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View Full Version : CFL Leadership Summit American Flag - protest, or error?




Matt Collins
09-03-2008, 02:54 AM
I was told by a member of my delegation from TN that the American Flag during the CFL Leadership Summit had a gold ring around the edges.


Was this intentional, or was it an oversight?



Even though I was in the room I personally did not happen to notice this.

mCsenget
09-03-2008, 11:04 AM
What is the significance of having gold rings around the edge?

Paul_Delegate
09-03-2008, 03:40 PM
The answer to this question is that the question itself is a load of jackassery.

You missed all of the content of the events and are worried about the "gold fringe".

Did you not get anything out of this weekend? Why did you go?

Don't bother with the smarmy answer of "someone else asked" and you're just trying to help them out.

No you're not. You want to know. If you didn't you would not have asked.

Let posterity know that you were not my countryman.

LibertyEagle
09-03-2008, 03:44 PM
The answer to this question is that the question itself is a load of jackassery.

You missed all of the content of the events and are worried about the "gold fringe".

Did you not get anything out of this weekend? Why did you go?

Don't bother with the smarmy answer of "someone else asked" and you're just trying to help them out.

No you're not. You want to know. If you didn't you would not have asked.

Let posterity know that you were not my countryman.

/mod hat off

I think I love you. ;)

Welcome to the forums. PLEASE come back more often.

CasualApathy
09-03-2008, 03:46 PM
The answer to this question is that the question itself is a load of jackassery.

You missed all of the content of the events and are worried about the "gold fringe".

Did you not get anything out of this weekend? Why did you go?

Don't bother with the smarmy answer of "someone else asked" and you're just trying to help them out.

No you're not. You want to know. If you didn't you would not have asked.

Let posterity know that you were not my countryman.

Take it easy. New members rarely destinguish themselves by hurling insults.

CasualApathy
09-03-2008, 03:47 PM
/mod hat off

I think I love you. ;)

Welcome to the forums. PLEASE come back more often.

Wow... way to promote a sober tone on these forums.

LibertyEagle
09-03-2008, 03:51 PM
Wow... way to promote a sober tone on these forums.

/mod hat off

Who is trying to "promote a sober tone"? I could care less about a sober tone. All I care about is getting my country back and to be honest with ya, I think there's a whole lot of people around here who are doing everything they can to destroy this movement.

As far as the mods getting more involved in the discussion goes, you can thank Sally08 for that. She gave us the suggestion just this morning how to do that. :)

Grimnir Wotansvolk
09-03-2008, 03:52 PM
Oversight. Is it really a big deal, though? Not many people know about it, and there are a truckload of other things to worry about.

CasualApathy
09-03-2008, 03:58 PM
/mod hat off

Who is trying to "promote a sober tone"? I could care less about a sober tone. All I care about is getting my country back and to be honest with ya, I think there's a whole lot of people around here who are doing everything they can to destroy this movement.

As far as the mods getting more involved in the discussion goes, you can thank Sally08 for that. She gave us the suggestion just this morning how to do that. :)

Well, it seem I have to quote the forum guidelines for you:


Insulting or personally attacking other users is not allowed by any member. There is very little tolerance for violations, particular for new members. Reason: Insults lead to relational which often result in disruption, which dilute the resources of members and the intent of the forum.

The headline of this new member sais "idiot" and he ends his post with "Let posterity know that you were not my countryman." and then there is the jackass-reference.

But hey, if that is allowed i guess I'm free to say that you look like an idiot without the mod-hat on. How about that?

LibertyEagle
09-03-2008, 03:59 PM
Oh, CasualApathy, perhaps you hadn't heard. We're not enforcing the forum guidelines anymore. :)

LibertyEagle
09-03-2008, 04:00 PM
But hey, if that is allowed i guess I'm free to say that you look like an idiot without the mod-hat on. How about that?

Sure, go right ahead. Anything goes...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-c2OM7HEfrs

wheeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee...... :)

CasualApathy
09-03-2008, 04:02 PM
Oh, CasualApathy, perhaps you hadn't heard. We're not enforcing the forum guidelines anymore. :)

Oh, how nice. I'm sure the trolls will love it.

Guess you got your wish then?

freelance
09-03-2008, 04:03 PM
Are we sure that the admiralty law story about the gold fringe story isn't hocus pocus? I have also seen it written that it's merely optional and decorative. I have no idea what the real story is, but either way, I would bet that there was no significance attached to it either way by the person in charge of rounding up a flag for the event.

