your ideal

[JosephTheLibertarian]

your ideal country that YOU run? What would it look like?

What's the most simplistic forms of taxation? I was thinking tariffs, and tolls, yes?

How about an migration tax? The military stops everyone on the borders, once in custody the person/people are taxed before they are allowed entry into the country? Maybe the military could even sit outside airports and do the exact same thing.

Other than that, what are some of the most simplistic tax systems?

I'm actually more in favor of voluntary contributions as an alternative to taxation. The government would then be able to use the contributions in order to function. I'm not talking about just pieces of paper. I'm talking about ANYTHING of value, the government would accept it all, maybe hold the noncurrency contributions in warehouses for future use, or auction.

As far as GOVERNMENT goes, I'd prefer myself to be a despot. That's what I'd prefer anyway. I would be in control of everything, but I would leave the economy alone. I'd let the free market work, I wouldn't have any government whatsoever, just me. I would probably appoint closet friends and relatives to duties that they're interested in, ambassador is about all I can think of. I would havea loyal cabinet to discuss how to better structure the military, we should also retire respected military officials so that they don't decide one day they might want t seize power. So it would be wise imo to retire threats of that nature.

The only thing I can think of that I would outlaw in the economy is the right of private military technology companies to sell or give cutting edge technology to other governments. I think I would be against that. I would be the only judge in the country. Criminals would be sent to me, I would listen to the defense and I would come to a conclusion. If found guilty, I would either choose to take possessions or I would sentence them to a few years of hard labor. That would basically be working on government projects, stuff like that. If I want a base built somewhere, we're going to use them to do most of the grunt work. I would also hear and decide on lawsuits, I think the victim should be the one to make the charge and request what they want in a victorious outcome. I would then decide the case, then I would decide what he/she receives if the case is wo by the victim. I might even make some counterlawsuit decisions in some cases.

I would meet with owners of companies and scientists and discuss possible research projects. For example, STAR WARS technology, I might say, "ok. Let's start a project, you will be in charge and I'll allocate funds for you." Just an example.

Here's a list


no death penalty
I would be the despot
no police, there would just be military
military would be voluntary
I would consider implementing some sort of court system once things get a bit..much
I would allow drug use
I would crack down hard on any child molestation that I find to be the case
my successor would be whoever I think it should be
I would not implement any tax system. voluntry contributions
no national currency
I would go to war if threatened or if I see a good opportunity
I would develop nukes for self defense
I would allow citizens to own military technology, but if they are showin signs of hostility towards us, we would probably kill whoever is perpetrating this
we would have a very top/down thought up military ranking system. some of my advisors would be military leaders, they would advise me on what changes we need. I might also put the military in charge of the judicial system, but any law I don't would not exist
I would have a very extensive spy network loyal to me
I would allow anyone to marry. no marriage licenses
no license to drive
no public roads
the oly time I would consider building a road is if the military needs to get around more efficiently


That's all I canthink of right now. I'm not an expert in judicial/tax systems, so tat's why I asked about simplistic models. I don't really now much how to implement everything all by my lonesome :P

[hypnagogue]

I don't want to live in your country.

[amy31416]

I would probably appoint closet friends and relatives to duties that they're interested in, ambassador is about all I can think of.

Something you need to confess, Joseph? :p

[Kludge]

It'd have <100 people (by my invite) and be run on machines & solar power. $100,000 entry fee but you'd truly be set for life once you join.

[Nirvikalpa]

My country would look something like this:

- All armed citizens.
- If you murder for any reason besides self-defense, you will be killed. slowly. publicly.
- Child pornography/child molestation/rape will not be tolerated. They would be first castrated then they will live their life being scientific experiments. Guinea pigs.
- If you steal and aren't shot by the owner first, you go to prison. You eat moldy bread and only enough water to keep you alive.
- You earn your living. If you can't work (disabled, pregnant, senior citizen), other citizens will help you. If you REFUSE to work... you get a bullet in your head. Welfare won't exist.
- Grow our own food.
- All natural medicine. No man-made crap that doesn't work and has tons of side effects.

... yeah, I'm in a bad mood, because I'm sick and light-headed. So really, I don't know what I just wrote.

[amy31416]

- Child pornography/child molestation/rape will not be tolerated. They would be first castrated then they will live their life being scientific experiments. Guinea pigs.


