CFL Dues We ARE Already Paying

[LinuxUser269]

Everybody's gotta pay their dues!
Now did everybody pay their dues?
Now did end up with tribal blues?
All the braves and squaws and the maids and the whores
Did, everybody pay their dues?


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=85DpgNAsdu8
Now did everybody pay their dues?
Now did they end up with tribal blues?
All the braves and squaws and the maids and the whores
Did, everybody pay their dues?

Now did everybody pay their dues?
Now did any of them try to refuse?
All the braves and squaws and the maids and the whores
Did, everybody pay their dues?

Dues .......Let me tell you I have payed my dues and continue to do so. Not that I have done more then anyone else this would certainly not be true .Still to this day wear a rp2008 button and it gets noticed all the time. I was in five parades . six rallies . one presidential debate ,three money bombs ,thousands of hours of online work , and dozens of sign waving's.


mandatory dues are a bad idea imo

i know of several people who i got to sign up who probably wont be able to pay dues and thus could be left outa the loop

there ought to be some type of free membership status and dues encouraged with some type of benefits granted to dues paying members as enticement the way they do in freedom force international

So the lords that can pay get more privileges then the surfs!? I thought we were getting away from this mentality.



i agree to a point. CFL staff SHOULD be all volunteers. They shouldn't
have salaries or compensation for the work they do.

if the current staff isn't willing to work on a volunteer basis they should
give up their positions to those willing to work as volunteers. I will bet
that there are hundreds of qualified folks that are up for the task
and many more willing to put in the effort to learn and contribute.

i despise 'fattening' people's bank accounts in the name of "liberty"
when there are folks that would do the work for free because they
truly BELIEVE in the cause.

i've donated my share to the Ron Paul campaign but i won't pay for
any membership dues. i have the RIGHT to expect to know how
exactly my contributions will be spent. giving to a specific political
campaign is one such way. although, shifting the money from his
presidential campaign to CFL was 'questionable' ... there is a thread
on this somewhere on this forum.

here here ...nicely said sidster but I think there would have to be some paid employees

[MsDoodahs]

As far as I know, RPFs will remain free, so you can continue to hang out here.

:)

[Kludge]

:confused:

[0zzy]

As far as I know, RPFs will remain free, so you can continue to hang out here.

:)

Thank you for your contribution to the campaign!

[MsDoodahs]

:D

[LinuxUser269]

As far as I know, RPFs will remain free, so you can continue to hang out here.

:)

Its the principal about the dues that have me ....well pissed. Its not that I could not pay the $35 FRN but his campaign has done exceptionally well with Grassroots supported money drives witch would net the CFL probably more FRN than any pay your dues drive.

[constituent]

Thank you for your contribution to the campaign!


As far as I know, RPFs will remain free, so you can continue to hang out here.

:)


:D

double-vision.

all Shakespeare and s*

[Jeremy]

Dues are for the precinct leaders dummy

[constituent]

Its the principal about the dues that have me ....well pissed. Its not that I could not pay the $35 FRN but his campaign has done exceptionally well with Grassroots supported money drives witch would net the CFL probably more FRN than any pay your dues drive.

frankly man, most organizations out there expect "dues."

c'mon, it is what it is.

[LinuxUser269]

frankly man, most organizations out there expect "dues."

c'mon, it is what it is.

So once i pay my dues I can feel all warm and fuzzy and not worry about anything till my dues are due again. thats a great deal!


If its only the precinct leaders that have to pay that dose not seem right either.The person doing the most work in the area has to pay dues?.. ... fishy

[DeadtoSin]

So once i pay my dues I can feel all warm and fuzzy and not worry about anything till my dues are due again. thats a great deal!


If its only the precinct leaders that have to pay that dose not seem right either.The person doing the most work in the area has to pay dues?.. ... fishy

Here is how I see it. The Precinct Leaders are just that, leaders. Within the Ron Paul campaign we had a lot of precinct leaders and unfortunately a lot of them didn't do anything. If they invest 35 dollars they are buying extra resources not given to the rest of the campaign to enable them to be leaders.