Paul_Delegate
09-03-2008, 04:18 PM
Well, it seem I have to quote the forum guidelines for you:



The headline of this new member sais "idiot" and he ends his post with "Let posterity know that you were not my countryman." and then there is the jackass-reference.

But hey, if that is allowed i guess I'm free to say that you look like an idiot without the mod-hat on. How about that?


You are right. "Idiot" in the subject line was inappropriate. I sincerely apologize.

The part about posterity forgetting that the sunshine patriot who calls himself Matt Collins was my countryman still holds though.

But again, guys (and gals), remind yourself here what you are wasting your time posting about.

Matt wanted to know if the gold fringe on the flag at whereever was an intentional signal that Ron Paul was part of the "admirlty" or whatever.

LOL

It is true that he is either attempting to cause division or is will not be a leader in the CFL because he sees spending time on this subject more important than talking to his neighbors and trying to win them over.

amy31416
09-03-2008, 04:25 PM
It is true that he is either attempting to cause division or is will not be a leader in the CFL because he sees spending time on this subject more important than talking to his neighbors and trying to win them over.

It's not about any of that, it's about how much attention can be garnered, in my opinion. Egos have big appetites.

CasualApathy
09-03-2008, 04:25 PM
You are right. "Idiot" in the subject line was inappropriate. I sincerely apologize.

The part about posterity forgetting that the sunshine patriot who calls himself Matt Collins was my countryman still holds though.

But again, guys (and gals), remind yourself here what you are wasting your time posting about.

Matt wanted to know if the gold fringe on the flag at whereever was an intentional signal that Ron Paul was part of the "admirlty" or whatever.

LOL

It is true that he is either attempting to cause division or is will not be a leader in the CFL because he sees spending time on this subject more important than talking to his neighbors and trying to win them over.

Good post, however I would suggest that there is plenty of space on these forums and noone forces you to "waste time" on threads you think lack merit. I get what you are saying and I tend to agree, but I wouldn't attack someone for asking a sincere question. I assume that the person just wondered about the flag, not that it was some devious scheme to devide us. There is plenty of that going on which is much more obvious.

Welcome to the forums :)

MsDoodahs
09-03-2008, 04:25 PM
Welcome to the forums!

:)

tangent4ronpaul
09-03-2008, 05:41 PM
More than you really wanted to know about gold fringe on American flags...

http://www.apfn.org/apfn/flag.htm

-n

angelatc
09-03-2008, 06:10 PM
More than you really wanted to know about gold fringe on American flags...

http://www.apfn.org/apfn/flag.htm

-n

I love conspiracy theorists - they're hilarious...

This sounds like the real story to me. http://www.usa-flag-site.org/forum/why-does-american-flag-have-gold-15-2.html


Well . . . believe it or not, there is actually a tiny shred of history behind this "gold fringe" business. Back in the 1920s, there was a sort of informal feud between the US Army and the US Navy about whether it was proper to have gold fringes on US flags. It arose because the Army's national colors normally did have fringes, whereas Navy ensigns did not. A Navy Admiral wrote an article in 1922 that accused the Army wanting a "yellow streak" on the flag. (It was a rather nasty double-entendre, because "yellow streak" is an old slang phrase for cowardice). Ultimately, the President (Harding) requested a legal opinion from the Attorney General on the subject. The opinion was issued in May 1925. The key sentence in the opinon said that " . . . a fringe is not considered to be part of the flag, and it is without heraldic significance. In the common use of the word it is a fringe and not a border." In other words, it's just decoration.

In the late 1980s, a group of libertarian crazies discovered the old 1925 Attorney General's opinion, and twisted it into a wacky legal doctrine saying that court decisions are invalid if there is a fringed flag in the courtroom. They tried to use this "doctrine" to prove that they didn't have to have drivers licenses, pay taxes, etc. The Anti-Defamation League has a on its web site a list of legal citations of court cases where people tried to use the "fringe defense."

