Possesion of Cash is now a crime?

[Razmear]

http://www.chron.com/disp/story.mpl/ap/tx/5081398.html

ACLU sues DEA on behalf of truck whose money was seized


ALBUQUERQUE, N.M. — A trucker has sued the Drug Enforcement Administration, seeking to get back nearly $24,000 seized by DEA agents earlier this month at a weigh station on U.S. 54 in New Mexico north of El Paso, Texas.

Anastasio Prieto of El Paso gave a state police officer at the weigh station permission to search the truck to see if it contained "needles or cash in excess of $10,000," according to the American Civil Liberties Union, which filed the federal lawsuit Thursday.

Prieto told the officer he didn't have any needles but did have $23,700.

Officers took the money and turned it over to the DEA. DEA agents photographed and fingerprinted Prieto over his objections, then released him without charging him with anything.

Border Patrol agents searched his truck with drug-sniffing dogs, but found no evidence of illegal substances, the ACLU said.

The lawsuit alleges the defendants violated Prieto's right to be free of unlawful search and seizure by taking his money without probable cause and by fingerprinting and photographing him.

"Mere possession of approximately $23,700 does not establish probable cause for a search or seizure," the lawsuit said.

It said Prieto pulled into the weigh station about 10:30 a.m. Aug. 8 and was let go about 4 p.m.

DEA agents told Prieto he would receive a notice of federal proceedings to permanently forfeit the money within 30 days and that to get it back, he'd have to prove it was his and did not come from illegal drug sales.

They told him the process probably would take a year, the ACLU said.

The ACLU's New Mexico executive director, Peter Simonson, said Prieto needs his money now to pay bills and maintain his truck. The lawsuit said Prieto does not like banks and customarily carries his savings as cash.

"The government took Mr. Prieto's money as surely as if he had been robbed on a street corner at night," Simonson said. "In fact, being robbed might have been better. At least then the police would have treated him as the victim of a crime instead of as a perpetrator."

The DEA did not immediately respond Friday to a request for comment from The Associated Press.

Peter Olson, a spokesman for the Department of Public Safety, which oversees state police, said he could not comment on pending litigation.

The lawsuit names DEA Administrator Karen P. Tandy, DEA task force officer Gary T. Apodaca, DEA agent Joseph Montoya and three state police officers identified only as John or Jane Doe.

[ladyjade3]

They want all money traceable and under their suveillance so the IRS can't be cut out of its fair share of every transaction in the country. The drug war is so convenient to these ends. If you don't trust banks, put your savings in gold, preferably in a way that won't trigger a paper trail for when they call in all the gold again.

Gold has tried in the past to spontaneously re-monetize. Back in '78 it almost did. Lots of people invested in gold. Then suddenly from "nowhere" (central banks) a bunch of gold was dumped on the market to make the price of gold fall. They are doing this again. Right now. To make people think gold is also a stinker. But they only have so much in reserves. They can only glut the market with gold so many times. They can glut dollars at will tho.

Its a good time to buy gold.

[constituent]

lady jade

They are doing this again. Right now. To make people think gold is also a stinker. But they only have so much in reserves. They can only glut the market with gold so many times. They can glut dollars at will tho.

here's my question... where is the gold stored and who is in charge of ensuring that it all even exists? it seems like when these numbers get so high and so many people are involved that fakery would be rampant.

sure sure in a free market, but will we ever have that free market?

i'm not trying to discourage people from buying gold, i'm saying who are you going to trust to inventory and watch all of that gold?

it makes nice jewelry, but as far as placing a value on it (other than that it is shiny)... you can't eat it. and how long before synthetic gold that's another thing i wonder. will the world gold market require another monopoly (a la the diamond certification thing) or perhaps the better term is cartel to ensure that the only exchangable gold is first certified through them?

[inibo]

That is just so wrong.

[inibo]

BTW http://digg.com/political_opinion/Apparently_it_is_now_illegal_to_possess_cash

[inibo]

Who Dugg This? * Razmear

Heh. Thanks.

[Sean]

That is just plain theft.

[angelatc]

It's been that way for a long time. At least since the '80's, which is when I first started getting angry about it. For a while, the drug posession laws were taking away property that actually belonged to landlords, but of course the elite managed to write a work around to that.

[constituent]

in texas they have these legalized drug enforcement task forces that amount to mercenary cop/spy forces. they way they work is this:

when someone is busted in the state w/ anything, the property used to transport or facilitate the purchase, possession, or use of the 'drug' is ceased and sold, even if the case is later dismissed. this money is turned around and used to purchase new toys and to pay for these mercenary forces.

how they operate is through the standard agents provocateur mechanism of lawbreaking and intimidation. basically, from above it is made known that if so and so is caught burglarizing a residence, car or anything of that nature to just let them off the hook. they will not be prosecuted.

so, these people go and do what people like to call black bag searches (something like that), where an informant breaks into or steals your property and turns it over to the cops. the cops shodilly construct a case, get a warrant from a friendly ear, bust down on 27 people in one day and seize all there stuff.

try and intimidate the people into a plea bargain b/c they know the case won't hold and the people can't afford to defend themselves. regardless of the outcome, the get at best the ceased assets, the dope (don't think they destroy all of it), and some free prison labor. at worst they get a minor repremand, the assets and the dope.

