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winston_blade
09-02-2008, 03:37 PM
I hope he doesn't go too far into 9/11 truth?

sean43
09-02-2008, 03:40 PM
Mmm from what I am seeing. 9/11 was an inside job chants, this isnt what was planned.

inibo
09-02-2008, 03:45 PM
I hope he doesn't go too far into 9/11 truth?

He did it just right. He asked a couple of valid questions and left it at that.

ClayTrainor
09-02-2008, 03:46 PM
Dammit, i just missed it.

Hopefully it wont take long for a youtube.

FrankRep
09-02-2008, 03:46 PM
He just asked some Questions.

Questions don't scare you, do they?

bkreigh
09-02-2008, 03:48 PM
"I need to see it in by action (progress towards the Revolution), in 2012 we will give them a race they will never forget." Ventura

thehighwaymanq
09-02-2008, 03:48 PM
He did it just right. He asked a couple of valid questions and left it at that.

Yup- everything he said is 100% fact. He did imply it was an inside job but he didnt take it to controlled demolition, etc...

It is a fact there should be a new investigation, even if it doesn't find out the "truther" truth- the family members deserve a independent investigation.

max
09-02-2008, 03:48 PM
I hope he doesn't go too far into 9/11 truth?

Why should Ventura shy away from telling the truth about that awful day that has defined the course of the 21st century????

inibo
09-02-2008, 03:53 PM
Why should Ventura shy away from telling the truth about that awful day that has defined the course of the 21st century????

Because someone who just comes right and says "inside job," right or wrong is committing political suicide. You don't have to like it, it's the way it is.

LibertyEagle
09-02-2008, 03:55 PM
because someone who just come right and says "inside job," right or wrong is committing political suicide. You don't have to like it, it's the way it is.

qft

Maltheus
09-02-2008, 04:30 PM
No doubt, Ventura's quotes will be associated with the CFL by the MSM from this point on. I happen to think it was an inside job, but there's no point in bringing it up at this venue. I like Ventura, I just wish he hadn't done that here.

FrankRep
09-02-2008, 04:32 PM
No doubt, Ventura's quotes will be associated with the CFL by the MSM from this point on. I happen to think it was an inside job, but there's no point in bringing it up at this venue. I like Ventura, I just wish he hadn't done that here.

Just questions...

Galileo Galilei
09-02-2008, 04:35 PM
Because someone who just comes right and says "inside job," right or wrong is committing political suicide. You don't have to like it, it's the way it is.

polling data shows that 43% of the country thinks 9/11 was a conspiracy. 84% question the 9/11 Ommission Report. Ron Paul has never polled that high. He could, if he embraced 9/11 Truth. To not embrace 9/11 Truth is political suicide.

freelance
09-02-2008, 05:00 PM
It seems that 9/11 truth is to the liberty movement what abortion is to the conservatives--A LITMUS TEST (which way, I'm not quite sure), but if we are to have any kind of litmus tests, then I'm quite clear that this is NOT freedom and liberty.

winston_blade
09-02-2008, 07:11 PM
polling data shows that 43% of the country thinks 9/11 was a conspiracy. 84% question the 9/11 Ommission Report. Ron Paul has never polled that high. He could, if he embraced 9/11 Truth. To not embrace 9/11 Truth is political suicide.

Show me a legit poll.

mport1
09-02-2008, 07:13 PM
I hope he doesn't go too far into 9/11 truth?

I hope the same for everyone.

jmdrake
09-02-2008, 07:32 PM
Show me a legit poll.

Here is a legit scientific poll showing that 84% of Americans question the official story.

http://www.angus-reid.com/polls/view/13469

Here is the Zogby poll that shows 42% thinking 9/11 was an inside job.

http://www.911truth.org/images/ZogbyPoll2007.pdf

But hey, in the spirit of Ron Paul's politics let's be "conservative". The Scripps Howard poll shows that 33 percent of Americans think either the government was involved in 9/11, or knew that 9/11 was going to happen but purposefully didn't act because it wanted an excuse to go to war.

http://www.scrippsnews.com/911poll

Had all of those people gone for Ron Paul he would have won the Republican nomination hands down. Of course that's a mighty big "if". But it's still too big of a number to ignore.

