Jessie Ventura is USELESS because.....

[erika]

Because he's a globalist when it comes to illegal immigration. If he wants to keep the southern border open it will only continue the cheap labor flowing in and states will continue to be impacted. Just like my beloved California.

For some reason there's a certain subset of americans that were 60s kids and they bought up all the "whitey is evil" retread. You can hear this come out in Jessie when he brings up the "brown" people diatribe like we're supposed to have white guilt because someone is brown. Jessie's a good bullshitter. But it comes down to jobs and the mass influx of people from the southern border. The states can't and aren't able to handle that, regardless of what color the people are.

To me Immigration is everything because a president could secure the borders but a president won't be able to end the Fed Reserve, that will take congress.

And what are jessie's views on everything else?

I'd rather Glen Jacobs aka KANE from the WWE run. He knows our rights better than jessie does.

[libertea]

Because he's a globalist when it comes to illegal immigration. If he wants to keep the southern border open it will only continue the cheap labor flowing in and states will continue to be impacted.

Welcome erika!

I thought free market was a good thing?

[Dr.3D]

Welcome erika!

I thought free market was a good thing?

Free market is a great thing. But having people come across the border illegally is not free market. If they want to get a job here, let them do it the legal way.

[Alex Libman]

You should do more research on Glen Jacobs. From what I hear, he's a fan of Free Talk Live, which is pretty much as open-border as you can get. Which is a good thing, IMHO. You want protectionism, move to North Korea.

[Dr.3D]

You should do more research on Glen Jacobs. From what I hear, he's a fan of Free Talk Live, which is pretty much as open-border as you can get. Which is a good thing, IMHO. You want protectionism, move to North Korea.

So now making people come across the border legally is called protectionism.
I don't mind people coming into our country legally. If they want to come here, then let them do it legally.

[Alex Libman]

Borders don't exist. They're a delusion based on various criminal gangs (which call themselves government) marking their territory of influence. There is one human race and one human economy. If someone in Mali can do your job a cent cheaper, s\he should get it.

Now I can agree that this Anarcho-Capitalist point of view is impractical and we'd need to go through a long transitional period toward minarchy in the meantime, so I'm not yelling "open borders now, get rid of welfare later". It should be a gradual process.

[Dr.3D]

Actually, this debate is going on in another thread right now.

http://www.ronpaulforums.com/showthread.php?t=151254

[mapcommander]

um this wouldnt be a problem for the free market if the economy was ok..



so I respectfully disagree.. hes no globalist and hes not useless..


do a bit of more research.....

[LiveFree79]

Borders don't exist. They're a delusion based on various criminal gangs (which call themselves government) marking their territory of influence. There is one human race and one human economy. If someone in Mali can do your job a cent cheaper, s\he should get it.

Now I can agree that this Anarcho-Capitalist point of view is impractical and we'd need to go through a long transitional period toward minarchy in the meantime, so I'm not yelling "open borders now, get rid of welfare later". It should be a gradual process.

Stupid philosophical mumbo jumbo logic. Reality is we need borders and most of us believe in a sovereign nation. You want in, do it legally. Every group of people has had some sort of "border" be it a tribe, a culture, or physical land borders.

[Grimnir Wotansvolk]

Not wanting to build a wall is hardly equivalent to being a globalist. Cut off their free handouts and they have no incentive to invade, that's it. And even if they do, it's a futile, fruitless effort.

Seriously, a wall? Even just advocating senseless violence against desperate agrarian families looking for a new opportunity is fucking shameful.

[berrybunches]

I believe in open borders. I also believe we should make it far easier to become a citizen of this country, the system is biased.
I can't imagine why anyone would trust our government enough to let them fence us in...cause that what it would be US being FENCED IN.

I also am vehemently against welfare, VERY pro-sovereignty/anti-globalist.
I don't understand why this country has always hated immigrants - look at how they treated the Irish, Chinese and on and on.
Immigrants can be blamed for very few problems. The welfare/warfare state can be blamed for almost every problem.

[Malakai]

Ron Paul himself doesn't believe in fences either, nor do I.

Remove the incentive to come here. No social program benefits of any kind, and sent home when your caught. So simple yet we do not do this at all.

[erika]

Yet Ron Paul Has said that we can't allow all of these illegals to just come in. I mean, you guys did watch the debates right? He's nice about it but even Ron knows that it can't continue.

