New Barr Press Release: Calls us a Cult of Personality!

[Lovecraftian4Paul]

Argh! Just when I was starting to cool down a little bit from yesterday, Barr goes and releases this:

http://campaign.blog.bobbarr2008.com/2008/09/11/principled-leadership-in-times-of-crisis/


...That brings me to my next point.

Today our campaign is being criticized by a few people for my decision to not attend a press conference sponsored by Ron Paul’s political action committee. I thought I would take a minute to explain to you why I made that decision.

It became evident to me after meeting with Ron Paul’s staff that this media event was not about promoting the liberty agenda; it was about promoting a man. That’s not what we’re in this for.

After rumors were spread in advance of the news conference that Bob Barr was dropping from the race – just to hype the event – I became even more hesitant to attend. Those tactics were unacceptable and when asked about it, Ron Paul’s staff simply smiled and said it would attract the press.

When I was provided a copy of Ron Paul’s prepared remarks just hours before the start of the planned news conference it became clear to me that the message Ron Paul intended to deliver was essentially to scatter the votes for the liberty agenda to the four winds.

His remarks not only encouraged anyone listening to support any one of four candidates, he also applauded ‘non-voters’. To me encouraging people not to vote is not principled leadership for the Liberty agenda.

I made the decision that attending that news conference was not consistent with Bob Barr’s principled leadership for the Liberty agenda.

Once I informed Ron Paul’s staff of my decision I was rudely informed that my decision would have permanent ramifications, I was personally threatened and Bob Barr was politically threatened. That’s a far cry from principled leadership.

One thing that did occur as a result of yesterday’s events is a clear separation of certain factions. Up until now, we have been dealing with two groups, those who want to advance the issues of liberty and those who have been drawn into a cult of personality.

There are those who support a specific politician and then there are those who support the liberty agenda regardless of standard-bearer.

Bob Barr, Wayne Allyn Root and the Libertarian Party stand for the issues of personal freedom and responsible government. As they have proven, both Bob and Wayne are willing to lead or follow for the advancement of our issues.

Now is their time to lead.

As we move into the final 50 days of the campaign we are in place to make a strong impact on the future of our country.

At the end of the day, the number of votes cast in support of the Liberty agenda in the General Election will influence the national political agenda of the next four years.

If we do our jobs, work hard and give us much as possible until Election Day, our voices will be heard and our agenda of smaller government, lower taxes, more personal freedom and government accountability will be on the table for years to come.

I appreciate your commitment and dedication.

[SnappleLlama]

w00t! I love that song!

[acptulsa]

Yeah, Barr, Ron Paul is just so charismatic that we can't resist him... :rolleyes:

He's just jealous because he has no personality whatsoever.

P.S. Who is Russ Verney and why is he making decisions for Barr?

[SnappleLlama]

I think Bob Barr takes orders from his moustache...

[Menthol Patch]

The truth is a neocon like Bob Barr is not worth voting for. Ron Paul could NOT endorse him!

[powerofreason]

Thats Russ Verney talking not Barr.

[Lovecraftian4Paul]

Barr is just looking like a split personality nutjob now. Disappear from the press conference, then offer Ron Paul your VP slot, then attack him as the center of a cult of personality the next day? What the hell? I just don't get it.

[Knightskye]

It also says the Paul Campaign spread disinformation to attract the press, and threatened Russ Verney personally and Bob Barr politically.

Individual liberty much?

[amy31416]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RZ5SVDYBNrY

[acptulsa]

Barr is just looking like a split personality nutjob now. Disappear from the press conference, then offer Ron Paul your VP slot, then attack him as the center of a cult of personality the next day? What the hell? I just don't get it.

Hell, they were calling him a thief at pretty much the same moment that they were offering him the vp slot!

[Truth Warrior]

I can see and understand that point of view. ;)

[Menthol Patch]

It also says the Paul Campaign spread disinformation to attract the press, and threatened Russ Verney personally and Bob Barr politically.

Individual liberty much?

Bob Barr is a lying neocon monster and I don't believe a word he says or anything his campaign says.

[m72mc]

sad

[Mister Grieves]

I made the decision that attending that news conference was not consistent with Bob Barr’s principled leadership for the Liberty agenda.He talks about himself in the third person like Bob Dole, to top it all off?

Jeesh.

[powerofreason]

He talks about himself in the third person like Bob Dole, to top it all off?

Jeesh.

Like I said before, thats Russ Verney talking, not Barr lulz. ;)

[RockEnds]

Do they really think we were born yesterday?

[Nirvikalpa]

So libertarian to get mad at someone for telling his supporters to vote for whomever they want, that they aren't just stuck with this guy or this guy.

[ARealConservative]

we all read about the rumors floating around about Barr dropping out.

I suspect it is totally accurate that the CFL did that to increase viewership. What a shitty thing to do!

The empire of lies seems to be strong in the CFL.

[HOLLYWOOD]

Hah!

I told y'all yesterday, BARR was going to do this, for extended Publicity! Lookout, here comes the Press releases.

The 3rd Parties need to UNITE and pull their voters together! Someone needs to get in the debate against the 2 Political Puppet Clowns.

[RonPaulFever]

I know an older gentleman who was involved with Russ Verney, and he nothing but bad things to say about him. Apparently Mr. Verney was a higher-up for the Reform Party during Perot's campaign and tried, according to my source, to basically ruin the RP's chances to become mainstream/electable. I don't know all of the details, but apparently Verney is not to be trusted.

[yongrel]

Ron Paul supporters are probably the exact wrong people to pull shenanigans with. Not terribly forgiving or prone to giving politicians the benefit of the doubt.

[ARealConservative]

Do they really think we were born yesterday?

that email rings extremely accurate.

[ShowMeLiberty]

That is so lame. It is not only insulting, it is written by a Libertarian who apparently doesn't really understand liberty!

He says, "there are those who support the liberty agenda regardless of standard-bearer". How is that anything other than partisan politics? Liberty means judging the candidates as individuals by your own standards, not just blindly following a "party" no matter what.

Fail.

[Mister Grieves]

Like I said before, thats Russ Verney talking, not Barr lulz. ;)
Ah. Would have at least made the thing a little more interesting had it been written by Barr.

"Jimmy can dunk. Jimmy's new in town. Jimmy will see you later."

[SnappleLlama]

we all read about the rumors floating around about Barr dropping out.

I suspect it is totally accurate that the CFL did that to increase viewership. What a shitty thing to do!

The empire of lies seems to be strong in the CFL.

:confused::confused:

I never read anything about Barr dropping out. I read a lot of posts URGING him to drop out, though! ;)

[gls]

we all read about the rumors floating around about Barr dropping out.

I suspect it is totally accurate that the CFL did that to increase viewership. What a shitty thing to do!

The empire of lies seems to be strong in the CFL.

More B.S.

I spent hours following this story yesterday and heard no such rumors. Zero.

Where is your evidence?

[ARealConservative]

Hah!

I told y'all yesterday, BARR was going to do this, for extended Publicity! Lookout, here comes the Press releases.

The 3rd Parties need to UNITE and pull their voters together! Someone needs to get in the debate against the 2 Political Puppet Clowns.

great self fulfilling prophecy.

Hey everybody, I bet the active candidate will issue press releases. :rolleyes:

[Rangeley]

Not surprisingly, the Libertarian Party is more concerned about advancing their party then the principles themselves. Ron Paul is willing to give props to the other parties for standing by the key principles, the LP would rather pretend these other parties don't exist. For all of Barr's talk about getting beyond partisanship, his campaign has been one with a heavy emphasis on partisanship... just for the LP rather then for a major party.

[yongrel]

Not surprisingly, the Libertarian Party is more concerned about advancing their party then the principles themselves. Ron Paul is willing to give props to the other parties for standing by the key principles, the LP would rather pretend these other parties don't exist. For all of Barr's talk about getting beyond partisanship, his campaign has been one with a heavy emphasis on partisanship... just for the LP rather then for a major party.

This.

[amy31416]

At least we know what they really think of us now, between Fergusen's post and this email.

Ah well, they had an opportunity to explain things and any good points they may have made are lost in the insults.

