So, what are the chances...

[tmosley]

Does anyone know what are the chances of McCain dying before the end of his first term are? I mean, he's 72 years old, had cancer FOUR times, and already exhibits some symptoms of mental decline. If he were to die, we would have someone who appears to be something closely resembling a Ron Paul Republican in the White House. Even if we don't, we will have a RP Republican exerting influence on McCain, and in charge of the Senate.

All the arguments I've seen against her seem to have been based on hand waving (How could you vote for McCain!!!? OMG!!!1!@!21), although I will admit I haven't read them in great depth, mainly because of the pervasiveness of inanity within those threads.

Does anyone have a clear argument against a McCain/Palin ticket that doesn't invoke misogyny, while taking into account her apparent libertarian leanings (or proving them as untrue)? If you still don't want to vote for McCain, what would be your strategy going forward?

Before his selection of Palin, I had thought that I would vote for Obama, in the hopes that he would screw up the country so badly that RP or equivilent would have a good chance in 2012. Now I am torn, strangely, between voting for the two mainstream candidates (I've never voted for a mainstream candidate before in my life).

[RickyJ]

McCain is not senile, he just isn't too bright, he never was. I doubt he will die in the next 4 years, but of course it is possible.

[Patriot123]

Not going to happen. Highly unlikely. Even then, you're really going to vote for McCain just because you're hoping he'll die? Do you not understand that if McCain wins it will mean the end of not only our revolution but will send a message to the Republican Party that Americans accept this doctrine that they have put on us? It doesn't matter if Palin were to take over, she would still be swayed by the Republican Party platform. Even though voting for Obama would mean national socialism we would at least have a fighting chance to retake the party.

[TER]

Does anyone know what are the chances of McCain dying before the end of his first term are? I mean, he's 72 years old, had cancer FOUR times, and already exhibits some symptoms of mental decline. If he were to die, we would have someone who appears to be something closely resembling a Ron Paul Republican in the White House. Even if we don't, we will have a RP Republican exerting influence on McCain, and in charge of the Senate.

All the arguments I've seen against her seem to have been based on hand waving (How could you vote for McCain!!!? OMG!!!1!@!21), although I will admit I haven't read them in great depth, mainly because of the pervasiveness of inanity within those threads.

Does anyone have a clear argument against a McCain/Palin ticket that doesn't invoke misogyny, while taking into account her apparent libertarian leanings (or proving them as untrue)? If you still don't want to vote for McCain, what would be your strategy going forward?

Before his selection of Palin, I had thought that I would vote for Obama, in the hopes that he would screw up the country so badly that RP or equivilent would have a good chance in 2012. Now I am torn, strangely, between voting for the two mainstream candidates (I've never voted for a mainstream candidate before in my life).


This was exactly McCain's plan. Leading you in to vote for him by putting a carrot in your face. Wait for the debates. The reasons why you thought you'd never vote for him will remind you again why any Ron Paul supporter could not in good conscious vote for him over Barr or Baldwin, heck, even Obama.

[Andrew-Austin]

What were the chances that Cheney was going to keel over?

[tmosley]

What were the chances that Cheney was going to keel over?

Cheney was only 59 when he was elected VP. The chances of him dying were fairly miniscule, even with the heart conditions considered.

I don't really see why the Revolution would die just because McCain won. Our voting block is relatively small, and about as fractured as it could be. The most we could get from voting 3rd party would be making a symbolic point.

If McCain won, and she turned into a real neocon, then we would just have longer to take over the party before heading to the White House (8 years vs 4).

[TER]

Cheney was only 59 when he was elected VP. The chances of him dying were fairly miniscule, even with the heart conditions considered.

I don't really see why the Revolution would die just because McCain won. Our voting block is relatively small, and about as fractured as it could be. The most we could get from voting 3rd party would be making a symbolic point.

If McCain won, and she turned into a real neocon, then we would just have longer to take over the party before heading to the White House (8 years vs 4).

McCain winning would be the WORST CASE SENARIO for this movement, IMO.