This isn't the libertarian forum. Ron Paul is an actual REAL republican. And the constitution doesn't grant ILLEGALS the right to just come over the border and stay illegally.

[erika]

You should do more research on Glen Jacobs. From what I hear, he's a fan of Free Talk Live, which is pretty much as open-border as you can get. Which is a good thing, IMHO. You want protectionism, move to North Korea.

I've listend to that show. Not impressed at all. And Glen isn't pro open borders for ILLEGALS. I've seen some of his youtube vids.

I'm not saying we need walls, I'm just saying that the flood of illegals from the southern border is a huge problem. 25 million is an invasion and part of its impact is crushing my state. We're suffering and feeling the crunch. Things need to change. If Ventura won't do anything about that then I can't vote for the 60s ex-hippie.

Ventura = Let the illegals and third world keep pouring in from the southern border. He's more of the same and won't change a damn thing in that regard. That IS one of the major problems that is crippling this country and since the fed won't be ended by congress, getting the illegals thing sorted out is imperative. Ventura will blather on about us being paranoid of brown skinned people. What a fucking idiot he is. If he doesn't see the invasion(influx of millions) and it's impact on the states then he's blind or just doesn't want to face reality.

This seems to be the norm with people who are rooted in the 60s. They still believe all the marxist bullshit they were taught back then. I hope I'm wrong, maybe he will change his mind.

[anaconda]

a president won't be able to end the Fed Reserve, that will take congress.

President can use executive order to instruct the treasury to issue silver certificates. An end-run around the Fed and Congress. JFK did it.

[erika]

President can use executive order to instruct the treasury to issue silver certificates. An end-run around the Fed and Congress. JFK did it.

Okay but he didn't technically END the fed and look what they did to him!

How do we know Ventura will even do that? He won't. He hasn't even talked about doing that. Does anyone have any links where he says he will???

Btw I still don't see how that will stop the millions of illegals from flooding into the country. lol

[Kludge]

This topic is ongoing, and four exceptionally spiffy threads come to mind...

http://www.ronpaulforums.com/showthread.php?t=146961
http://www.ronpaulforums.com/showthread.php?t=145943
http://www.ronpaulforums.com/showthread.php?t=144651
http://www.ronpaulforums.com/showthread.php?t=138095

[nobody's_hero]

I think if we could dismantle the welfare state, even with open borders, we'd have less immigration.

When we make it so that the only thing we have to offer is the 'pursuit' of happiness, rather than instant happiness - we will see a separation of immigrants who want to come into the country and earn a living, vs. those who wanted the free rides that their governments couldn't provide.

Our 'immigration problem' is the welfare state.

EDIT: Who knows? We might even inspire liberty-minded foreigners to fix their own governments.

[anaconda]

I think if we could dismantle the welfare state, even with open borders, we'd have less immigration.


You're now my hero. Brilliant post. Ventura would probably agree with your assessment.

[MRoCkEd]

Jesse Ventura is far from a globalist...
He wants to bring our troops home from not just Iraq, but Germany, Europe, Japan etc. like RP.
What globalist says that?

[torchbearer]

he makes a good point when he says a fence built to keep people out can also be used to keep people in.

[JohnMeridith]

Jesse Ventura is far from a globalist...
He wants to bring our troops home from not just Iraq, but Germany, Europe, Japan etc. like RP.
What globalist says that?
Globalists dont say that and Jesse Ventura is not a globalist. He is an honest man that is not looking to prosper from holding office. Very much like the founders, he sees it as a burden, but he sees it as a duty he should perform if called upon.

[rbu]

This is a nation of immigration. PERIOD. End of story.

They desperately WANT to be a part of the society, pay taxes and be a part of this nation. Who are you to deny them this opportunity and human right? People like yourself are the only ones that keep them illegal and on the fringe of society. You are not better than anyone else in this world no matter how many times you tell yourself that in the mirror.

[torchbearer]

If we didn't have a welfare state, I wouldn't care about waves off immigrants coming in.. because they could only add to our economy.
Under our current communist/fascist government of welfarism, a good portion of them will take more than they give.

So- I can go along with Jessie if he first removes the welfare state.

[libertea]

Stupid philosophical mumbo jumbo logic. Reality is we need borders and most of us believe in a sovereign nation. You want in, do it legally. Every group of people has had some sort of "border" be it a tribe, a culture, or physical land borders.

Sovereign: adj.

1. Self-governing; independent:

We need borders to be Self-governing; independent?

