propane cylinders

[cbc58]

how long do you think propane cylinders have for a shelf life if you were to buy some today?

how about white gas (coleman fuel)? tks.

[Dr.3D]

how long do you think propane cylinders have for a shelf life if you were to buy some today?

how about white gas (coleman fuel)? tks.

As long as the propane cylinder doesn't get a leak in it from rust or some other accident, or the valve doesn't leak, you don't have to worry about a shelf life.

White gas will degrade in time.... it might be good for perhaps as long as a year. I'm not sure you can use a stabilizer in it to make it last longer or not.

[cbc58]

found another site that says coleman fuel will last for 5 years stored... fyi. tks.

[Scribbler de Stebbing]

Just started thinking about getting some kind of off-grid stove. Any recommendations based on the ease of accessing fuel, stability of various fuels, etc?

[Scribbler de Stebbing]

Something else to consider: is there any type of fuel stove I could use indoors? Propane might not be great for that, eh?

[Danke]

Any recommendations based on the ease of accessing fuel, stability of various fuels, etc?

Northern Minnesota. :p

http://www.cwac.net/forests/forest.JPG

[Scribbler de Stebbing]

Danke schoen. Call me spoiled, but I was hoping to maintain some kind of creature comforts. But just in case, put my name on the cave next to yours up there.

[Danke]

Danke schoen. Call me spoiled, but I was hoping to maintain some kind of creature comforts. But just in case, put my name on the cave next to yours up there.

Creature comforts?

It is all relative:

http://www.taiga.net/reports/traditional_fisheries/Icefishing1.jpg


vs:

http://1.bp.blogspot.com/_Dh7f-hMSRW8/R-I2-cFH2NI/AAAAAAAABeU/5meIVEFVvl0/s400/Ice+Fishing+shack+and+chair.JPG

[Texan4Life]

how long do you think propane cylinders have for a shelf life if you were to buy some today?

how about white gas (coleman fuel)? tks.


From the coleman website (http://www.coleman.com/coleman/faq/faqreturn.asp?question=19):

"An un-opened container of Coleman® Fuel stored in a dry area with no rapid extreme changes in temperature will remain viable for five to seven years. An opened container stored in the same area will remain viable for up to two years though will be at its best if used within a year.

Coleman® Propane Cylinders can be stored indefinitely in a dry area. The propane fuel inside the cylinder will not break down."



Something else to consider: is there any type of fuel stove I could use indoors? Propane might not be great for that, eh?

propane would be safe... many houses who do not have access to natural gas do (an opt not to have electric stoves).. ever seen a house with a white tank next to them? That's a propane tank.

in the Coleman FAQ they say not to use their stoves or lantern indoors... but I think that is just because the don't want to be sued by someone who zips up their one man tent for hours.

houses/cabins are not air tight enough to pose a CO2 build up risk. So I would be configurable using any liquid/propane stove or lanterns for short periods of time in the house... How long is a short period? I would say a few hours. I mean when people bake a turkey for hours in their natural gas/propane oven none is falling over dead of CO2 poisoning.

...If you want to be on the side of caution, they make CO2 detector/alarms (like a fire alarm) the beep and light up if CO2 levels start to get to high.

[ryanduff]

Personally, if I had any sort of yard, I'd have some buried (except for the tops) and when you get attacked, shoot at the tops of them. Blowing the gauge off a 20lb tank makes a very nice explosion ;)

[tangent4ronpaul]

Just started thinking about getting some kind of off-grid stove. Any recommendations based on the ease of accessing fuel, stability of various fuels, etc?

Wood/coal fireplace.

-t

[tangent4ronpaul]

Something else to consider: is there any type of fuel stove I could use indoors? Propane might not be great for that, eh?

http://beprepared.com/product.asp_Q_pn_E_CK%20H900_A_name_E_%5B%5BProduc tNameURL%5D%5D

Mr Heater® Portable Big Buddy™
Mr Heater® Portable Big Buddy™
Click for larger image.