You won't be crippled in your fight for Constitutional government if you don't pay, but others may be interested in doing so. I'm not saying it separates the good from the bad, but an uncommitted person is not nearly as likely to become a precinct leader if it costs dues rather than being free.

[WRellim]

Here is how I see it. The Precinct Leaders are just that, leaders. Within the Ron Paul campaign we had a lot of precinct leaders and unfortunately a lot of them didn't do anything. If they invest 35 dollars they are buying extra resources not given to the rest of the campaign to enable them to be leaders.

You won't be crippled in your fight for Constitutional government if you don't pay, but others may be interested in doing so. I'm not saying it separates the good from the bad, but an uncommitted person is not nearly as likely to become a precinct leader if it costs dues rather than being free.

A lot of those people didn't "do anything" because shortly after they signed up to be precinct leaders (which program didn't even EXIST until shortly before Super Tuesday)...



...the campaign decided to go all A.W.O.L. on them.

You remember, the campaign stopped advertising (even though they were sitting on Million$ of dollars); and then the candidate stopped campaigning; and they even put out a PRESS RELEASE that literally stated that the campaign was "suspending active campaigning" while Ron Paul concentrated on his Congressional Primary re-election...

So when those "do nothing" precinct leaders DID make phone calls, and when they DID go door to door they ended up with people telling they that they were being foolish because that "Ron Paul guy dropped out." They heard it on the news you see. And so they end up having to argue that "No, no... it just seems like he dropped out because he stopped advertising and campaigning..." which just doesn't convince anyone.



As a meetup leader it's really difficult to push others to START doing that when they think it's pointless. And its even hard to keep that up for too long yourself, you know?

But of course, none of that should reflect badly on the campaign staff or the candidate... Nope, it's all the fault of those lazy grassroots supporter people.


Yeah right... smell me another one?

[constituent]

If its only the precinct leaders that have to pay that dose not seem right either.The person doing the most work in the area has to pay dues?.. ... fishy

according to a post on the board, Debbie Hopper said it won't be a "welfare state" kinda situation. so it's all kinda blurry atm, but it doesn't look like freeloading will be tolerated. if you wanna help the cfl achieve its goals (???), then the best thing to do is donate. that should have gone without saying.

i think the expectation will ultimately be "something from everyone, get what you pay for" to some extent. c'mon, the staff does need to be compensated for their time...

that's the way the world works.


it is rather unfortunate to notice that it seems as though everyone's hell bent on simply getting something for nothing.

[LibertyEagle]

Ok WRellim, most of us agree that the campaign had a lot of failings. What do you want to do? Lie around and gripe about it for the next 5 years? What's it going to take for you to MOVE ON? If you don't want to hook up with the C4L, don't. No one is making you. Go start your OWN thing. We should never put all our eggs in one basket anyway.

[Kalifornia]

Lets see, based on my previous VOLUNTARY contributions, I should be paid up for, oh, I dont know MANY YEARS...

Seriously, voluntarism works...

[DeadtoSin]

A lot of those people didn't "do anything" because shortly after they signed up to be precinct leaders (which program didn't even EXIST until shortly before Super Tuesday)...



...the campaign decided to go all A.W.O.L. on them.

You remember, the campaign stopped advertising (even though they were sitting on Million$ of dollars); and then the candidate stopped campaigning; and they even put out a PRESS RELEASE that literally stated that the campaign was "suspending active campaigning" while Ron Paul concentrated on his Congressional Primary re-election...

So when those "do nothing" precinct leaders DID make phone calls, and when they DID go door to door they ended up with people telling they that they were being foolish because that "Ron Paul guy dropped out." They heard it on the news you see. And so they end up having to argue that "No, no... it just seems like he dropped out because he stopped advertising and campaigning..." which just doesn't convince anyone.



As a meetup leader it's really difficult to push others to START doing that when they think it's pointless. And its even hard to keep that up for too long yourself, you know?

But of course, none of that should reflect badly on the campaign staff or the candidate... Nope, it's all the fault of those lazy grassroots supporter people.


Yeah right... smell me another one?