[torchbearer]

Borders do define jurisdiction and the extent of a state's sovereignty.

[MRoCkEd]

We need borders, just not necessarily ones that are fenced off...

[libertea]

Borders do define jurisdiction and the extent of a state's sovereignty.

And the extent of their oppression.

[torchbearer]

And the extent of their oppression.

Yes, if that government is unjust.
Why haven't you abolished it yet?

[libertea]

Yes, if that government is unjust.
Why haven't you abolished it yet?

All governments are unjust. Even If I could abolish them, humanity is not ready for that yet.

[torchbearer]

All governments are unjust. Even If I could abolish them, humanity is not ready for that yet.

Anarchy? WHo will protect you from my gang of thugs when we come to take what you own?

[MRoCkEd]

Anarchy? WHo will protect you from my gang of thugs when we come to take what you own?
His gang of thugs. :D

[torchbearer]

His gang of thugs. :D

Law of the jungle. Sounds like perfect government to me. :rolleyes:

[libertea]

Anarchy? WHo will protect you from my gang of thugs when we come to take what you own?
Who is protecting me now from the gang of thugs in Washington?

[Kludge]

Yes, people incapable of planning for retirement (or next month for that matter) are going to properly plan for military invasions of their land.

[torchbearer]

Who is protecting me now from the gang of thugs in Washington?

Dr. Ron Paul, and many others who are actually doing something to stop it.
What have you done lately to help remove tyrants?

[libertea]

Dr. Ron Paul, and many others who are actually doing something to stop it.
What have you done lately to help remove tyrants?

I have been promoting Ron Paul and Jesse Ventura for years and have always voted my concious. I did not need Ron Paul to tell me to vote for 3rd party.

Lately I have been standing up to people when the criticize Jesse Ventura.

[torchbearer]

I have been promoting Ron Paul and Jesse Ventura for years and have always voted my concious. I did not need Ron Paul to tell me to vote for 3rd party.

Lately I have been standing up to people when the criticize Jesse Ventura.

Why bother helping them, they promote a constitutional republic...
and in you own words...

All governments are unjust.

You are supporting people who support unjust government?

[libertea]

Why bother helping them, they promote a constitutional republic...
and in you own words...


You are supporting people who support unjust government?

The way I see it, they oppose the unjust government.

[torchbearer]

The way I see it, they oppose the unjust government.

How? BY supporting a constituional republic?

[libertea]

How? BY supporting a constituional republic?

By opposing the corruption.

I never said a government can't be just, I just said that they aren't. OK, maybe I didn't phrase it correctly.

I have an appointment. Gotta go. It's been fun.

[erika]

This is a nation of immigration. PERIOD. End of story.

They desperately WANT to be a part of the society, pay taxes and be a part of this nation. Who are you to deny them this opportunity and human right? People like yourself are the only ones that keep them illegal and on the fringe of society. You are not better than anyone else in this world no matter how many times you tell yourself that in the mirror.

NO! NOT END OF STORY! WHO WAS HERE FIRST?!

http://first-americans.blogspot.com/

Ever hear of solutrean culture?

I find it interesting the Caucasoid skulls and not mongoloid are the oldest in the americas.

It looks like caucasions were wiped out!


And btw illegals aren't paying taxes! They are using other people's social security numbers.

The third world doesn't just have a right to come here and enter. My relatives didn't and many were denied!


You do NOT have a right to live here. Leach off of another country!

[libertea]

And btw illegals aren't paying taxes!



There you go with "reality" again.

[EPIC1934]

What about the other side of the coin?

The CIA involvement in proping up their unbelievably corrupt government. THe CIA involvement in proping up the dicatators in Latin America that lead eventually to NAFTA? I am against illegal immigration too, but we have to see how the CIA and especially Rockefeller led Corporations have been involved in creating fascistic governements in Latin America that increase poverty there and send citizens to those countries to ours. There sometimes seems too little discussion of this side of the coin.

[constituent]

What about the other side of the coin?

The CIA involvement in proping up their unbelievably corrupt government. THe CIA involvement in proping up the dicatators in Latin America that lead eventually to NAFTA? I am against illegal immigration too, but we have to see how the CIA and especially Rockefeller led Corporations have been involved in creating fascistic governements in Latin America that increase poverty there and send citizens to those countries to ours. There sometimes seems too little discussion of this side of the coin.

b/c you'd be run off almost instantly, unfortunately.

i feel ya though.

