Mike Gravel is Desperate

[paulaholic]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TI6PA4v6dZg

[Conza88]

:eek:

If only she had brains.

[newyearsrevolution08]

I need to drink more... lol

[Perry]

Ow my ears.
Mike still has easily the best music video of the bunch.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Q1PeZDHXgsw

[angelatc]

I like Mike Gravel.

[Mesogen]

Poor Mike Gravel. I once respected him. Now he's going around telling libertarians (and Libertarians) that global government, no no I mean governance, is the answer.

What a tool.

[sophocles07]

Yea, that's pretty bad.

[yongrel]

Hahaha. I love it. I can't wait to be a crazy old man.

[amy31416]

Wow.

He's a friggin' hoot, that one.

[Patriot123]

You know, this is the sort of stuff that really just ticks me off... I just love how people are always trying to make Gravel out to be this joke. He's anything but a joke. Must I remind you that this man has accomplished more in Congress than many others? More than Ron Paul himself. Give the damn man some respect. You'd most likely be dead if it weren't for him stopping the draft ;) Either that, or this country would have gone bankrupt a long time ago.


Poor Mike Gravel. I once respected him. Now he's going around telling libertarians (and Libertarians) that global government, no no I mean governance, is the answer.

What a tool.
That's because a global government is the solution. If you crazy Alex Jones nut jobs would stop seeing a world government as hell for mankind with RFID chips and everything else, you might actually come to your senses and see that a global government doesn't have to be bad ;) A world government based on the Republic system would essentially solve a majority of the worlds problems. Gravel endorses this. Not some crazy RFID filled world government like Alex Jones dreams about.

[amy31416]

You know, this is the sort of stuff that really just ticks me off... I just love how people are always trying to make Gravel out to be this joke. He's anything but a joke. Must I remind you that this man has accomplished more in Congress than many others? More than Ron Paul himself. Give the damn man some respect. You'd most likely be dead if it weren't for him stopping the draft ;) Either that, or this country would have gone bankrupt a long time ago.



Gravel is the one who made that video, among many other videos that are exceedingly campy and cheesy.

I respect a lot of what he's done, but man, Gravel is playing the part of a goofball intentionally--he's the one who's doing it. It's part of his non-traditional, over-the-top persona. Hasn't he always been known as being a bit off-kilter?

[ThePieSwindler]

That's because a global government is the solution. If you crazy Alex Jones nut jobs would stop seeing a world government as hell for mankind with RFID chips and everything else, you might actually come to your senses and see that a global government doesn't have to be bad ;) A world government based on the Republic system would essentially solve a majority of the worlds problems. Gravel endorses this. Not some crazy RFID filled world government like Alex Jones dreams about.

Hmm. I'm not sure world government (even of a more benevolent kind) is exactly the key to more freedom, but i also tend to agree that its hardly the end of humanity, and is probably eventually inevitable. People rarely talk about motives when discussing conspiracy theory - they always assume the worst. Sure, some elites are jackasses who care little for humanity, but its too simplistic to say they all are, and they all want to enslave humanity. The biggest thing to remember about "the system" in place, is that the reason its still working so well at keeping people as sheep, is because people are actually taken care of fairly well under it, in some instances. Sure they complain, but they don't REALLY do anything about it because they have their home, their family, and a decent life. The elites are very smart, and they realize that there must be appeasement and even a mostly-beneficial system in place to keep the system moving.

Of course, there is also plenty of malevolence and contempt for humanity, but its not some grand orchestrated conspiracy. The elites are humans too, and they often have similar motivations to you or I in much of what they do - though perhaps on a much grander scale. The betterment of humanity is perhaps one.

I think world government as the key to human progress is a bit simplistic of an answer. We worry about what is happening in American government, and by extending that to a world state, these sorts of trends will probably only become magnified. I fail to see how this would change much, perhaps other than having more formal peace. I'm no fanboy of national sovereignty, so i think an alternative social order of some sort would be best, but certainly not likely. The republican nation state, and perhaps the larger-but-similar (and perhaps worse) world-state, are here to stay, because too many believe democracy/republicanism is the "last form of government".

