Pentagon Tests Raygun On Mock Anti-War Protesters

[PatriotOne]

I'm putting this in the Grassroots section because I feel pretty certain this will be available for the GOP convention. The only question is whether a tin foil hat will deflect the rays or be a conductor for the rays :eek:

Pentagon Tests Raygun On Mock Anti-War Protesters

http://www.prisonplanet.com/articles/june2008/060208_tests_raygun.htm

Pain compliance device used to disperse crowd as military-industrial complex tools up to deal with dissenters

Paul Joseph Watson
Prison Planet
Monday, June 2, 2008

The Pentagon proudly displayed what it has in store for anti-war protesters last night during a CBS 60 minutes feature which depicted the use of the army's "Active Denial System" against peace demonstrators at Moody Air Force Base in Georgia.

The Active Denial System is a giant raygun that directs a sizzling hot beam at its target, causing instant pain and forcing the subject(s) to disperse.

Similar to the Taser, the machine acts as a form of pain compliance or torture. It was designed in secret for 10 years before being unveiled in 2001.

The CBS clip alarmingly shows mock American peace protesters being targeted by the device.

See clip here:

http://www.prisonplanet.com/articles/june2008/060208_tests_raygun.htm

The CBS report fails to mention the fact that the device was already mobilized and place on stand-by to combat protesters during the 2004 National Republican Convention in New York City, as is documented in Alex Jones' film Martial Law 9/11: Rise of the Police State.

As Raw Story highlights, "Failure to deploy the weapon as planned (In Iraq) has raised suspicions that the real intention is to use it for domestic crowd control."

"In 2006, Air Force Secretary Michael Wynne was quoted as saying that the device should be used first on Americans, because "if we're not willing to use it here against our fellow citizens, then we should not be willing to use it in a wartime situation. ... If I hit somebody with a nonlethal weapon and they claim that it injured them in a way that was not intended, I think that I would be vilified in the world press."

A smaller scale version of the device named "Silent Guardian" is also being developed by Raytheon for use in "law enforcement, checkpoint security, facility protection, force protection and peacekeeping missions."

The use of mock role players in martial law training exercises is nothing new, the precedent stretches back at least ten years.

Documentarian and radio talk show host Alex Jones has has attended numerous military urban warfare training drills across the U.S. where role players were used to simulate arresting American citizens, confiscating their weapons, and taking them to internment camps. Actors scream out that they have constitutional rights as they are handcuffed and hauled off to the detainment facility.

Legislation has already been passed that paves the way for the U.S. military to engage American citizens on home soil.

The John Warner Defense Authorization Act of 2007 allows the President to declare a "public emergency" and station troops anywhere in America and take control of state-based National Guard units without the consent of the governor or local authorities, in order to "suppress public disorder."

Police state expert Frank Morales traced the ancestry of the bill back to "Operation Garden Plot" and the United States Civil Disturbance Plan 55-2, now de-classified programs dating back to the 80's which outlined how the military would be involved in suppressing domestic civil disobedience in America. The groups listed as potential non-conformist troublemakers included tax protesters, militia groups, religious cults, and various other general anti-government dissenters.

"It's very clear that they anticipated reaction to the agenda that they had projected for themselves," said Morales, "they were obviously aware of what they were gonna attempt to do in terms of their world domination project....they estimated quite correctly that there would be reaction on the part of the American people so it's logical in a sense that they would have been moving kind of in tandem with their global maneuvers to oppress us at home," stated Morales in response to the passage of the bill.

Morales added that the authorities know full well that a widespread awakening is taking place and so the Defense Authorization Act was essentially part of a move to try and "tool up" for the reaction that will take place after their next lunge to destroy what's left of American liberty.

The "Active Denial System" may be one such tool that jackbooted martial law thugs are salivating about using on the American people once the next crisis unfolds.

[rpfan2008]

sending us a signal

[Paulfan05]

lets name it Ronald Raygun

[-lotus-]

our tax dollars at work

[yongrel]

Prison Planet ≠ credible source

[evilfunnystuff]

lets name it Ronald Raygun

thanks now i have to clean up the orange juice off the wall lol

[Rangeley]

Prison Planet ≠ credible source
They arent a very credible source, but the story they quote is for real:
http://rawstory.com/news/2008/60_Minutes_Pentagons_ray_gun_tested_0602.html

[evilfunnystuff]

Prison Planet ≠ credible source

how bout the 60 minutes video that is there scource that is on the page or the video showing them in alexs documantary martial law 9/11 rise of the police state from 2004

http://www.prisonplanet.com/articles/june2008/060208_tests_raygun.htm
http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-6495462761605341661&q=&hl=en

[soapmistress]

Fuck Ronald RayGun!

