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View Full Version : Will the bailout revive secession talk?




Sandra
09-25-2008, 09:38 AM
Montana was on the verge of seceeding, according to the MT SOS and Governor, when the right to bear arms was up before the SCOTUS. What on earth will the bailout bring?

JRegs85
09-25-2008, 09:45 AM
The bailout won't revive secession talk, but an economic depression would. As always, I look to Montana for leadership on this issue.

Grimnir Wotansvolk
09-25-2008, 09:49 AM
Would they be prepared for the flood of refugees?

Should I start packing?

Mortikhi
09-25-2008, 09:55 AM
Montana was on the verge of seceeding, according to the MT SOS and Governor, when the right to bear arms was up before the SCOTUS. What on earth will the bailout bring?

I just made a similar post on the economics forum :D

I believe there will be secession talks. Our representatives are not listening to us. Like someone else said, this is taxation without representation.

QueenB4Liberty
09-25-2008, 09:56 AM
Vermont also has a huge succession movement.

Cinderella
09-25-2008, 09:57 AM
lucky for me vermont is my neighbor

malibuu
09-25-2008, 10:01 AM
Great interesting question.

State rights eroded after the national banking landmark case in 1819 of McCulloch v. Maryland.

States should consider legal actions against the U.S. now, up to and including secession.

runamuck
09-25-2008, 10:02 AM
As nice as that all sounds... secession talk makes us look like complete lunatics to almost everyone. :cool:

constituent
09-25-2008, 10:07 AM
we can all hope, can't we?

tpreitzel
09-25-2008, 12:10 PM
As nice as that all sounds... secession talk makes us look like complete lunatics to almost everyone. :cool:

I don't think so anymore. When Congress clearly violates the will of the people in favor of special interests, secessionists have a firm and reasonable basis to separate. All we need to do is use the words of our country's founders and the actions of our congressmen who repeatedly ignore the will of their constituents in favor of special interests. It's time. The real revolution has begun and congress's repeated failure to represent the people has lit the match and started the clock for secession.

powerofreason
09-25-2008, 12:39 PM
Vermont also has a huge succession movement.

Yea... to create their own socialist paradise. They have the only openly socialist senator in the country to my knowledge.

Micah Dardar
09-25-2008, 12:52 PM
Yea... to create their own socialist paradise. They have the only openly socialist senator in the country to my knowledge.

To my knowledge they also have a very lenient gun law. If they get tired of it, they can handle it.

porcupine
09-25-2008, 12:58 PM
Vermont also has a huge succession movement.

The biggest in the country

Razorback Fan
09-25-2008, 01:02 PM
Yea... to create their own socialist paradise. They have the only openly socialist senator in the country to my knowledge.

Look at it this way: They had a free and fair election, and someone other than a Republicrat got elected. They actually counted the votes, and he actually won, and they let him into office. Hell, even Ron Paul doesn't think he could get reelected to Congress if he ran third-party. Give the Vermonters a little credit for not being zombies.

powerofreason
09-25-2008, 01:38 PM
Look at it this way: They had a free and fair election, and someone other than a Republicrat got elected. They actually counted the votes, and he actually won, and they let him into office. Hell, even Ron Paul doesn't think he could get reelected to Congress if he ran third-party. Give the Vermonters a little credit for not being zombies.

Thats fine. I'm just making the point that the Vermont secession movement is NOT liberty oriented. That being said, I hope they accomplish their goal.

tonesforjonesbones
09-25-2008, 02:04 PM
Secession is a libertarian idea. When the colonies agreed to Independence it was with the guarantee that if they didn't like it, they could seceed. The south reminded the "union" of this...and look what happened. Thank Abraham Lincoln for destroying that understanding with his War of Northern Aggression. Lincoln was a big government POLECAT and no hero to ANY Southerner. Tones

nate895
09-25-2008, 03:36 PM
I hope so. I think the Mountain West and Alaska will go, then Vermont, then the Southern States, then possibly the plains states and the rest of the states will stay in and try to get scratch out an existence from what remains. If one state goes, many more will follow suit.

socialize_me
09-25-2008, 04:07 PM
Montana thought about seceding upon news of a gun ban?? When was this?? Sorry I'm not too well scripted on this topic. I do, however, think the 2nd amendment is by far the most important amendment. If you can't fight back, what good can you do protecting the 1st amendment rights??

