Ron Paul Following Libertarian Party Founding Father Murray Rothbard's Vision

[ArrestPoliticians]

Just as conservatives and liberals have effectively blended into a consensus to uphold the Establishment, so what America needs now – and can have – is a counter-coalition in opposition to the Welfare-Warfare State. A coalition that would favor the short-term libertarian goals of militant opposition to the [Iraq] War and the [Empire] generally, and to conscription, the military-industrial complex, and the high taxes and accelerated inflation that the state has needed to finance these statist measures. It would be a coalition to advance the cause of both civil liberty and economic freedom from government dictation. It would be, in many ways, a renaissance of a coalition between the best of the Old Right and the old New Left, a return to the glorious days when elements of Left and Right stood shoulder to shoulder to oppose the conquest of the Philippines and America’s entry into World Wars I and II. Here would be a coalition that could appeal to all groups throughout America, to the middle class, workers, students, liberals, and conservatives alike. But Middle America, for the sake of gaining freedom from high taxes, inflation, and monopoly, would have to accept the idea of personal liberty and a loss of national face abroad. And liberals and leftists, for the sake of dismantling the war machine and the American Empire, would have to give up the cherished Old Left-liberal dream of high taxes and Federal expenditures for every goody on the face of the earth.

This coalition has been a long time coming.

[rockandrollsouls]

This beautiful plan seems so obvious. The fact that Bob Barr and his hired e-monkeys won't admit its elegance and plausibility shows their real motives.

That quote and your opinion have no connection whatsoever. Stop speculating and making up nonsense. You're being reported.

[torchbearer]

Hey! That is what we are doing in Louisiana!
Sept 20th. all constitution loving americans will be meeting.. leadership from many 3rd party and liberty organizations.

[ArrestPoliticians]

That quote and your opinion have no connection whatsoever. Stop speculating and making up nonsense. You're being reported.

I think that the quote is pretty damn good evidence of my opinion, considering how Ron Paul was a good friend of Rothbard.

[rockandrollsouls]

I think that the quote is pretty damn good evidence of my opinion, considering how Ron Paul was a good friend of Rothbard.

It has nothing to do with Bob Barr....you're making arbitrary connections.

[ArrestPoliticians]

It has nothing to do with Bob Barr....you're making arbitrary connections.

Um, Bob Barr denied that this was an effective strategy in his press conference. His paid cronies continue to espouse the distastefulness of associating with *gasp* SOCIALISTS. Rothbard had no such qualms.

[rockandrollsouls]

Um, Bob Barr denied that this was an effective strategy in his press conference. His paid cronies continue to espouse the distastefulness of associating with *gasp* SOCIALISTS. Rothbard had no such qualms.

Might wanna check your info, bud.

[ArrestPoliticians]

Might wanna check your info, bud.

"Not worth my time/Waste of time." -Bob Barr

Barr might want to read up on the real history of his adopted party.

[JosephTheLibertarian]

This beautiful plan seems so obvious. The fact that Bob Barr and his hired e-monkeys won't admit its elegance and plausibility shows their real motives.

Are you a card carrying LP member?

Furthermore, are you registered to vote with the GOP?

[ArrestPoliticians]

Are you a card carrying LP member?

Furthermore, are you registered to vote with the GOP?

Constitutional Libertarian Ron Paul Republican.

[rockandrollsouls]

Constitutional Libertarian Ron Paul Republican.

That's not the same as a card holding libertarian...

[JosephTheLibertarian]

Constitutional Libertarian Ron Paul Republican.

Then why aren't you petitioning to remove McCain from the ballot? Why are you criticizing an organization that has a more libertarian platform than the organization that you're currently a member of? Would that be some hypocrisy there?

[torchbearer]

That's not the same as a card holding libertarian...

I'm a card carrying libertarian who is also on the LALP central committee, does that count?
Do I get some special say in something?

[ArrestPoliticians]

Then why aren't you petitioning to remove McCain from the ballot? Why are you criticizing an organization that has a more libertarian platform than the organization that you're currently a member of? Would that be some hypocrisy there?