[Minuteman]

Nice press release. I will still be voting for Barr.

He was also spot on about the cult of personality.

[acptulsa]

Nobody--nobody--is this incompetent at spin control. Just nobody.

This is reeking more and more every damned minute of a concerted attempt to dig the party into a hole so deep there's nothing left to do but go ahead and bury it.

[Shink]

Fu*k Bob Barr. If I could see any Presidency I want, it'd be Ron Paul and Badnarik in no particular order. Bob Barr seems like he's keeping his foot in the door to slip back into the GOP after this election cycle. If I vote at all, it will be for neither Barr nor the other big government jackasses.

[Menthol Patch]

I call Bob Barr supporters a cult of fascism.

They are supporting a candidate who still supports the war on drugs.

They are supporting a candidate who put thousands of innocent people in prison.

They are supporting a candidate who voted for the war in Iraq.

They are supporting a candidate who voted for the Patriot Act.

They are supporting a candidate who will not cooperate with other third party candidates.

[Andrew-Austin]

I agree with Barr that Paul is going about this all wrong, fragmenting support to all the third parties.

[Menthol Patch]

Nobody--nobody--is this incompetent at spin control. Just nobody.

This is reeking more and more every damned minute of an attempt to dig the party into a hole so deep there's nothing left to do but go ahead and bury it.

I've said it over and over again for months that Bob Barr was a neocon who infiltrated the LP.

[rockandrollsouls]

Thats Russ Verney talking not Barr.

Even if it is Russ it's a reasonably fair assessment. That certainly sounds like Ron's campaign....I've never felt like they've been in step with him. What I see is two good guys with two equally poor campaigns.

"There are those who support a specific politician and then there are those who support the liberty agenda regardless of standard-bearer."

Couldn't be more true. 90% of the anti-Barr posts come from mentholpatch anyway.

[fr33domfightr]

I think many of you are part of this "Cult of Personality" and are in denial. What he's stating here is, Ron Paul is your "ONLY" guy. That you'll only vote for him, even though Ron Paul said it was about the movement, not him. That's all the statement was about. Don't take it personally unless the shoe fits. If you truly feel that Ron is your only guy, then say so, and accept that people will criticize you.


FF

[DRV45N05]

I'm convinced this isn't Bob Barr's calculation, it's Russ Verney's.

Bad move by Bob to hire this guy. He should have gone with a long-time libertarian activist with some campaign experience, or a Paul veteran.

[ARealConservative]

I agree with Barr that Paul is going about this all wrong, fragmenting support to all the third parties.

wow - we rarely agree on anything.

[rajibo]

Argh! Just when I was starting to cool down a little bit from yesterday, Barr goes and releases this:

http://campaign.blog.bobbarr2008.com/2008/09/11/principled-leadership-in-times-of-crisis/


I had the exact same reaction. Not showing up to that press conference may have been a blunder, but a forgivable one. The constant insults from the Barr campaign that followed are unforgivable.

I may still have to vote for him if Baldwin doesn't make the ballot, but even a vote for Baldwin won't be done with a ton of enthusiasm.

Way to screw everything up Barr.:mad:

[ARealConservative]

I've said it over and over again for months that Bob Barr was a neocon who infiltrated the LP.

and it would of never been possible without Ron Paul supporting him.

[SnappleLlama]

I'm convinced this isn't Bob Barr's calculation, it's Russ Verney's.

Bad move by Bob to hire this guy. He should have gone with a long-time libertarian activist with some campaign experience, or a Paul veteran.

If that's true, though, then why hasn't Bob Barr himself made a statement to clarify his feelings on the matter? :confused:

[Andrew-Austin]

I call Bob Barr supporters a cult of fascism. Bob Bar is a neocon.

Everyone is aware of your position on Barr, saying it over and over again does not make it anymore true or self evident. Its just rhetoric.

[RockEnds]

I agree with Barr that Paul is going about this all wrong, fragmenting support to all the third parties.

No. The third parties aren't supposed to work together. It's a real threat to TPTB. We're supposed to identify with the false right/left paradigm and hate the Greens more than the Democrats. Ron Paul is doing this exactly right.

[nc4rp]

Bob Barr = Neocon i'm almost completely convinced now.

[acptulsa]

I think many of you are part of this "Cult of Personality" and are in denial. What he's stating here is, Ron Paul is your "ONLY" guy. That you'll only vote for him, even though Ron Paul said it was about the movement, not him. That's all the statement was about. Don't take it personally unless the shoe fits. If you truly feel that Ron is your only guy, then say so, and accept that people will criticize you.


FF

The only reason it resembles a "cult of personality" is because there are damned few people in Washington that we can trust.

These morons are not building trust.

[SnappleLlama]

No. The third parties aren't supposed to work together. It's a real threat to TPTB. We're supposed to identify with the false right/left paradigm and hate the Greens more than the Democrats. Ron Paul is doing this exactly right.

Exactly. Ron Paul isn't promoting anyone. He's just telling people that there are ALWAYS more choices than the Republican or Democratic parties. Third parties need to be given stronger voices.

[Flash]

this media event was not about promoting the liberty agenda; it was about promoting a man. That’s not what we’re in this for.

This comment makes no sense whatsoever. It was supporting 4 anti-establishment Candidates to get them into the debates. I guess the LP believes its wrong for the Repubs and Dems to snuff them out, but its perfectly fine for the LP not to support The Greens' and Independents right to debate.

[acptulsa]

This comment makes no sense whatsoever. It was supporting 4 anti-establishment Candidates to get them into the debates. I guess the LP believes its wrong for the Repubs and Dems to snuff them out, but its perfectly fine for the LP not to support The Greens' and Independents right to debate.

x2

[rockandrollsouls]

I had the exact same reaction. Not showing up to that press conference may have been a blunder, but a forgivable one. The constant insults from the Barr campaign that followed are unforgivable.

I may still have to vote for him if Baldwin doesn't make the ballot, but even a vote for Baldwin won't be done with a ton of enthusiasm.

Way to screw everything up Barr.:mad:

What exactly in that letter is offensive? I support a liberty agenda and that doesn't bother me one bit.

And, keep in mind, those of you saying Bob is a "neocon" that infiltrated the LP, Ron did plug his name and help him get there. That, of course, doesn't matter, though :rolleyes:

[jyakulis]

What a crock. I never trusted that fool.

All Paul is trying to do is open up the debates. News flash Bob. You ain't gonna win. Unless we open up the debate a third party doesn't have a chance.

[ARealConservative]

No. The third parties aren't supposed to work together. It's a real threat to TPTB. We're supposed to identify with the false right/left paradigm and hate the Greens more than the Democrats. Ron Paul is doing this exactly right.

They aren’t working together. Did you hear them announce a unity ticket? Nope, still separate tickets diluting the disenfranchised vote.

Ron Paul managed to get freedom loving people to pay attention, and then he squandered it all by pretending any third party message is good enough. Or if you like, just don’t vote at all.

The more Bob Barr explains his reasoning, the more inept the C4L appears.

In 4 years the socialists will point to all the votes going towards Nader and the Green’s and say “see, we need to gain even more power, that is what the people want”.

[svf]

More B.S.

I spent hours following this story yesterday and heard no such rumors. Zero.

Where is your evidence?

http://www.economicpolicyjournal.com/2008/09/ron-paul-to-make-major-announcement.html


...there is even speculation that Baldwin and Barr are stepping aside so that Paul can become the nominee of both the Constitution and Libertarian Parties.

[TurtleBurger]

Interesting that the blog has nothing but pro-Barr comments on it. I guess we can now see how Bob Barr feels about censorship.

[surf]

i'm not sure Bob's a true libertarian as Dr. Paul is. this is very disappointing. i told a polster Tuesday night that i'd be voting for Barr, and i don't like to lie.... i've voted for libertarians when i could my entire adult life (inc. Dr. Paul in '88), i've ran for State office as a libertarian, i've served as party treasurer, and donated monthly to the party.

i can't vote for Nader, can i? it's looking like Baldwin.

Please, Bob, grab a clue. if you're stuck in a deep hole, stop digging.