... yeah, I'm in a bad mood, because I'm sick and light-headed. So really, I don't know what I just wrote.

Crabby or not, I'm moving to your country. Have room for a benevolent version of Dr. Mengele?

[constituent]

One law:

Don't shoot at me and I won't shoot back.

[Nirvikalpa]

'Course Amy. You could be the one doing the experiments :):D

[malkusm]

My ideal country:

-The death penalty does exist for murderers and violent criminals.

-The prison system would pay for itself: criminals would engage in meaningful work, contributing to society to make up for their living expenses while in the system.

-Taxes would be imposed directly on goods and services, and each tax rendered would collect the money for a fund independent from the rest of the government. Example: Revenues of a gasoline tax or toll booth would go to a fund which could only be used for maintaining state-owned roadways.

-Because of the above point, the government would need to specifically cite a reason for taxation, and make completely transparent the reasons for such taxation. The only exception would be:

-A sales tax of 1% of ALL goods and services would be rendered to pay for the operations of government. This would pay the salaries of elected officials (I don't consider this stealing since citizens are allowed to freely vote of said officials, and since this is one of the few things taxed, they may therefore be more inclined to ensure that a good representative is chosen).

-No law will be made on what will or will not be accepted as currency or payment. The government may circulate their own currency if they so choose (by legislative procedure).

-The highest law of the land would require all bills to be read aloud to the legislature before voting. This would either keep them short (thereby keeping their purpose clear) or would slow down the legislative branch so much that they might pass 2 bills per year.

I can probably answer any questions on my govt. if anyone has any. I probably have an opinion on anything and everything, but these are just my important points.

[Kludge]

'Course Amy. You could be the one doing the experiments :):D

GML in charge and Amy conducting experiments on the citizens.... Sign me up!

[amy31416]

'Course Amy. You could be the one doing the experiments :):D

Sweet, I'll stock up on catheters and scalpels. Won't be needing any ether.

[FindLiberty]

CLOSE ENOUGH!

JosephTheLibertarian, will you be my benevolent dictator?

[Fox McCloud]

-any form of government action that is taken part in my the public is billed to each person (or family) that engages in said service---if you take part in no governmental services, then you will never be billed for anything.
-gold or silver backed currency
-death penalty via public hanging (not the kind where the neck snaps either--I'm talking death by asphyxiation) for debasing, in any form, the monetary.
-Fractional Reserve banking is illegal
-bi-monthly fund-raiser+auction sale to fund the military
-encourage all able-body citizens to serve in the military, but promise never to go to war unless we're attacked first.
-immigration is encouraged, but each person entering the country is heavily scrutinized.
-if you can work, but refuse and you're found trespassing on private or public property, you will be jailed and will be put to work for private-corporations that bid on you for various menial jobs (cleaning out sewers, etc).
-have a yearly "know your government" program whereby all documents not pertaining to national security are released to the public
-the government will own one and ONLY one national television and radio station, in which the sole purpose of such is to raise voluntary funds, inform people on possible threats so the militia can prepare, and to tell various lame jokes from time to time.
-all drugs will be allowed, but harming another individual while high or impaired will have very very VERY low tolerance for.
-once you hit the age of 21, you will undergo compulsory 4 weeks compulsory gun training that fits within your time schedule (probably one of my only coercive actions on the citizenry that isn't linked with committing a crime)--training will not be required if a citizen shows adequate knowledge in how to operate and fire several different weapons and can pass a written test.
-All States and municipalities are forbidden from entering into a single-company contract with a phone, cable, or any other telecommunications company--if the market will bear more than 2 phone companies, then 2 will exist.
-There will be a national holiday for Larry McDonald and Ron Paul.

can't think of any more ATM, but those are things off the top of my head.

[JosephTheLibertarian]

CLOSE ENOUGH!

JosephTheLibertarian, will you be my benevolent dictator?

Sure thing :)

I'll give you a nice cushy job. ;) Actually, I think I'd like to be the one guy in a matriarchal society of several million women. That would be fun.

[JosephTheLibertarian]

I don't want to live in your country.

Why not?