I like how you seemed to think I was insinuating that I was blaming those "lazy grassroots supporter people." Try not to read into my stuff anymore because I'm not a subtle guy. I say what I think, and I don't insinuate hidden stuff.

I know a few precinct leaders in Texas that did absolutely nothing except hold a meeting where they accomplished nothing. All I meant by my post is that a 35 dollar due would allow the Ron Paul people to weed out the people that may not want to commit time or may not be able to commit as much time as they like.

Yes, there may be some that could commit time but do not want to pay 35 dollars. That's fine, do your thing. I support you. Considering the fact that it is not mandatory, I can't understand why it is such a big deal.

Heck, a meet up could all chip in to buy a precinct leader account and get together and watch the material.

[RSLudlum]

I don't understand what the fuss is all about? It is voluntary to sign up, if you don't want to pay the fee then don't become a precinct captain.... It is a private org. and can make their own rules up within the 'unfortunately' dismal number of laws and restrictions.... I was planning on donating some more to the CFL anyway, and I guess if I want to be a precinct captain I can go ahead an put it toward my dues....Are any of you JBS members? Did you pay the dues for it? Are you in any other private clubs/orgs. that allow special privileges to paying members?

You know how it is sometimes, hell most of the time,,,,you gotta pay to play.

[LinuxUser269]

Lets see, based on my previous VOLUNTARY contributions, I should be paid up for, oh, I dont know MANY YEARS...

Seriously, voluntarism works...

Thanks ..that is my point.


We The Members Of The Campaign For Liberty in order to form a more perfect union, establish justice, insure domestic tranquility, provide for the common defense, promote the general welfare, and secure the blessings of liberty to ourselves and our posterity, do ordain and establish this Constitution for the Campaign For Liberty.

So if we are members and we dont get choose what happens(by vote)are we not just drones .

[DeadtoSin]

Thanks ..that is my point.


We The Members Of The Campaign For Liberty in order to form a more perfect union, establish justice, insure domestic tranquility, provide for the common defense, promote the general welfare, and secure the blessings of liberty to ourselves and our posterity, do ordain and establish this Constitution for the Campaign For Liberty.

So if we are members and we dont get choose what happens(by vote)are we not just drones .

Doesn't have quite the moral backing or ring to it IMO. If the Campaign for Liberty was an oppressor, sure. They are a legitimate private organization though.

[MsDoodahs]

I gotta say...I'm liking this dues paying precinct leader idea more and more. :)

[newyearsrevolution08]

Dues are great for lazy people who would rather give money than to actually do the footwork. The money will HOPEFULLY go to help those who want to do the footwork BUT don't have the cash to fund it.

As far as RPF remaining free, I swear I have seen some "thoughts" on making it a paid forum... correct me if I am wrong but the only person who could do that is the owner himself... Any word on this being thought about and if so WHEN this free 2 paid might happen?

Servers are not free which I know since I own one so it is really how much profit is being made through the paid ads and donations to make it worth the owners time.

Once this election cycle ends the whole "ron paul forums" and revolution will break apart and move towards a more general revolution i'm sure so maybe a new domain or catchy name might need to be brought up so the next patriot candidates can have a place to call home.

Many still believe it is Ron Paul or bust and no candidate is really worth talking about and I think those people will always remain with that mind set. Hoping for Ron Paul in 2012 2016 and even when he is 120 years old. Ron Paul or no one lol......

Pay dues if you want to to whatever it is you want, that is the great thing about things like this. Unlik a tax it isn't mandatory and if you don't care to pay you go somewhere else and I know many free options will always exist even with the cfl, there will be secondary places to still keep the revolution going without having to pay to be apart of it.

[Sally08]

according to a post on the board, Debbie Hopper said it won't be a "welfare state" kinda situation. so it's all kinda blurry atm, but it doesn't look like freeloading will be tolerated. if you wanna help the cfl achieve its goals (???), then the best thing to do is donate. that should have gone without saying.

i think the expectation will ultimately be "something from everyone, get what you pay for" to some extent. c'mon, the staff does need to be compensated for their time...

that's the way the world works.


it is rather unfortunate to notice that it seems as though everyone's hell bent on simply getting something for nothing.

