Court hears claim linking vaccines to autism

[PatriotOne]

Court hears claim linking vaccines to autism

Reuters

By Maggie Fox, Health and Science Editor

Mon May 12, 2008 2:36pm EDT

WASHINGTON (Reuters) - The parents of two 10-year-old boys who believe vaccines caused their sons to develop autism brought their case to U.S. federal court on Monday, arguing a mercury preservative in the shots caused a rare reaction.

Their case is the second of three being heard by a special court trying to determine if autism might sometimes be caused by vaccines. Although most medical experts say there is no link, the court can rule there is a plausible association and allow parents of children with autism to get federal compensation from a special vaccine fund.

More than 5,300 cases have been filed by parents who believe vaccines may have caused autism in their children and are seeking payment under the National Vaccine Injury Compensation Program, a no-fault system that pays out for vaccine injuries.

Under the program, someone injured by a vaccine does not have to prove the vaccine actually caused his or her injuries.

All that is necessary is to prove that vaccines sometimes cause that particular condition or injury. The no-fault payout system is meant to protect vaccine makers from costly lawsuits that drove many out of the vaccine-making business.

Payouts in such cases sometimes top $1 million. The compensation program is funded by a 75-cent tax on vaccinations.

The court is hearing three different theories on how vaccines might cause autism. One is that a combination vaccine for measles, mumps and rubella, or MMR, plus a mercury-containing preservative called thimerosal, can cause autism. The court heard those arguments last year and has not ruled.

On Monday, the court began hearing arguments that thimerosal in various vaccines might have caused autism in William Mead and Jordan King, both 10 and both from Portland, Oregon

INTERACTION WITH GENES

"What we will conclude ... is that thimerosal-containing vaccines belong on the list of environmental factors ... when one is evaluating what might have caused autism in a child when all of the other theories have been ruled out," attorney Tom Powers told the court in opening arguments.

He said the boys had conditions that made them especially vulnerable to the mercury in thimerosal.

"The evidence is indirect and it is circumstantial but it is supportive of the general theory of causation," he said.

No one knows what causes autism, which can severely disable a child with symptoms ranging from severe social avoidance to repetitive behaviors and sometimes profound mental retardation.

The U.S. Centers for Disease Control and Prevention estimates that about one in every 150 children has autism or a related disorder such as Asperger's syndrome.

Doctors agree there is a genetic link, and probably that something in the environment, possibly even conditions in the womb, can cause the brain effects that lead to symptoms.

While many studies have shown the thimerosal in vaccines has not caused autism, a vocal group argues the government and other experts are ignoring or covering up the evidence. Thimerosal has now been removed from most childhood vaccines.

"I think we will be able to convince you that the epidemic is real, that the increase is real," Mike Williams, another attorney for the boys, told the three "special masters" hearing the cases.

"The debate is over. There is no controversy," government attorney Lynn Ricciardella retorted in her opening arguments.

"The credible scientific community has already spoken on this issue and has rejected it."

Some autism activists have seized on the case of Hannah Poling, a girl from Georgia who won a case claiming a vaccine caused autism-like complications from a rare disorder.

The activists say it proves the federal courts gave in on the argument, but the government says Poling's case, which was removed from the special process and heard separately, was an exception and cannot be used as a precedent.

(Editing by Will Dunham and Cynthia Osterman)

[yongrel]

"Although most medical experts say there is no link..."

Nevermind the experts, huh? Ya know, the people who have spent their entire professional careers becoming informed and educated on this subject. Just ignore them.

"Under the program, someone injured by a vaccine does not have to prove the vaccine actually caused his or her injuries."

Wait... what? Hmm.

"Payouts in such cases sometimes top $1 million."

Well, that sounds like an awful good reason for a parent to claim their kid has autism from vaccines. 1 million reasons, actually.

"The evidence is indirect and it is circumstantial..."

"No one knows what causes autism..."

"While many studies have shown the thimerosal in vaccines has not caused autism..."

"...a vocal group argues the government and other experts are ignoring or covering up the evidence."

Do they mean, like, a conspiracy?! Duhn duhn duhnnn!

[asgardshill]

Under the program, someone injured by a vaccine does not have to prove the vaccine actually caused his or her injuries.


Wow. You might as well just fire up those FRN printing presses in Denver and San Francisco then, USG - you're gonna need a lot more long green. Christ on a pogo stick, no wonder we're in debt.

[amy31416]

I predict it could go like the silicone breast implant trial. Lots of money, lots of appeals to people's sympathy, zero scientific proof.