Here's the bottom line. Ron Paul didn't embrace 9/11 and he didn't win. Bob Barr hasn't embraced 9/11 and he probably won't win either. The idea of someone running for public office who openly questions 9/11 hasn't been sufficiently tested. The claims that this is "political suicide" is nothing but untested conventional wisdom.

Regards,

John M. Drake

Todd
09-02-2008, 07:32 PM
Because someone who just comes right and says "inside job," right or wrong is committing political suicide. You don't have to like it, it's the way it is.

Bingo. You win the prize.

If you want to be a truther...fine....but keep it under wraps. What's the old saying you catch more flies with honey than nutty peanut butter?

jmdrake
09-02-2008, 07:40 PM
Bingo. You win the prize.

If you want to be a truther...fine....but keep it under wraps. What's the old saying you catch more flies with honey than nutty peanut butter?

I didn't know there was a prize for groupthink. :rolleyes: I'm just glad that Ron Paul invited Aimme Allen and Jesse Ventura to speak even though they didn't keep their honest beliefs "under wraps". This rally is making it clear that the "cat herding" days of this movement are over.

Regards,

John M. Drake

winston_blade
09-02-2008, 07:41 PM
Here is a legit scientific poll showing that 84% of Americans question the official story.

http://www.angus-reid.com/polls/view/13469

Here is the Zogby poll that shows 42% thinking 9/11 was an inside job.

http://www.911truth.org/images/ZogbyPoll2007.pdf

But hey, in the spirit of Ron Paul's politics let's be "conservative". The Scripps Howard poll shows that 33 percent of Americans think either the government was involved in 9/11, or knew that 9/11 was going to happen but purposefully didn't act because it wanted an excuse to go to war.

http://www.scrippsnews.com/911poll

Had all of those people gone for Ron Paul he would have won the Republican nomination hands down. Of course that's a mighty big "if". But it's still too big of a number to ignore.

Here's the bottom line. Ron Paul didn't embrace 9/11 and he didn't win. Bob Barr hasn't embraced 9/11 and he probably won't win either. The idea of someone running for public office who openly questions 9/11 hasn't been sufficiently tested. The claims that this is "political suicide" is nothing but untested conventional wisdom.

Regards,

John M. Drake

That is interesting. It makes me wonder why the MSM never talks about it.

constituent
09-02-2008, 07:43 PM
That is interesting. It makes me wonder why the MSM never talks about it.

fail.

winston_blade
09-02-2008, 07:47 PM
fail.

For what?

constituent
09-02-2008, 07:49 PM
For what?

where would you like me to start?

Carole
09-02-2008, 07:51 PM
He merely asked why we have not brought charges against OBL as we did after the first bomb event. The FBI says we have not enough evidence to bring charges!!!!
:)

winston_blade
09-02-2008, 07:54 PM
where would you like me to start?

I'm not a truther, man. In fact, my response of "That's interesting.....MSM sucks" was mainly so I didn't become involved in some sort of flame war with a truther. It's too late at night for something like that.

ClayTrainor
09-02-2008, 07:56 PM
He merely asked why we have not brought charges against OBL as we did after the first bomb event. The FBI says we have not enough evidence to bring charges!!!!
:)

One of the many valid questions, we need answers to.

And how about the funding, does no one want to investigate the ISI funding?

Ventura will have massive support if he runs, i dont doubt it. He knows how to play the media but, they may make serious efforts against him.

jmdrake
09-02-2008, 08:03 PM
That is interesting. It makes me wonder why the MSM never talks about it.