As you might guess, judges have not been very sympathetic. The judge in a 1997 case in Missouri said, "Jurisdiction is matter of law, statute and constitution, not a child's game wherein one's power is magnified or diminished by the display of some magic talisman." Even the libertarian crazies seem to have figured out that the "fringe defense" is a bunch of goofy nonsense. However, it still seems to turn up on the internet from time to time.

rajibo
09-03-2008, 06:15 PM
Umm, the flag probably came with the room.:rolleyes:

afmatt
09-03-2008, 06:32 PM
Matt you seem like a fairly intelligent guy. Why would you care about something that A. You don't know for certain B. Nobody but complete conspiracy nutjobs cares about? I mean seriously man does this MATTER? I mean will having one kind of flag or the other in a room where we got some great training have a difference? I didn't even notice a flag in the room - I was paying attention to Mike.

I'd like to say I'm getting kinda tired of the majority of the threads you starting having negative slants to them. Whining about dues? Gold Thread or no gold thread? Cmon dude...

constituent
09-03-2008, 06:56 PM
It's not about any of that, it's about how much attention can be garnered, in my opinion. Egos have big appetites.

Sounds like politics to me. Besides, w/out egos we'd have no politicians to save the world for us.

Matt Collins
09-03-2008, 11:55 PM
What is the significance of having gold rings around the edge?I haven't researched it for myself but from what I was told it has to do with admiralty law and the fact that there is absolute rule of law from whomever has that flag. In other words, on a ship captain's word is law. And in a court room if there is a gold ring around the flag, the judge's word is law.

But again, I don't know much about this which is why I am posting this here.

Matt Collins
09-04-2008, 12:00 AM
The answer to this question is that the question itself is a load of jackassery.Wow... another personal attack on me. Out of your 23 posts from a member who registered 2 days ago, how many of them attack me? So do you care to tell me your real name yet?



You missed all of the content of the events and are worried about the "gold fringe".I'm not worried about it, but I am curious. What's wrong with seeking information. And why are you personally attacking me?


Did you not get anything out of this weekend? Why did you go?I got a lot out of this weekend.


Don't bother with the smarmy answer of "someone else asked" and you're just trying to help them out.Nope not at all. I am just curious.



Let posterity know that you were not my countryman.It's ok, if you are who I think you are, I don't want to be associated with you either. So what's your real name?

Matt Collins
09-04-2008, 12:02 AM
Is it really a big deal, though? No I don't think it's a big deal at all.

I am just curious:
1- is there any relevance to the gold around the flag?
2- if there is, was this a decision by CFL, or just a coincidence?

It really doesn't matter, but I am curious.

Matt Collins
09-04-2008, 12:03 AM
Are we sure that the admiralty law story about the gold fringe story isn't hocus pocus? I don't know. That's why I posted this thread to get more information.



I would bet that there was no significance attached to it either way by the person in charge of rounding up a flag for the event.That's my guess too, but I am by nature a curious person.

Matt Collins
09-04-2008, 12:06 AM
I sincerely apologize.Somehow I doubt that given your other 15+ personal attacks against me in various other posts recently.


But again, guys (and gals), remind yourself here what you are wasting your time posting about. Since when are you to judge who is wasting time and who isn't? Did I ever claim that this issue ever had any relevance to anything what so ever?



Matt wanted to know if the gold fringe on the flag at whereever was an intentional signal that Ron Paul was part of the "admirlty" or whatever.No, not at all. I just wanted to know if it was placed there intentionally, and if so, what does it mean.


It is true that he is either attempting to cause division or is will not be a leader in the CFL Neither.


because he sees spending time on this subject more important than talking to his neighbors and trying to win them over.
What time? I have spent a total of 3 minutes on this thread (and yes I was counting). Last time I checked it's kind of hard to talk to the neighbors at 1am or while I'm at the airport. :rolleyes:


So why do you keep personally attacking me? You only registered 2 days ago and out of your 20 something posts most of them have been an attack on me. What is your real name?

Matt Collins
09-04-2008, 12:10 AM
Why would you care about something that A. You don't know for certain I don't care. But I am curious because someone posed this question to me on the way home. And since I don't know for certain I'm posting the question here.



B. Nobody but complete conspiracy nutjobs cares about?Again, I don't care about it either, I am just curious.


I mean seriously man does this MATTER? Of course it doesn't, I never said it did. But what is wrong with asking questions and seeking information?



I didn't even notice a flag in the roomI didn't either. This was mentioned to me on the way home.


I'd like to say I'm getting kinda tired of the majority of the threads you starting having negative slants to them.Then don't read. But if you actually DID read you would realize that not all of my threads are negative.