And, for f#cks sake, Bob, don't praise W for anything.

[speciallyblend]

send a message to the lp, barr is just a liar and this guy has just lost any hope of gaining votes... as a 12 yr member of the LP, i am ashamed.

[fr33domfightr]

The only reason it resembles a "cult of personality" is because there are damned few people in Washington that we can trust.

These morons are not building trust.


I agree with you, but we've got to expand our horizons. Ron is 73 now.


FF

[rockandrollsouls]

i'm not sure Bob's a true libertarian as Dr. Paul is. this is very disappointing. i told a polster Tuesday night that i'd be voting for Barr, and i don't like to lie.... i've voted for libertarians when i could my entire adult life (inc. Dr. Paul in '88), i've ran for State office as a libertarian, i've served as party treasurer, and donated monthly to the party.

i can't vote for Nader, can i? it's looking like Baldwin.

Please, Bob, grab a clue. if you're stuck in a deep hole, stop digging.

And, for f#cks sake, Bob, don't praise W for anything.

So you won't be voting for him because he didn't show up to a conference but signed off on the agreement? Because he released a fairly reasonable assessment of the situation and you were offended? Because he hasn't done one THING to violate the LP platform?

You've got to be kidding me. Some of you people are simply unreasonable and clouded by emotions. "Omg Bob made me feel bad he's a meanie." Grow up. Anything you don't agree with is horrible and a sin...you act more like communists than proponents of liberty. Seriously, some of you need to step back and reassess.

[Knightskye]

They aren’t working together. Did you hear them announce a unity ticket? Nope, still separate tickets diluting the disenfranchised vote.

Ron Paul managed to get freedom loving people to pay attention, and then he squandered it all by pretending any third party message is good enough. Or if you like, just don’t vote at all.

The more Bob Barr explains his reasoning, the more inept the C4L appears.

In 4 years the socialists will point to all the votes going towards Nader and the Green’s and say “see, we need to gain even more power, that is what the people want”.

Exactly. Thank you. :)

[freelance]

IOW, Barr actually thought that RP would call them all together just to endorse HIM? LOL!

[Menthol Patch]

IOW, Barr actually thought that RP would call them all together just to endorse HIM? LOL!

Yep. Bob Barr is just ticked off that Ron Paul causes about making third parties relevant rather than supporting a neocon and helping him get a couple extra votes.

[freelance]

Yep. Bob Barr is just ticked off that Ron Paul causes about making third parties relevant rather than supporting a neocon and helping him get a couple extra votes.

That's so far beyond pathetic that I am at a loss for words.

[constitutional]

Cult? He has no clue what we RP supporters fighting for. That's it, Barr.

[specsaregood]

These people have it all backwards.

Ron Paul's conference was all about making it NOT about him.
He brought together people from various philosophies and parties and got them to agree on a basic platform. He was saying, "All of these people have a following, they all agree on this basic platform. They all deserve to be heard." Anybody that thought the announcement was about "Ron Paul" didn't watch it or had some biased filters already in mind. He was trying to hand the baton off to all the candidates that agreed with this basic platform. Only B. Barr wasn't there to reach for it.

Whereas, Bob Barr offering Ron Paul the VP position WAS completely treating it like a "Cult of Personality". He thought, "it's not the message, its the messenger. Let me get him on my ticket." So I guess with that in mind, this email makes sense.

And blaming the rumors on the campaign? It shows the complete lack of understanding of the grassroots. Which is more likely: some grassroots random supporters started that rumor or the campaign? Come on! "Ron Paul’s staff simply smiled and said it would attract the press." is a true statement. It is not an admission of guilt.

[mcgraw_wv]

Hey Bob Barr...

Don't Bite the Hand that Feeds you!!!


Dumb@ss Politician...

[freelance]

The pathology seems to have spread to the entire Barr campaign. They're acting as crazy as the McCain and the Obama folks.

[acptulsa]

These people have it all backwards.

Ron Paul's conference was all about making it NOT about him. .

Here is the very crux of the issue in two simple sentences.

[mnewcomb]

All 3rd party candidates CAN step aside and put Paul on their ballots whether he wants it or not...

We elect dead people on a regular basis and they are not consenting to anything...

[Rhys]

Well... This is why I asked the CFL to get the story out first, last night.... but libertarians seem to be anti-public relations

[surf]

Seriously, some of you need to step back and reassess.



“In times of crisis, strength in leadership requires boldness of character, clear direction and firm resolve. As we witnessed after the attacks of September 11th, President George W. Bush showed incredible leadership as he stood atop a fire truck amidst the rubble of the twin towers to rally America.”

i'm going to have a tough time voting for someone that says this

[Menthol Patch]

The Bob Barr supporters are acting like spoiled children.

They are just angry that Bob Barr's campaign is going no where fast.

[Melissa]

Interesting that the blog has nothing but pro-Barr comments on it. I guess we can now see how Bob Barr feels about censorship.

+1

[SnappleLlama]

The Bob Barr supporters are acting like spoiled children.



I'm starting to believe this. I can feel their desperation coming through the intertubes! LOL....

[Dorfsmith]

I was out this morning buying some cheap silver and I come home to this email from Barr's campaign.

Last night after I had calmed down I told my wife that what Barr did was wrong but I was still going to vote for him because Nader is too far to the left for me. I also let all my friends on my messageboard know that I was willing to vote for Barr even though I was still upset.

BUT, Bob Barr's campaign could not leave it alone and try to move on. They had to send this crap out. I unsubscribed from the email list and will probably be undecided until election day about who I will vote for. ONE THING IS FOR SURE...IT WILL NOT BE BOB BARR. They could have let it go but this is the last straw. Barr supporters, go ahead and attack me. You won't change my mind this time. :mad:

[KenInMontiMN]

There's really no more reason for Paul to endorse Barr that there is for Paul to endorse Nader. Their past records stand eons apart on many issues. If Paul was going to endorse anyone, which he's not, the obvious consistent candidate closest to his own personal stances is Baldwin.

Barr's lucky to be included in the C4L small party endorsement still after yesterday's misguided shenanigans, and a decent percentage of our people will vote the libertarian label regardless of the fact that a non-libertarian headlines the ticket. They can do that with C4L's blessing (still), if that matters to them.

No minor party is going to win this cycle, combined or not. But a combined minor party take of the total that is unexpectedly large and presumably growing as long as present directions continue to be pursued in Washington, is the aim here. Its about sending an ever-greater amplified message. In 2012 the landscape may be different, but that's the picture today.

So really there no two-sided beef, sounds like a one-sided Barr/Varley problem to me. If LP is where you want to spend your minor-party vote you can do that with Dr. Paul's blessing.

[jyakulis]

I'm such a conspiracy theorists, but this still seems so staged to me.

Him not showing up after he was suppose to.

First question from person right in front: How much unity can there be Barr is not here blah blah bah.

The mainstream support. Times article: americans ready for libertarianism? Beck endorsing Barr all of sudden that it's safe to.

It's wreaks of CONTROLLED OPPOSITION

DIVIDE AND CONQUER

[ceakins]

Well RP showed a great lack of leadership, in suggesting we support a theocrat, or a socialist. It does seem like there is some cultish behavior going on. I know what it looks like first hand, I grew up a Jehovah's Witness.

[SnappleLlama]

Well RP showed a great lack of leadership, in suggesting we support a theocrat, or a socialist. It does seem like there is some cultish behavior going on. I know what it looks like first hand, I grew up a Jehovah's Witness.

Ron Paul was not promoting anyone specifically, he just wanted people to know that there are other choices besides the main two parties. That's it!

[Dorfsmith]

Well RP showed a great lack of leadership, in suggesting we support a theocrat, or a socialist. It does seem like there is some cultish behavior going on. I know what it looks like first hand, I grew up a Jehovah's Witness.

I came up with this idea way before Ron Paul. I remember posting here several months ago saying I would love to see 30% Obama, 30% McCain, and 40% other. Maybe it's the cult of Dorf and Ron Paul worships me. :)

[constitutional]

Well RP showed a great lack of leadership, in suggesting we support a theocrat, or a socialist. It does seem like there is some cultish behavior going on. I know what it looks like first hand, I grew up a Jehovah's Witness.

