A Few Suggestions from Michael Moore

[TastyWheat]

Okay, just because Michael Moore suggested these doesn't mean they're bad. I saw these in his new book and three of them are worth considering (the other three really sucked).


You're a citizen? You're registered to vote!
After reading the short blurb in his book I wondered the same thing. Why do we have to register to vote? Aside from ex-convicts (which I don't agree with) we should all be at least eligible to register to vote. So why not just show an I.D. or social security card and vote?
Paper ballots and a #2 pencil.
I'm sure most will agree with this. Voting machines are definitely a 21st century way of voting, but we all know their trustworthiness is low. Paper (recycled for the greenies), a pencil and optical scanners. How hard is that?
Weekend voting.
It's not like we aren't given ample opportunity to vote (including early voting), but why is the last day of voting almost in the middle of the work week?

[christagious]

Aside from ex-convicts (which I don't agree with) we should all be at least eligible to register to vote.

Why not? I happen to know a few ex-convicts who are completely reformed. I don't think that somebody who made a mistake in their life should be punished by never allowing their voice to be heard. My friend's dad is serving time in prison right now, he gets out in a year, and he's completely changed. He made a mistake, got involved with some bad people got hooked on drugs and robbed a store; he's paying for it. But he's taking college classes in prison and I've read some of his essays. He has a lot of ideas on how to change Ohio for the better and change prison budgets; he's against all the amenities that prisoners get, there's no incentive to stay out of prison, they get better stuff than some of us.

My point is I don't think ex-convicts should not be allowed to vote

[LibertyEagle]

Okay, just because Michael Moore suggested these doesn't mean they're bad. I saw these in his new book and three of them are worth considering (the other three really sucked).

[LIST=1]
You're a citizen? You're registered to vote!
After reading the short blurb in his book I wondered the same thing. Why do we have to register to vote? Aside from ex-convicts (which I don't agree with) we should all be at least eligible to register to vote. So why not just show an I.D. or social security card and vote?


The only problem is, you're going to get more voter fraud. It's the lefties that usually push this angle, because they want to have illegal aliens voting, dead people, etc.

In my opinion, I'd rather go back to the old days when only property owners could vote, or an equivalent would be that if you're feeding off of government largesse, you would not be allowed to vote. One shouldn't be able to vote to steal more out of their neighbor's pocket.

When the number of people taking handouts from government exceed the number who do not, we are truly sunk.

[christagious]

In my opinion, I'd rather go back to the old days when only property owners could vote


No way dude. I know of a lot less votes Ron Paul would have gotten. I rent my house, so there goes 2 votes from my wife and myself. My friend, 19 years old, lives with his mom, who also rents their house, so there goes his vote, her vote, and his brother's vote. My younger brother lives with our parents still, there goes another. Right there is 6 votes lost, just from people close to me, for a liberty candidate with this thinking, think about this extrapolated across the nation.

[LibertyEagle]

No way dude. I know of a lot less votes Ron Paul would have gotten. I rent my house, so there goes 2 votes from my wife and myself. My friend, 19 years old, lives with his mom, who also rents their house, so there goes his vote, her vote, and his brother's vote. My younger brother lives with our parents still, there goes another. Right there is 6 votes lost, just from people close to me, for a liberty candidate with this thinking, think about this extrapolated across the nation.

Ok and what did those votes get us? What would the overall look like if only those people could vote that were not accepting handouts from government? Would we be better off or worse off?

To me, the premise still stands. People that are sucking off the government teat (and the government gets its money by stealing it from some of our pockets), should not be able to vote to increase that amount of money they get from stealing from their neighbors.

That was also the premise behind having to be a land owner. Land owners had a vested interest in this country back then. Maybe this isn't appropriate now; that is why I made the forementioned suggestion.

[TastyWheat]

How does it make voter fraud worse? Given I don't understand how illegal aliens are able to vote now, why would it be worse to simply prove citizenship? Not to say this should be national law, but I don't see why every state requires registration to vote.