[BenIsForRon]

I think Gravel is referring to more of a voluntary, participatory world government. Not one that dictates laws to nations, but rather is a place for open discussion amongst nations. If the UN didn't enforce it's laws by violence or coercion, and allowed all nations to join, I would be in favor of it.

[Kotin]

Hmm. I'm not sure world government (even of a more benevolent kind) is exactly the key to more freedom, but i also tend to agree that its hardly the end of humanity, and is probably eventually inevitable. People rarely talk about motives when discussing conspiracy theory - they always assume the worst. Sure, some elites are jackasses who care little for humanity, but its too simplistic to say they all are, and they all want to enslave humanity. The biggest thing to remember about "the system" in place, is that the reason its still working so well at keeping people as sheep, is because people are actually taken care of fairly well under it, in some instances. Sure they complain, but they don't REALLY do anything about it because they have their home, their family, and a decent life. The elites are very smart, and they realize that there must be appeasement and even a mostly-beneficial system in place to keep the system moving.

Of course, there is also plenty of malevolence and contempt for humanity, but its not some grand orchestrated conspiracy. The elites are humans too, and they often have similar motivations to you or I in much of what they do - though perhaps on a much grander scale. The betterment of humanity is perhaps one.

I think world government as the key to human progress is a bit simplistic of an answer. We worry about what is happening in American government, and by extending that to a world state, these sorts of trends will probably only become magnified. I fail to see how this would change much, perhaps other than having more formal peace. I'm no fanboy of national sovereignty, so i think an alternative social order of some sort would be best, but certainly not likely. The republican nation state, and perhaps the larger-but-similar (and perhaps worse) world-state, are here to stay, because too many believe democracy/republicanism is the "last form of government".

The Pie Swindler is an impeccable name.

[sophocles07]

I don't think Gravel is a crazy old man etc.; he doesnt have the best public relations man though.

[mdh]

Poor Mike Gravel. I once respected him. Now he's going around telling libertarians (and Libertarians) that global government, no no I mean governance, is the answer.

What a tool.

Uhhh, no he isn't. He said something along the lines of nations working together globally (free trade, to fight environmental problems, etc). He's come out against the UN types and the globalist corporatists quite strongly.
He's never advocated global governance.

[Patriot123]

Uhhh, no he isn't. He said something along the lines of nations working together globally (free trade, to fight environmental problems, etc). He's come out against the UN types and the globalist corporatists quite strongly.
He's never advocated global governance.

Uh... Yes he has. Definitely, definitely, definitely has. Just not the kind that Alex Jones preaches about ;)



Hmm. I'm not sure world government (even of a more benevolent kind) is exactly the key to more freedom, but i also tend to agree that its hardly the end of humanity, and is probably eventually inevitable. People rarely talk about motives when discussing conspiracy theory - they always assume the worst. Sure, some elites are jackasses who care little for humanity, but its too simplistic to say they all are, and they all want to enslave humanity. The biggest thing to remember about "the system" in place, is that the reason its still working so well at keeping people as sheep, is because people are actually taken care of fairly well under it, in some instances. Sure they complain, but they don't REALLY do anything about it because they have their home, their family, and a decent life. The elites are very smart, and they realize that there must be appeasement and even a mostly-beneficial system in place to keep the system moving.

Of course, there is also plenty of malevolence and contempt for humanity, but its not some grand orchestrated conspiracy. The elites are humans too, and they often have similar motivations to you or I in much of what they do - though perhaps on a much grander scale. The betterment of humanity is perhaps one.

I think world government as the key to human progress is a bit simplistic of an answer. We worry about what is happening in American government, and by extending that to a world state, these sorts of trends will probably only become magnified. I fail to see how this would change much, perhaps other than having more formal peace. I'm no fanboy of national sovereignty, so i think an alternative social order of some sort would be best, but certainly not likely. The republican nation state, and perhaps the larger-but-similar (and perhaps worse) world-state, are here to stay, because too many believe democracy/republicanism is the "last form of government".
It would unify the world. It would end many conflicts in the world. And, if it's done right, like something like our founders envisioned and we actually make a decent constitution, unlike ours, which states the size that the federal government must be; small, require local militias individually run by the people, etcetera, then we would be quite prosperous. A global government would be a dream come true, if done right. However, like Gravel has said in the past and still stands by like myself and others, we as a human race are not ready for it as of now, and won't be for a while. Let me say that again.