He invited Barr, Baldwin, Nader but Barr did not attend -- thus Nader took all the attention.

Seriously, Barr just wants to get our votes but he is doing it through wrong way.

[dawnbt]

After rumors were spread in advance of the news conference that Bob Barr was dropping from the race – just to hype the event – I became even more hesitant to attend. Those tactics were unacceptable and when asked about it, Ron Paul’s staff simply smiled and said it would attract the press.

I think we would have most definately heard this rumor. We are the all knowing, seeing eye, of the internet.

If Barr was the only third party candidate in my state...I would not vote!

[angelatc]

We all read about the rumors floating around about Barr dropping out. I suspect it is totally accurate that the CFL did that to increase viewership. What a shitty thing to do! The empire of lies seems to be strong in the CFL.

I didn't hear it. I heard that some people were hoping that an endorsement was forthcoming.

[constitutional]

After rumors were spread in advance of the news conference that Bob Barr was dropping from the race – just to hype the event – I became even more hesitant to attend. Those tactics were unacceptable and when asked about it, Ron Paul’s staff simply smiled and said it would attract the press.

I think we would have most definately heard this rumor. We are the all knowing, seeing eye, of the internet.

If Barr was the only third party candidate in my state...I would not vote!

I agree. Why didn't Barr attend Rally for Republic? Were there some kind of rumors too? Seriously, Barr is trying to isolate his campaign from our movement and yet at the same time trying to break out movement to get votes.

[Dorfsmith]

Is the Barr campaign happy now or are they going to keep throwing fuel on the fire? By the time this is over they won't have any votes to lose.

[freelance]

Well RP showed a great lack of leadership, in suggesting we support a theocrat, or a socialist. It does seem like there is some cultish behavior going on. I know what it looks like first hand, I grew up a Jehovah's Witness.

He wasn't asking you to vote for anyone. In fact, he wasn't even ASKING you to vote third party. He was emphasizing the importance of third parties and how the two-party system has let us down.

For the record, I do not agree with some of Ron Paul's positions, but liberty trumps everything for me. I can't remember every agreeing with anyone 100%, and I'm not about to let go of my beliefs just to support RP (or anyone else, for that matter).

[Menthol Patch]

This picture best illustrates Bob Barr supporters.

http://unity2008.org/911/CTW_html_ea7da88.jpg

They refuse to see no evil about his support of the war in Iraq.

They refuse to hear no evil about his support of the Patriot Act and the War on Drugs.

They refuse to say no evil about his refusal to cooperate with other third party candidates, drop out of a press conference at the last minute, and then lie about it.

[TruthisTreason]

I'm a voter. Nothing more, nothing less. He had a chance to win my vote. Barr lost it! He had a chance to bring me into the LP, Barr lost it. Call it what you will.

[V3n]

He didn't call all of us a "cult of personality" there are also "those who want to advance the issues of liberty" whoever is leading it.

I think we can still be both!

[Andrew-Austin]

The Bob Barr supporters are acting like spoiled children.

:rolleyes: x 50, your the one crusading against a third party candidate, for nary a coherent reason, on an internet forum. You repeatedly use emotionally based rhetoric (talking points w/o any logical substance), and now your calling me a chimp.

Get a grip, go outside and get some fresh air.

[jyakulis]

This picture best illustrates Bob Barr supporters.

They refuse to see no evil about his support of the war in Iraq.

They refuse to hear no evil about his support of the Patriot Act and the War on Drugs.

They refuse to say no evil about his refusal to cooperate with other third party candidates, drop out of a press conference at the last minute, and then lie about it.

Totally in agreement. They are no better than brain dead repubs dems supportings anything with a D or R in front of their name except this time it's an L (L for LOSER).

Despite whatever he says if it looks like a neocon, tastes like a neocon, and smells like a neocon it's still a neocon.

Barr=wolf in sheeps clothing

[rajibo]

I agree. Why didn't Barr attend Rally for Republic? Were there some kind of rumors too? Seriously, Barr is trying to isolate his campaign from our movement and yet at the same time trying to break out movement to get votes.

I saw Barr at the Rally. At least outside the Rally. He also spoke at the picnic.

[Malakai]

I fail to see how RP's promoting of 4 clear points of interest (anti-war, pro-privacy, pro-fed investigation/oversight/reform, anti-deficit) are talking about "the man" and not the movement.

Seems getting every third party to agree to some serious pro-liberty ideals is doing exactly what Barr says RP wasn't doing!

[Lovecraftian4Paul]

Oh yeah, I left out one of the best parts at the top of his new press release:


May we never forget . . .

In times of crisis, strength in leadership requires boldness of character, clear direction and firm resolve. As we witnessed after the attacks of September 11th, President George W. Bush showed incredible leadership as he stood atop a fire truck amidst the rubble of the twin towers to rally America.

What's this jackass thinking?? "Incredible leadership" is yelling about terrorists in a pile of rubble while you send the real heroes (rescue workers and cleaners) to die in the poison air and dust the next day? Sick!

[dannno]

What a nightmare. This whole thing just sucks.


Look, the Federal Reserve's job is to increase corporate welfare. This has been happening for about a century now. In order to offset the corporate welfare, citizen welfare was created as a direct result because corporate welfare was driving prices too high.

Ron Paul himself has said that he would not end social programs because people are dependent on them. There are too many people in this movement who won't fucking listen and think that poor people getting welfare ARE the problem. That is Neocon Conservative propaganda. They are the RESULT of the problem, that is what Ron Paul attempts to explain. Do ANY of you Bob Barr supporters understand this concept or do I need to explain it further?

Until we fix the problems with the Fed and corporate welfare, we can't take citizens off of social welfare. Once we fix there problem, welfare will inevitably disappear because there won't be a need. The need comes from the system!!

Now that these left-progressives like Nader who understand the problems with corporate welfare are beginning to understand this problem is related to the Federal Reserve, and since they understand social issues of liberty much better than neofascist Bob Barr, they really are not a bad choice... and they are promoting liberty, in total, better than Barr.

But feel free to vote for Barr if that is the only third party candidate you can identify with..

[Thomas_Paine]

we all read about the rumors floating around about Barr dropping out.

I suspect it is totally accurate that the CFL did that to increase viewership. What a shitty thing to do!

The empire of lies seems to be strong in the CFL.

Ron Paul Campaign for Liberty is an Empire of Lies?

HA HA HA HA

Nice Try

[rockandrollsouls]

:rolleyes: x 50, your the one crusading against a third party candidate, for nary a coherent reason, on an internet forum. You repeatedly use emotionally based rhetoric (talking points w/o any logical substance), and now your calling me a chimp.

Get a grip, go outside and get some fresh air.

Thumbs up. They'll come around eventually. This shouldn't come as a surprise, though. The same group tends to overreact to everything.

[rockandrollsouls]

I saw Barr at the Rally. At least outside the Rally. He also spoke at the picnic.

Yes. In fact, it's my understanding Barr has been given the cold shoulder many, many times. I'd expect nothing less from Ron's campaign managers....the same people praising Benton now and the holiness that is his position wanted him to resign months ago.

Two very good men are surrounded by awful aides....Benton and his crew being the worst among them.

[Andrew-Austin]

Now that these left-progressives like Nader who understand the problems with corporate welfare are beginning to understand this problem is related to the Federal Reserve, and since they understand social issues of liberty much better than neofascist Bob Barr, they really are not a bad choice... and they are promoting liberty, in total, better than Barr.



A pro free healthcare, pro carbon tax socialist is not better than Barr.

[james1844]

Just for the record, this movement is about supporting not only Ron Paul, but also liberty candidates all over the United States, these candidates include people like BJ Lawson.

Ron holds a highly influential leadership position, but its not just about Ron, its about the philosophy of true conservatism.