[Kotin]

Prison Planet ≠ credible source

is 60 minutes then?

[acptulsa]

thanks now i have to clean up the orange juice off the wall lol

He's a drug store truck drivin' man
He's the head of the Ku Klux Klan...
Look up Country Joe and the Fish.

Yeah, if ol' Ronnie had had one of these in the sixties when he was governor of California, it would be well-proven now.

[Andrew-Austin]

Don't raygun me bro.

[Grandson of Liberty]

Funny, I could have sworn I read somewhere about the right to peaceful assembly.

Oops, that's right- the govt. doesn't follow that document anymore.

[SeanEdwards]

Yeah, that's gay. Much better to hose protesters with a ma deuce.

[kombayn]

Prison Planet ≠ credible source

+1, I can't stand that money-making fraud Alex Jones.

[Jordan]

+1, I can't stand that money-making fraud Alex Jones.

He represents the otherside of news. I mean, we all hate the money making fraud Fox as well. The thing is, you can't just get news anymore. Its news + opinion.

But it wouldnt be right to completely hate Alex Jones, there is a lot that he's done for RP and the movement towards personal liberties. While it is fed with conspiracy and plenty of nonesense, the kind of government he wants to promote is the kind we can all agree with: personal liberty and a weak federal government.

[surf]

"just $13.1 million..."

[SeanEdwards]

He represents the otherside of news. I mean, we all hate the money making fraud Fox as well. The thing is, you can't just get news anymore. Its news + opinion.

But it wouldnt be right to completely hate Alex Jones, there is a lot that he's done for RP and the movement towards personal liberties. While it is fed with conspiracy and plenty of nonesense, the kind of government he wants to promote is the kind we can all agree with: personal liberty and a weak federal government.

Oh Alex Jones is fantastic. Particularily when he starts ranting about satanists in government ushering in some bible-thumper end times vision. I just can't get enough of end times prophecy and book of revelation nonsense. That shit is better than L. Ron Hubbard.

[RideTheDirt]

Don't raygun me bro.
fucking lol

[kombayn]

He represents the otherside of news. I mean, we all hate the money making fraud Fox as well. The thing is, you can't just get news anymore. Its news + opinion.

But it wouldnt be right to completely hate Alex Jones, there is a lot that he's done for RP and the movement towards personal liberties. While it is fed with conspiracy and plenty of nonesense, the kind of government he wants to promote is the kind we can all agree with: personal liberty and a weak federal government.

I'm not denouncing what Alex Jones has done for the Ron Paul movement, it still doesn't change the fact he's a fraud. He prays on people's insecurities with their government by using Fear-Mongering.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NAgTFWglHrc

William Cooper exposed him back in 2000-2001. He's in this business to make money, go to any of his sites, it looks like an extremely bad infomercial.

[PatriotOne]

+1, I can't stand that money-making fraud Alex Jones.

Try to stay on topic. Ray guns for protestors in case you didn't bother to read the article.

[PatriotOne]

Oh Alex Jones is fantastic. Particularily when he starts ranting about satanists in government ushering in some bible-thumper end times vision. I just can't get enough of end times prophecy and book of revelation nonsense. That shit is better than L. Ron Hubbard.

The topic is ray guns for protestors...not another I hate AJ thread.

[SeanEdwards]

The topic is ray guns for protestors...not another I hate AJ thread.

Alex Jones is a raygun for the mind.

Edit: Furthermore, AJ is related to this topic, because of the typical AJ spin on the article that YOU linked in your original post. You're the one who introduced prison planet into discussion of this weapon system, so don't complain when people point out that the article comes from an unreliable fearmongering demagogue.

[Danke]

The topic is ray guns for protestors...not another I hate AJ thread.

Oh, come on Patriotone, we don't have enough of those here!

[kombayn]

Funny, I could have sworn I read somewhere about the right to peaceful assembly.

Oops, that's right- the govt. doesn't follow that document anymore.

