"I don't care what some guy said 300 years ago."

[a_moran3]

This really enflamed me. I didn't say anything, I just walked away. Basically before work we were debating foreign policy and I brought up the Constitution and he just said to me, "I really don't care what some guy said 300 years ago. They were in a whole different time period. Times have changed and it is useless."

Do you guys encounter these kinds of comments when discussing politics with others?

[nate895]

This really enflamed me. I didn't say anything, I just walked away. Basically before work we were debating foreign policy and I brought up the Constitution and he just said to me, "I really don't care what some guy said 300 years ago. They were in a whole different time period. Times have changed and it is useless."

Do you guys encounter these kinds of comments when discussing politics with others?

I would have pointed out that it was 200 years ago.

[madRazor]

I would have punched him in the groin and said it doesn't matter, times have changed since I groin-punched you.

[hawks4ronpaul]

This really enflamed me. I didn't say anything, I just walked away. Basically before work we were debating foreign policy and I brought up the Constitution and he just said to me, "I really don't care what some guy said 300 years ago. They were in a whole different time period. Times have changed and it is useless."

Do you guys encounter these kinds of comments when discussing politics with others?

Does that mean that he is not a Christian?

http://hawks4ronpaul.blogspot.com/

[Mr. White]

Our legal system and government is based on what some guy said 200 years ago. Each decision after that was based on the presumption of stability or thoughtful consideration of the ramfications of change. Failure to at least acknowledge and consider what was said flies in the face of all logic.

Your friend is either making a flippant comment or representative of the "fix it now" mantra of the times we live in. Either way, keep chipping away and don't let yourself get too frustrated. Imagine being a teacher and having 100+ similar attitudes to deal with. You can lead a horse to water.

[a_moran3]

Wow, I'm really surprised at how calm you guys are. I'm even pissed and this happened 10 hours ago.

[a_moran3]

Oh and I mean it in a good way.

[nullvalu]

I would tell him he should pick up a book from time to time. Things really haven't changed that much, if he read or understood history he might realize that.

[wgadget]

Our country is just a baby compared to, say the Roman Empire, which lasted over 1000 years.

[SL89]

wgadget: first of all the Roman "Empire" lasted only 503 years. In response to the OP: Of course we get angry, we fight ignorance daily. The only way is to educate. This R3volution is based on History and the Human experience. There is nothing we encounter in this world that has not been experienced before. Rash judgments and anger accomplish little. Teach the ignorant and support the wise.

[Kotin]

to be honest , most people don't even know what the Constitution actually is..


in there minds it is the exact same thing as the Declaration of Independence...

[nullvalu]

wgadget: first of all the Roman "Empire" lasted only 503 years. In response to the OP: Of course we get angry, we fight ignorance daily. The only way is to educate. This R3volution is based on History and the Human experience. There is nothing we encounter in this world that has not been experienced before. Rash judgments and anger accomplish little. Teach the ignorant and support the wise.

Sorta, the Roman Republic lasted about 500 years, and the Empire followed for another 500 years after Caesar took power.

[SL89]

Yes you are right. Just playing semantics. And as we see now, The US started as a republic and now we are an Empire. (by definition).

[LEK]

I would have pointed out that it was 200 years ago.

Me too, being the nerd that I am. :)

Ok, let's say he's right. If this is the foundation our government was built on (forget the fact that all representatives have to swear to uphold it) and it is no longer relevant - where is the new set of rules? Where is the replacement?

Or should everyone just do what is right in their own eyes?

I believe that's called chaos.

[Mr. White]

Yes you are right. Just playing semantics. And as we see now, The US started as a republic and now we are an Empire. (by definition).

Since this thread has already gone to non sequitur hell, I'll point out that an empire and a republic as you've applied them, are not comparable in any meaningful fasion.

[Mr. White]

Me too, being the nerd that I am. :)

Ok, let's say he's right. If this is the foundation our government was built on (forget the fact that all representatives have to swear to uphold it) and it is no longer relevant - where is the new set of rules? Where is the replacement?