[pacelli]

Does anyone know what are the chances of McCain dying before the end of his first term are? I mean, he's 72 years old, had cancer FOUR times, and already exhibits some symptoms of mental decline. If he were to die, we would have someone who appears to be something closely resembling a Ron Paul Republican in the White House. Even if we don't, we will have a RP Republican exerting influence on McCain, and in charge of the Senate.

All the arguments I've seen against her seem to have been based on hand waving (How could you vote for McCain!!!? OMG!!!1!@!21), although I will admit I haven't read them in great depth, mainly because of the pervasiveness of inanity within those threads.

Does anyone have a clear argument against a McCain/Palin ticket that doesn't invoke misogyny, while taking into account her apparent libertarian leanings (or proving them as untrue)? If you still don't want to vote for McCain, what would be your strategy going forward?

Before his selection of Palin, I had thought that I would vote for Obama, in the hopes that he would screw up the country so badly that RP or equivilent would have a good chance in 2012. Now I am torn, strangely, between voting for the two mainstream candidates (I've never voted for a mainstream candidate before in my life).

Thanks for such a thoughtful post. I only hope this thread continues in the manner in which you have demonstrated.

I will not be voting for John McCain. Adding Palin to the ticket did give me a moment of pause in my pledge to never vote for McCain. However, I signed my name to the letter to the GOP and I am not about to retract my pledge nor convictions. She is more inexperienced than even Obama on the national stage but a fighter for her people in Alaska. She is conservative and fights against the good ole' boys club. I truly hope that she distances herself from McShame after this election and runs with another RP VP candidate for the next cycle. I also need to learn more about Palin's economic experience.

I'd vote for her if she was the nominee for President, since Ron won't be on all the ballots. But I cannot vote for her now, because a vote for Palin is a vote for McCain. That's just not going to happen. I can't just 'forget' ALL the McCain bashing that was on these forums over the past year. Many contributed money to fund VietnamVeteransAgainstJohnMcCain.com. The Ron Paul movement delivered McCain's "stay in Iraq for 100 years" to youtube, at which point some very intelligent democrats dropped it into the media cycle. I just can't forget about all the horrible things that McCain has done over his career (McCain Kennedy, McCain Feingold, Keating 5). Campaigning on his POW experience while denying further investigations to look for other Vietnam POW's who are still left behind. I just can't ignore all of that, just because Palin walks on the stage. I'm not easily distracted.

I won't vote Obama because I disagree with his plan for change. He has no economic strategy that will make an immediate impact. Neither does McCain, for that matter.

I believe that my vote will be for a third party, or write-in Ron Paul. I've already heard the "it won't count" and "vote for third party is a vote for obama" arguments ad nauseum, but at this point, I am not paying attention to the guilt-based rhetoric. If Ron endorses Chuck Baldwin or Bob Barr, or tells us what to do at the rally, then that is what I will do. I paid Ron Paul $4600 across both campaigns, and I expect a little direction. If Ron doesn't give us any direction during the Rally, then I'm going to have to really do some soul searching.

Ron Paul e-mailed this statement yesterday morning: We must resist the false choices the two major parties are giving us.

So right there, he's telling me not to vote R or D. I'll wait for the next suggestion from him.

[TER]

Thanks for such a thoughtful post. I only hope this thread continues in the manner in which you have demonstrated.

I will not be voting for John McCain. Adding Palin to the ticket did give me a moment of pause in my pledge to never vote for McCain. However, I signed my name to the letter to the GOP and I am not about to retract my pledge nor convictions. She is more inexperienced than even Obama on the national stage but a fighter for her people in Alaska. She is conservative and fights against the good ole' boys club. I truly hope that she distances herself from McShame after this election and runs with another RP VP candidate for the next cycle. I also need to learn more about Palin's economic experience.