Umm... They showed the protestors in the video throwing shit at them and acting in a "violent" manner. Troops don't want to shoot them, so they use a ray-gun that won't cause any major pain. The big deal about the ray-gun is...? Oh wait, Alex Jones is reporting about it so they must be using it as the next phase to enslave us. Come on... More fear-mongering from that knuckle-heads website.

[PatriotOne]

Alex Jones is a raygun for the mind.

Edit: Furthermore, AJ is related to this topic, because of the typical AJ spin on the article that YOU linked in your original post. You're the one who introduced prison planet into discussion of this weapon system, so don't complain when people point out that the article comes from an unreliable fearmongering demagogue.

It's important people going to the convention to know about this so try not to dilute the subject. The ray gun is real....if you can't read then just watch the video ;)

[PatriotOne]

Umm... They showed the protestors in the video throwing shit at them and acting in a "violent" manner. Troops don't want to shoot them, so they use a ray-gun that won't cause any major pain. The big deal about the ray-gun is...? Oh wait, Alex Jones is reporting about it so they must be using it as the next phase to enslave us. Come on... More fear-mongering from that knuckle-heads website.

Their last so-called non-lethal weapon (tasers) is killing people. Besides, they love to use their toys so many times they use provocateers to start the violence so they can use their new toys.

[Rangeley]

Alex Jones isnt a credible source, but what do the credible sources say? If you watched the 60 Minutes segment, at the end they state there have been cases of injury caused by this Raygun in testing, and when testing they would have people face away from it to protect peoples eyes. Microwaves are harmful for your eyes, because your eyes are bad at heat transfer and are damaged when a lot of heat is applied to them. Its why you arent supposed to stand close to microwaves when heating food. They can literally cook.

Using microwaves as a "non-lethal" weapon comes with obvious risks - what if people are stuck in a crowd and cant easilly get out of the way? What if the operator turns up the power on them?

The concerns about this weapon are legitimate, and are not fearmongering. We have seen how other "non-lethal" weapons are used against even non-violent people, just because the fake protesters in the video were throwing things doesnt mean this will only be used against people who are violent.

[SeanEdwards]

Umm... They showed the protestors in the video throwing shit at them and acting in a "violent" manner. Troops don't want to shoot them, so they use a ray-gun that won't cause any major pain. The big deal about the ray-gun is...? Oh wait, Alex Jones is reporting about it so they must be using it as the next phase to enslave us. Come on... More fear-mongering from that knuckle-heads website.

That's what I'm talking about. The jackbooted thugs at Kent state didn't have any trouble dispersing protestors, and they did it without Buck Rogers raygun tech.

Personally, I think I'd rather be dispersed by a high-tech less-than-lethal pain ray, as opposed to the low tech cavalry charge / sabering of Dr. Zhivago.

But then this forum is full of nitwits who have gone on the record saying that they'd rather be shot than tasered. The world is overflowing with stupid people. And hucksters like AJ are more than willing to exploit that stupidity to make a buck.

[kombayn]

Alex Jones isnt a credible source, but what do the credible sources say? If you watched the 60 Minutes segment, at the end they state there have been cases of injury caused by this Raygun in testing, and when testing they would have people face away from it to protect peoples eyes. Microwaves are harmful for your eyes, because your eyes are bad at heat transfer and are damaged when a lot of heat is applied to them. Its why you arent supposed to stand close to microwaves when heating food. They can literally cook.

Using microwaves as a "non-lethal" weapon comes with obvious risks - what if people are stuck in a crowd and cant easilly get out of the way? What if the operator turns up the power on them?

The concerns about this weapon are legitimate, and are not fearmongering. We have seen how other "non-lethal" weapons are used against even non-violent people, just because the fake protesters in the video were throwing things doesnt mean this will only be used against people who are violent.

But it also doesn't mean they're going to use it on peaceful protesters. I know that you have a concern with the weapon, but I find it to be unfair to immediately put up a scare tactic that they're going to use this on people in a harmful way. I find it very misleading and that article that was wrote on PrisonPlanet.com is pure fear-mongering.

[SeanEdwards]

Their last so-called non-lethal weapon (tasers) is killing people. Besides, they love to use their toys so many times they use provocateers to start the violence so they can use their new toys.

I bet Amadou Diallo (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Amadou_Diallo) would have preferred to be tasered.

[PatriotOne]

That's what I'm talking about. The jackbooted thugs at Kent state didn't have any trouble dispersing protestors, and they did it without Buck Rogers raygun tech.