[Trigonx]

All i see is jealousy coming from the Barr campaign. If they would take the time to listen to a few of Dr. Paul's speeches at rallies they would know its about the message and not the messenger. I for one have never thought about voting for Barr because of his voting record on key issues like the Patriot Act and the war. To expect Dr. Paul to handle this situation any different than he did would mean you don't have the slightest clue about his integrity and character. As Dr. Paul has said many times hes the messenger and his job is to get us active and that we have the obligation to not sit around but to spread the message of freedom and further its cause. At the press conference Dr. Paul's whole speech was all about getting the people to change the system which is completely biased by not voting for McBama, to spin this as saying Dr. Paul lacks leadership rather than focusing on promoting freedom by attending the conference is absurd. I personally think Dr. Paul is showing plenty of leadership by just doing what hes been doing, and that is staying true to himself and continuing to fight for our rights no matter what people say about him or do against him.

[rajibo]

Yes. In fact, it's my understanding Barr has been given the cold shoulder many, many times. I'd expect nothing less from Ron's campaign managers....the same people praising Benton now and the holiness that is his position wanted him to resign months ago.

Two very good men are surrounded by awful aides....Benton and his crew being the worst among them.

Who the heck is praising Benton??? I haven't seen anybody praising Benton.

[Jamsie 567]

There was a lot of hurtful insulting remarks on hear that were childish attacking Barr. To the inmature people who post stupid shit think before you post something. You can divide this movment as well. I don't agree with Barr on his decision yesterday but I didn't get rude over it.

CNN was here and made this forum look like a joke IMO.

[rockandrollsouls]

Who the heck is praising Benton??? I haven't seen anybody praising Benton.

Benton and the managers set up events...not Ron. His aides have always been incompetent. Do you care to address the rest of my post?

[dannno]

A pro free healthcare, pro carbon tax socialist is not better than Barr.

You are very short-sighted.

This thread is for YOU:


http://www.ronpaulforums.com/showthread.php?t=154932

[rockandrollsouls]

There was a lot of hurtful insulting remarks on hear that were childish attacking Barr. To the inmature people who post stupid shit think before you post something. You can divide this movment as well. I don't agree with Barr on his decision yesterday but I didn't get rude over it.

CNN was here and made this forum look like a joke IMO.

I'm in agreement 100%. The best argument people have against Barr is "neocon" and "noshow." They need to get a life and actually promote liberty rather than attempting to isolate it.

[Kade]

Argh! Just when I was starting to cool down a little bit from yesterday, Barr goes and releases this:

http://campaign.blog.bobbarr2008.com/2008/09/11/principled-leadership-in-times-of-crisis/

Wtf... are you kidding me?

I hate Bob Barr...


I mean I really hate this man.

[SnappleLlama]

There was a lot of hurtful insulting remarks on hear that were childish attacking Barr. To the inmature people who post stupid shit think before you post something. You can divide this movment as well. I don't agree with Barr on his decision yesterday but I didn't get rude over it.

CNN was here and made this forum look like a joke IMO.

Damn, CNN was here? I forgot to dress up and be on my best behavior!

:p

[Alawn]

we all read about the rumors floating around about Barr dropping out.

I suspect it is totally accurate that the CFL did that to increase viewership. What a shitty thing to do!

The empire of lies seems to be strong in the CFL.

You are delusional. Nobody really believed that. Plus any stupid rumors were started by idiots on the internet on message boards not the campaign.

[ARealConservative]

Ron Paul Campaign for Liberty is an Empire of Lies?

HA HA HA HA

Nice Try

it sure seems so.

We know for a fact that the C4L was told 3 hours before the event that Barr was out, yet Paul acted as if he was going to arrive at anytime.

Nobody has explained this one to me yet.

[kombayn]

Wtf... are you kidding me?

I hate Bob Barr...


I mean I really hate this man.

+1, Bob Barr really showed his true colors yesterday. He knows he's not going to win, he even admitted it to Cavuto before he became the LP nominee. What would this hurt? I'll tell you. Bob Barr doesn't want to be seen with them because he's going to re-join the GOP and run for POTUS in 2012 if McCain loses.

[Thomas_Paine]

There was a lot of hurtful insulting remarks on hear that were childish attacking Barr. To the inmature people who post stupid shit think before you post something. You can divide this movment as well. I don't agree with Barr on his decision yesterday but I didn't get rude over it.

CNN was here and made this forum look like a joke IMO.

Let's get this straight

Barr Lied to Ron Paul about attending the press conference

Barr is trying to divide this movement, he who has shown his true colors in his recent actions are words.

[acptulsa]

it sure seems so.

We know for a fact that the C4L was told 3 hours before the event that Barr was out, yet Paul acted as if he was going to arrive at anytime.

Nobody has explained this one to me yet.

How do we know this is the fact again? I missed it.

[rajibo]

Do you care to address the rest of my post?

Umm, ok.

I have no idea if Barr has been given the cold shoulder by Paul's people.

Both campaigns are/were amateurishly run.

Paul is definately a very good man, but I now have severe doubts about Barr's goodness.

I have no love for Benton, haven't seen him being praised by anybody, and think it's all his fault for calling yesterday's announcement "major" in the first place. He seems to be best at creating clusterfucks.

[tropicangela]

[Paul]... applauded ‘non-voters’. To me encouraging people not to vote is not principled leadership for the Liberty agenda. http://campaign.blog.bobbarr2008.com...mes-of-crisis/

Really? Because this is what came in my mailbox today from Ron Paul that was sent to the National Press Club:


For me, though, my advice—for what it’s worth—is to vote! Reject the two candidates who demand perpetuation of the status quo and pick one of the alternatives that you have the greatest affinity to, based on the other issues.

[Perry]

Today our campaign is being criticized by a few people...

If Barr has taken this time to respond so quickly then it's a heck of a lot more than just a few people.:p

Way to minimize Bob!:D
Bob Barr has destroyed his chances and he deserves it. He won't live this one down.

[tropicangela]

And +300,000,000

I never heard of Barr dropping out.

[Cowlesy]

Hah --- don't you all just love Washington wonks with their little rumor-games, blog posts and other assorted sillyness?

Glad this guy said "a few people" --- yeah, only a couple.

And as for "cult of personality" --- I was wondering why we had a few trolls over the past few weeks popping up and taking that line --- must be on a scratch-pad to use against Paul supporters somewhere.

Guess what...if Ron Paul just dumped all his principles, decided that all we can use now to fix the problem is fascism.....0.001% of this board would start going "ZOMG...RON PAUL SAYS FASCISM IZ HAS THE ANSWER...FASCISM FTW!!" ---- the rest of us would ask that he seek psychiatric help.

This guy's "blog post" fuckin' fails.

[acptulsa]

Guess what...if Ron Paul just dumped all his principles, decided that all we can use now to fix the problem is fascism.....0.001% of this board would start going "ZOMG...RON PAUL SAYS FASCISM IZ HAS THE ANSWER...FASCISM FTW!!" ---- the rest of us would ask that he seek psychiatric help.

You might have that percentage a mite high, but otherwise qft.

[idiom]

Lets set-up a Chip-in so Barr can buy one of these and get there faster.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/herefordandworcester/content/images/2007/12/07/drill_2_300_300x400.jpg

[tonesforjonesbones]

I disagree...Ron Paul's pac has been neo conned. I will not participate. The Libertarian Party has also been neo conned. I will not participate. No one is safe from these barstards. Take the blinders off people...all of it has been corrupted. Tones

[tonesforjonesbones]

We best be a step ahead of them. WAKE UP. tones

[idiom]

If the Chip-in doesn't help, a Money Bomb could buy Barr one of these:

http://www.ilexenergy.com/pages/Pictures/Excavator.jpg

[texasbelle]

In the past I considered possibly 'holding my nose' and voting for Barr because I refuse to vote McBama but now no way I am voting Barr.

[Scotso]

You lost my vote, Bob. You could have easily salvaged it by admitting you were wrong to shun Dr. Paul and apologizing to your supporters.

You are STILL attacking him. Saying the press conference was about “one man.” It’s insulting to those of us that admire Dr. Paul a great deal. The issue here seems to be that you percieve that the conference was all about Ron Paul…. so you being all about Bob Barr (and not about the historic moment that this could have been, a grand coalition of third parties), you decided to boycott instead of attending.