[Hook]

I think you mean seize :)

[constituent]

thank ya much.

[jonahtrainer]

That is just plain theft.

You act like this is not the status quo. Confiscation laws are on the books (http://www.sovereignsociety.com/offshore2204.html)and widely used to fund entire agencies.

[jonahtrainer]

They want all money traceable and under their suveillance so the IRS can't be cut out of its fair share of every transaction in the country. The drug war is so convenient to these ends. If you don't trust banks, put your savings in gold, preferably in a way that won't trigger a paper trail for when they call in all the gold again.

Gold has tried in the past to spontaneously re-monetize. Back in '78 it almost did. Lots of people invested in gold. Then suddenly from "nowhere" (central banks) a bunch of gold was dumped on the market to make the price of gold fall. They are doing this again. Right now. To make people think gold is also a stinker. But they only have so much in reserves. They can only glut the market with gold so many times. They can glut dollars at will tho.

Its a good time to buy gold.

The Ancient Metal of Kings (http://zealllc.com/2002/digigold.htm) will reclaim its throne as the ultimate medium of exchange. Greenspan still says it is the 'ultimate form of payment.' There will be no confiscation because that would start a civil war (http://zealllc.com/2002/hydra.htm). The future is as bright as gold!

[Razmear]

If you can't afford gold and silver, base metals like copper and nickel are good solid assets right now too.
Copper is about $3/lb and Nickel is about $12/lb.
Nickel is actually looking like a good investment right now, if I had the cash I'd be buying right now.

http://www.kitconet.com/charts/metals/base/spot-nickel-5y-Large.gif
http://www.kitconet.com/charts/metals/base/spot-copper-5y-Large.gif
http://kitco.com/LFgif/ag95-pres.gif
http://kitco.com/LFgif/au95-pres.gif
eb

[jjschless]

DEA agents told Prieto he would receive a notice of federal proceedings to permanently forfeit the money within 30 days and that to get it back, he'd have to prove it was his and did not come from illegal drug sales.

WHAT!


I thought it was innocent until proven guilty.....

[McDermit]

This crap scares me. I routinely carry large sums of cash.. never used/sold/bought a drug in my life. But even just taking 15k in cash out of my own bank account triggers all kind of reports. Call me paranoid, but I've been investigated 3 times in the past 2 years for doing NOTHING wrong. And I'm relatively certain that there's some kind of regular surveillance on me.. I see cars crawling past or stopping at the top of my property all too often. (I live in the middle of nowhere. There are 3 homes on this dead end road.)

[constituent]

i think most if not all people are under surveillance these days.

not so much surveillance as steady intimidation. it seems like they've been stepping that sort of thing up over the past few years.

the other day in my little town of 5,000 i saw a plain unmarked van w/ some kinda white thing on top just spinning the blocks... they do it fairly often. we've also gotten cameras at our one stoplight in town now too.

[McDermit]

They recently added cameras in a city about half an hour from here. A few people are pushing for them to be added in one of the cities closer to me. "Crime deterrant" my ass.

[Razmear]

the other day in my little town of 5,000 i saw a plain unmarked van w/ some kinda white thing on top just spinning the blocks... they do it fairly often.

Thats why I'd never install a wireless router in my house. I prefer having CAT5 cables running from room to room than sharing my PC with anyone who drives by with monitoring equipment.

eb

[constituent]

i'm going to go picket the cameras here pretty soon. i live up the road right now, but plan on returning so... better get started now.

everyone hates 'em but says 'what are you gonna do?'

[inibo]

i'm going to go picket the cameras here pretty soon. i live up the road right now, but plan on returning so... better get started now.

everyone hates 'em but says 'what are you gonna do?'

You might consider something like this:
http://www.notbored.org/the-scp.html

[Thunderbolt]

...

[Thunderbolt]

...

[ChooseLiberty]

You guys do know that radio waves, as in rfid, are fairly easily blocked, right?

They aren't like clear channel AM stations. :D

[micahnelson]

Im worried one of these days I'll be busted for fraud when I try to buy something with a Reserve Note.

Thank God it says "Legal Tender" on there or nobody would take em!

[Darren McFillintheBlank]

..

[Trance Dance Master]

If you don't trust banks, put your savings in gold, preferably in a way that won't trigger a paper trail for when they call in all the gold again.
Don't worry about paper trails. They won't call in gold again. Last time the did, you only lost your gold if you willingly turned it in, which is what less than 1% of gold-owning Americans did. I prefer silver to gold anyway.

Best place to buy either is www.apmex.com

[kylejack]

They want all money traceable and under their suveillance so the IRS can't be cut out of its fair share of every transaction in the country. The drug war is so convenient to these ends. If you don't trust banks, put your savings in gold, preferably in a way that won't trigger a paper trail for when they call in all the gold again.
Any suggestions on how to do this? I mean, I guess I can pay cash at a local coin dealer, but I suspect I wouldn't get a very good price.

P.S. It was a pleasure to meet you at the Birthday Bash, keep up the good work.

[angelatc]

Wouldn't buying over the internet leave too much of a paper trail?

[kylejack]

Wouldn't buying over the internet leave too much of a paper trail?
Yes, which is why it would seem I'm at an impasse. Maybe find an online dealer and deal with them in cash or some other form of untraceable payment?