Gravel stands by the fact that we as a human race are not ready for a global government yet, and won't be for a while.

[stilltrying]

Hmm. I'm not sure world government (even of a more benevolent kind) is exactly the key to more freedom, but i also tend to agree that its hardly the end of humanity, and is probably eventually inevitable. People rarely talk about motives when discussing conspiracy theory - they always assume the worst. Sure, some elites are jackasses who care little for humanity, but its too simplistic to say they all are, and they all want to enslave humanity. The biggest thing to remember about "the system" in place, is that the reason its still working so well at keeping people as sheep, is because people are actually taken care of fairly well under it, in some instances. Sure they complain, but they don't REALLY do anything about it because they have their home, their family, and a decent life. The elites are very smart, and they realize that there must be appeasement and even a mostly-beneficial system in place to keep the system moving.

Of course, there is also plenty of malevolence and contempt for humanity, but its not some grand orchestrated conspiracy. The elites are humans too, and they often have similar motivations to you or I in much of what they do - though perhaps on a much grander scale. The betterment of humanity is perhaps one.

I think world government as the key to human progress is a bit simplistic of an answer. We worry about what is happening in American government, and by extending that to a world state, these sorts of trends will probably only become magnified. I fail to see how this would change much, perhaps other than having more formal peace. I'm no fanboy of national sovereignty, so i think an alternative social order of some sort would be best, but certainly not likely. The republican nation state, and perhaps the larger-but-similar (and perhaps worse) world-state, are here to stay, because too many believe democracy/republicanism is the "last form of government".

Yea Codex Alimetarius is great. Natural health means are BAD for you, go pickup some poisons I mean pharmaceuticals and line the pockets of corporates who are being shielded by global government whom plan make illegal vitamins and minerals. Go get them from your genetically engineered foods. I oh forgot humans have been living on earth for at least 4000 years and food wasnt quite right for humans so we must modify it to whatever Monsanto, Codex, and global government tell us is natural. Fuck world government plain and simple. If these small nations cannot manage their current problems making a bigger nation is not going to make it easier. WHEN HAS ADDING VERY LARGE NUMBERS EVER MADE ANYTHING EASIER OR MORE MANAGEABLE.

[AFM]

Thats the funniest thing Ive ever seen

[AFM]

He just said "gravela hella copta"

[AFM]

Gravela Helicopta Up In This Hizzouse

[mdh]

Uh... Yes he has. Definitely, definitely, definitely has. Just not the kind that Alex Jones preaches about ;)



It would unify the world. It would end many conflicts in the world. And, if it's done right, like something like our founders envisioned and we actually make a decent constitution, unlike ours, which states the size that the federal government must be; small, require local militias individually run by the people, etcetera, then we would be quite prosperous. A global government would be a dream come true, if done right. However, like Gravel has said in the past and still stands by like myself and others, we as a human race are not ready for it as of now, and won't be for a while. Let me say that again.

Gravel stands by the fact that we as a human race are not ready for a global government yet, and won't be for a while.

That's not advocating, that's having a dialogue on. I dialogue on a vast many things which I do not advocate. So do most intellectual folks.

[Patriot123]

Yea Codex Alimetarius is great. Natural health means are BAD for you, go pickup some poisons I mean pharmaceuticals and line the pockets of corporates who are being shielded by global government whom plan make illegal vitamins and minerals. Go get them from your genetically engineered foods. I oh forgot humans have been living on earth for at least 4000 years and food wasnt quite right for humans so we must modify it to whatever Monsanto, Codex, and global government tell us is natural. Fuck world government plain and simple. If these small nations cannot manage their current problems making a bigger nation is not going to make it easier. WHEN HAS ADDING VERY LARGE NUMBERS EVER MADE ANYTHING EASIER OR MORE MANAGEABLE.

You're assuming what a world government would be like. Obviously thanks to Alex Jones, I presume. A world government, like one advocated by Mike Gravel, would be a Democratic one, or one based off of the Republic system. Doesn't mean it would have all of that junk ;) Remember, it's global. Meaning if you piss people off, you're gonna' be pissing an entire planet off.