I wonder if the free market would create roads in my nation. If not, then I'd have to use penal labor and military to get some needed projects done. Prisoners would be able to petition me to reduce/eliminate their sentences. All government created infrastructure would be to the benefit of the state, the people would run the economy without any state interference, so that means they would have to create their own roads, bridges, railroads, schools,etc. if they choose to use mine, they'll have to pay a usage fee.

All rebel forces will be annihilated.


abortion will be legal
strategic bases will exist all over the nation
navy will patrol the waters
we'll also hve a strong airforce
we would have a strong state spac eprgram but we will allow private space projects, that's fine
prostitution and gambling will be legal
state will have its own cast telephone and internet network. the people will have to create their own via free market

[hypnagogue]

Why not?

Because...




I would be the despot
no police, there would just be military
I would consider implementing some sort of court system once things get a bit..much
my successor would be whoever I think it should be
I would not implement any tax system. voluntry contributions
no public roads
I would have a very extensive spy network loyal to me

[JosephTheLibertarian]

Because...

yes, I want to knows things are secure in my nation. I will adopt future measures to better consolidate. We might implement some sort of flat tax system once we figure out..how. I don't know how myself, that's why I didn't bring it up. There will never be representative government--sorry. I can't allow anti-free market factions to ruin the nation, however, it will be very free. I just need to know I have everything under my control.

I'll create a "suggestion box" for the people. I'll have each and every message read to me. ;)

[hypnagogue]

I can't allow anti-free market factions to ruin the nation, however, it will be very free. Isn't it noteworthy that you consider a Free Market more important than a Free People?

[JosephTheLibertarian]

Isn't it noteworthy that you consider a Free Market more important than a Free People?

How are they not free? I didn't take any of their rights away. Other political theories have been tried throughout history and are inferior, so we will not tolerate their presence any longer.


one nation
one government
one direction

[hypnagogue]

How are they not free? I didn't take any of their rights away. What about the right to choose their own form of government. Do you not recall that just government draws it's authority only from the consent of the governed? And let us not forget that the only purpose of government is to secure the rights of it's citizens. Without courts or police, your government does no such thing.

Don't take it personally. Obviously this wasn't a serious governmental proposal, but we can still discuss theoretically.

[noxagol]

My ideal country:

-Government maintains three functions 1) National defense 2)Law enforcement 3)Courts

-National defense is funded through a tax based on land area as this is the largest factor in the consideration of a force's ability to defend said area. The bigger it is, the harder it is, therefore the more it will cost. Also, consider if all the land were owned by a single person, and they were to pay a third party to defend it. This would most likely how the price would be derived.

-All funding for law enforcement is conducted on a pay per service instead of constant taxation and has an oversight court that deals with complaints and objections an individual may have with the conduct of officer(s) that respond to his/her call. This does two things 1)It holds the police directly accountable for their actions and must respond to all calls for help and actually do a good job or they don't get paid. 2) Creates incentive for people to take ample measures to deter crime against them and their property as this could potentially save them vasts amount of money down the road because of the lack of paying the police constantly. Third party organizations would also be allowed given that they are bound by the same rules of operation and oversight as the government police are.

-The only form of gun control will exist over weapons that cannot be reasonably limited in damage to the intended target. This allows for just about any fire arm or military weapon except for NBC weapons or large scale bombs. The purpose of weapons is self-defense, against both criminals and government (so just crmiinals really :D) If the effect of the weapon you are attempting to use cannot be limited to just those that you have just cause of attacking in a reasonable fashion then it is not fullfililng its purpose as solely self defense.

-All other laws can be summed up in one line. No individual or group of individuals may cause physical harm onto the property of another individual or group of individuals nor can any individual or group of individuals attempt to take the property of another individual or group of individuals without their prior consent.

-All punishment for crimes are to be focused not on punishment but on compensation to the victim in proportion with the violation upon the victims property that occured. If such compensation cannot be given or compensation is not sufficiently possible in any given case, then a prison sentence term shall be assigned that is in proportion with the remainder of compensation owed or the scale of the crime. Prisons are to be 100% self sufficient and not rely on tax money.

-The death penalty will only be ascribed in cases of cold blooded murder. All other cases of homicide will be replaced with a prison sentence and/or compensation to the next of kin of the victim(s).


Other than that, anything goes for the most part. I may have left a thing or two out I can't remember right now lol.