Whining about dues? Gold Thread or no gold thread? Cmon dude...Where did I whine about dues? In fact I think they are a good idea. Also, where did I whine about gold thread? Why are you attacking me for asking a simple question?

Paul_Delegate
09-04-2008, 12:16 AM
I haven't researched it for myself but from what I was told it has to do with admiralty law and the fact that there is absolute rule of law from whomever has that flag. In other words, on a ship captain's word is law. And in a court room if there is a gold ring around the flag, the judge's word is law.

But again, I don't know much about this which is why I am posting this here.


You admit you post about things you don't know about.

You said that someone else was interested.

You made an implication in your original post that there was something sinister about it.

It was YOU who made the attack. It was YOU who intended to cause division.

Don't turn it around Matt.

You created this dumb topic. Why not just delete it?

Because your intention is to cause division and keep people online and divide them rather than encourage them and do any real work for the revolution yourself.

Matt Collins
09-04-2008, 12:17 AM
Umm, the flag probably came with the room.:rolleyes:That is my guess.

Matt Collins
09-04-2008, 12:20 AM
You admit you post about things you don't know about.So I am not allowed to ask a question? The point of this post was to learn more, not to make an opinion or statement about it.




You made an implication in your original post that there was something sinister about it.No I did not I simply asked a question. Please quote this so-called implication.


It was YOU who made the attack. It was YOU who intended to cause division.What attack? Who did I attack?


You created thistopic. Why not just delete it?Because I am curious about it and want to know what others think.




Because your intention is to cause division and keep people online and divide them rather than encourage them and do any real work for the revolution yourself.And where did I say that? Please quote me.


Why are you personally attacking me?
What is your real name?
Did you join 2 days ago and 20 posts ago just to attack me?

LibertyEagle
09-04-2008, 12:22 AM
I don't know who he is, but he's re-energized the heck outta me. :D

Sally08
09-04-2008, 12:25 AM
Why are you personally attacking me?
What is your real name?
Did you join 2 days ago and 20 posts ago just to attack me?

Matt, please check your PMs:D

muh_roads
09-04-2008, 12:33 AM
Arguing...
Internet...
Special olympics...
etc...

Matt Collins
09-04-2008, 12:47 AM
Arguing...
Internet...
Special olympics...
etc...HA HA HA!

Hey, I didn't start it, and I am not perpetuating it. I am just defending myself here from some unfounded personal attacks.

Paul_Delegate
09-04-2008, 01:13 AM
So I am not allowed to ask a question? The point of this post was to learn more, not to make an opinion or statement about it.



Lie.

You asked "was this intentional or an oversight" as if there were something nefarious, known or unknown about it.

Not attacking. Just telling the truth in a straightforward manner.

Matt Collins
09-04-2008, 08:41 AM
You asked "was this intentional or an oversight" as if there were something nefarious, known or unknown about it.Yes - was it intentional that the flag had gold around it, or was it not? I don't even for sure know what the gold fringes mean, that's why I posted the question here.

LibertyEagle
09-04-2008, 08:44 AM
Yes - was it intentional that the flag had gold around it, or was it not? I don't even for sure know what the gold fringes mean, that's why I posted the question here.

Don't we have more important issues to focus on, Matt, than whether some stupid gold fringe was on the American flag? :confused:

constituent
09-04-2008, 08:49 AM
Don't we have more important issues to focus on, Matt, than whether some stupid gold fringe was on the American flag? :confused:

i don't know... 15,583 posts makes me wonder.

angelatc
09-04-2008, 08:55 AM
Don't we have more important issues to focus on, Matt, than whether some stupid gold fringe was on the American flag? :confused:

Maybe we can focus on giving Matt some tools to use in his quest for knowledge. http://snurl.com/3mxut .

Matt Collins
09-04-2008, 08:59 AM
Don't we have more important issues to focus on, Matt, than whether some stupid gold fringe was on the American flag? :confused:Of course, but I am seeking knowledge here because I am curious. What is wrong with asking questions?

Paul_Delegate
09-04-2008, 09:13 AM
Of course, but I am seeking knowledge here because I am curious. What is wrong with asking questions?


For the fourth time, you asked whether the use of it was intentional, implying something nefarious because you are opposed to the CFL and want to cause division.