( customer reviews)

The Big Buddy takes portable heaters to a new level with a multi-position heat setting that allows you to select 4,000, 9,000, and 18,000 BTU-per-hour output. The heater has the capacity to heat up to 400 square feet of space for up to 220 hours (on the low position). Big Buddy's dual-heating system combines radiant heat with convection heat air flow for maximum heating efficiency. An internal blower fan uses an AC adapter or four D-cell batteries to distribute heat throughout the room. The unit can run on one or two 1 lb. propane cylinders or up to two 20 lb. cylinders. Multi-position heat settings control the comfort level. Built-in low oxygen shutoff sensor and tip-over switch ensures indoor-safe operation (adequate ventilation must be provided; see operating instructions). Certified by CSA International (American Gas Association) for indoor and outdoor use.

Note: transporting multiple 20 lb propane cylinders at once will lable you as a "suicide bomber" and may get you a free vacation in Gitmo...


-t

[Scribbler de Stebbing]

Wood/coal fireplace.

-t

T, you're thinking for heating, and that's important too. I was thinking about cooking. I do have a wood stove I took out for space a few years ago, and should put that back in.

I'm hearing from you all that a propane-powered stove is safe for cooking, but to ventilate well when operating, and keep the time of operation down. Since we're going to all this trouble to stay alive, I'd just as soon not knock myself off with fumes.

[pcosmar]

T, you're thinking for heating, and that's important too. I was thinking about cooking. I do have a wood stove I took out for space a few years ago, and should put that back in.

I'm hearing from you all that a propane-powered stove is safe for cooking, but to ventilate well when operating, and keep the time of operation down. Since we're going to all this trouble to stay alive, I'd just as soon not knock myself off with fumes.

http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3230/2621299080_de7dd70b3f.jpg?v=0

We have a propane stove right now, This is in case we can't get propane.
They do make a propane conversion for these too.
http://www.goodtimestove.com/
http://www.goodtimestove.com/stove_gas_conversion_update_kit.html

[Scribbler de Stebbing]

Pcos, forgive me -- I'm blonde. Is that a wood stove, and where is the fire? Where is the chimney? Through the wall?

[Ninja Homer]

I'd recommend something like this:

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ORIGO-6000-Alcohol-Oven-Stove_W0QQcmdZViewItemQQ_trkparmsZ72Q3a1171Q7c66Q3 a2Q7c65Q3a12Q7c39Q3a1Q7c240Q3a1318Q7c301Q3a1Q7c293 Q3a1Q7c294Q3a50QQ_trksidZp3286Q2ec0Q2em14QQhashZit em330315322574QQitemZ330315322574QQptZBoatQ5fParts Q5fAccessoriesQ5fGear
http://i23.ebayimg.com/02/i/001/3a/d8/baa0_1.JPG

It's an oven with 2 stove burners.
It runs on denatured alcohol, which is available almost everywhere for pretty cheap and lasts indefinitely (depending on the container it's stored in).
It runs unpressurized, so it won't sputter or explode (this is actually made to be used on boats because it's considered one of the safest indoor fuels).

If you use it much indoors, you'd want to ventilate it, because burning denatured alcohol can give off a pretty bad smell, but at least you'll know when you need to crack some windows.

I don't know the original price on that model, but at the current auction price ($177.50) it looks like a really good deal.

edit: just found it (http://www.defender.com/product.jsp?path=-1|406|694|319792&id=60353) :eek:

[pcosmar]

Pcos, forgive me -- I'm blonde. Is that a wood stove, and where is the fire? Where is the chimney? Through the wall?

It is a wood stove, but not in use at this time. Firebox is to the left of the oven door.
Just above it, in the corner there is a plate covering the chimney access. The stovepipe is temporarily removed, but can be operational in 5 min. :)

This one is for heat and is in use.

http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3224/2620476281_59b4a7c3e8.jpg?v=0

My main heat is a wood furnace in the basement, but on cold mornings this gets fired up.
Literally. :D

The house is a 4 bd room, 2 story farmhouse built in 1921. I have heated it with wood all this winter and I still have snow.