Actually there was quite a bit of buzz in the MSM about the Scripps Howard poll when it first came out. Anyway, why isn't the MSM covering the Rally for the Republic? In terms of beating expectations it's kicking the RNC's butt.

Flash
09-02-2008, 08:06 PM
I don't like Ventura that much, he looks too wild. I really was impressed by that Gary Johnson though!

V4Vendetta
09-02-2008, 08:06 PM
9/11 was done by elements of the New World Order at very high ranking positions.

Google "Fabled Enemies"

jmdrake
09-02-2008, 08:07 PM
He merely asked why we have not brought charges against OBL as we did after the first bomb event. The FBI says we have not enough evidence to bring charges!!!!
:)

Thanks for posting that. I missed Ventura's speech. If that's all he said I wonder why the concern?

1) He's gone MUCH farther than that in other public appearances.
2) This is an undeniable statement of fact.
3) This is a question that even a "non truther" could raise. (You might raise it to point out the fact that the Bush administration hasn't seriously gone after OBL while launching a war against a country that had nothing to do with 9/11.)

Leroy_Jenkems
09-02-2008, 08:10 PM
I don't like Ventura that much, he looks too wild. I really was impressed by that Gary Johnson though!

You're going to have to come up with a better reason that, otherwise the statement you just made belongs more in Mike Huckabee's camp than Ron Paul's.

The dude was a Navy SEAL, and he shoots straight. I like him more than dislike him, to say the least.

constituent
09-02-2008, 08:39 PM
I'm not a truther, man. In fact, my response of "That's interesting.....MSM sucks" was mainly so I didn't become involved in some sort of flame war with a truther.

thanks, you make my case well.

Misesian
09-02-2008, 08:39 PM
I guess you could say that I'm small-t truther who really does not see what can become of promoting this issue, so I'd rather stick to the C4L mission statement. I mean seriously, isn't it also truth that in 1913, the Secretary of State Philander Knox stamped the 16th amendment as RATIFIED when it was in fact NOT ratified? The Tax truth movement hasn't gotten us anywhere.

I thought the goal in truth was to see the light of liberty at the end of the tunnel. Truth is relative to the individual. Haven't we learned anything from the "How to Sell Liberty" YouTubes?

Heck even the Federal Reserve stuff would be considered conspiratorial by most and ignored, if it weren't for the basic economic principles that underlie what the Fed does of increasing the supply of paper money. We're able to discuss these economic concepts of monetary inflation without sounding "crazy", we're able to talk about free markets without sound "crazy", we're able to talk about the governmental leash of the Constitution without sounding "crazy", and if we know history and some basic facts we can of coures talk about noninterventionist foreign policy without sound "crazy".

It just goes back to the basic premise that we should not make our agenda, the agenda of others we're trying to win over, and keeping everything in perspective with the mission statement of the C4L, becaus that is a DAMN good Constitution for us to follow as members of this extremely patriotic organization.

acstichter
09-02-2008, 09:07 PM
Here is a legit scientific poll showing that 84% of Americans question the official story.

http://www.angus-reid.com/polls/view/13469

Here is the Zogby poll that shows 42% thinking 9/11 was an inside job.

http://www.911truth.org/images/ZogbyPoll2007.pdf

But hey, in the spirit of Ron Paul's politics let's be "conservative". The Scripps Howard poll shows that 33 percent of Americans think either the government was involved in 9/11, or knew that 9/11 was going to happen but purposefully didn't act because it wanted an excuse to go to war.

http://www.scrippsnews.com/911poll

Had all of those people gone for Ron Paul he would have won the Republican nomination hands down. Of course that's a mighty big "if". But it's still too big of a number to ignore.

Here's the bottom line. Ron Paul didn't embrace 9/11 and he didn't win. Bob Barr hasn't embraced 9/11 and he probably won't win either. The idea of someone running for public office who openly questions 9/11 hasn't been sufficiently tested. The claims that this is "political suicide" is nothing but untested conventional wisdom.

Regards,

John M. Drake

That Zogby poll shows that only 4.6% believe the govt carried out the 9/11 attacks. It also shows that 26.4% believe some people in gov't knew attacks would happen and did nothing to stop them. I might choose that option knowing that the FBI agent wrote warning memos about the ME men learning to fly and not land.

Nothing in that survey says 42% think 9/11 was an inside job. It shows only 4.6%.

acstichter
09-02-2008, 09:08 PM
fail.

:confused:

Anti Federalist
09-03-2008, 05:12 AM
Ventura said the two parties and their puppets that run the system are destroying this nation.

Ventura said the 2nd Amendment exists for the sole purpose of rising up against the bastards.

Ventura said the "official" story of 9/11 is, essentially, bullshit.

And I heard the collective gasps from the "summer soldiers" and "sunshine patriots".

And I stood up in front of the TV and cheered!!!

Pepsi
09-03-2008, 05:53 AM
It seems that 9/11 truth is to the liberty movement what abortion is to the conservatives--A LITMUS TEST (which way, I'm not quite sure), but if we are to have any kind of litmus tests, then I'm quite clear that this is NOT freedom and liberty.

What is needed is hard evidence that can stand up in court with out being struck down, that proves beyond a shadow of a doubt that it was in fact a inside job or not.

freelance
09-03-2008, 06:53 AM
What is needed is hard evidence that can stand up in court with out being struck down, that proves beyond a shadow of a doubt that it was in fact a inside job or not.

When the people on the commission say that their hands were tied, how on earth would that be possible?

Maltheus
09-03-2008, 07:25 AM
What is needed is hard evidence that can stand up in court with out being struck down, that proves beyond a shadow of a doubt that it was in fact a inside job or not.

Guys, it just doesn't matter at this point. It's in the past and although it may one day be widely accepted at truth that it was an inside job, it'll never come to light in a court of law. Even if Ron Paul was president. The Kennedy assassination is instructive here.

It's much easier to argue with people using the official story of 9/11. The cost of the response to 9/11 makes the actual event trivial by comparison. 3000 died on 9/11 and at least a million have died as part of our response. Not to mention the loss of liberties and the near complete destruction of the economy. We've got bigger problems now that need addressing and like it or not, 9/11 makes us look bad to most people.

That being said, we did provide a stark contrast to the other more scripted conventions out there and I felt good about that.

LibertyInJeopardy
09-03-2008, 07:56 AM
All I've seen from 9/11 truth are things that raise questions, but the practice of accusations based on questions should be carefully considered before being added to the list of philosophies associated with our brand of republicanism. "9/11 was an inside job" is making a giant leap right past questions directly into assumption. You know who gets made to look like asses because of that? Not Bush/Cheney et al. You, me, and any movement tied to your accusations in that regard gets to wear the "ass"umption label. I would respect your position far greater if the goal was to raise questions and seek further evidence for eventual presentation as cause for a new investigation with a broad and unbiased analysis. If you are serious about it you have to treat it with more professionalism. Start gathering attorneys and organizing investigations, but make every effort to avoid assumption - especially when the accusations that leads to run the risk of tangling up a movement focused on broader philosophies and thus poisoning it with the distractions of defending itself from attacks having nothing to do with its positions.

HaddEnuff
09-03-2008, 08:04 AM
I hope he doesn't go too far into 9/11 truth?
Why? What exactly do you have against the truth?

HaddEnuff
09-03-2008, 08:35 AM
Guys, it just doesn't matter at this point.
Of course it does. That's why murder has no statute of limitations.


We've got bigger problems now that need addressing and like it or not, 9/11 makes us look bad to most people.

Most people who aren't going to join the movement anyway. People who swallow the MSM propoganda hook, line and sinker.
If we were worried about what they think, this movement would have never gotten off the ground.

Look, the government lied about 9/11. Anyone with a working brain knows that. Could enough evidence be gathered up to prove it in court? As far as I know, it would be the first time.