Personally, I think I'd rather be dispersed by a high-tech less-than-lethal pain ray, as opposed to the low tech cavalry charge / sabering of Dr. Zhivago.

But then this forum is full of nitwits who have gone on the record saying that they'd rather be shot than tasered. The world is overflowing with stupid people. And hucksters like AJ are more than willing to exploit that stupidity to make a buck.

They'll be tasering uncooperative toddlers who don't share their toys next:

RCMP subdue hospitalized man, 82, with Taser

http://www.cbc.ca/canada/british-columbia/story/2008/05/08/bc-kamloops-man-taser.html

[evilfunnystuff]

But it also doesn't mean they're going to use it on peaceful protesters. I know that you have a concern with the weapon, but I find it to be unfair to immediately put up a scare tactic that they're going to use this on people in a harmful way. I find it very misleading and that article that was wrote on PrisonPlanet.com is pure fear-mongering.

likem they didnt shoot this peacfull protester in the face with a rubber bullet in this cnn coverage then get caught on tape jokin about it

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=G63FEamhpA0&feature=related

[SeanEdwards]

They'll be tasering uncooperative toddlers who don't share their toys next:

RCMP subdue hospitalized man, 82, with Taser

http://www.cbc.ca/canada/british-columbia/story/2008/05/08/bc-kamloops-man-taser.html

A fallacious combo shot! Appeal to emotion and slippery slope fallacy all in one! Bravo!

[PatriotOne]

But it also doesn't mean they're going to use it on peaceful protesters. I know that you have a concern with the weapon, but I find it to be unfair to immediately put up a scare tactic that they're going to use this on people in a harmful way. I find it very misleading and that article that was wrote on PrisonPlanet.com is pure fear-mongering.

Ummm, yeah. People should be afraid that their own government is planning on using ray guns on them if they want to protest.

[newbitech]

Abuse of power and authority plain and simple. These weapons get developed so the the government can stay 1 up on the people. The government wouldn't have to spend the money or worry about saving face if it didn't go around pissing people off in the first place.

The people in this thread bashing AJ and supporting tech like tasers and rayguns ought to peel back a few more layers. I understand the objectivity, but really folks, do we want our cops running around with devices that can force an entire crowd of people to go in to a stampede? What about innocent bystanders? I guess its ok if cops burn the shit out of someone who is reporting on crowd, or protecting their shop from looters or whatever.

I suppose little children who are with their parents during this type of protest also deserve to get burnt to hell to? Come on people, use your brains. This is a weapon to be used against a GROUP of people. Sort of like cluster bombs, nukes, chems, etc etc.

And am I the only one who caught what the AIRFORCE Sec said? if we're not willing to use it here against our fellow citizens, then we should not be willing to use it in a wartime situation. Since when the hell did the military especially the AF start giving a RATS ASS what the world thinks about how it conducts business. And for the sake of all that is good and right, since when did testing wartime weapons against American Citizens become part of the military SOP?

So not only are people defending this weapon, they are defending this mentality! Please, use your critical thinking against the people who are your enemy and NOT against fellow Ron Paul Revolution supporters!

Re: AJ, if it weren't for this article on Prison Planet, I might have never known. Much like many other articles that AJ has connected the dots and put the pieces together. Maybe you don't like his opinion, but I don't see anyone else out there with the nads to do what he's doing. He's waking people up and exposing the REAL FRAUD.

[evilfunnystuff]

like the police didnt try to incite violence pretending to be protester at this spp protest

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9Q1Fbuq2cT8

[humanic]

Don't raygun me bro.

lol

[Dequeant]

Two words......

Aluminium Foil

It protects against energy weapons (such as this) AND tazers. Doesn't stop bullets so well so don't get TOO cocky (pretty sure the cops will freak when you dont run away/pull the leads out and throw them back at them).
I'll be in St Paul, and my clothes WILL be lined with aluminium foil. I'm going to do it nice, as in two layers of clothing with the aluminium foil between them. This way no one will ever KNOW its there, but it will be there.

Ironic.......our tin foil hats will keep us safe..........wear them proudly!

[SeanEdwards]

Abuse of power and authority plain and simple.


And you're claiming that inanimate objects make this abuse inevitable? Isn't that the same argument that gun-grabbers use to justify their fear of firearms?



I understand the objectivity, but really folks, do we want our cops running around with devices that can force an entire crowd of people to go in to a stampede?