[JosephTheLibertarian]

What about the right to choose their own form of government. Do you not recall that just government draws it's authority only from the consent of the governed? And let us not forget that the only purpose of government is to secure the rights of it's citizens. Without courts or police, your government does no such thing.

Don't take it personally. Obviously this wasn't a serious governmental proposal, but we can still discuss theoretically.

Well, it's my country. They can leave, if they want :D This is my transitional government, we haven't setup the judical system..yet.

[asgardshill]

I think I'd go for the Galactic Empire model myself. Pretty much a Machiavellian paradise, at least for me. It would suck for everybody else, but hey this is MY fantasy, not yours.

[hypnagogue]

National defense is funded through a tax based on land area as this is the largest factor in the consideration of a force's ability to defend said area. The bigger it is, the harder it is, therefore the more it will cost. Also, consider if all the land were owned by a single person, and they were to pay a third party to defend it. This would most likely how the price would be derived.
That's not a half bad idea... The expense of such taxes would also be passed along to tenants, so those living on another's land will still pay a share. Although, it just occurred to me that a problem may arise with land abandonment. Say you own a piece of land out in the middle of nowhere. There's little option to make the land productive, but you are still paying taxes on it. Further, it would be difficult to sell the land, since it is of so little value. It could be better to tax based upon the value of the land, with a minimum threshold. Thus, useless land out in the boonies would be cheap enough that no taxation would be required, but should the area develop and raise the value of the land, the owner would be encouraged to either develop it or sell it to someone else who would.


-All funding for law enforcement is conducted on a pay per service instead of constant taxation and has an oversight court that deals with complaints and objections an individual may have with the conduct of officer(s) that respond to his/her call. This does two things 1)It holds the police directly accountable for their actions and must respond to all calls for help and actually do a good job or they don't get paid. 2) Creates incentive for people to take ample measures to deter crime against them and their property as this could potentially save them vasts amount of money down the road because of the lack of paying the police constantly. Third party organizations would also be allowed given that they are bound by the same rules of operation and oversight as the government police are. This I think has some issues. For starters it tends to be low income areas which suffer the most crime. It would be crippling to burden them with the costs of protection when it is not even they who are the offenders. Which is my second objection, which I'll put in the form of a suggestion; would it not be immeasurably better to charge the offender for the costs involved in his prosecution? Of course, not all justified police action results in a successful prosecution, and so you will not always have someone to charge. I don't think a just police agency could be sustained in such a manner. A per head tax seems to me much more just and reasonable. Certainly, you can supplement that with charges to offenders found guilty.


The only form of gun control will exist over weapons that cannot be reasonably limited in damage to the intended target. This allows for just about any fire arm or military weapon except for NBC weapons or large scale bombs. The purpose of weapons is self-defense, against both criminals and government (so just crmiinals really :D) If the effect of the weapon you are attempting to use cannot be limited to just those that you have just cause of attacking in a reasonable fashion then it is not fullfililng its purpose as solely self defense. Examples?


All other laws can be summed up in one line. No individual or group of individuals may cause physical harm onto the property of another individual or group of individuals nor can any individual or group of individuals attempt to take the property of another individual or group of individuals without their prior consent. This, unfortunately, can become extremely complicated. There are so many, many ways someone can both positively and negatively affect another person, that it still takes considerable intellect to discern what negatively affecting actions are to be disallowed, and which are to be allowed.


All punishment for crimes are to be focused not on punishment but on compensation to the victim in proportion with the violation upon the victims property that occured. If such compensation cannot be given or compensation is not sufficiently possible in any given case, then a prison sentence term shall be assigned that is in proportion with the remainder of compensation owed or the scale of the crime. Prisons are to be 100% self sufficient and not rely on tax money. What then, should be done about the rich? Should they be able to commit crimes and simply pay the pittance required by law? Consider even the possibility that someone might devise a business model which relied upon committing crimes against others, but that was so lucrative the fair compensation could simply be factored in. Certainly that shouldn't be allowed. Or what if there were some sick, rich people that enjoyed bulldozing people's houses for fun? "Pay $1,000,000 and get to ruin this guy's home? Hell yeah!"

The flip side of that is the poor would be frequently jailed for crimes that other people can simply ignore. That would be a truly horrid condition.