Silicone breast implants are considered safe to this day, even after all that hoopla.

[yongrel]

I predict it could go like the silicone breast implant trial. Lots of money, lots of appeals to people's sympathy, zero scientific proof.

Silicone breast implants are considered safe to this day, even after all that hoopla.

I have three that I use for juggling. No mysterious illnesses yet.

[amy31416]

I have three that I use for juggling. No mysterious illnesses yet.

You're such a boob.


(Oh man, that is rich.)

[PatriotOne]

"Although most medical experts say there is no link..."

Nevermind the experts, huh? Ya know, the people who have spent their entire professional careers becoming informed and educated on this subject. Just ignore them.

"Under the program, someone injured by a vaccine does not have to prove the vaccine actually caused his or her injuries."

Wait... what? Hmm.

"Payouts in such cases sometimes top $1 million."

Well, that sounds like an awful good reason for a parent to claim their kid has autism from vaccines. 1 million reasons, actually.

"The evidence is indirect and it is circumstantial..."

"No one knows what causes autism..."

"While many studies have shown the thimerosal in vaccines has not caused autism..."

"...a vocal group argues the government and other experts are ignoring or covering up the evidence."

Do they mean, like, a conspiracy?! Duhn duhn duhnnn!

The government experts also claimed there were WMD's in Iraq :rolleyes:

The "no fault" vaccine pay outs are to avoid trials and exposing the links to autism Yongrel. You can bet they have to sign away their rights to a court trial when they accept their hush money.

Quit being a big mo Yongrel ;)

[PatriotOne]

Never fails. I post a thread and the Government paid hyena's come out in force.

http://i39.photobucket.com/albums/e198/Yekt40/lionkinghyenas.jpg

Oh wait.....MDH is missing. Is it his day off?

http://i39.photobucket.com/albums/e198/Yekt40/hyena.gif

[yongrel]

Never fails. I post a thread and the Government paid hyena's come out in force.

http://i39.photobucket.com/albums/e198/Yekt40/lionkinghyenas.jpg

Oh wait.....MDH is missing. Is it his day off?

http://i39.photobucket.com/albums/e198/Yekt40/hyena.gif

Be prepared.

[PatriotOne]

Be prepared.

Prepared for what?

[yongrel]

Prepared for what?

Be prepared for a chance of a lifetime, for sensational news. A shining new era is tiptoeing nearer.

[PatriotOne]

Be prepared for a chance of a lifetime, for sensational news. A shining new era is tiptoeing nearer.

Oh my, how mysterious. Here's your tin foil hat. You accidently left it in the other thread ;):

http://i39.photobucket.com/albums/e198/Yekt40/63917206_519188e5f5.jpg

[yongrel]

Be Prepared. (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=L0AiN8vrn9Y&eurl=http://video.google.com/videosearch?q=be+prepared&ie=UTF-8&oe=UTF-8&rls=org.mozilla:en-US:official&cli)

[PatriotOne]

Be Prepared. (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=L0AiN8vrn9Y&eurl=http://video.google.com/videosearch?q=be+prepared&ie=UTF-8&oe=UTF-8&rls=org.mozilla:en-US:official&cli)

Link ='s blank page that won't load. Gee, how will I sleep tonight wondering what knowledge the brain damaged Yongrel tried to share with me.

[lucius]

Here is another physician’s opinion concerning immunizations from chapter 19, ‘IMMUNIZATION AGAINST DISEASE: A medical time bomb?’ from the book, ‘How To Raise a Healthy Child…In Spite of Your Doctor’ pages 210-211, by Robert S. Mendelsohn, M.D.:

“Although I administered them myself during my early years of practice, I have become a steadfast opponent of mass inoculations because of the myriad hazards they present. The subject is so vast and complex that it deserves a book of its own. Consequently, I must be content here with summarizing my objections to the fanatic zeal with which pediatricians blindly shoot foreign proteins into the body of your child without knowing what eventual damage they may cause.

Here is the core of my concern:

1) There is no convincing scientific evidence that mass inoculations can be credited with eliminating any childhood disease. While it is true that some once common childhood diseases have diminished or disappeared since inoculations were introduced. No one really knows why, although improved living conditions may be the reason. If immunizations were responsible for the disappearance of these diseases in the United States, one must ask why they disappeared simultaneously in Europe, where mass immunizations did not take place.