Even if you were right about the event, what harm could have come to you for going? Do you really think Ron Paul supporters who would have considered voting for you would EVER vote for McKinney? Until yesterday, I thought I would never consider voting for Nader. But your antics in the past 24 hours have solidified another vote for Nader in my state.

Face the facts, you really blew it with this one, and no amount of spin is going to convince anyone who has respected and supported Ron Paul over the years that he has, overnight, turned into the egomaniac that people have claimed you embody (and perhaps, it seems, rightfully so). This election is about LIBERTY. It’s about the things Americans have in common that the two major parties ignore. This election is about returning our country to the people and giving us back our essential liberties. This election is NOT about Bob Barr. If you can realize that and apologize, I’ll reconsider giving you my vote. If you continue in these childish antics, me and a lot of my fellow libertarians (and Libertarians) are going to take their support elsewhere.

Also, it seems that a great number of the posts on the Bob Barr for President official blog are extremely pro-Barr and anti-Paul. A sharp turn from the posts yesterday. Yesterday they stopped people from posting, and today it seems they might be deleting posts that they don’t agree with. I hope that’s not true, because censorship by a Libertarian candidate would be just about the worst thing (s)he could possibly do.

Is the Libertarian Party really this stupid? Are they so completely stubborn and out of touch that they're willing to turn their backs on the standard bearer of the libertarian movement in this country just because he isn't officially backing their candidate? I believe in the Party and the movement, and I think these sorts of blustering antics are going to do more to harm us than anything any opponent could offer. Unless the Libertarian Party moves away from these disgusting attacks on Ron Paul and the stubborn "with-us-or-against-us" mentality that I only thought Obama fanatics and Republican neocons has mastered, I'm going to leave the Party. Where I'll go, I don't know... but as they say... anywhere is better than here.

I'm from Virginia and I respect Bill Redpath a great deal, I'd be really interested to hear his thoughts on all of this. He doesn't seem to be the bitter egomaniac that have hijacked our Party from us.

[rockandrollsouls]

Let's get this straight

Barr Lied to Ron Paul about attending the press conference

Barr is trying to divide this movement, he who has shown his true colors in his recent actions are words.

Barr doesn't have any contact with Ron....the campaigns manage everything. :rolleyes:

[rockandrollsouls]

Umm, ok.

I have no idea if Barr has been given the cold shoulder by Paul's people.

Both campaigns are/were amateurishly run.

Paul is definately a very good man, but I now have severe doubts about Barr's goodness.

I have no love for Benton, haven't seen him being praised by anybody, and think it's all his fault for calling yesterday's announcement "major" in the first place. He seems to be best at creating clusterfucks.

Thank you. Rationality and history seems to suggest it was a miscommunication between campaigns and interest rather than an issue between Bob and Ron, which some people are inferring and is certainly not the case.

[xtravar]

1. I'm voting for the party, not the man, and the party that represents me is the LP. Since no third party candidate will win, the candidates themselves don't personally matter.
2. What a load of drama. For supposedly being tough, independent-thinking libertarians, some of you are quite sensitive and reactionary.

[liberalnurse]

We were the ones speculating on what the "big announcement" was going to be not the CFL. We were just daydreaming, no more, no less. Anyone who thinks they were rumors is grasping at the proverbial staw.

[FindLiberty]

IMO, "we" have been infiltrated by a few people (in/from all camps) interested in sabotaging the liberty effort, possibly including BB himself.

I do not trust him at all, but so what? He's not going to be elected POTUS.

This controversy not going to stop me from voting for him. There's a good chance that the LP can take enough vote % to gain EZ ballot access in 2010*.

THEREFORE, I will still need to 'hold my nose and vote for Barr'.
I'll put TWO clothes clips on my nose, just in case the first one falls off.

*Now would be a good time to start educating LP candidates and membership so that careful nominations (looking for principle) so that a cautious LP convention election process can take place in 2010 and 2012.

[liberalnurse]

You lost my vote, Bob. You could have easily salvaged it by admitting you were wrong to shun Dr. Paul and apologizing to your supporters.

You are STILL attacking him. Saying the press conference was about “one man.” It’s insulting to those of us that admire Dr. Paul a great deal. The issue here seems to be that you percieve that the conference was all about Ron Paul…. so you being all about Bob Barr (and not about the historic moment that this could have been, a grand coalition of third parties), you decided to boycott instead of attending.

Even if you were right about the event, what harm could have come to you for going? Do you really think Ron Paul supporters who would have considered voting for you would EVER vote for McKinney? Until yesterday, I thought I would never consider voting for Nader. But your antics in the past 24 hours have solidified another vote for Nader in my state.

Face the facts, you really blew it with this one, and no amount of spin is going to convince anyone who has respected and supported Ron Paul over the years that he has, overnight, turned into the egomaniac that people have claimed you embody (and perhaps, it seems, rightfully so). This election is about LIBERTY. It’s about the things Americans have in common that the two major parties ignore. This election is about returning our country to the people and giving us back our essential liberties. This election is NOT about Bob Barr. If you can realize that and apologize, I’ll reconsider giving you my vote. If you continue in these childish antics, me and a lot of my fellow libertarians (and Libertarians) are going to take their support elsewhere.

Also, it seems that a great number of the posts on the Bob Barr for President official blog are extremely pro-Barr and anti-Paul. A sharp turn from the posts yesterday. Yesterday they stopped people from posting, and today it seems they might be deleting posts that they don’t agree with. I hope that’s not true, because censorship by a Libertarian candidate would be just about the worst thing (s)he could possibly do.

Is the Libertarian Party really this stupid? Are they so completely stubborn and out of touch that they're willing to turn their backs on the standard bearer of the libertarian movement in this country just because he isn't officially backing their candidate? I believe in the Party and the movement, and I think these sorts of blustering antics are going to do more to harm us than anything any opponent could offer. Unless the Libertarian Party moves away from these disgusting attacks on Ron Paul and the stubborn "with-us-or-against-us" mentality that I only thought Obama fanatics and Republican neocons has mastered, I'm going to leave the Party. Where I'll go, I don't know... but as they say... anywhere is better than here.

I'm from Virginia and I respect Bill Redpath a great deal, I'd be really interested to hear his thoughts on all of this. He doesn't seem to be the bitter egomaniac that have hijacked our Party from us.

Kudos..Well said..

[speciallyblend]

rips the guitar , cult of personality and starts bopping around, this is almost comical if it were not real!!!! bob barr basically attacking the mother teresa of the republican party....and it's followers, who are the exact same folks that were supporting barr, well not anymore!

[moostraks]

I think many of you are part of this "Cult of Personality" and are in denial. What he's stating here is, Ron Paul is your "ONLY" guy. That you'll only vote for him, even though Ron Paul said it was about the movement, not him. That's all the statement was about. Don't take it personally unless the shoe fits. If you truly feel that Ron is your only guy, then say so, and accept that people will criticize you.


FF

Uhhh...bull shoosh. Many of us here are going in different directions because our top choice ain't gonna be there. What was happening was a banter of McCain or Obama because third parties don't matter, the media said so. Gosh...clue in. The game is rigged. All you had to do was be a delegate to see it up close and personnal. It ain't gonna change until we start from the ground up and change those who are making the rules.

Bob Barr is an elitest jerk. He has always had a my way or the highway attitude. He will tell us which religion to support, who can marry, and when and what drugs we can use medical or otherwise. Just because the libertarians got snowed does not mean he is now a liberty seeker. What life altering experience made Bobby Barr change his opinion on all these issues along with the patriot act and the war in Iraq??? How much are we supposed to believe a person changes in this short a period?????

Now unless we are supporting the libertarian aka BOB BARR party we aren't freedom lovers but socialists or theocrats?? He is the snob who could not demean himself to acknowledge other views exist except those that he holds(ala I won't be seen on the stage with THEM.) As if they have cooties or something. So we are supposed to trust that he will be for giving our freedoms back? Umm maybe he should start by understanding we aren't following Paul because of his personality but because he embraces RESPECT for others and his policys allows room for disent. Hard to do when you are too good to share the stage with others.