Matt Collins
09-04-2008, 09:38 AM
you asked whether the use of it was intentional, implying something nefarious I did not imply anything. I asked a question because I am curious and would like more information about the topic.



because you are opposed to the CFL and want to cause division.Hardly. I am looking to become a leader in the CFL and don't want to cause any division. In fact I have made personal sacrifices to NOT cause division.

So why are you trolling against me? Why did you join 2 days ago and most of your posts are personal attacks against me? Why won't you share you real name instead of hiding behind an anonymous account?

Paul_Delegate
09-04-2008, 09:41 AM
Hardly. I am looking to become a leader in the CFL and don't want to cause any division. In fact I have made personal sacrifices to NOT cause division.


Then why wouldn't you provide the forum or Sally 08 with SPECIFICS of what you learned at the Leadership Conference rather than just vague accusations against the CFL?

Stop talking about it. DO IT.

Matt Collins
09-04-2008, 09:54 AM
Then why wouldn't you provide the forum or Sally 08 with SPECIFICS of what you learned at the Leadership Conference rather than just vague accusations against the CFL?hBecause there were not that many specifics offered. I Have posted about what I saw and heard. The CFL is not ready yet to move forward because they don't have everything in place, decisions reached, or details settled. My guess is that they have been focusing all of their attention on the rally which would make sense. Hopefully by January we'll start to see some more substantive stuff come out.

LibertyEagle
09-04-2008, 10:15 AM
Because there were not that many specifics offered. I Have posted about what I saw and heard. The CFL is not ready yet to move forward because they don't have everything in place, decisions reached, or details settled. My guess is that they have been focusing all of their attention on the rally which would make sense. Hopefully by January we'll start to see some more substantive stuff come out.

Are you kidding me, Matt? How many hours of training did you just sit through? Are you telling us that you didn't learn a thing? Not one thing? :confused:

Matt Collins
09-04-2008, 10:21 AM
Are you kidding me, Matt? How many hours of training did you just sit through? Are you telling us that you didn't learn a thing? Not one thing? :confused:I didn't sit through any training. I sat through the leadership summit. From that I did a lot of networking and also learned about the outline of the CFL.

Ozwest
09-04-2008, 10:31 AM
As the world leader in land mine production, is their a gold fringe encompassing the American flag for every individual maimer?

Your tax dollars at work.

Ozwest
09-04-2008, 10:33 AM
The gift that keeps on giving...

Ozwest
09-04-2008, 10:46 AM
Whilst every civilized country has banned production of land mines due to ...

The obvious.

America is the world's largest supplier of land mines, and is in the company of other top notch nations ...

Burma , Cuba, India, Iran, Nepal, North Korea, Pakistan, Russian Federation, and Vietnam.

Nice to hold the moral high ground isn't it?

Ozwest
09-04-2008, 10:49 AM
Better a bridge to no-where, then funding land mines. :(

Matt Collins
09-07-2008, 12:03 PM
a load of jackassery.Oh the irony... well looks like I get the last word :)

constituent
09-09-2008, 08:46 AM
You are right. "Idiot" in the subject line was inappropriate. I sincerely apologize.

The part about posterity forgetting that the sunshine patriot who calls himself Matt Collins was my countryman still holds though.

But again, guys (and gals), remind yourself here what you are wasting your time posting about.

Matt wanted to know if the gold fringe on the flag at whereever was an intentional signal that Ron Paul was part of the "admirlty" or whatever.

LOL

It is true that he is either attempting to cause division or is will not be a leader in the CFL because he sees spending time on this subject more important than talking to his neighbors and trying to win them over.


You admit you post about things you don't know about.

You said that someone else was interested.

You made an implication in your original post that there was something sinister about it.

It was YOU who made the attack. It was YOU who intended to cause division.

Don't turn it around Matt.

You created this dumb topic. Why not just delete it?

Because your intention is to cause division and keep people online and divide them rather than encourage them and do any real work for the revolution yourself.


Oh the irony... well looks like I get the last word :)


Indeed, though it is no laughing matter. The whole episode was quite disheartening/unnerving. I will soon be posting a thread in hot topics that thoroughly analyzes the situation, and the implications (as already manifest) of Jeff Greenspan's (Paul_Delegate) behavior.

Matt, your input, and the input of others will be much appreciated.

Thanks.

"constituent" ;)

Wendi
09-09-2008, 10:32 AM
Umm, the flag probably came with the room. That was my guess as well.