:confused:

Volley fire from a bunch of high powered rifles doesn't alarm protestors?



And am I the only one who caught what the AIRFORCE Sec said? if we're not willing to use it here against our fellow citizens, then we should not be willing to use it in a wartime situation.

So not only are people defending this weapon, they are defending this mentality! Please, use your critical thinking against the people who are your enemy and NOT against fellow Ron Paul Revolution supporters!

The mentality that it's preferrable to disperse a mob without resorting to killing lots of people? What mentality exactly are you defending?

[SeanEdwards]

Two words......

Aluminium Foil

It protects against energy weapons (such as this) AND tazers. Doesn't stop bullets so well so don't get TOO cocky (pretty sure the cops will freak when you dont run away/pull the leads out and throw them back at them).
I'll be in St Paul, and my clothes WILL be lined with aluminium foil. I'm going to do it nice, as in two layers of clothing with the aluminium foil between them. This way no one will ever KNOW its there, but it will be there.

Ironic.......our tin foil hats will keep us safe..........wear them proudly!

Brilliant. Force them to escalate to deadly force when oppressing you. Darwinism in action?

[newbitech]

And you're claiming that inanimate objects make this abuse inevitable? Isn't that the same argument that gun-grabbers use to justify their fear of firearms?



:confused:

Volley fire from a bunch of high powered rifles doesn't alarm protestors?



The mentality that it's preferrable to disperse a mob without resorting to killing lots of people? What mentality exactly are you defending?

Not going to argue you for the sake of arguing. Nor am I interested in a debate. Would you care to share your opinion in direct statements to me?

Assuming you want clarification. Abuse of power and authority comes in the form of threatening to use high tech mass effect weapons against a group of peaceful protesters. The right to peacefully assemble is protected by the constitution. Apparently there is a need to directly challenge this right with the threat of force. So in a nutshell, yes crowd control weapons that have more than a localized effect are an abuse of power.

No it is not the same argument. The people wielding this weapon represent the government and the government does not have a natural right to keep and bear arms.

Any threat to a GROUP of people is unconstitutional. Our most fundamental laws protect the rights of each individual in that group. By targeting a group the people using ANY form of mass crowd control weapon in a peaceful situation, the government is denying due process. This law gets broken by cops all the time because of the virtual abolishment of the 4th amendment and the gross misinterpretation of "probable cause".

Was that a question? Read what is highlighted in red, thats what it sounds like you are defending. You think its ok for cops to rush there horses in to a crowd they want to disperse too?

I say if no one is getting hurt and no property is damaged, then the cops should find a donut shop until someone calls them. I am also against the mentality that says because someone has a badge, or judge in front of their name, then they are allowed to punish you for a crime that you MIGHT commit. That mentality reeks.

I am also against using American protesters and dissenters as an example of how we will treat sovereign countries if they are also against our government. If fact, the logic is quite backwards.

If your own people are that upset with your policies, then maybe you ought to review your policies before forcing them on the rest of the world. Our Government is ass backwards.

[newbitech]

Brilliant. Force them to escalate to deadly force when oppressing you. Darwinism in action?

hey I know I already responded to you directly, but are you advocating a tolerant approach to the encroachments of the state on the natural rights of the people?

[surf]

anyone really believe that these things can't be lethal if directed at someone for an extended period of time? if that claim is true - i appologize for my ingorance, but i'm thinking of someone that - for whatever reason - can't move.

[Rangeley]

anyone really believe that these things can't be lethal if directed at someone for an extended period of time? if that claim is true - i appologize for my ingorance, but i'm thinking of someone that - for whatever reason - can't move.
Of course they can be lethal, but even less then that, they can cause serious damage including blindness if someone is subjected to it for an extended period of time.

In a chaotic crowd, people could be trapped and totally unable to escape due to being in a mass of people. Make them feel like they are on fire, and its worse then yelling fire.

[armstrong]

wow , just what the next 90-155 days will bring us....somebody write a book just on from jan to the election...not to mention the bank meltdowns,fuel,a new war,the election,the repulican convention,and a possible withdraw of Hillary that may run independent,,,,and so on...wow

[SeanEdwards]

Not going to argue you for the sake of arguing. Nor am I interested in a debate. Would you care to share your opinion in direct statements to me?


No, I don't want to have a private discussion with you, I prefer to debate right here where anyone can view and chime in.