[SeanEdwards]

How does it make voter fraud worse? Given I don't understand how illegal aliens are able to vote now, why would it be worse to simply prove citizenship? Not to say this should be national law, but I don't see why every state requires registration to vote.

How would they stop an individual from voting in one polling place, and then voting again at a different polling place? You could manage that if you had some jumbo sized multi-user database tracking when and where each individual voted, but that sounds like an expensive logistical nightmare that would offer no significant advantage over the current system.

[SeanEdwards]

When the number of people taking handouts from government exceed the number who do not, we are truly sunk.

What about employees of the government? There's a lot of people who aren't on welfare that depend on a big expansive government .

[Matt Collins]

Okay, just because Michael Moore suggested these doesn't mean they're bad.Now there's a turd that just won't flush :rolleyes:

[Conza88]

Okay, just because Michael Moore suggested these doesn't mean they're bad. I saw these in his new book and three of them are worth considering (the other three really sucked).


You're a citizen? You're registered to vote!
After reading the short blurb in his book I wondered the same thing. Why do we have to register to vote? Aside from ex-convicts (which I don't agree with) we should all be at least eligible to register to vote. So why not just show an I.D. or social security card and vote?
Paper ballots and a #2 pencil.
I'm sure most will agree with this. Voting machines are definitely a 21st century way of voting, but we all know their trustworthiness is low. Paper (recycled for the greenies), a pencil and optical scanners. How hard is that?
Weekend voting.
It's not like we aren't given ample opportunity to vote (including early voting), but why is the last day of voting almost in the middle of the work week?


1. Voter fraud. Why not just go to as many booths as possible? Why not have fake id's? Registering means you have an address etc, a name, a place of residence etc. It curbs this somewhat.

2. Paper ballots FTW. Pencil's / pens - FTW. Optical scanners - FTL. - seriously what is the point of paper; if the results get transferred into bits? 1's and 0's? :rolleyes: They can just change them there. No - fuck centralization in general, and that means fuck all the optical scanners making numbers and sending them to one big server.

3. It should be a Saturday. The reason it is Tuesday, is because that's the least day likely for people to vote... or go out.. You know Cheap Tuesday's etc... entice growth is sales etc.. The politicans want as little participation as possible so Washington can keep doing what it wants without too much worry.. while they can play to extremes to get the evangelicals / people who are in the know and pissed off about shit, (faux capitalism?) voting... the normal working class people get fked regardless.

4. Preferential voting... my fken God. IMPLEMENT THIS. The LEAST hated candidate wins, or at least has a chance... PEOPLE who like RP but think he is hopeless, put him as No. #1, then say they hate Obama... they put McCain #2, then you could have LP candidate as #3, Greens #4 and Democrats #5 etc.

It's basically ranked voting on ballots. The least hated candidate is more likely to win. Australia uses this system and it pwns pretty much everything else... except the public are retarded as the main parties give out how to vote cards... and 80% of the people tend to follow them.. so naturally they put their main party first and the others in the middle and the opposition on the bottom.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Preferential_voting

Ron Paul wld have pwned imo... if this was the system, and he ran independent.. :(

5. Hand counting the paper ballots is also done. We've got a population of 20 million. Say.. 10 million vote. Voting closes at 6pm. The result is usually known at 10pm.. but it has known to go on longer... last election where it is extremely close, the counting can go on for weeks - with the result deciding as to who goes to parliament. Usually it doesn't matter too much, because whether the government goes into power and opposition - there is a far wider margin, than waiting on several seats.

An army of volunteers count the ballots by hand. Recounts are done by request of the candidates if it is close.

[LibertyEagle]

How does it make voter fraud worse? Given I don't understand how illegal aliens are able to vote now, why would it be worse to simply prove citizenship? Not to say this should be national law, but I don't see why every state requires registration to vote.

It has to do with document forgery. The states can put their docs on paper that is not easily forgeable, but many have not done that yet. Right now, we have people voting under dead people's names, etc. It would be made even worse, if we didn't require people to register.