[Scribbler de Stebbing]

Pcos, my folks used to heat with a Franklin stove all winter. I remember it being COLD when I got up. I need to get mine put back in before next winter. Could at lease reduce my heating costs.

Ninja, I won't bid against ya, but that is the only one on eBay. I'll save a search for it. That doesn't look too dangerous, even for me.

[Scribbler de Stebbing]

There is a pretty good discussion of stove types and fuel types on this sailing forum:

http://www.sailnet.com/forums/gear-maintenance/40186-non-pressure-alcohol-oven.html

What I got out of it is that everyone has an opinion, and few of them are similar.

[pcosmar]

There is a pretty good discussion of stove types and fuel types on this sailing forum:

http://www.sailnet.com/forums/gear-maintenance/40186-non-pressure-alcohol-oven.html

What I got out of it is that everyone has an opinion, and few of them are similar.

Sailboats have unique needs, and it depends on how it is used, eg: day sailor, cruising, long range or a live aboard.
Wanted one in the Keys (even had a good deal on one) but couldn't get my wife to go for it.

[Ninja Homer]

Pcos, my folks used to heat with a Franklin stove all winter. I remember it being COLD when I got up. I need to get mine put back in before next winter. Could at lease reduce my heating costs.

Ninja, I won't bid against ya, but that is the only one on eBay. I'll save a search for it. That doesn't look too dangerous, even for me.

Go ahead and bid if you want it... I won't be bidding on it.

I have a big old wood burning stove (not currently being used but could be in a pinch), I use a charcoal Weber year-round, and I make alcohol stoves out of beer cans. http://zenstoves.net/Stoves.htm (fun stuff!) I'm also surrounded by 15 acres of renewable energy (forest) so I'm pretty much set. If I was going to spend money on anything, it would be a more efficient wood burning stove. They've made some vast improvements in the last 10 years.

The biggest hazard with burning alcohol is that you usually can't see the flames unless it's dark. You can add a little salt to the alcohol and then it will burn yellow, but it leaves a residue that needs to be cleaned occasionally.

Here's the stove I'd really like to get:
http://www.antiquestoves.com/kitchenqueen/images/const/12.jpg

It's an oven, stove, will heat up to 2400 square feet, and will heat 40 gallons of water per hour (replacing a hot water heater) all at the same time. http://www.kitchenqueenstoves.com

[tangent4ronpaul]

http://www.britelyt.com/

the most versatile lantern on the market today.(Heat, cook, and light).

BriteLyt lanterns run on a variety of fuels...kerosene, diesel, gasoline, White Gas,Biodiesel, mineral spirits,paint thinner,charcoal lighter fluid, lamp oils,Coleman fuel,Jp fuels,etc.)

Check and see if your city has a Fuel disposal area this is where you can get FREE fuel for the BriteLyt lantern, if its old just mix 50 50 with new fuel at half the cost.

Heat Out put of some fuels below:
Gas fuels white gas out put of heat approx: 350 to 450 Degs
Jp fuels out put of heat approx 850 to 1150 degs
Diesel fuel out put of heat approx: 850 to 1100 degs.
Biodiesel out put of heat approx: 1125 degs.


PREFERRED BY MILITARYdue to it’s ability to use not only gasoline, standard lantern & stove fuels,White Gas,but can also use JP5, JP8, diesel,wast oil, & other liquid, volatile fuels.
American Designed/American Engineered

!! Even Citronella oil !! KEEP THE BUGS AWAY !!

http://www.britelyt.com/images/5pNEWNEW2.JPG

http://www.vogelzang.com/cast-iron-stoves.htm

-t

[Scribbler de Stebbing]

Now that looks handy! And between $105 and $190 depending on which type. I may order one of these.