevensville resident who currently leads in all nine counties on that side of the Chesapeake. Harris, who represents Baltimore County in the state Senate, leads in Baltimore, Anne Arundel and Harford counties.


I think a big question for harris is whether the absentee ballots from around the world get back in time. They have 25000+ ballots, but they issued 32000+. Ballots will be counted if postmarked by Nov. 4th, so they have to wait till early next week to make sure they even have all the ballots. So we won't see a declared winner until next week, and even then, there will probably be a recount.

I can't believe Harris took a district that was specifically gerrymandered to be Republican and made it this competitive. If he loses, maybe the Dems should pay Harris to run in District 6 after Roscoe retires so the whole damn state goes blue. :rolleyes:

Z

Malakai
11-08-2008, 01:09 AM
Unfortunately if the LP candidate sucked then, oh well.

It's true that the GOP should be working hard to bring libertarians into their fold.

libertarian4321
11-08-2008, 11:33 AM
.
Richard James Davis

To those in this movement who are running for office currently or who will be running in the future, this is NOT the way to win people to our side at all.



I don't know this guy, but odds are, he has no political experience. He may not even have any public speaking experience.

Remember, the LP is small. It doesn't get to pick between a group of slick politicians- they are usually forced to put up any candidate who is willing to come forward and run for office (it takes time, money, and effort, even to run a low level campaign).

While major party candidates are usually career politicians, or at least lawyers or other professionals who have a ton of public speaking experience, the Libertarians are often regular people- accountants, truck drivers, mechanics.

They get on a stage or on TV, and they just freeze up. Standing in front of a TV camera or a live audience and debating ain't the same thing as posting on the RPF. I've seen plenty of people who can craft clever posts on computer forums turn into puddles of goo when put in front of a crowd.

At least the guy ran for office and showed up for the debate. Thats more than most are willing to do.

trey4sports
11-08-2008, 07:09 PM
if i were old enough to run i really think i could win my state district. its a college town and im a terrific public speaker, been doing it since i was 14. talk to the kids about personal freedoms and talk to their parents about keeping their money