I'm not petitioning to remove Barr from the ballot. I'm not criticizing the LP party either. Edgy, eh? :D

[rockandrollsouls]

I'm a card carrying libertarian who is also on the LALP central committee, does that count?
Do I get some special say in something?

Well then you should have a valid opinion in the LP. What I'm saying is I don't like the idea of people who have not done anything for the party having their views put before mine. I am not committed to voting for Barr but I do feel like he is being shortchanged. Let us, the members of the LP solve it.

[JosephTheLibertarian]

I'm not petitioning to remove Barr from the ballot. I'm not criticizing the LP party either. Edgy, eh? :D

Then, what exactly are you doing?

[RockEnds]

Someone please send both McCain and Obama the memo that they can't criticize one another because they belong to different parties. (It will reduce the crap on the news.) Then, please go back in time and refuse to pass the first amendment since free speech was primarily design to protect free political speech--both positive and negative.

Thx.

[torchbearer]

Well then you should have a valid opinion in the LP. What I'm saying is I don't like the idea of people who have not done anything for the party having their views put before mine. I am not committed to voting for Barr but I do feel like he is being shortchanged. Let us, the members of the LP solve it.

True.
But the LALP has washed their hands of Barr.
We never got any call backs from his office.
And when we did get someone, they couldn't tell us anything...
And because of this, Barr didn't get on the ballot in louisiana, the easiest state in the union to get on the ballot. and that is not an hyperbole.

Of course, petitions are useless. And things will be taken care of by our membership.
In Louisiana, we are shedding our party designations and are coming together with everyone as americans who want constitutional government.

[ArrestPoliticians]

Then, what exactly are you doing?

Explaining how Ron Paul is following Murray Rothbard's vision of a left and right coalition coming together on important issues to drive out the establishment hacks.

My Barr comment is referring to the attacks by Barr and others on the strategy of associating with socialists like Nader/McKinney.

[torchbearer]

Someone please send both McCain and Obama the memo that they can't criticize one another because they belong to different parties. (It will reduce the crap on the news.) Then, please go back in time and refuse to pass the first amendment since free speech was primarily design to protect free political speech--both positive and negative.

Thx.

note- the first amendment applies to the government.
The government cannot restrict your speech.
Any property owner can censor whatever speech they want.

Can't use the constitution against property owners. It was written for the government.

[rockandrollsouls]

Someone please send both McCain and Obama the memo that they can't criticize one another because they belong to different parties. (It will reduce the crap on the news.) Then, please go back in time and refuse to pass the first amendment since free speech was primarily design to protect free political speech--both positive and negative.

Thx.

No, your opinion shouldn't be put before members of the party.

[rockandrollsouls]

True.
But the LALP has washed their hands of Barr.
We never got any call backs from his office.
And when we did get someone, they couldn't tell us anything...
And because of this, Barr didn't get on the ballot in louisiana, the easiest state in the union to get on the ballot. and that is not an hyperbole.

Of course, petitions are useless. And things will be taken care of by our membership.
In Louisiana, we are shedding our party designations and are coming together with everyone as americans who want constitutional government.

I never said his campaign wasn't foolish. I'm just for fairness here. The forum is very biased against Barr and that translated into an idea that they could, somehow, begin to govern a party they have no part of.

[RockEnds]

note- the first amendment applies to the government.
The government cannot restrict your speech.
Any property owner can censor whatever speec they want.

Can't use the constitution against property owners. It was written for the government.

Yes, very true. However, I really don't think that JTL and R&RS are the forum owners here. If Josh says Barr is beyond reproach here, then Barr is beyond reproach here.

[rockandrollsouls]

Yes, very true. However, I really don't think that JTL and R&RS are the forum owners here. If Josh says Barr is beyond reproach here, then Barr is beyond reproach here.