I'd vote for her if she was the nominee for President, since Ron won't be on all the ballots. But I cannot vote for her now, because a vote for Palin is a vote for McCain. That's just not going to happen. I can't just 'forget' ALL the McCain bashing that was on these forums over the past year. Many contributed money to fund VietnamVeteransAgainstJohnMcCain.com. The Ron Paul movement delivered McCain's "stay in Iraq for 100 years" to youtube, at which point some very intelligent democrats dropped it into the media cycle. I just can't forget about all the horrible things that McCain has done over his career (McCain Kennedy, McCain Feingold, Keating 5). Campaigning on his POW experience while denying further investigations to look for other Vietnam POW's who are still left behind. I just can't ignore all of that, just because Palin walks on the stage. I'm not easily distracted.

I won't vote Obama because I disagree with his plan for change. He has no economic strategy that will make an immediate impact. Neither does McCain, for that matter.

I believe that my vote will be for a third party, or write-in Ron Paul. I've already heard the "it won't count" and "vote for third party is a vote for obama" arguments ad nauseum, but at this point, I am not paying attention to the guilt-based rhetoric. If Ron endorses Chuck Baldwin or Bob Barr, or tells us what to do at the rally, then that is what I will do. I paid Ron Paul $4600 across both campaigns, and I expect a little direction. If Ron doesn't give us any direction during the Rally, then I'm going to have to really do some soul searching.

Ron Paul e-mailed this statement yesterday morning: We must resist the false choices the two major parties are giving us.

So right there, he's telling me not to vote R or D. I'll wait for the next suggestion from him.

+1

[evilfunnystuff]

I believe that my vote will be for a third party, or write-in Ron Paul. I've already heard the "it won't count" and "vote for third party is a vote for obama" arguments ad nauseum, but at this point, I am not paying attention to the guilt-based rhetoric. If Ron endorses Chuck Baldwin or Bob Barr, or tells us what to do at the rally, then that is what I will do. I paid Ron Paul $4600 across both campaigns, and I expect a little direction. If Ron doesn't give us any direction during the Rally, then I'm going to have to really do some soul searching.

Ron Paul e-mailed this statement yesterday morning: We must resist the false choices the two major parties are giving us.

So right there, he's telling me not to vote R or D. I'll wait for the next suggestion from him.

you should do some soul searching instead of waiting for someone to tell you what to do. this whole movement is about not being told what to do and the fact that we can figure out what is right for us and not depending on others to tell us what is best.

having said that ron has personaly said he doesnt feel writing him in is a good use of our votes. (not nesacerily meant to direct you as you should vote your conscience but something to consider anyways)

[josephadel_3]

A vote for McCain is a vote for 4 more years of Bush, which is pretty much the only accurate thing Obama has ever said. If you vote for McCain because he picked an attractive female as his VP, then I pity you. But hey, it's none of my business who you vote for. I'm not gonna get all fascist and demand you vote for Barr or Baldwin. Vote for whoever you want, just do a lot of thinking and soul seeking before you do, and ask yourself: Is voting for McCain, because he might die and that attractive female might take over really the right choice? If you answered yes to this, then so be it. I will continue to mourn your decision.

But it really makes no difference. It's like that simpsons halloween special where the two aliens, kang and kodos, cloned themselves to look like Clinton and Dole. "It makes no difference which one of us you vote for! Either way your planet is doomed DOOMED!

First, let me say I would never vote for John McCain, no matter what, nor would I vote for Obama. You can bash these guys all you want for voting for McCain, but what difference does it make? Obama isn't gonna get us outta Iraq and will bomb Iran, and McCain definitely isn't getting outta Iraq and will definitely bomb Iran. Therefore, innocent civilian and American soldiers are going to die in vain no matter who of the two "major candidates" ends up commander in chief.

So, I urge you to vote on principle for either Barr or Baldwin for the sake of saving your conscience, and know you didn't hypothetically suppport the American war machine with your vote. I'm voting for Nader because neither Barr nor Baldwin are on the ballot in Maine. Nader is a long shot from a constitutionalist, but at least he is an actually true peace candidate. He's actually my only option and is functioning as a protest vote.