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bcreps85
09-07-2008, 01:56 PM
We all know that Palin said that Ron Paul is a cool guy on an MTV interview, and I keep reading about people suggesting that we should support the Republican party come election since they supposedly did this to please Ron Paul people and conservatives.

My question however is, does anybody else think that this is just an elaborate plan to try and trick us into supporting them during the election? All of the initial information on her seemed to make her sound like a true conservative(as if she were picked specifically to cater to us), but the more I find out, the less I like...she isn't Paulian in any way, shape, or form. Seems to me like we were supposed to think that she's some kind of closet Ron Paul lover and give in to the GOP.

freelance
09-07-2008, 02:23 PM
Well, that's really KEWL since Palin doesn't believe or stand for much of anything that RP does. LOOK at her record, the official record, before it vanishes down the rabbit hole.

bcreps85
09-07-2008, 02:27 PM
Well, that's really KEWL since Palin doesn't believe or stand for much of anything that RP does. LOOK at her record, the official record, before it vanishes down the rabbit hole.

That is exactly what I'm saying. Right after he picked her, everything I heard about her suggested that she was conservative, a RP supporter, etc, but the more I dig the more I find out the opposite is true. This is why I think it was intended as a way to trick us into supporting the party.

Oh well, write-ins won't be counted, so I'm likely voting for Barr. Then again with our rigged elections, those may not be counted either, but at least there is a chance.

speciallyblend
09-07-2008, 02:37 PM
FIRMLY, HELL NO, NOT GOING TO HAPPEN, mccain/gop already burnt their bridges, bastards should of thought about this crap before they violated their own gop by-laws and silenced us with unethical and illegal tactics, NEVER FORGET, HOLD THEM ACCOUNTABLE, I SURE AS HELL WILL!!!!!!!!!!

jbuttell
09-07-2008, 02:40 PM
Other than that MTV clip where she speaks favorably of Ron Paul, I see no reason for anyone to have gotten excited about her. Her convention speech basically said exactly who she is. She seems like a good person, just full of the wrong ideas. Too bad.

.jeremy

Theocrat
09-07-2008, 02:59 PM
We all know that Palin said that Ron Paul is a cool guy on an MTV interview, and I keep reading about people suggesting that we should support the Republican party come election since they supposedly did this to please Ron Paul people and conservatives.

My question however is, does anybody else think that this is just an elaborate plan to try and trick us into supporting them during the election? All of the initial information on her seemed to make her sound like a true conservative(as if she were picked specifically to cater to us), but the more I find out, the less I like...she isn't Paulian in any way, shape, or form. Seems to me like we were supposed to think that she's some kind of closet Ron Paul lover and give in to the GOP.

Yes, I agree with you that McCain's choice of Palin as his VP is just an age old tactic used by the GOP to gain support from discouraged conservatives and others outside the party who would otherwise not vote for McCain. This tactic is called "dishing the Whigs."

According to William Safire's Political Dictionary (http://books.google.com/books?hl=en&id=jK-0NPoMiYoC&dq=William+Safire+Political+Dictionary&printsec=frontcover&source=web&ots=AVe-iIwzYz&sig=z_NGwxwpzde9nTT5Mtt7XUCIMh4&sa=X&oi=book_result&resnum=7&ct=result) (p.186), "dish the Whigs" means,


To steal the opposition's clothes; to win by reversing long-held stands.

In nineteenth-century English slang, to dish was to defeat decisively, especially by trickery; the term probably came from the notion of cooking something and serving it well-done.

When England's Conservative party surprised itself and the world by passing the radical Reform Bill of 1867--thereby enfranchising two million working men, a goal of its Whig opposition for many years--the Prime Minister, Lord Derby, said delightedly, "Dont you see we have dished the Whigs?" With the aid of Benjamin Disraeli, who was to succeed him as head of the Tories, Derby had indeed won support that had been taken for granted by the opposition.

The British phrase was a favorite of Newsweek columnist Stewart Alsop's, and is still used by history buffs to describe cooptation: "Seldom in Western politics since Disraeli's Reform Bill of 1897," declared a New York Times editorial about Nixon summiteering on February 10, 1972, "--when Lord Derby boasted, 'We dished the Whigs'--has a national leader so completely turned his back on a lifetime of beliefs to adopt those of his political opponents."

The Derby reference was especially piquant, since his only other famous remark was: "When I first came into Parliament, Mr. Tierney, a great Whig authority, used always to say that the duty of an Opposition was very simple--it was to oppose everything, and propose nothing." That statement has been shortened to the duty of an Opposition is to oppose" and, with poetic injustice, is attributed to the politician who won by adopting the tenets of his opposition.

Thus, John McCain and the GOP have merely stolen the position of their opposition and used it as a method to try and defeat them in the upcoming election by nominating Sarah Palin as their VP candidate. This will ensure they gather more votes from both social conservatives in the GOP who like Palin's outspokenness and livelihood of her Christian beliefs as well as women voters from the Democratic side who are disappointed that Hilary was not nominated as the first female Presidential candidate.