I never said I was a forum owner, but the forum has gotten rowdy lately, rules are not being followed, and the mods aren't doing much about it. Aside from that, I do have a membership in the LP and I don't appreciate people that aren't a part of the party trying to dictate who we should and should not have on our ticket.

[torchbearer]

Yes, very true. However, I really don't think that JTL and R&RS are the forum owners here. If Josh says Barr is beyond reproach here, then Barr is beyond reproach here.

True. I was just noting the context, not the subjects.

[RockEnds]

I never said I was a forum owner, but the forum has gotten rowdy lately, rules are not being followed, and the mods aren't doing much about it. Aside from that, I do have a membership in the LP and I don't appreciate people that aren't a part of the party trying to dictate who we should and should not have on our ticket.

And that is just my point. People who are not card carrying members of the LP are allowed to criticize it because this is America. Free political speech is a cornerstone of our political system. I know you didn't claim to be the forum owner. Torchbearer was simply saying that the forum can limit speech if the forum owner wishes, and that is certainly true.

[RockEnds]

True. I was just noting the context, not the subjects.

I know, and you're absolutely right.

[torchbearer]

Yes, very true. However, I really don't think that JTL and R&RS are the forum owners here. If Josh says Barr is beyond reproach here, then Barr is beyond reproach here.

What ticks me off, I've been spending months trying convince Ron Paul supporters to not do a useless write-in and vote for Barr.
Many were beginning to agree, but now- ha, good luck selling that.

One good thing though, The guys in Louisiana knew they needed electors to vote for Ron, and we got them now.
Our meeting on Sept 20th will have all the top activist in the state.
Members of the central committee of the LALP - including chair
Members of the central committee of the LACP
State Coordinator and Asst. Coordinator of Louisiana for the Campaign for liberty (along with some district reps)
Members of Dems, GOP, Reform, Green, and indies will be present also.
Delegations from all parts of the state, from all parties...
First meeting of its type. And (stroke my own ego ;) ) I was instrumental in putting it together. :)

[torchbearer]

I find it interesting Rothbard was talking about this... and Ron was talking about it...
But the meeting would have happened, whether I knew they said that or not... meaning, they predicted it.

[rockandrollsouls]

And that is just my point. People who are not card carrying members of the LP are allowed to criticize it because this is America. Free political speech is a cornerstone of our political system. I know you didn't claim to be the forum owner. Torchbearer was simply saying that the forum can limit speech if the forum owner wishes, and that is certainly true.

No, I've said time and again you can criticize whoever you want, but don't think you have a right to impose your will on my and other LP members "property" by believing you have an obligation and right to change our ticket.

[RockEnds]

What ticks me off, I've been spending months trying convince Ron Paul supporters to not do a useless write-in and vote for Barr.
Many were beginning to agree, but now- ha, good luck selling that.

One good thing though, The guys in Louisiana knew the needed electors to vote for Ron, and we got them now.
Our meeting on Sept 20th will have all the top activist in the state.
Members of the central committee of the LALP - including chair
Members of the central committee of the LACP
State Coordinator and Asst. Coordinator of Louisiana for the Campaign for liberty (along with some district reps)
Members of Dems, GOP, Reform, Green, and indies will be present also.
Delegations from all parts of the state, from all parties...
First meeting of its type. And (stroke my own ego ;) ) I was instrumental in putting it together. :)

We're all frustrated. I'm probably going to cast one of those useless write-in votes. And I'm really pissed at Barr. But I'm more pissed at the GOP, Washington DC in general, the fact that my son is 150 miles away from Iran STILL and TPTB think the military is at their unaccountable disposal. Oh, I have a whole list. I wish there were someone I could feel good about campaigning for. There really isn't. I hope we can all find someone or something to band together and support--soon.

[torchbearer]

We're all frustrated. I'm probably going to cast one of those useless write-in votes. And I'm really pissed at Barr. But I'm more pissed at the GOP, Washington DC in general, the fact that my son is 150 miles away from Iran STILL and TPTB think the military is at their unaccountable disposal. Oh, I have a whole list. I wish there were someone I could feel good about campaigning for. There really isn't. I hope we can all find someone or something to band together and support--soon.