But......for the first time in the history of man, fire....and fire ALONE, brought down a major steel-structured building (WTC7). The government's words, not mine.

So you see, there's a first time for everything.

HaddEnuff
09-03-2008, 08:51 AM
It also shows that 26.4% believe some people in gov't knew attacks would happen and did nothing to stop them. I might choose that option knowing that the FBI agent wrote warning memos about the ME men learning to fly and not land.
If that's not the definition of "inside job" please explain to me what is?

Maltheus
09-03-2008, 08:58 AM
Of course it does. That's why murder has no statute of limitations.

In a war, you don't attempt to prosecute every enemy soldier who shot at one of yours. You look at it as a whole and pick the objectives that will end the war as soon as possible. 9/11 was one shot in this war, but even if we get our day in court, it won't really change anything.

Let's say we finally convinced people of 9/11. You know it would be blamed on the Bush administration and people would move past it once Obama gets in. It's a single event. I'm more concerned with overthrowing the system itself. If anything, convincing people 9/11 was an inside job would only solidify democrat/socialist control over us for many years to come.

We have to use our resources effectively. I personally know of several people who, while well versed in Austrian economics, dropped out of the Ron Paul movement because they wanted nothing to do with the truthers. Shrinking our movement in an attempt to prosecute a single crime will lose us the war. We should focus on the few issues we all agree on, like the fed and income taxes. The rest will take care of itself if we win on those.

HaddEnuff
09-03-2008, 09:05 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by winston_blade
I hope he doesn't go too far into 9/11 truth?

I hope the same for everyone.
__________________

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ ~~~~~~~~~~~~
Listen to Free Talk Live - Help Spread the Message of Liberty*

Quite ironic for someone advocating "Free Talk Live" which by the way is among the most irrelevant "free talk" shows on the internet.


VENTURA '12

Perry
09-03-2008, 09:23 AM
He just asked some Questions.

Questions don't scare you, do they?

Nicely done Frank.:)

demolama
09-03-2008, 09:42 AM
I think Ventura's point was very clear... If we were willing to fight 2 wars because of countries with supposed connections to OBL then why is he not charged with the 9/11 attacks? Isn't that why we invaded Afghanistan to find OBL and to oust the Taliban who supported him?? Isn't that the reason behind taking out Saddam because he had "connections" with OBL and we were afraid OBL would get WMD from Saddam??

This has nothing to do with 9/11 conspiracy its more of accountability. Those who rush to war based on false information are neglectful of their duties and should be held responsible for their rush to judge.

We are in two wars because of 9/11 and as of right now there "isn't enough evidence" to charge OBL for 9/11 the reason for the 2 wars

HaddEnuff
09-03-2008, 10:07 AM
In a war, you don't attempt to prosecute every enemy soldier who shot at one of yours. You look at it as a whole and pick the objectives that will end the war as soon as possible. 9/11 was one shot in this war, but even if we get our day in court, it won't really change anything.
When does it become too late for justice? 1913? 2001?


Let's say we finally convinced people of 9/11. You know it would be blamed on the Bush administration
Why not let the judicial system sort that one out? Who knows how far down the rabbit hole this thing goes.


and people would move past it once Obama gets in.
Could your crystal ball also tell me who’s going to win the 7th race at Belmont this afternoon? I could use a little extra cash.


It's a single event.
Perhaps the single most important event of our lifetime.
A single event that has led this country into two unconstitutional wars, an attack on our liberties, and put us on the verge of bankruptcy.


I'm more concerned with overthrowing the system itself.
Uh, yeah. That’s pretty much the entire reason for investigating 9/11.


If anything, convincing people 9/11 was an inside job would only solidify democrat/socialist control over us for many years to come.
If the people of this country are that dumbed-down, then there really isn’t any hope, is there.