Assuming you want clarification. Abuse of power and authority comes in the form of threatening to use high tech mass effect weapons against a group of peaceful protesters. The right to peacefully assemble is protected by the constitution. Apparently there is a need to directly challenge this right with the threat of force. So in a nutshell, yes crowd control weapons that have more than a localized effect are an abuse of power.


This is logically absurd. Abuse of power has nothing to do with area effect weapons. Power can just as easily be abused using weapons of pinpoint accuracy. A sniper taking carefully aimed headshots at protest leaders is not an abuse of power in your construct? In Korea they use specially trained martial artists to infiltrate crowds of protestors, single out ring leaders, and beat them senseless with their hands and feet. That's not abuse? Abuse could be conducted without weapons at all, by identifying protestors and attacking them with the judicial system, or an IRS audit.

Your objection is to government oppression of lawful assembly, it has nothing to do with the means used to affect that oppression. And to be clear, I'm not in favor of government oppression, whether it's done with pain rays, or any other means. But then I'm also opposed to murder, whether done with a gun, or a knife.



No it is not the same argument. The people wielding this weapon represent the government and the government does not have a natural right to keep and bear arms.


The people, through their representatives, authorize the government to use weapons to maintain law and order.



Any threat to a GROUP of people is unconstitutional. Our most fundamental laws protect the rights of each individual in that group. By targeting a group the people using ANY form of mass crowd control weapon in a peaceful situation, the government is denying due process. This law gets broken by cops all the time because of the virtual abolishment of the 4th amendment and the gross misinterpretation of "probable cause".


That's an interesting argument. Of course, you again qualify your argument with the magic words "peaceful situation", which kind of renders the entire position moot. Any forceful attack on a peaceful lawful assembly is invariably unjust. The more interesting question is whether threats of force against a non-peaceful group, particularily indiscriminate area weapons, is unconstitutional because of the concept of individual guilt before the law and not group guilt. I would argue that there's extensive legal precedent supporting the use of indiscriminate weapons to disperse mobs, such as tear gas and water cannons. This pain ray is not really much different functionally.



Was that a question? Read what is highlighted in red, thats what it sounds like you are defending.

I understood the comment in red to mean that it would be politically untenable to deploy a less-than-lethal weapon system against foreigners that we'd be unwilling to deploy against our own citizens. Makes perfect sense to me.



You think its ok for cops to rush there horses in to a crowd they want to disperse too?


I guess I have to reiterate that I object to any abuse of power to unlawfully oppress peaceful assembly, and I don't care what technical means is used to affect that oppression. Abuse via horses, abuse via pain ray, abuse via holding down and tickling, it's all the same to me. Murder is murder no matter what weapon is used.



I say if no one is getting hurt and no property is damaged, then the cops should find a donut shop until someone calls them.


Uh yeah. Do you really think anyone is going to argue with that statement? Do you imagine that I'm sitting here, clammoring for SWAT to hose down a peaceful church social with a pain gun?



If your own people are that upset with your policies, then maybe you ought to review your policies before forcing them on the rest of the world. Our Government is ass backwards.

And when the embassy is being attacked by a mob and set on fire, do you prefer that the embassy staff burn alive, defend themselves with firearms, or use less than lethal weapons, like a pain ray, to try and de-escalate the situation?

[SeanEdwards]

hey I know I already responded to you directly, but are you advocating a tolerant approach to the encroachments of the state on the natural rights of the people?

I'm saying that if the cops are shooting pain rays at you, that it's time to leave. It's not time to defeat their less-than-lethal weapons system, thus placing them in the position of using more lethal weapons on you. Do you imagine that when their pain ray doesn't have the desired effect that the cops will just give up and go back to the donut shop?

If cops are abusing their authority to attack peaceful assembly, then the lawful way to resist is through the courts, not mob combat in the streets with your aluminum foil armor.

[AFM]

lets name it Ronald Raygun

HAHAHHAA

[fxmercenary]

I'm saying that if the cops are shooting pain rays at you, that it's time to leave. It's not time to defeat their less-than-lethal weapons system, thus placing them in the position of using more lethal weapons on you. Do you imagine that when their pain ray doesn't have the desired effect that the cops will just give up and go back to the donut shop?

If cops are abusing their authority to attack peaceful assembly, then the lawful way to resist is through the courts, not mob combat in the streets with your aluminum foil armor.