[rockandrollsouls]

1. I'm voting for the party, not the man, and the party that represents me is the LP. Since no third party candidate will win, the candidates themselves don't personally matter.
2. What a load of drama. For supposedly being tough, independent-thinking libertarians, some of you are quite sensitive and reactionary.

amen man.

[gls]

We were the ones speculating on what the "big announcement" was going to be not the CFL. We were just daydreaming, no more, no less. Anyone who thinks they were rumors is grasping at the proverbial staw.

Apparently those "rumors" were a couple of comments left on some Reason blog post, which is a hangout for Ron Paul hating, "inside-the-beltway" (sellout) cosmotarians.

[freelance]

There was a lot of hurtful insulting remarks on hear that were childish attacking Barr. To the inmature people who post stupid shit think before you post something. You can divide this movment as well. I don't agree with Barr on his decision yesterday but I didn't get rude over it.

Maybe you better reread the above. Might wanna run the ole spell check while you're at it.

[tonesforjonesbones]

Straussian Trotskyites have hijacked Ron Paul's movement. I believe they did it a long time ago. Pity. tones

[Korey Kaczynski]

I think many of you are part of this "Cult of Personality" and are in denial. What he's stating here is, Ron Paul is your "ONLY" guy. That you'll only vote for him, even though Ron Paul said it was about the movement, not him. That's all the statement was about. Don't take it personally unless the shoe fits. If you truly feel that Ron is your only guy, then say so, and accept that people will criticize you.


FF

Because he's the only one who is honestly worth voting for.

Barr is a neocon shill, and the libertarian party is a joke now.

The green party and Nader are too left leaning economically for me to seriously consider.

The Constitution Party is too theocratic to honestly adhere to States' Rights.

So, who else then?

[tropicangela]

1. I'm voting for the party, not the man, and the party that represents me is the LP.

Wouldn't that be like Ron Paul voting for McCain just because he's a Republican?

[kombayn]

Because he's the only one who is honestly worth voting for.

Barr is a neocon shill, and the libertarian party is a joke now.

The green party and Nader are too left leaning economically for me to seriously consider.

The Constitution Party is too theocratic to honestly adhere to States' Rights.

So, who else then?

If you live in Montana or Louisiana you can vote Ron Paul. :)

[xtravar]

Wouldn't that be like Ron Paul voting for McCain just because he's a Republican?

Not at all, because McCain has a chance of winning and easy ballot access due to their successful numbers in the past.

[musicmax]

Barr is a neocon shill, and the libertarian party is a joke now.

Barr was never a liberal, therefore he is not a "neocon." "Neo" means "new," and genuine neoconservatives are pro-war liberals like Feith, Podhoretz, Kristol, Kirkpatrick, etc., who were Democrats (most of the aforementioned worked for either LBJ or Scoop Jackson) and became Republicans when the Dems nominated McGovern.

"Neocon" has become as meaningless an epithet as "liberal" or "cut and run." We, who are supposed to be more politically literate, should choose the correct words lest we be misinterpreted (i.e. if you can differentiate between "isolationist" and "non-interventionist" you should be able to properly define "neoconservative" as well.)

[tonesforjonesbones]

I have to give ya'll a clue. If Ron Paul wants to change the GOP...the only way to do it is to play their game until they trust ya...get more people to do the same...and when you have the power..>THEN you make your move. Rebelling within the party gets you nowhere..as you all have seen. The Straussian Trotskyites who hijacked the GOP were the loudest cheerleaders...gained respect and were appointed into high positions. When they had enough of them in there....they effecitvely shifted the party to their agenda. TOnes

[tonesforjonesbones]

Will you win in poker if you show your hand? tones

[acptulsa]

I have to give ya'll a clue. If Ron Paul wants to change the GOP...the only way to do it is to play their game until they trust ya...get more people to do the same...and when you have the power..>THEN you make your move. Rebelling within the party gets you nowhere..as you all have seen. The Straussian Trotskyites who hijacked the GOP were the loudest cheerleaders...gained respect and were appointed into high positions. When they had enough of them in there....they effecitvely shifted the party to their agenda. TOnes

Tones, is there actually a point in here somewhere?

[acptulsa]

Wouldn't that be like Ron Paul voting for McCain just because he's a Republican?

Well, of course there's more to it than that. Dr. Paul advocated protest voting just yesterday, remember?

[dawnbt]

wouldn't that be like ron paul voting for mccain just because he's a republican?

+1000

[Andrew-Austin]

I have to give ya'll a clue. If Ron Paul wants to change the GOP...the only way to do it is to play their game until they trust ya...get more people to do the same...and when you have the power..>THEN you make your move.

Must this concept really be debunked yet again? andrew..

[CapitalistRadical]

I have to give ya'll a clue. If Ron Paul wants to change the GOP...the only way to do it is to play their game until they trust ya...get more people to do the same...and when you have the power..>THEN you make your move. Rebelling within the party gets you nowhere..as you all have seen. The Straussian Trotskyites who hijacked the GOP were the loudest cheerleaders...gained respect and were appointed into high positions. When they had enough of them in there....they effecitvely shifted the party to their agenda. TOnes

I don't think they had to shift the GOP all that far.

The neoconservatives have one main agenda, which is Empire. There are many in Washington willing to sign up for defense appropriation and overseas adventure. Eisenhower warned us, as Major Butler did before him -- this is nothing new!

Compare the ease of selling power to the power-hungry against selling Paul's principled humility to the power-hungry. No comparison!

[tonesforjonesbones]

That is what the Straussian Trotskyites did isn't it? Sure it is....we have to reverse it. Please watch G. Edward Griffin's speech on Individualism vs. Collectivism. Thanks. Tones

[nc4rp]

after all, theres a reason Paul didnt endorse Bob "Neocon" Barr..

[MelissaCato]

Another one down, Another one down .. Another one BITES the DUST !! HEY we're gonna GIT YOU TWO ... :D:D:D:D

[tonesforjonesbones]

well actually..truth be told, it further breaks down the chance of any third party making any headway. This is an agenda folks, the Straussian Trotskyites are winning the game. Tones

[tonesforjonesbones]

Who, exactly, are you "getting"? Now no third party has any leverage whatsoever...that's really winning LOLLLL Tones. (Kids say the darndest things)

[Indy Vidual]

What a nightmare. This whole thing just sucks....

</thread>

[mitty]

eh. seeing all those still trying to defend barr after what he did. maybe barr ought to look at his own supporters before making such a statement.

[tonesforjonesbones]

I am not supporting Barr anymore. nope. I also left the LP. I'm going independent. I have decided that political parties are worthless...too easily infiltrated and corrupted. I have decided to "float". Tones

[tropicangela]

I am not supporting Barr anymore. nope. I also left the LP. I'm going independent. I have decided that political parties are worthless...too easily infiltrated and corrupted. I have decided to "float". Tones

Till next primary?

[Scotso]

eh. seeing all those still trying to defend barr after what he did. maybe barr ought to look at his own supporters before making such a statement.

lol!

Spot on.

[literatim]

The neocons tried to get Alan Keyes nominated in the Constitution Party. Kristol was Keyes' roommate in college and ran Alan Keyes senate run in 1988. The Constitution Party was smarter than the Libertarian Party.

[TurtleBurger]

If there was a Ron Paul Personality Cult I would definitely join. RP's personality is pretty awesome!

[BenMuldowney]

Barr was never a liberal, therefore he is not a "neocon." "Neo" means "new," and genuine neoconservatives are pro-war liberals like Feith, Podhoretz, Kristol, Kirkpatrick, etc., who were Democrats (most of the aforementioned worked for either LBJ or Scoop Jackson) and became Republicans when the Dems nominated McGovern.

"Neocon" has become as meaningless an epithet as "liberal" or "cut and run." We, who are supposed to be more politically literate, should choose the correct words lest we be misinterpreted (i.e. if you can differentiate between "isolationist" and "non-interventionist" you should be able to properly define "neoconservative" as well.)

neocon now has taken on a life of its own and is very fitting for bob barr.

[ARealConservative]

The neocons tried to get Alan Keyes nominated in the Constitution Party. Kristol was Keyes' roommate in college and ran Alan Keyes senate run in 1988. The Constitution Party was smarter than the Libertarian Party.

why assign human traits to non human entities?