2) It is commonly believed that the Salk vaccine was responsible for halting the polio epidemics that plagued American children in the 1940s and 1950s. If so, why did the epidemics also end in Europe, where polio vaccine was not so extensively used? Of greater current relevance, why is the Sabin live virus vaccine still being administered to children when Dr. Jonas Salk, who pioneered the first vaccine, points out that Sabin vaccine is now causing most of the polio cases that appear. Continuing to force this vaccine on children is irrational medical behavior that simply confirms my contention that doctors consistently repeat their mistakes. With the polio vaccine we are witnessing a rerun of the medical reluctance to abandon the smallpox vaccination, which remained as the only source of smallpox-related deaths for three decades after the disease had disappeared.

3) There are significant risks associated with every immunization and numerous contraindications that may make it dangerous for the shots to be given to your child. Yet doctors administer them routinely, usually without warning parents of the hazards and without determining whether the immunization is contraindicated for the child. No child should be immunized without making that determination, yet small armies of children are routinely lined up in clinics to receive a shot in the arm with no questions asked!

4) While the myriad short-term hazards of most immunizations are known (but rarely explained), no one knows the long-term consequences of injecting foreign proteins into the body of your child. Even more shocking is the fact that no one is making any structured effort to find out.

5) There is a growing suspicion that immunization against relatively harmless childhood disease may be responsible for the dramatic increase in autoimmune diseases since mass inoculations were introduced. These are fearful diseases such as cancer, leukemia, rheumatoid arthritis, multiple sclerosis, Lou Gehrig’s disease, lupus erythematosus, and the Guillain-Barre syndrome. An autoimmune disease can be explained simply as one in which the body’s defense mechanisms cannot distinguish between foreign invaders and ordinary body tissues, with the consequence that the body begins to destroy itself. Have traded mumps and measles for cancer and leukemia?”

As a parent, I highly recommend this book.

This is just my take; medical solutions are sold just like new cars, latest wars or politicians touting ‘change’—it is important to be informed consumers.

[asgardshill]

Link ='s blank page that won't load. Gee, how will I sleep tonight wondering what knowledge the brain damaged Yongrel tried to share with me.

Well, its pretty obvious that you don't have kids. :rolleyes:

"With you, everything's gas."

[cvaldiv1]

Here is another physician’s opinion concerning immunizations from chapter 19, ‘IMMUNIZATION AGAINST DISEASE: A medical time bomb?’ from the book, ‘How To Raise a Healthy Child…In Spite of Your Doctor’ pages 210-211, by Robert S. Mendelsohn, M.D.:

“Although I administered them myself during my early years of practice, I have become a steadfast opponent of mass inoculations because of the myriad hazards they present. The subject is so vast and complex that it deserves a book of its own. Consequently, I must be content here with summarizing my objections to the fanatic zeal with which pediatricians blindly shoot foreign proteins into the body of your child without knowing what eventual damage they may cause.

Here is the core of my concern:

1) There is no convincing scientific evidence that mass inoculations can be credited with eliminating any childhood disease. While it is true that some once common childhood diseases have diminished or disappeared since inoculations were introduced. No one really knows why, although improved living conditions may be the reason. If immunizations were responsible for the disappearance of these diseases in the United States, one must ask why they disappeared simultaneously in Europe, where mass immunizations did not take place.

2) It is commonly believed that the Salk vaccine was responsible for halting the polio epidemics that plagued American children in the 1940s and 1950s. If so, why did the epidemics also end in Europe, where polio vaccine was not so extensively used? Of greater current relevance, why is the Sabin live virus vaccine still being administered to children when Dr. Jonas Salk, who pioneered the first vaccine, points out that Sabin vaccine is now causing most of the polio cases that appear. Continuing to force this vaccine on children is irrational medical behavior that simply confirms my contention that doctors consistently repeat their mistakes. With the polio vaccine we are witnessing a rerun of the medical reluctance to abandon the smallpox vaccination, which remained as the only source of smallpox-related deaths for three decades after the disease had disappeared.

3) There are significant risks associated with every immunization and numerous contraindications that may make it dangerous for the shots to be given to your child. Yet doctors administer them routinely, usually without warning parents of the hazards and without determining whether the immunization is contraindicated for the child. No child should be immunized without making that determination, yet small armies of children are routinely lined up in clinics to receive a shot in the arm with no questions asked!

4) While the myriad short-term hazards of most immunizations are known (but rarely explained), no one knows the long-term consequences of injecting foreign proteins into the body of your child. Even more shocking is the fact that no one is making any structured effort to find out.