What is this aluminum foil armor, and where can I purchase it? Does it come with a mirror shield?

[AFM]

It comes with a Robocop helmet

[SeanEdwards]

What is this aluminum foil armor, and where can I purchase it? Does it come with a mirror shield?

You're giving me a great idea for a halloween costume.

[kombayn]

likem they didnt shoot this peacfull protester in the face with a rubber bullet in this cnn coverage then get caught on tape jokin about it

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=G63FEamhpA0&feature=related

Alright, fair enough. The cop who shot her should be suspended and the leading commander who laughed should seriously start looking for a new line of work. Cops are human beings too, they're doing what is told of them so they don't lose a job or their lively hood. Plus, that chick will get her lawsuit money anyways and it's not like she was injured in the situation.

I love how people are so quick to point the finger at authorities as if they're the bad-guy, you can see all this cop-bashing all over the place yet... I never see one topic that actually gives a thumbs up to our troops, officers, fire-fighters and other people who serve civilians so they don't have to deal with war, crime or natural disasters.

Alex Jones & the "Truth Movement" are nothing more than a one-sided secular group. I think Alex Jones promotes more hate than our own government at times, and the funny part is he doesn't do it at other nations who truly put people through tyranny, he claims the people with-in our own country are tyrants.

But the funny part is... 23 years I lived in America and for 23 years, I've lead a prosperous and peaceful life, 'nuff said!

[RadioDJforPaul]

Wait, so wearing tinfoil will deflect the microwave rays? Why is it when I put tin foil in the microwave it catches on fire?!

[RideTheDirt]

Someone in this thread may be cooked at the convention if he decides to wear ALUMINUMfoil and the police bust out this pain ray:eek:

[FindLiberty]

Cooked like a baked potato...

Foil will work fine but remember you also need some copper or aluminum window screen to see / breathe through! Fiberglass screen is useless to block microwaves.

Without this, the clear parts inside your eyes will whiten and cook like, well an egg white ...and leave your quite BLIND unless you have an inner Vulcan eyelid.

Also, the suggestion to sandwich aluminum foil between two RP signs was PERFECT. With a slight bowing to form a rudimentary parabolic reflector, the ray could be re-directed back to its source. The Police will also need to add foil to their clear plastic shields and helmet visors. Then, set the ray to "extra crispy" and 19 minutes after everyone is blinded, the streets can be flooded with warm Jello and everyone can thrash about until they find peace and love. Ah, what a sight for sore eyes. On second thought, this all is a very bad idea (starting with the death ray device), so lets just stick to the Liberty message instead. It can be emitted from the free-speech-zone, if they permit one.

[Grimnir Wotansvolk]

lets just stick to the Liberty message instead. It can be emitted from the free-speech-zone, if they permit one.Yes, let's retreat to a restricted free-speech zone so that we can fight for our right to freedom of speech. We can also use bombs and violence to show them how much we love peace.

[Ninja Homer]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Active_Denial_System
"Electromagnetic radiation cannot pass through a conductor, so the effect can be shielded by a a conductive mesh or foil which forms a Faraday cage around the target."

Foil would work, but metal window screen material would probably work better. Window screen also works for tasers.

More...
"While the effects can be unpleasant, ADS has undergone extensive testing since its inception more than 12 years ago. Research into whether or not the device will cause long term health effects has been inconclusive. Many aspects of the research are classified, making independent evaluation impossible. The beam is designed only to affect an individual for a short moment, due to safety presets and features, but these settings can be overridden by the operator.[9] According to public release, there have been over 10,700 "shots" by ADS.[10] At least eight people have been seriously injured by the ADS system[citation needed], and several of those were hospitalized with second degree burns (blister injuries)."

I don't particularly trust proper use of this when the operator can override the safety features. How powerful can it get?

[NEPA_Revolution]

Seriously though, make the signs with the foil and the angle. If anybody needs 2x4 Signs I have two just for the occasion.

[newbitech]

No, I don't want to have a private discussion with you, I prefer to debate right here where anyone can view and chime in.



This is logically absurd. Abuse of power has nothing to do with area effect weapons. Power can just as easily be abused using weapons of pinpoint accuracy. A sniper taking carefully aimed headshots at protest leaders is not an abuse of power in your construct? In Korea they use specially trained martial artists to infiltrate crowds of protestors, single out ring leaders, and beat them senseless with their hands and feet. That's not abuse? Abuse could be conducted without weapons at all, by identifying protestors and attacking them with the judicial system, or an IRS audit.