You see, time is the great equalizer. We all receive but one lifetime, and the hours of a rich man can only be more valuable than the hours of a poor man. Restitution can only be half the equation. I firmly believe a loss of precious time is due punishment and deterrence.

I fully agree that prisons should cease to be nasty places you spend your sentence sitting around in. They need to be work places. Of course, the government is very bad at turning a profit, so it would be better if their labor could be leased out to private entrepreneurs.


The death penalty will only be ascribed in cases of cold blooded murder. All other cases of homicide will be replaced with a prison sentence and/or compensation to the next of kin of the victim(s). Personally, I trust no government well enough to mete out life and death to it's citizens. To take the life of even one innocent human being is intolerable in my opinion. False imprisonment is bad enough. Think of the years wasted and all the experiences a person misses. All they can give you in return is money. That is indeed a very poor substitute for stolen youth.

[satchelmcqueen]

My country would look something like this:

- All armed citizens.
- If you murder for any reason besides self-defense, you will be killed. slowly. publicly.
- Child pornography/child molestation/rape will not be tolerated. They would be first castrated then they will live their life being scientific experiments. Guinea pigs.
- If you steal and aren't shot by the owner first, you go to prison. You eat moldy bread and only enough water to keep you alive.
- You earn your living. If you can't work (disabled, pregnant, senior citizen), other citizens will help you. If you REFUSE to work... you get a bullet in your head. Welfare won't exist.
- Grow our own food.
- All natural medicine. No man-made crap that doesn't work and has tons of side effects.

... yeah, I'm in a bad mood, because I'm sick and light-headed. So really, I don't know what I just wrote.

sounds good to me.

[AmericaFyeah92]

no scientologists :mad:

[T-K]

Im thankfull to live in America after reading this thread

[JosephTheLibertarian]

I think I'd go for the Galactic Empire model myself. Pretty much a Machiavellian paradise, at least for me. It would suck for everybody else, but hey this is MY fantasy, not yours.

That was actually my idea. The Confederacy of Independent System's (CIS) model sounds better, to me ;) I loved them in the prequels.

http://images4.wikia.nocookie.net/starwars/images/thumb/3/34/CIS_roundel.svg/600px-CIS_roundel.svg.png

http://images4.wikia.nocookie.net/starwars/images/thumb/b/bf/Homingspidergeonosis.jpg/800px-Homingspidergeonosis.jpg

http://images4.wikia.nocookie.net/starwars/images/thumb/7/79/75GeneralGrievousFinal.jpg/374px-75GeneralGrievousFinal.jpg

[Alex Libman]

Utopianism is dangerous. One can talk about what can be done in the context of an existing society to improve it, and one can have an optimistic long-term vision, but detaching your vision from reality completely, as if it is a painting limited only by your imagination, is a completely different matter.

[JosephTheLibertarian]

Utopianism is dangerous. One can talk about what can be done in the context of an existing society to improve it, and one can have an optimistic long-term vision, but detaching your vision from reality completely, as if it is a painting limited only by your imagination, is a completely different matter.

I take it you haven't watched the STAR WARS prequels? The CIS was backstabbed and the CIS leadership was murdered by Darth Vader on Mustafar. so umm not very utopian

[FindLiberty]

Hey Boss (JosephTheLibertarian), want me to "take care of" all these complainers for ya?

[Renegades]

My country would look something like this:

- All armed citizens.
- If you murder for any reason besides self-defense, you will be killed. slowly. publicly.
- Child pornography/child molestation/rape will not be tolerated. They would be first castrated then they will live their life being scientific experiments. Guinea pigs.
- If you steal and aren't shot by the owner first, you go to prison. You eat moldy bread and only enough water to keep you alive.
- You earn your living. If you can't work (disabled, pregnant, senior citizen), other citizens will help you. If you REFUSE to work... you get a bullet in your head. Welfare won't exist.
- Grow our own food.
- All natural medicine. No man-made crap that doesn't work and has tons of side effects.

... yeah, I'm in a bad mood, because I'm sick and light-headed. So really, I don't know what I just wrote.
Quite dangerous precedents in a free society.

[revolutionman]

your ideal country that YOU run?

The original post as quoted above indicates that your country would be some sort of authoritarian state, with YOU as the ruler. Under this guideline I will move forward outlining Government, citizenship, taxation, law, and education.