Nate K
09-25-2008, 04:09 PM
As nice as that all sounds... secession talk makes us look like complete lunatics to almost everyone. :cool:

who the fuck cares, i'm downright tired of people like you, trying to "work hard to give us a phony impression". we are who we are, and we have principles, if you're too spineless to stand for them, then GET THE HELL OUT.

cska80
09-25-2008, 04:12 PM
I don't know about secession but I see news stories every day about Russia becoming very agressive in its military stance and openly forming alliances with our enemies. Although, who could really invade the U.S.? We're the most armed country in the world.

nate895
09-25-2008, 04:21 PM
Montana thought about seceding upon news of a gun ban?? When was this?? Sorry I'm not too well scripted on this topic. I do, however, think the 2nd amendment is by far the most important amendment. If you can't fight back, what good can you do protecting the 1st amendment rights??

The Secretary of State circulated a petition among legislators early this year and a majority signed the petition threatening the US Government with secession if they didn't support an individual right to bare arms.

Swmorgan77
09-25-2008, 04:22 PM
Montana was on the verge of seceeding, according to the MT SOS and Governor, when the right to bear arms was up before the SCOTUS. What on earth will the bailout bring?

I don't know but I imagine it should give a healthy boost to the tax protest movement!

Swmorgan77
09-25-2008, 04:28 PM
As nice as that all sounds... secession talk makes us look like complete lunatics to almost everyone. :cool:

That's because uninformed people equate secession with slavery and pro-confederacy.

1) Secession was threatened and proposed in several instances long before the civil war, most notably by abolitionists in Northern States

2) Threat of Secession, and refusal by states to enforce Supreme Court rulings was effectively used as a final check against the Federal Judiciary in Jefferson's principles of 98 plan.

3) The Civil War did not happen simply because states seceded, it happened because they came together and formed a "counter-union" or confederacy (with agents of the British Central bank steering the effort I might add.

Had only individual states seceded, but not formed a confederacy and instead renegotiated admission back into union each on individual terms, the outcome may have been very different.

kombayn
09-25-2008, 04:29 PM
If a Civil War 2 happened, the Union would win again, they have all the weapons.

kathy88
09-25-2008, 04:34 PM
I just asked my husband a couple hours ago if he would be into moving to Montana.

He's game.

nate895
09-25-2008, 04:36 PM
If a Civil War 2 happened, the Union would win again, they have all the weapons.

No they wouldn't. They had to force most of the people into the military last time, and they almost lost, next time there won't be enough soldiers around to force enough men into the military. The states have their National Guards, which would be enough to form the nucleus of a larger army.

nate895
09-25-2008, 04:38 PM
That's because uninformed people equate secession with slavery and pro-confederacy.

1) Secession was threatened and proposed in several instances long before the civil war, most notably by abolitionists in Northern States

2) Threat of Secession, and refusal by states to enforce Supreme Court rulings was effectively used as a final check against the Federal Judiciary in Jefferson's principles of 98 plan.

3) The Civil War did not happen simply because states seceded, it happened because they came together and formed a "counter-union" or confederacy (with agents of the British Central bank steering the effort I might add.

Had only individual states seceded, but not formed a confederacy and instead renegotiated admission back into union each on individual terms, the outcome may have been very different.

No, it wouldn't have, Lincoln would have marched on the South if he didn't give them what they wanted (that, is, NO TARIFF), he was intent on it. It was his primary plank running for president (to raise the tariff to over 50%), and the South just wasn't gonna take it anymore, especially since all the money went to pork in the North to benefit industry.

MsDoodahs
09-25-2008, 05:17 PM
since all the money went to pork in the North to benefit industry.

some things never change. ;)

nate895
09-25-2008, 05:28 PM
some things never change. ;)

The more things change, the more they stay the same.

Swmorgan77
09-25-2008, 06:40 PM
I just asked my husband a couple hours ago if he would be into moving to Montana.

He's game.

If Montana seceded of Constitutional / Separation of power reasons, and I felt confident they would independently preserve natural rights in their independent State afterward, I would move there.

dr. hfn
09-25-2008, 07:26 PM
Dear god!!!! I hope they seccede!!! Do it!!