We have to use our resources effectively. I personally know of several people who, while well versed in Austrian economics, dropped out of the Ron Paul movement because they wanted nothing to do with the truthers.
Did you ask your “friends” if they interview every shopper in their grocery store every single time they go there to make sure they are in total agreement with every one of them, every time on every issue, so that they can feel secure in shopping there on a regular basis?


Shrinking our movement in an attempt to prosecute a single crime will lose us the war.
If people want to leave the movement, they'll find a reason.


We should focus on the few issues we all agree on, like the fed and income taxes. The rest will take care of itself if we win on those.
O.K., well are you going to take it upon yourself to make out the questionnaire so that we can survey each and every member and make sure we all think exactly alike?
Let me ask you something, do you honestly believe that every voter planning on voting for either McCain or Obama think exactly the same on every issue?

Peace&Freedom
09-03-2008, 10:35 AM
I think Ventura's point was very clear... If we were willing to fight 2 wars because of countries with supposed connections to OBL then why is he not charged with the 9/11 attacks? Isn't that why we invaded Afghanistan to find OBL and to oust the Taliban who supported him?? Isn't that the reason behind taking out Saddam because he had "connections" with OBL and we were afraid OBL would get WMD from Saddam??

This has nothing to do with 9/11 conspiracy its more of accountability. Those who rush to war based on false information are neglectful of their duties and should be held responsible for their rush to judge.

We are in two wars because of 9/11 and as of right now there "isn't enough evidence" to charge OBL for 9/11 the reason for the 2 wars

True, and the problem is there are loads of 9-11 questions just like the OBL one, but the truth avoiders would rather stay silent on the matter while the neocons continue to scream their "9-11" victory cant into the forseeable future. Such silence amounts to self-imposed impotence before an enemy whose emotional rally cry will lead them to political wins, while we keep gazing our navel. 'Paul supporters' who can't tolerate a 2 minute talk on 9-11 across a 6 hour rally, are tempermentally too thin-skinned to move this Revolution forward.

Maltheus
09-03-2008, 11:07 AM
When does it become too late for justice? 1913? 2001?

How about freedom first? Once we have that, I'm happy to revisit the issue.



Why not let the judicial system sort that one out? Who knows how far down the rabbit hole this thing goes.

You must have more faith in our judicial system than I do.



Could your crystal ball also tell me who’s going to win the 7th race at Belmont this afternoon? I could use a little extra cash.

Not sure about the 7th, but Lucky Lady in the 4th is a sure bet. :)


Perhaps the single most important event of our lifetime.

A single event that has led this country into two unconstitutional wars, an attack on our liberties, and put us on the verge of bankruptcy.

I think it's more important that people understand that even if the government account was true, it still wouldn't be a justification for giving up our liberties are bankrupting this nation. In fact, a 9/11 every single month wouldn't be worth that in my opinion.

And besides, the official account makes a better case against empire than does the true account, since it was supposedly done in response to our mucking around in Muslim countries. If we hinge peoples beliefs on when war is justified to whether or not it was an inside job or not, then all it takes is a real attack for all our efforts to be undermined. And there's certainly enough hatred out there to justify a genuine attack.


O.K., well are you going to take it upon yourself to make out the questionnaire so that we can survey each and every member and make sure we all think exactly alike?

Let me ask you something, do you honestly believe that every voter planning on voting for either McCain or Obama think exactly the same on every issue?

Obviously people don't think alike on this issue. That's the whole point. But there are core Ron Paul issues that pretty much every supporter out there agrees upon. Those issues are the fed, taxes and reducing the size/power of government. Those are the issues that have drawn in a wide variety of people. And that's more than enough for a movement to focus on. If we take care of those, then everything else follows.

newyearsrevolution08
09-03-2008, 11:11 AM
all he asked was 2 questions about it.

come on people

nit pickin abit are we?


I didn't hear him scream

INSIDE JOB!

and rant about it

he asked why we haven't formally charged them

I agree with that don't you?