I would be the Despot or Dictator, and then there would be a congress or senate made up of publicly elected officials with some limited powers in legislation, in their provinces, and on a national level. My citizens would be as free as can be, with laws only in place against violent crimes and various forms of theft. They would be taxed based on the products they buy, services they use, and roadways they travel.

Law...
Unjustified deliberate homicide = Death
Rape and Child Molestation = Life
Political Corruption = Life
Falsified News reporting = 20 years
White Collar crime = 20 years
Theft = between 30 days and 15 years depending on the details of the crime.
Assault = same as theft

Drugs are legal, being a useless bum is not, its punishable by two years in prison where you will work 5 hours every day of the week, every day of the year except the 5 day period in April that stretches from tax day to 4/20 with my birthday in the middle. You will be paid, and then you will pay rent and utilities every month you will buy your own food and clothes from the commissary, you will pay for your mattress and pillow and bedsheets. if your payment is late, or if you refuse to comply you will be savagely beaten. if you fail to clean your act up on the outside, you will be re incarcerated and savagely beaten some more.

Insulting me = I get to come to your house and punch you one time, in the mouth. Second offense, I sell you on E Bay like a used car stereo system.

The Goat = I get to call you a **** and kick you four times in the ass... wait thats something else...

Education is public, and every graduate has to be certified in a trade or craft, but is still encouraged to go to college.

There will be no minimum wage but there will be labor unions.

We would have a state religion, and the main principal of that religion is that you can believe whatever the hell you'd like, but cannot attempt to convert anyone else.

I'm going to watch TV now.

[AmericaFyeah92]

NO GINGERS :mad:

[Kludge]

NO GINGERS :mad:

I didn't mind ginger ale all that much... :confused:

[Kludge]

While we're making up authoritarian death traps....

My secondary country (where all the raw materials are harvested for the utopia) will hold all criminals, political dissidents and antichrists.... and members of Scientology.


The Twelve Directives:

1. Harvest at maximum efficiency. The lives of others depend on you. Loafing is punishable by death or ((x+y)/h) lashes where x=minutes the death star appears in the last episode of something with a death star, y=% cloud coverage and h=1.

2. The "I Have A Scream" speech by VP Howard Dean must be recited when the sun is highest in the sky 10 times in a monotonous style.

3. Fedora hats and plaid overshirts must be worn at all times. Failure to do so will result in an immediate lobotomy conducted by Europeans in scary crow costumes.

4. No pants may be present on your person at any time during... inspection.

5. You must abide by the state religion, Kludgism, the worship of those living in the Utopian world so that you do not envy them.

6. Fashion designers will be shot no less then 10 times upon notice, no matter their sexual orientation.

7. When addressed, you will say "I would like campaign finance reform in New Zealand."... OR ELSE!

8. Praise of Poland is not permitted for any reason. Violators will be stapled alive to a giant billboard.

9. Committing aggression is the forfeiture of your rights. Unless you regional officer(s) request your presence, the victim of your aggression is legally justified in doing whatever they feel as reasonable punishment.

10. The igniting of ANY materials anywhere on the planet is punishable by death.

11. The drinking of ANY substance anywhere on the planet is permitted.

12. Yawning is not permitted in public and is punishable by death.


Failure to abide by any of these not-so-much-directives-but-outlines-as-to-the-legal-consequences-of-your-actions will result in the throwing of sand at your eyes.

[AmericaFyeah92]

I didn't mind ginger ale all that much... :confused:

by "gingers" i met kids with red hair and freckles.

there's something not right about them.....

[electronicmaji]

I've been thinking about this for a while...


if i had my own country it would have the following constitution (Which is not fully complete)

1) The government exists to protect and ensure the freedoms and rights of everyone.

2) The pursuit of happiness is one of those rights except when the actions taken to achieve happiness infringe upon the freedoms or rights of another being.

3) Everyone has a right to affordable and efficient healthcare. They have the right to be free of worry or care about cost, coverage, and quality of service. They have the freedom to opt-out of government subsidized healthcare.
4) Everyone has a right to basic nourishment. They have the right to be free of hunger and worry.
5) Everyone has a right to a basic and advanced education. They have the freedom to choose what school they attend.