Or should everyone just do what is right in their own eyes?

I believe that's called chaos.

In the spirit of a one sided conversation, I'll play devil's advocate and submit that this individual was implying that we should ignore what was said by individuas 200 years ago (a la the Federalist papers) and instead abide by what those individuals wrote (The Constitution).

Of course that would have severely handicapped our nation at every turn, but hey, we deal in absolutes around here apparently.

[j650]

I can understand his point. The world certainly has changed since the time of Washington, Jefferson, Madison, and the rest. Technology has made significant advances. The role of the United States abroad has changed significantly. The New Deal changed how we take care of people. You can't just undo all of that with the flip of a switch. To say that we can and that things are exactly like they were in the late 18th century is extremely ignorant. And that's probably why many people write Ron Paul and his supporters off as crazy and unrealistic.

[Mr. White]

I can understand his point. The world certainly has changed since the time of Washington, Jefferson, Madison, and the rest. Technology has made significant advances. The role of the United States abroad has changed significantly. The New Deal changed how we take care of people. You can't just undo all of that with the flip of a switch. To say that we can and that things are exactly like they were in the late 18th century is extremely ignorant. And that's probably why many people write Ron Paul and his supporters off as crazy and unrealistic.

Ahhh, that post was like a breath of fresh air in a stale smokey room.

[nate895]

wgadget: first of all the Roman "Empire" lasted only 503 years. In response to the OP: Of course we get angry, we fight ignorance daily. The only way is to educate. This R3volution is based on History and the Human experience. There is nothing we encounter in this world that has not been experienced before. Rash judgments and anger accomplish little. Teach the ignorant and support the wise.

Depends on what you consider the "Roman Empire," it could have lasted anywhere from 503 years to apx. 1800 years, and if you include the Republican and Monarchy phases, add on 800 years to that.

[Kap]

I would have pointed out what was said 200 years ago is more relevant today.

Why? America was young and at the time on hostile terms with a foreign enemy with a greater military power. England's army was well-buit, larger, and spreading across the world in the 1700s. Several countries offered "entangling alliances" to counter the threat of England's imperialism. Despite those problems America not only survived, but prospered.

Now take us to today, the mainstream media would have us believe we're under constant threat of nuclear terrorism. It's because we've refused to listen to George Washington's final advice we are at the point we are today. If we stayed out of the Middle East, dined with Saudi kings, or created Isreal we wouldn't be dealing with Islamic fundamentalists.

Offtopic: It's been a while since I've been on, but I've been following RP very closely. I'd just like to say as much as Ron Paul's words inspire me, everyone's dedication to the Revolution is even more so. Keep fighting.

[SL89]

Nate: You are right. Just semantics.

[VaderM5]

This really enflamed me. I didn't say anything, I just walked away. Basically before work we were debating foreign policy and I brought up the Constitution and he just said to me, "I really don't care what some guy said 300 years ago. They were in a whole different time period. Times have changed and it is useless."

Do you guys encounter these kinds of comments when discussing politics with others?

Does your co-worker care more about fishing, bud light and weeding out terrorist than history. :confused:

[Dequeant]

I would have looked him in the eye, and very calmly and collectively said:

"Do you have any idea how many people I have killed for less than that?"

There will be a silent 2 second pause.....after which you will say: "Exactly"

Tends to freak people out and i love it! :D

[Soccrmastr]

This is just one of the arguments that also get me very angry. people who say this are generally ignorant and/or dumb, and debating with them doesnt matter. Just walk away and know you're better.

[Todd]

This really enflamed me. I didn't say anything, I just walked away. Basically before work we were debating foreign policy and I brought up the Constitution and he just said to me, "I really don't care what some guy said 300 years ago. They were in a whole different time period. Times have changed and it is useless."

Do you guys encounter these kinds of comments when discussing politics with others?