[Patriot123]

That's not advocating, that's having a dialogue on. I dialogue on a vast many things which I do not advocate. So do most intellectual folks.

...he advocates it. He publically said he advocates it. I can't quite find the clip at the moment, but he certainly has said this.

[Mesogen]

I think Gravel is referring to more of a voluntary, participatory world government. Not one that dictates laws to nations, but rather is a place for open discussion amongst nations. If the UN didn't enforce it's laws by violence or coercion, and allowed all nations to join, I would be in favor of it.

The UN doesn't have laws. And they don't enforce anything by violence.

Some countries (*cough, US, Israel, cough*) use the UN as a forum for coercion and sometimes an excuse for violence, but the UN is not a monolith.

Sorry, that wasn't clear.

The UN wants to codify "International Law" so that every nation has to follow it. Right now there is only treaties between/among nations. Not universal codified international law.
http://www.un.org/law/ilc/

Here is one clip with Mike Gravel advocating UN control and global governance:
http://antiwar.com/radio/2008/04/07/mike-gravel/

Here's another:
http://mp3.wtprn.com/Badnarik/0804/20080414_Mon_Badnarik1.mp3
http://mp3.wtprn.com/Badnarik/0804/20080414_Mon_Badnarik2.mp3

[crazyfingers]

I can't believe Gravel is seriously trying to debate the merits of world government with Libertarians. Between that and his national initiative idea, it's like he's trying to lose the nomination. I guess I just assumed he'd focus on the things he has in common with Libertarians, like ending the military-industrial complex and the drug war, and restoring our civil liberties.

[Cowlesy]

I think Gravel is flopping around trying to be an LP candidate because he's racked up yet another enormous amount of debt.

http://www.opensecrets.org/pres08/summary.php?cid=N00007982&cycle=2008

In fact according to his December 2007 report, not only is he in violation of campaign finance laws since he has not filed since December, his campaign is about $112,000 in debt and it appears to have a cash overdraft of $2,733.

If I were him, I'd try and hang on as long as possible using the internet to try and paydown all that debt. Though, if his prior experiences with debt are any indication, he may just welch on it like he did a previous $90k in revolving debt he declared bankruptcy on.

I refuse to ever cast a vote for someone as fiscally irresponsible as Mike Gravel.

[Aratus]

Cowlesy... are you saying he's pulled on a small scale what hillary has done on a large scale?
that the reason why the money indicator does not go up for his LP run is that the new checks
only negate the debt insted of helping out the campaign kitty? i know bob barr has donations!

[Dieseler]

Many different races and religions, freewill and liberty would have to be destroyed before world government would or could work.
Someone would always have to be demonized and then euthanized.
Mankind can not rule itself as a Republic like we once had.
Look how we have failed right here even.
Mankind must know its limitations as it is all or nothing for the ones at the top.
Keep that in mind.

[IRO-bot]

You're assuming what a world government would be like. Obviously thanks to Alex Jones, I presume. A world government, like one advocated by Mike Gravel, would be a Democratic one, or one based off of the Republic system. Doesn't mean it would have all of that junk ;) Remember, it's global. Meaning if you piss people off, you're gonna' be pissing an entire planet off.

Yeah....because America's republic has worked out so wonderful! We haven't lost one single grain of freedom or civil liberties.
A quote comes to mind. One that I have often said on this board.

"Absolute power corrupts absolutely."

Well there it is. With that much power at stake you can be sure it won't be in the interest of freedom and liberty. :rolleyes:

[IRO-bot]

bump

[Patriot123]

Yeah....because America's republic has worked out so wonderful! We haven't lost one single grain of freedom or civil liberties.
A quote comes to mind. One that I have often said on this board.

"Absolute power corrupts absolutely."

Well there it is. With that much power at stake you can be sure it won't be in the interest of freedom and liberty. :rolleyes:

And that is due to the fact that we have a terrible Constitution.

[IRO-bot]

And that is due to the fact that we have a terrible Constitution.

Oh yes, I am sure all the powerful Kings, Queens, Presidents, and Dictators will be very willing to write a wonderful new WORLD constitution that absolutely garauntees our freedoms and liberty. /sarcasm. :rolleyes: