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spacehabitats
06-27-2008, 08:55 AM
Looks like someone stole "my" idea about psychopathy and the source of evil in politics.;)

A book with the unfortunate title of Political Ponerology (http://www.sott.net/articles/show/148141-The-Trick-of-the-Psychopath-s-Trade-Make-Us-Believe-that-Evil-Comes-from-Others)is reviewed and an excellent interview with the editors is at this link:

The Trick of the Psychopath's Trade: Make Us Believe that Evil Comes from Others (http://www.sott.net/articles/show/148141-The-Trick-of-the-Psychopath-s-Trade-Make-Us-Believe-that-Evil-Comes-from-Others)

The interview alone gives a lot of interesting background information about how psychopaths, conscienceless manipulators, shape our political landscape and change the course of history. For example:


When psychopaths are the policy makers in government and the CEOs of big business, the way they think and reason - their 'morality' - becomes the common culture and 'morality' of the population over which they preside. When this happens, the mind of the population is infected in the way a pathogen infects a physical body. The only way to protect ourselves against this pathological thinking is to inoculate ourselves against it, and that is done by learning as much as possible about the nature of psychopathy and its influence on us. Essentially, this particular 'disease' thrives in an environment where its very existence is denied, and this denial is planned and deliberate.For my original post about this topic you might want to review:

Personality Disorders and Politics - 101 (http://www.ronpaulforums.com/showthread.php?t=132614)

But by all means, check out the article above.

Psychopaths are not just a threat to our government, they threaten to infiltrate and undermine almost any organization or movement that would propose to do good.

To recognize this threat is to understand why so many of us in the freedom movement are "obsessed" with the integrity of anyone proposing to be one of our "leaders".

Truth Warrior
06-27-2008, 09:04 AM
An estimated 4% of the human populations are sociopaths.

That's ~12.32 million in the USA. ( Hmm, why do the Clintons suddenly spring to mind? )

Only ~265 million overall, roaming the Earth. :eek:

Oh, the good news is, the rest of us aren't. ;)

amy31416
06-27-2008, 09:31 AM
Any good "litmus" tests for who is and who isn't a sociopath? I mean, I know that personality is a spectrum, but I want something I can inject into a mass spec and have the results come out the other end, so to speak.

Psychology annoys me, nothing about it is black & white and results are rarely repeatable.

Truth Warrior
06-27-2008, 09:37 AM
Any good "litmus" tests for who is and who isn't a sociopath? I mean, I know that personality is a spectrum, but I want something I can inject into a mass spec and have the results come out the other end, so to speak.

Psychology annoys me, nothing about it is black & white and results are rarely repeatable.
http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/sociopath
http://www.reference.com/browse/wiki/Sociopathy

http://tearsandhealing.com/sociopath3.htm?utm_content=3ishe-notcrazy-LrnDis-stopAb&gclid=CMTv9aX7lJQCFQyfnAodPzKnfg

:)

spacehabitats
06-27-2008, 10:12 AM
Any good "litmus" tests for who is and who isn't a sociopath? I mean, I know that personality is a spectrum, but I want something I can inject into a mass spec and have the results come out the other end, so to speak.

Psychology annoys me, nothing about it is black & white and results are rarely repeatable.

I share your frustration with the lack of objective tests.
It is especially hard to detect a psychopath at a distance (over the radio, TV, etc.) but it is also sometimes challenging even in an intimate relationship!
Think of all of the family members and neighbors who comment on serial killers as having appeared to be "just an ordinary guy".
Usually there were clues, however.

"I know one when I see one" is a poor substitute, I know.

There are "red flags" and clues, however.

Failure to conform to social norms with respect to lawful behaviors as indicated by repeatedly performing acts that are grounds for arrest.
Deceitfulness, as indicated by repeatedly lying, use of aliases, or conning others for personal profit or pleasure
Impulsivity or failure to plan ahead
Irritability and aggressiveness, as indicated by repeated physical fights or assaults
Reckless disregard for safety of self or others
Consistent irresponsibility, as indicated by repeated failure to sustain consistent work behavior or honor financial obligations
Lack of remorse, as indicated by being indifferent to or rationalizing having hurt, mistreated, or stolen from another.None of these are conclusive, of course, and we all have done one or more of these things at times. If I had to pick one above all of these I would pick #7.
Lack of conscience or empathy should be a huge red flag for anyone.

Too often the most successful psychopaths are good enough not to get caught very often, so we must maintain a high index of suspicion and a very low tolerance for these kinds of behavior, especially when it is in someone who desires to be a leader.

We need to be cognizant that we will often only get a glimpse of the tip of the iceberg,

There is a recent example of someone in our online movement who fit this profile in enough respects that I had no difficulty diagnosing him at a distance.
But like an abused wife, many people (including some on this forum) continued to make excuses for and defend his behavior "because of the good he was doing". The forum members who tried to sound the alarm (including myself) were often attacked as being intolerant, petty, or obsessed. Later, when he was discovered to have a fairly extensive criminal record, most people finally came to realize the depths of his depravity.