LittleLightShining
09-07-2008, 03:03 PM
Yes, I agree with you that McCain's choice of Palin as his VP is just an age old tactic used by the GOP to gain support from discouraged conservatives and others outside the party who would otherwise not vote for McCain. This tactic is called "dishing the Whigs."

According to William Safire's Political Dictionary (http://books.google.com/books?hl=en&id=jK-0NPoMiYoC&dq=William+Safire+Political+Dictionary&printsec=frontcover&source=web&ots=AVe-iIwzYz&sig=z_NGwxwpzde9nTT5Mtt7XUCIMh4&sa=X&oi=book_result&resnum=7&ct=result) (p.186), "dish the Whigs" means,



Thus, John McCain and the GOP have merely stolen the position of their opposition and used it as a method to try and defeat them in the upcoming election by nominating Sarah Palin as their VP candidate. This will ensure they gather more votes from both social conservatives in the GOP who like Palin's outspokenness and livelihood of her Christian beliefs as well as women voters from the Democratic side who are disappointed that Hilary was not nominated as the first female Presidential candidate.Very interesting. I believe you're right on but I've never heard the term "dishing the whigs" before. Thanks.

RCA
09-07-2008, 03:24 PM
Yes, I agree with you that McCain's choice of Palin as his VP is just an age old tactic used by the GOP to gain support from discouraged conservatives and others outside the party who would otherwise not vote for McCain. This tactic is called "dishing the Whigs."

According to William Safire's Political Dictionary (http://books.google.com/books?hl=en&id=jK-0NPoMiYoC&dq=William+Safire+Political+Dictionary&printsec=frontcover&source=web&ots=AVe-iIwzYz&sig=z_NGwxwpzde9nTT5Mtt7XUCIMh4&sa=X&oi=book_result&resnum=7&ct=result) (p.186), "dish the Whigs" means,



Thus, John McCain and the GOP have merely stolen the position of their opposition and used it as a method to try and defeat them in the upcoming election by nominating Sarah Palin as their VP candidate. This will ensure they gather more votes from both social conservatives in the GOP who like Palin's outspokenness and livelihood of her Christian beliefs as well as women voters from the Democratic side who are disappointed that Hilary was not nominated as the first female Presidential candidate.

Thanks for the info, I added that book to the Running for Office section of Books for Liberty:

http://www.ronpaulforums.com/showthread.php?p=1364298#post1364298

Matt Collins
09-07-2008, 04:35 PM
My question however is, does anybody else think that this is just an elaborate plan to try and trick us into supporting them during the election? Of course it is... but anyone who votes for a ticket because of a Vice President is a moron.

slacker921
09-07-2008, 05:07 PM
She bowed down to AIPAC this past week.. enough said.

I think the dirty trick was picking somebody they KNEW was loaded down with scandals that the liberals would attack... the attacks came.. and it rallied the evangelical base of the GOP to hate the liberals more and vote for McCain even though they don't really agree with him.

Theocrat
09-07-2008, 08:41 PM
She bowed down to AIPAC this past week.. enough said.

I think the dirty trick was picking somebody they KNEW was loaded down with scandals that the liberals would attack... the attacks came.. and it rallied the evangelical base of the GOP to hate the liberals more and vote for McCain even though they don't really agree with him.

Are you saying that a Jewish organization was the primary reason Palin got chosen as McCain's VP nominee? If so, that sounds a little too conspiratorial, to me.

bcreps85
09-07-2008, 10:45 PM
Yes, I agree with you that McCain's choice of Palin as his VP is just an age old tactic used by the GOP to gain support from discouraged conservatives and others outside the party who would otherwise not vote for McCain. This tactic is called "dishing the Whigs."

According to William Safire's Political Dictionary (http://books.google.com/books?hl=en&id=jK-0NPoMiYoC&dq=William+Safire+Political+Dictionary&printsec=frontcover&source=web&ots=AVe-iIwzYz&sig=z_NGwxwpzde9nTT5Mtt7XUCIMh4&sa=X&oi=book_result&resnum=7&ct=result) (p.186), "dish the Whigs" means,



Thus, John McCain and the GOP have merely stolen the position of their opposition and used it as a method to try and defeat them in the upcoming election by nominating Sarah Palin as their VP candidate. This will ensure they gather more votes from both social conservatives in the GOP who like Palin's outspokenness and livelihood of her Christian beliefs as well as women voters from the Democratic side who are disappointed that Hilary was not nominated as the first female Presidential candidate.

That sounds about right, though I never heard the term before. Thank you for that bit of knowledge. Slacker921 also has a very plausible suggestion.

Matt's comment is true, but kinda silly...if this country wasn't full of morons it wouldn't be so hard to get someone like Ron Paul elected now would it?

slacker921
09-07-2008, 11:07 PM
Are you saying that a Jewish organization was the primary reason Palin got chosen as McCain's VP nominee? If so, that sounds a little too conspiratorial, to me.

No.. I don't think that's why she was chosen, but now that she's the nominee she was certainly led to the place where she needed to get the blessings of some powerful folks. To say that AIPAC isn't powerful is just plain silly. Obama and McCain have both gone before AIPAC and pledged their "lifelong support" as did she.