6) Everyone has a right to say, print, and distribute; upon their own property and on public property any material they see fit except for when the material was created via the infringement of others rights and freedoms.
7) Everyone has a right to assemble and peacefully protest, on public and private property; except when infringing on the rights and freedom of others.
8) Everyone has a right to live and interact freely; except for when they infringe on others rights and freedoms. Life is therefore defined to begin at the start of the second trimester.

9) The government does not have the right to take anyone’s life. The only acceptable defense for any private citizen taking another’s life is self-defense.
10) An exception to the above is granted during a time of war; such as any soldier, private citizen, or public official, as seen fit by the government and a court of law; may take the life of any aggressor, enemy, or traitor.
11) The definition of traitor for the above statement specifically refers to one whom with malicious intent sabotages or attempts to sabotage any operation.

12) When possible a soldier, private citizen, or public official should not kill but capture aggressors, enemies, or traitors.

13) The rights for any captured aggressor, enemy, or traitor are those set forth by international accords; and in the case that local rights superseed those accords; those rights will also be extended to the captured. Prisoners have a right to a fair trial as soon as possible and a speedy execution when deemed fit. They also have a right to not be tortured or be forced to suffer any cruel and unusual punishment

[FreeMo P48]

Whose right will it be to provide affordable health care, basic nourishment and basic and advanced education?

Beware the illusion of freedom!
Beware the freedom of illusion!

[electronicmaji]

Whose right will it be to provide affordable health care, basic nourishment and basic and advanced education?

Beware the illusion of freedom!
Beware the freedom of illusion!

The goverment most likely.

[hypnagogue]

Sounds terrible Maji. Unlike Joe, I think you mean it.

[electronicmaji]

I take that as a compliment; anything a anarchist would hate can only be good.

[hypnagogue]

I take that as a compliment; anything a anarchist would hate can only be good. Did you just call me an anarchist? :confused:

[Kludge]

I take that as a compliment; anything a anarchist would hate can only be good.

No ownership over yourself, your property or your labor?

That sucks...

[LittleLightShining]

I'm moving to the Republic of MCloud.

I like this as an option for our current prison system.

you will be jailed and will be put to work for private-corporations that bid on you for various menial jobs (cleaning out sewers, etc).


-all drugs will be allowed, but harming another individual while high or impaired will have very very VERY low tolerance for.


-once you hit the age of 21, you will undergo compulsory 4 weeks compulsory gun training that fits within your time schedule (probably one of my only coercive actions on the citizenry that isn't linked with committing a crime)--training will not be required if a citizen shows adequate knowledge in how to operate and fire several different weapons and can pass a written test.I like this but I think the age could be lower. Maybe 16hrs of firearm training for 14-16yo within a 10mo period. Then a weekend camp for 16-18 year-olds on top of the training. From 18-21 you do 2 weeks and at 21 the 4 weeks. Most kids who come from a hunting family learn these skills at these young ages through hunter safety courses. These kids learn a respect for firearms and are generally not the same kids that are going to school to shoot down their peers and teachers.

I also like GML's castration punishment for sex crimes against kids but I don't know about the experimentation part.

I haven't thought enough about what my country would look like, but I'm pretty sure I would also be a benevolent dictator ;) There would be a new holiday where people bake cookies and bring them to their neighbors.

I wouldn't interfere with people doing what they do on their property and with each other so long as there was no harm. Injury or damage to property would be dealt with swiftly in a humiliating and case-appropriate way so as to deter future miscreants.

I don't think people who work for the government should get any pay. It should be volunteer. Maybe compulsory service in lieu of taxes. Local communities would have to work out infrastructure issues on their own.

Also, like GML's country I would require every citizen to be armed and trained in the use of their firearm. This is national defense. If that's not good enough for you don't move here.

I wouldn't require people to work. There will be no welfare of any type. If you can manage as a vagrant and not cause anyone injury or property damage that's you're prerogative.

Insurance companies are not welcome in my country. Patients and doctors are free to negotiate services. I haven't thought this one through but I like to think of Doc Baker from Little House. That's medicine the way it should be.

[electronicmaji]

No ownership over yourself, your property or your labor?

That sucks...

I never said that; everyone has complete ownership over themselves, their personal property, and their labour. Nowhere in my ideal country does anything contradict that.

You anarchists are extremist; you want all or nothing. You refuse to realize or take any proof that civilized societies can not exist without things like taxes. Your beyond all hope.