5) There is a growing suspicion that immunization against relatively harmless childhood disease may be responsible for the dramatic increase in autoimmune diseases since mass inoculations were introduced. These are fearful diseases such as cancer, leukemia, rheumatoid arthritis, multiple sclerosis, Lou Gehrig’s disease, lupus erythematosus, and the Guillain-Barre syndrome. An autoimmune disease can be explained simply as one in which the body’s defense mechanisms cannot distinguish between foreign invaders and ordinary body tissues, with the consequence that the body begins to destroy itself. Have traded mumps and measles for cancer and leukemia?”

As a parent, I highly recommend this book.

This is just my take; medical solutions are sold just like new cars, latest wars or politicians touting ‘change’—it is important to be informed consumers.

That is one physicians opinion. He ignores several very large clinical trails that show no correlations besides the temporal relationship between the MMR vaccine and autism. The best designed study of them all was designed look at adverse events after MMR vaccine followed 1.8 million children for 14 years and did not document a singe case of autism as a consequence of MMR vaccination

Also it is true in the 20th century, infectious diseases began to be better controlled because of improvements in hygiene and sanitation (clean water and pest control). However, the incidence of vaccine-preventable diseases only began to drop dramatically after the vaccines for those diseases were licensed and began to be used in large numbers of children. For example Since the Hib vaccine was introduced in 1985, serious Hib disease has declined from about 20,000 cases per year to 34 cases in 2002. This was clearly due to the immunizations rather than sanitation, because it was introduced in 1985.

There are risks, I'm not denying that. The risks however are less than most OTC medications. Is there potential for harm, yes. Physicians however weight the risks and benefits, and in doing so it's easy to see that the benefits of immunizations clearly outweigh the risk of doing so.

Also regarding the autoimmune disorder statement. This is true. This is a hypothesis that many immunologists make, specifically regarding allergies. But this is only a hypothesis and isn't really backed by any study yet. And if that's a quote from a physician I'd be worried because most diseases that were listed aren't autoimmune.

[lucius]

… The best designed study of them all was designed look at adverse events after MMR vaccine followed 1.8 million children for 14 years and did not document a singe case of autism as a consequence of MMR vaccination
Is your “The best designed study”, a Finnish study, where autism was not a specific criteria looked for in the study’s children?

Here is another physician’s opinion:

"I am no longer "trying to dig up evidence to prove" vaccines cause autism.

There is already abundant evidence, the same conclusion made by a 2003 U.S. Congressional Committee.

This debate is not scientific but is political. I am trying to encourage physicians who have been badly misled by nothing less than spin and propaganda to review the extensive scientific evidence for themselves showing the vaccine-autism link, even though "experts" disagree." David Ayoub, MD


Since the Hib vaccine was introduced in 1985, serious Hib disease has declined from about 20,000 cases per year to 34 cases in 2002. This was clearly due to the immunizations rather than sanitation, because it was introduced in 1985.

Bias, spin & skew?

In preliminary studies conducted by the CDC comprising six areas of the U.S., the Hib vaccine showed an overall efficacy rate of 41 percent. However, published reports on the vaccine's effectiveness often show higher results because members of the medical industry attempted to skew the results by excluding areas where their findings didn't agree with the conclusions they sought. --["Policy Statement, (HbPV)," AAP News, Nov 1987]

"Hib is not a disease but a type of bacteria--defined by lab test…so hard to see if there is any disease decline…Primary motive was to combat "invasive bacterial infections", but no evidence this has been achieved. 3 major types of "ibi"--Hib, pneumococcal, and meningococcal. …decline in Hib infections appears to have been accompanied by an increase in the other two [pneumococcal, meningococcal]…there appears to be no evidence of a decrease in invasive bacterial disease overall...in aus notifications of meningococcal disease in 1995 was highest since 1979...this rise occurred in parallel with the fall in Hib disease, so what savings in illness have there been? …so, there seems to be no demonstration savings in illness in children, on top of this there seems to be an association between dpt vaccine and invasive Hib disease."--Greg Beattie, author of ‘Vaccination A Parent's Dilemma’, ISBN 1876308001.

Potential Hib downside?

In Minnesota, a state epidemiologist, Michael Osterholm, concluded that the Hib vaccine increases the risk of illness when a study revealed that vaccinated children were five times more likely to contract meningitis than unvaccinated children.


…There are risks, I'm not denying that. The risks however are less than most OTC medications...

We can agree to disagree, but probably both follow Dr. Paul on state mandated vaccinations:

"When we give government the power to make medical decisions for us, we, in essence, accept that the state owns our bodies."--U.S. Representative Ron Paul