Yes... Everyone today thinks our current "sages" are the real bastions of wisdom and Knowledge.

Washington, Jefferson, Madison, Bush, Obama. Sounds reasonable. :rolleyes:


You should pick up Alan Bloom's "The closing of the American Mind" and understand how the truth's of the past is very relevant and important to understanding our current times.

[Richie]

I encounter stuff like this all the time. Just ignore it. When Clinton becomes President, he'll care about the Constitution all of the sudden and you can laugh at him.

[Buzz]

Only a fool would think that the world has really changed in the last few hundred or more years. Elements of civilization change apparent form but they don't go away. The more history you read, the more parallels you'll draw between the past and the present, even though the past and present seem different on the surface. The world only changes as human nature changes, which happens so slowly as to be negligible.

[Ron LOL]

Yeah, I really hate the "it's old, times have changed" argument. Dude, by what superior wisdom do you know better? No, seriously, answer that. They never can. They just continue on with "things are different now," not realizing that the constitution is the product of a few thousand years of first hand experience with malgovernance and abuse of power.

[me3]

I would have punched him in the groin and said it doesn't matter, times have changed since I groin-punched you.
+1000

[j650]

Ahhh, that post was like a breath of fresh air in a stale smokey room.

Well, Jesus Christ. Some of these people seem to think that the founders were right about everything and noone should dare question their wisdom. The founders were human beings. They weren't perfect and they made mistakes just like all of us. These were people who owned slaves for God's sake. Do you really want to go back to the 18th century when other human beings were forced to work for their owner against their will? People around here make fun of the sheep who listen to everything they hear on the mainstream media, yet these same people take what the founders did and said and do the same thing. Who are the real sheep?

Someone can make a legitimate argument about the 2nd amendment and how technology has advanced by leaps and bounds since the 18th century and the founders never could have envisioned it. But a Ron Paul supporter will ignore all that and just argue what the founders said about guns in their day and age. Do you really think the founders would want you take their word as the gospel and not question them? Wouldn't they want us to adapt as things change?

[Joseph Hart]

+4fathers /roll-graves

[clintontj72]

+4fathers /roll-graves

LOL!!!

Jefferson, Washington, and American People to British "All Your Base are Belong to US'...British "Say What?"

Ron Paul and RP Revolutionaries to Neocons at convention "All Your Base are Belong to US"...Neocons "Say What"

My dream scenario no matter the long odds.

That should be the Revolutions long term motto "All Your Base are Belong to US!".

Oh...and if you do not know the history of this saying...google it...interesting story :P

[slamhead]

Just tell him where we are heading.

Tyranny|Revolt|Freedom|Prosperity|Dependence|Tyran ny

[lynnf]

This really enflamed me. I didn't say anything, I just walked away. Basically before work we were debating foreign policy and I brought up the Constitution and he just said to me, "I really don't care what some guy said 300 years ago. They were in a whole different time period. Times have changed and it is useless."

Do you guys encounter these kinds of comments when discussing politics with others?


"What has been is what will be, and what has been done is what will be done there is nothing new under the sun" (ECC 1:9 RSV).

'Those who cannot remember the past are condemned to repeat it.' George Santayana

"They that can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety." Ben Franklin

All lessons from the past. If the guy has any religious affinity at all in the Judeo-Christian area, it all comes from more than hundreds of years ago, as would Islam or Buddhism.


He is only showing his ignorance. Perhaps you should point this out to him. The major sciences all have roots in the past hundreds of years and it all depends upon work done then. What was said in the past matters. Duh!

lynn

[Carson]

The United States Constitution is the foundation of the country and the rules the government was meant to rule by.

The coming times may show just what a government that chose not to abide by the rules they were sworn to govern by will bear fruit.

We have no one to blame but ourselves, I suppose. We were suppose to have checks and balances for this sort of thing. I think it all comes down to us for not standing up to them.

It was our duty and we failed.