I hate... i mean, really hate to say this to you, after knowing your position with your son... but we've already lost 2008. matters not who we vote for...
All we can hope for... is to send a message by having a ton of non-republicrat votes.
The media will be watching this year because of Ron.
Whatever you do, make sure your vote is valid. That is all I ask people now.
Don't write-in unless you know for a fact, that it will be a legal vote that is counted. (though in presidential races, i don't see how it could be counted)

[ArrestPoliticians]

A lot of the argument for voting for Barr was to consolidate the voting numbers into one candidacy. Nader is your guy if that is your sole motive. I am voting for Baldwin.

[RockEnds]

I hate... i mean, really hate to say this to you, after knowing your position with your son... but we've already lost 2008. matters not who we vote for...
All we can hope for... is to send a message by having a ton of non-republicrat votes.
The media will be watching this year because of Ron.
Whatever you do, make sure your vote is valid. That is all I ask people now.
Don't write-in unless you know for a fact, that it will be a legal vote that is counted. (though in presidential races, i don't see how it could be counted)

Oh, I know. I'm not sure there was ever a way to win. But hopefully, enough people have gained enough experience in the political process that maybe we might be a little smarter as a group.

[JosephTheLibertarian]

A lot of the argument for voting for Barr was to consolidate the voting numbers into one candidacy. Nader is your guy if that is your sole motive. I am voting for Baldwin.

Sorry, I can't support banning pornography. This violates property rights.

[ArrestPoliticians]

Sorry, I can't support banning pornography. This violates property rights.

Life is tough, isn't it.

[JosephTheLibertarian]

Life is tough, isn't it.

Ah. Just what I thought. You're not a libertarian. Thought so!

[ArrestPoliticians]

Ah. Just what I thought. You're not a libertarian. Thought so!

Lol wuuuut?

[torchbearer]

Oh, I know. I'm not sure there was ever a way to win. But hopefully, enough people have gained enough experience in the political process that maybe we might be a little smarter as a group.

It will take more than that...
We need to all make a commitment to work our precincts.
You can do this however you wish, but the campaign for liberty website will be launching october 1st a precinct leadership program that will provide list and tools to help us do this...
If we don't take the time to work our precinct, we will never win.

[acptulsa]

No, I've said time and again you can criticize whoever you want, but don't think you have a right to impose your will on my and other LP members "property" by believing you have an obligation and right to change our ticket.

Who is storming the LP with guns ablazing to change the ticket? A petition is a method of persuasion. It is not a .50 cal. Browning Automatic Rifle. Is it? I didn't see DHS having to set up a defensive perimiter when speciallyblend petitioned the G.O.P., did you? And I didn't hear you complaining about that petition, either.

Are you going to report me, too? Please be sure to try to bring Authority down on all Dissent--no need to stop now... :rolleyes:

[tonesforjonesbones]

The libertarians on this forum drove me away from the Libertarian party. If pornography, drugs and gambling are your prime concerns...eh...that's not the party for me. Did Ron Paul say in his speech that we now live in an IMMORAL SOCIETY...and the politicians are IMMORAL...yes, he did. Even though I like many of the Libertarian stances, such as individual sovereignty, self governance, Limited government, humble foreign policy, sound money...it just seems to attract Immoral people who flock to the LP because THEY consider PORN, ATHEISM (actually an acidic HATE for Christians/Christianity,) GAMBLING and DRUGS to be the true issues of the LP. So, I now consider myself a libertarian / conservative...and guess I will attach myself to NO political party. I'm voting Palin because I like her. Tones

[acptulsa]

I'm voting Palin because I like her. Tones

No, actually you're threatening to vote for McCain because you like Palin. Not the same thing.

Now, tell me this. Do you really think getting off to porn and hating Christianity are worse than lighting off immoral wars and stealing from the populace? Don't overreact and do something your conscience won't approve of later, please.

Just making the request because I like you.