[constituent]

I take that as a compliment; anything a anarchist would hate can only be good.

back again? don't make me post the pics.

[JosephTheLibertarian]

My real ideal would be a stateless society of voluntary social interaction. I like to play with statism once in a while, but my true ideal is true freedom. Do you support private organizations that you are not a member of to dictate your life? To legislate you? We never joined this country voluntarily, so why should we have to obey the laws? That's how I feel....sometimes :p

[amy31416]

I'm moving to the Republic of MCloud.

I like this but I think the age could be lower. Maybe 16hrs of firearm training for 14-16yo within a 10mo period. Then a weekend camp for 16-18 year-olds on top of the training. From 18-21 you do 2 weeks and at 21 the 4 weeks. Most kids who come from a hunting family learn these skills at these young ages through hunter safety courses. These kids learn a respect for firearms and are generally not the same kids that are going to school to shoot down their peers and teachers.

My only problem with making anything mandatory is that it doesn't take into account at all the wide variations in people. For instance, would you really want autistic, handicapped, down's syndrome, tourettes (the tic kind), or severely depressed kids being trained to use firearms? There has to be an out for those scenarios.



I also like GML's castration punishment for sex crimes against kids but I don't know about the experimentation part.


You spoil my fun! Killjoy!

[amy31416]

As far as socialist programs go, like welfare, health care, etc. I would have it written that the promotion and establishment of any programs of the sort must truly be "free." That is, all health care must be provided by an entirely voluntary medical staff in a facility that is donated by the people of the town/city. They can figure out the specifications locally.

Any politician who tries to tax for these services will be considered a thief of future generations, even if the current population agrees to it. It's fine if you as a soveriegn individual want to donate to whatever you want, but to attempt to legislate it for others and future generations will be punishable by law--not sure yet how to punish them though, because it can't be a burden on the population. Hard labor in camps perhaps.

[Anti Federalist]

Rule one: Don't touch other people's stuff.

Rule two: Keep your hands to yourself.

That is all.

[amy31416]

Rule one: Don't touch other people's stuff.

Rule two: Keep your hands to yourself.

That is all.

Amendment to Rule two: unless both parties agree to the laying on of hands, so to speak. :)

[Anti Federalist]

Amendment to Rule two: unless both parties agree to the laying on of hands, so to speak. :)

Stop. That's twice tonight you made me spill my coffee.:D:D:D:D:D

[amy31416]

Stop. That's twice tonight you made me spill my coffee.:D:D:D:D:D

Mission accomplished. My work is done here. :p

Now what was the other time? Hmmm....

[LittleLightShining]

My only problem with making anything mandatory is that it doesn't take into account at all the wide variations in people. For instance, would you really want autistic, handicapped, down's syndrome, tourettes (the tic kind), or severely depressed kids being trained to use firearms? There has to be an out for those scenarios. Points taken. I should have thought further into it. I guess I should think about establishing an advisory council.




You spoil my fun! Killjoy! Sorry :o It just seems like something could go terribly awry, you know?

[amy31416]

Sorry :o It just seems like something could go terribly awry, you know?

I'm obviously kidding around--I started out in college as pre-med and then learned I would have to dissect a cadaver. I'm squeamish about medical stuff, I can do it if I have to, but I have a rather strong reaction to it--I'd never make it as a serial killer or a Mengele wanna-be.

[Anti Federalist]

Mission accomplished. My work is done here. :p

Now what was the other time? Hmmm....

This...:D


Originally Posted by JosephTheLibertarian
I would probably appoint closet friends and relatives to duties that they're interested in, ambassador is about all I can think of.

Something you need to confess, Joseph?

[amy31416]

This...:D



Something you need to confess, Joseph?

Ha--I dont' think I ever got a response from him over his closet friends either. :D

[klamath]

God! After reading this thread I need to reread my signature again:D

[JosephTheLibertarian]

Ha--I dont' think I ever got a response from him over his closet friends either. :D

I confess. I wish I could have you as my "closet friend." :)

[user]

Why is there so much statism here? :confused:

[Ron Paul in 2008]

I confess. I wish I could have you as my "closet friend." :)

Are you a satanist?

[Conza88]

Anarcho-Capitalism.

As close as you'll get to heaven on earth.