Unfortunately, I still don't think people and recognize WHY these people can be so successful at rising to positions of leadership, why they can be so destructive, and why we need to react so decisively when they are uncovered.

acptulsa
06-27-2008, 10:19 AM
Any good "litmus" tests for who is and who isn't a sociopath? I mean, I know that personality is a spectrum, but I want something I can inject into a mass spec and have the results come out the other end, so to speak.

Psychology annoys me, nothing about it is black & white and results are rarely repeatable.

Yeah, they crack me up when they whine at people who don't consider it a science like physics. How could we ever be as predictable as a chunk of granite?

Naysay them and see if you get an instant attempt to intimidate you. I go about 6'3" and 235 lbs., and have found that I can naysay people and tell the psychos by the way they give me a sharp look and start to try to intimidate me, then see that it obviously won't work and shift gears. A non-psycho will simply consider my counter-suggestion and address it on merit.

Don't guess it works for everyone, but naysaying someone you suspect of being a psycho should get you some kind of reaction.

Grimnir Wotansvolk
06-27-2008, 10:31 AM
Any good "litmus" tests for who is and who isn't a sociopath? I mean, I know that personality is a spectrum, but I want something I can inject into a mass spec and have the results come out the other end, so to speak.

Psychology annoys me, nothing about it is black & white and results are rarely repeatable.Things, like, sending hundreds of thousands to their deaths and showing no remorse for it.

Bonus points for claiming that God talks to you.

amy31416
06-27-2008, 10:35 AM
http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/sociopath
http://www.reference.com/browse/wiki/Sociopathy

http://tearsandhealing.com/sociopath3.htm?utm_content=3ishe-notcrazy-LrnDis-stopAb&gclid=CMTv9aX7lJQCFQyfnAodPzKnfg

:)

Thanks, checking out the links as soon as I get the chance.




There are "red flags" and clues, however.

Failure to conform to social norms with respect to lawful behaviors as indicated by repeatedly performing acts that are grounds for arrest.
Deceitfulness, as indicated by repeatedly lying, use of aliases, or conning others for personal profit or pleasure
Impulsivity or failure to plan ahead
Irritability and aggressiveness, as indicated by repeated physical fights or assaults
Reckless disregard for safety of self or others
Consistent irresponsibility, as indicated by repeated failure to sustain consistent work behavior or honor financial obligations
Lack of remorse, as indicated by being indifferent to or rationalizing having hurt, mistreated, or stolen from another.None of these are conclusive, of course, and we all have done one or more of these things at times. If I had to pick one above all of these I would pick #7.
Lack of conscience or empathy should be a huge red flag for anyone.

Unfortunately, I still don't think people and recognize WHY these people can be so successful at rising to positions of leadership, why they can be so destructive, and why we need to react so decisively when they are uncovered.

Thanks for the list and the info. I fully realize why it's so important and I appreciate all of the information that you've given us. It's very clear and reasonably presented, so take some comfort that you've helped convince at least this person.


Yeah, they crack me up when they whine at people who don't consider it a science like physics. How could we ever be as predictable as a chunk of granite?

Naysay them and see if you get an instant attempt to intimidate you. I go about 6'3" and 235 lbs., and have found that I can naysay people and tell the psychos by the way they give me a sharp look and start to try to intimidate me, then see that it obviously won't work and shift gears. A non-psycho will simply consider my counter-suggestion and address it on merit.

Don't guess it works for everyone, but naysaying someone you suspect of being a psycho should get you some kind of reaction.

The naysaying thing doesn't work out so well for the female of the species, it got me jacked up against a wall. All naysaying to potential sociopaths will now be done from a distance. But you're right, you do get a response, they don't like to be questioned on anything.

Thanks guys, for all the great info.

lucius
06-27-2008, 11:14 AM
Excellent topic! Political Ponerology is one of the most important books I have ever read. If the masses understood this concept, this mayhem would stop:

"The actions of [pathocracy] affect an entire society, starting with the leaders and infiltrating every town, business, and institution. The pathological social structure gradually covers the entire country creating a “new class” within that nation. This privileged class [of pathocrats] feels permanently threatened by the “others”, i.e. by the majority of normal people. Neither do the pathocrats entertain any illusions about their personal fate should there be a return to the system of normal man." [Andrew M. Lobaczewski]

Could be higher percentage than four percent:

If we speculate the actual number of psychopaths to be around 6 percent - or even just 4 percent as Stout claims - then these other "people" Lobaczewski is talking about could be as frequent as 12 to 18 percent of the population. That would mean that the total number of psychopaths plus "almost psychopaths" would be 16 to 24 percent of the total population.