A party is just a collective of individuals.

The Libertarian Party nominated Barr thanks in larger part to Ron Paul talking Bob Barr up. Same with Baldwin and the Constitution Party.

[ceakins]

:rolleyes: x 50, your the one crusading against a third party candidate, for nary a coherent reason, on an internet forum. You repeatedly use emotionally based rhetoric (talking points w/o any logical substance), and now your calling me a chimp.

Get a grip, go outside and get some fresh air.

When people don't know how to debate they resort to name calling.

[BuddyRey]

Wow...

Barr backs out of a Conference he already RSVP'ed for, just to hold his own like a stubborn Prima Donna, and RON PAUL is the conceited one?!?!?!

Nuts to you, Bo-Bo.

[alaric]

Because he's the only one who is honestly worth voting for.

Barr is a neocon shill, and the libertarian party is a joke now.

The green party and Nader are too left leaning economically for me to seriously consider.

The Constitution Party is too theocratic to honestly adhere to States' Rights.

So, who else then?

Huckabee? You've got to be kidding. Staying in Iraq to save face. jeesh:rolleyes:

[alaric]

If there was a Ron Paul Personality Cult I would definitely join. RP's personality is pretty awesome!

hey, i like that!

[amy31416]

The Libertarian Party nominated Barr thanks in larger part to Ron Paul talking Bob Barr up. Same with Baldwin and the Constitution Party.

I don't know if that's true or not (the first part), but I've certainly learned to take RP's endorsements with a grain of salt. He's just got terrible judgment in people.

[FrankRep]

http://www.forumammo.com/cpg/albums/userpics/10071/picard-no-facepalm.jpg

[Arklatex]

Barr, you've got some bad advice dude. You'd have been the biggest beneficiary of that conference, if you would have showed instead of pulling a publicity stunt.

duppy

I'm the, duppy CONQUEROR, CONQUEROR RON PAUL IS yes my friend

[Arklatex]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=o_aYI66WuY8

[Brassmouth]

More B.S.

I spent hours following this story yesterday and heard no such rumors. Zero.

Where is your evidence?

Watch the clip of Cavuto and RP from the 9th. The day before the conference. Pwned.

[RonpaulSupporter7777]

Barrs a stooge for missing ron pauls press conference. He could of jumped a few percentage points in the polls.

[revolutionary8]

Oh yeah, I left out one of the best parts at the top of his new press release:
In times of crisis, strength in leadership requires boldness of character, clear direction and firm resolve. As we witnessed after the attacks of September 11th, President George W. Bush showed incredible leadership as he stood atop a fire truck amidst the rubble of the twin towers to rally America.


What's this jackass thinking?? "Incredible leadership" is yelling about terrorists in a pile of rubble while you send the real heroes (rescue workers and cleaners) to die in the poison air and dust the next day? Sick!

Yes, he pulled a roundhouse on RP, but this is the most offensive, most telling, and most disturbing part of the press release.
he is a monster.
It seems the last clutches of the BB supporters here are trying to tell us that BB doesn't agree with any of this stuff his campaign blog spot publishes. I hope they will see the light some day.

[acptulsa]

My personal theory is that Barr is set for life. He'll never need to work again.

[revolutionary8]

Watch the clip of Cavuto and RP from the 9th. The day before the conference. Pwned.

Link and what are you trying to say?


My personal theory is that Barr is set for life. He'll never need to work again.
Yep acp, I'm sure he is Set FL. He is a diversion. That's it.

[westmich4paul]

I will start this off by saying that this whole thing that has transpired over the past week has had me well baffeled to say the least. First off this was no major announcement, and in my personal opinion after dealing with the campaign since last july is that Benton has got to go. He always seems to do more harm than good to this campaign.

I agree with what Ron's announcment was trying to do. Get the minor Parties to agree on a certain platform and let the public know that there are other choices out there that are available to them. I have been very leary of Bob Barr even though I have heard that he is friends with Ron and basically it was Ron's good word that got him the nod for the LP ticket. But due to Barr's past voting records I have been very hesitant to back him.

So after a couple of days of stewing what could this major announcement be, I mean they are even calling in the MSM for this I waited like a kid on x-mas eve. So when the announcement came and that Barr didn't show although previously commiting to doing so I was like what is up with that?

So now today after seeing the annnouncement by Barr's campaign Manager? I am, assumiong here because I am not really sure of Verneys role I am like what the sam hill happened.

First of all I did not see this announcement in any way major, nor did i see it really anything about Paul, so from both sides of the fence I saw some weird things. Next thing I hear is that Barr is scheduling a news conference about an hour or more after Paul's. I then hear there was some war of word going on from both sides of the campaign's camps, then I hear news of Barr's invitation to Paul to join him on his v.p ticket.

Ok, so by now I am thinking I just entered the Twighlight Zone and now I am even more confused. So if anyone could help enlighten me with just the facts and not personal opinions I would appreciate it.

1. Why if Barr had allready agreed to be at theis press conference would he no show? I heard Verneys explanation but it just did not even make any sense to me.


2. Why was this taughted as a major announcement? There reallly was not anything major about it.

3. Why if Bob and Ron are friends wouldn't they just release their own take on this and if it was misscommunication that just be told?

4. Why would Bob feel the need to replace his V.P. with Paul? My only ideas could be the money support and the rise in the polls for the debates?

5. Why if Paul is trying to change the GOP from within would he hold a major press announcement to let people know that they should support 3rd party candidates and include all of these candidates in person to do this?

6. Why if Paul says we will not be able to change the things that need to be changed with the two party system we have in place now would he turn down the offer ofa third party run with Barr? Or even bettter why didn't he decide on running on an independent ticket monthes ago when he could have gotten ballot access?

I mean so he loses his congressional seat in 30 years what major changes has he been able to make as a congressmen?

I love Ron Paul, I love Ron's message, I love Ron's stances on the way we should run our government, but I hate hi campaign staf to me they are inept at best, and 85% percent of the time I do not even think Ron if given the chance would even want trhe job as President or Vice President. Which inuriates me because I have worked my ass off for this campaign and have spent money I probably should have to help promote this message because even with ton's of cash the inept campaign staff couldn't help me out. I do not know but I went from apathetic to very inspired to becoming very apathetic all over again.

[tonesforjonesbones]

Good post. I agree with it. I figure the neo con s have invaded both camps...I bet Ron Paul doesn't know 85% of what those jokers are doing that are running his campaigns..I bet he didn't know those clowns were advertising that Bob Barr was dropping out. They flat out lied to get media attention and if Ron Paul doesn't nip this in the bud right now...it will be just like those newsletters that he failed to oversee. It will cause him great damage. Tones

[alaric]

[QUOTE=westmich4paul;1672880]I will start this off by saying that this whole thing that has transpired over the past week has had me well baffeled to say the least. First off this was no major announcement, and in my personal opinion after dealing with the campaign since last july is that Benton has got to go. He always seems to do more harm than good to this campaign.

I agree with what Ron's announcment was trying to do. Get the minor Parties to agree on a certain platform and let the public know that there are other choices out there that are available to them. I have been very leary of Bob Barr even though I have heard that he is friends with Ron and basically it was Ron's good word that got him the nod for the LP ticket. But due to Barr's past voting records I have been very hesitant to back him.

My feeling that Barr's betrayal is what downgraded the press announcement. I think it would have entailed a lot more than what transpired and that Barr messed up a lot more than just missing it. Possibly more of a fusion would have been or was set up to be with his participation. Maybe that's why Ron got so mad at him!

[BeFranklin]

I will start this off by saying that this whole thing that has transpired over the past week has had me well baffeled to say the least. First off this was no major announcement, and in my personal opinion after dealing with the campaign since last july is that Benton has got to go. He always seems to do more harm than good to this campaign.


Go with your feelings. It seems that no matter which character we go with, the effect is the same - to divide our movement to the four winds in different political parties, or to strangle it in a can't do party.

None of it leds to what the political establishment is really worried about - A take-over of the Republican party in a non-election year.

Hold onto your political will. Believe those feelings about what is getting in the way of it.