Your objection is to government oppression of lawful assembly, it has nothing to do with the means used to affect that oppression. And to be clear, I'm not in favor of government oppression, whether it's done with pain rays, or any other means. But then I'm also opposed to murder, whether done with a gun, or a knife.



The people, through their representatives, authorize the government to use weapons to maintain law and order.



That's an interesting argument. Of course, you again qualify your argument with the magic words "peaceful situation", which kind of renders the entire position moot. Any forceful attack on a peaceful lawful assembly is invariably unjust. The more interesting question is whether threats of force against a non-peaceful group, particularily indiscriminate area weapons, is unconstitutional because of the concept of individual guilt before the law and not group guilt. I would argue that there's extensive legal precedent supporting the use of indiscriminate weapons to disperse mobs, such as tear gas and water cannons. This pain ray is not really much different functionally.



I understood the comment in red to mean that it would be politically untenable to deploy a less-than-lethal weapon system against foreigners that we'd be unwilling to deploy against our own citizens. Makes perfect sense to me.



I guess I have to reiterate that I object to any abuse of power to unlawfully oppress peaceful assembly, and I don't care what technical means is used to affect that oppression. Abuse via horses, abuse via pain ray, abuse via holding down and tickling, it's all the same to me. Murder is murder no matter what weapon is used.



Uh yeah. Do you really think anyone is going to argue with that statement? Do you imagine that I'm sitting here, clammoring for SWAT to hose down a peaceful church social with a pain gun?



And when the embassy is being attacked by a mob and set on fire, do you prefer that the embassy staff burn alive, defend themselves with firearms, or use less than lethal weapons, like a pain ray, to try and de-escalate the situation?

I assume you didn't watch the video. the "mob" was carrying anti-war signs. look find someone else to argue with ok? if cops cant de-escalate without violence, then they aren't doing the job we need them to do.

The threat of force, overwhelming force you know SHOCK AND AWE is what will cause people to form mobs. you can't threaten peaceful people with violence and then turn around and call them hypocrites when they knock your ass out.

[newbitech]

How powerful can it get?

tesla weapons, scalar technology, btw this entire video is awesome.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YIFRzAua3m0

microwave weapon from raytheon 2006.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TKlKhMbK468&feature=related

so to answer your question.. microwave technology can get as powerful as the people buying this stuff want it to get.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z2qzoN1oynI&feature=related (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z2qzoN1oynI&feature=related)

[Rhys]

http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=5739498632493916944&q=Active+Denial+System+60&ei=8qlFSOSLAY784AKa6MT5CA

60 minutes report

[Rhys]

lol i keep watching. 3 sheets of paper can stop this thing. big deal. let them shoot us with it. no pain, no gain.

haha still watching. the girl who got shot with it giggled. rofl

[Kade]

Prison Planet ≠ credible source

I can't even get to the site.. .but I posted the CBS news article about this two months ago...

[invisible]

This weapon is inherently unsafe. It works the exact same way that your microwave oven cooks food. What are considered to be rules of safe practice in working with microwaves are being totally ignored here. We are cautioned to never look into a waveguide or microwave antenna. We are cautioned to never open a microwave oven while it is operational. We are cautioned to never intentionally expose oneself to microwave energy in any way. If this microwave energy is safe, then why does our own federal government have standards for exposure? OSHA has a set of standards for safe levels of microwave exposure. The FCC has a set of standards for safe levels of microwave exposure. If microwaves are so safe, why are there very strict standards as to how much of this energy can leak from a microwave oven before it can be sold to consumers? I haven't seen any technical specifications on the field strength or power produced by this weapon, but for it to boil the water in someone's skin at a distance of a half mile, it obviously has to have a LOT more power than a microwave oven (and that power will be "amplified" by the gain of that large parabolic antenna). There is NO POSSIBLE WAY that this weapon is safe, according to the government's own set of standards (both OSHA and FCC). I find it very convenient that 60 minutes (and all other news sources, apparently) forgot to do even the tiniest bit of research into the generally accepted standards of safe microwave exposure. Is there any way we can challenge it's deployment, based on the government's own standards of safety?

A quick google search for "osha standards microwave exposure" and "fcc standards microwave exposure" should be an eye-opener.