[KenInMontiMN]

For whatever it's worth, here's Ventura on record on both legal and illegal immigration during the time frame in which he sought and held public office. If he were to run again seeking our support we would have to hold the big feet to the fire and get some clear answers regarding his take and solutions on illegal immigration.
http://www.ontheissues.org/Governor/Jesse_Ventura_Immigration.htm

And lastly, there's been a lot of spewing on this thread regarding tariffs and the constitution party. Either we get a handle on the balance of trade or we go broke as a nation. You have to produce/export in equal measure over the long run to what you consume/import or you bleed your nation dry of wealth and property ownership and somebody else ends up calling the shots. That should be crystal clear today- you need look no further than China warning us that we either cover their losses/investments in Fannie Mae/Freddie Mac or the whole international monetary system as it exists today, based on the dollar, will no longer be propped up by that country.

Internationalists who support the insolvency of the USA, some of them on these boards apparently, have no strong objections to the eventual dissolution of this country, giving way to international corporate rule. That's their utopia. The notion as presented, that there exists only the extremes of free trade and protectionism, is exactly that- an extremist notion. There are acres of real estate in between those extremes that involve reasonable trade regulation insuring ongoing solvency. Free trade as packaged today involves maximized short-term profit margins with no thought whatsoever towards the country's ongoing economic stability. If you don't understand this, watch IOUSA again for the simple cliff-notes version. Free trade scare-mongers would have you believe that any regulation is protectionism. The classical definition of protectionism is closing your borders to trade, period. Not reasonable regulation.

Any large and complex machinery needs regulated processes in order to accomplish the desired goals. Not too many of us order an automobile with nothing but a max. go switch and a full brake switch, insisting on no option in between. And no steering wheel. If we did it would just be a matter of time before that machine drove us over a cliff somewhere. Most of us want to regulate that machine to one degree or another.

In economic terms that's pretty much where we're headed today with our unregulated economic machine- over the cliff and into a state of freefall.

[RickyJ]

Borders don't exist.

OK, then I am going to set up camp on your "property", but because you don't believe in borders, you can't say can't anything about it. :D

I could say you don't exist as well, means about as much as your "borders don't exist" nonsense.

[sailor]

NO! NOT END OF STORY! WHO WAS HERE FIRST?!

http://first-americans.blogspot.com/

Ever hear of solutrean culture?

I find it interesting the Caucasoid skulls and not mongoloid are the oldest in the americas.

It looks like caucasions were wiped out!

Haha. So you are alright with open borders for "caucasions" since they were here first and all?

[sailor]

OK, then I am going to set up camp on your "property", but because you don't believe in borders, you can't say can't anything about it. :D

I could say you don't exist as well, means about as much as your "borders don't exist" nonsense.

Borders of property are backed up by property rights.

It is a poor analogy.

[jyakulis]

Man back in the day like when this country was founded we had people coming over here in droves. I'm with Ron Paul with the fact that the illegals are essentially a scapegoat for a poor economy. Once we get our financial house in order I doubt anyone will give a damn aout illegals. Just my opinion.

I dont' agree with amnesty, but I also don't agree with raiding business and what not. Just a little too draconic for my liking.

[MRoCkEd]

Illegals working here is not that much of a problem compared to illegals getting welfare, free healthcare, free schooling...

[torchbearer]

Illegals working here is not that much of a problem compared to illegals getting welfare, free healthcare, free schooling...

this.

[PlzPeopleWakeUp]

nt

[erika]

Erika = troll
end of story

Plzpeople = Inane plebeian.

End of story



I'm not saying we need walls, I'm just saying that the flood of illegals from the southern border is a huge problem. 25 million is an invasion and part of its impact is crushing my state. We're suffering and feeling the crunch. Things need to change. If Ventura won't do anything about that then I can't vote for the 60s ex-hippie.

Ventura = Let the illegals and third world keep pouring in from the southern border. He's more of the same and won't change a damn thing in that regard. That IS one of the major problems that is crippling this country and since the fed won't be ended by congress, getting the illegals thing sorted out is imperative. Ventura will blather on about us being paranoid of brown skinned people. What a fucking idiot he is. If he doesn't see the invasion(influx of millions) and it's impact on the states then he's blind or just doesn't want to face reality.

This seems to be the norm with people who are rooted in the 60s. They still believe all the marxist bullshit they were taught back then. I hope I'm wrong, maybe he will change his mind.