Hmm. Look at the huge amount of grassroots efforts the campaign got *for nothing* in terms of marketing, advertising, promotion, creative design, event planning and execution, and the list goes on.

It would be interesting to calculate the "fair market value" of all of those functions.

What about the CFL site design contest? Wasn't it promoted as something for the winner's resume? Yet, $1 million was spent on the Rally?

Not only did most grassroots leaders *not* even get reimbursed for expenses, some lost substantial amounts of their own for taking the risks they did. What thanks did they get (vs. what hatred)?

I could make a very strong case that the business world *is* expecting something for nothing, or at least half of what it cost in previous *decades*.

If those grassroots people had *not* done all of that work for free, what people would have received *income* for doing that work?

Are such "free efforts" actually contributing to lower incomes/unemployment w/related home foreclosures?

How many of you are running into major defects on corporate websites as I am? Consumers have accepted that it is their (free) job to notify sites of major defects (DailyPaul had critical problems just after Michael left town!) What people are no longer needed at those companies, then?

How many of you are reporting product failures due to the same lack of quality control? What people obviously no longer have jobs at those companies, either?

How many products and programs/websites totally fail to meet customer needs, because the people in those areas of defining future business requirements no longer have jobs at those companies, either?

Even the animated RP advertisements - have you noticed the animated commercials/movies on TV/in the theaters? What actors/actresses were no longer needed for those commercials/movies?

If CFL people want to get paid, no problem. However, there should be "stockholders" who can vote incompetent people out, just as the real world works today.

And I don't think the source of revenue should be the "employees". Will there be any other source of revenue than donations? It's possible, but there needs to be something of value produced, as the former print newspaper companies are finding out with their online versions.

Years ago, the owner of a major education group decided to charge those who *posted*. That decision backfired!

Actually, Internet marketers routinely have "membership sites" with a minor monthly fee. The "Walmart" thinking is that the revenues are directly related to the number of subscribers who receive value for their subscriptions in terms of information or e-products.

I would think CFL would want the largest number involved vs. penalizing those who are doing the majority of the work! That doesn't make any more sense than consumers paying their bank to be allowed to have a savings account.

Also, given the fact that many parents are both working and possibly on two different jobs each, the turnover in precinct captains will be constant as "real world" happens after college.

Who will train the replacements? A business pays for employee training. Will precinct captains have to pay $85(?) for training, in addition to the "dues"?

More importantly, will future replacements even consider paying the $35 when they weren't part of this RP campaign?

[MsDoodahs]

Dues are great for lazy people who would rather give money than to actually do the footwork.

Um....there are some of us who aren't able to do the footwork for one reason or another. Financial support is the method available to me, so it's what I use. :)

[newyearsrevolution08]

Um....there are some of us who aren't able to do the footwork for one reason or another. Financial support is the method available to me, so it's what I use. :)

nothing wrong with that. just pointing out that there are many ways to help the effort all around. Some choose the footwork and some pull out the visa, both work.

[evilfunnystuff]

its painfully obvious people wont voluntarily give money to causes they believe in (especialy those who are willing to put in actual time and effort to promote the cause) :confused:


ps. for people shitting on those who signed up as precinct leaders and "did nothing" i seem to remember a whole lot of threads annd storys around the web and possibly even an email or 2 from the campaign pressuring people to sign up even if they didnt have the time to put into it and thus making people feel guilty for not signing up :mad:

i never signed up cause due to working times/locations i could not work within any specific precinct though workin on the fly passin out trifold flyers and slim jims i had printed at a kinkos type place, puttin up piles of very profesional home made signs i kept in the back of my truck, everywhere. talkin to random folks where ever i was employin tchniques from the sellin liberty videos. but was still made to feel guilty for not signin up for the precinct leader program and i almost signed up even though i knew i couldnt cover any particular precinct cause of everyone guilting those of us who didnt

pps and im sure that these "do nothing" precinct leaders did not donate anything to the campaign the lazy fuckin bums