Ought we have an National Initative?

[Banana]

Wanted to throw out another idea.

I don't know if other states has similar program to Washington, but it has initatives which basically allows anyone to place a proposal on ballot to be voted (provided they are able to collect X signatures), thus bypassing the legislative system entirely.

It potentially would be very useful if the Constitution was amended to allow such proposal to be voted and give the people a measure of keeping reins on Congress, especially for issues that Congress are loath to bring it upon themselves.

Suppose Congress decided they needed another raise and passed the raise, the people wouldn't have to wait to vote them out, but rather start a initiative to retract the raise and abolish any future raises. Much easier than trying to get the politicans out of the bed, no?

But on the other hand, initiatives has their own problem. In Washington for example, Tim Eyman successfully passed a initiative slashing license tab fee which used to vary based on car make, model & year to flat fee for everyone. It passed wildly, but there was nothing to replace the revenue for DoT and thus set the road maintenece two decades back.

Would you think this would be worth having in forcing issues that Congress won't have the balls to face? Or would it destroy the foundation of republic, inviting direct democracy?

[nate895]

I believe almost every state has similar things. I disagree with national initiatives on the principal of states' rights.

P.S. The people of WA know what will happen because the state equivalent of the General Accounting Office here puts out a "fiscal impact" information brief when a ballot measure comes up.

[Banana]

I believe almost every state has similar things. I disagree with national initiatives on the principal of states' rights.

Even if the initiatives should only deal with Federal matters?


P.S. The people of WA know what will happen because the state equivalent of the General Accounting Office here puts out a "fiscal impact" information brief when a ballot measure comes up.

I could be wrong, but I believe that Mr. Eyman's proposal didn't have that fiscal statement as it was added later after that disaster, but yes you're right- all initatives has to file a fiscal statement so everyone knows how it will be accounted for.

[Edu]

In Washington for example, Tim Eyman successfully passed a initiative slashing license tab fee which used to vary based on car make, model & year to flat fee for everyone. It passed wildly, but there was nothing to replace the revenue for DoT and thus set the road maintenece two decades back.Registration fees go towards the highway patrol mostly, which that job could easily be done by the sheriffs department.

When the initiative was being considered, every crazy thing that was funded (improperly) by those registration funds were screaming how the world was going to fall apart if fees were lower (nothing really happened). Arizona went through something of the same sort and the DMV there hates it, they actually have to give money back if you have months left on your plate after you sell your car, and a few other things changed.

Washington is $35 a year, Oregon is $18 per year and has been OK with it for years now, no world falling apart.

Road maint is paid for by ROAD taxes, like you pay when you buy gas and tires.

If your DOT is having problems you might want to see what improper things are being done with the road taxes. I bet they get put in the general fund and are spent on everything except roads. They probably want to make you think it's the car tag tax that is causing it so you will want to repeal the initiative. Those bastards will do anything to raise revenue. DON'T LET THEM FOOL YOU!

Dig deeper.

On the national initiative, maybe do it as a state one first and if enough states say yes then it passes?

[Banana]

Registration fees go towards the highway patrol mostly, which that job could easily be done by the sheriffs department.

Really? They said it partially funded maintenece fo roads.... Hmmm.


Dig deeper.

Will. But that would mean that initiative is really a great program to have, no?



On the national initiative, maybe do it as a state one first and if enough states say yes then it passes?

As a matter of fact, this is how we enact new state laws- other states look at example of one state and decide they like it so they pass it.

For an national initiative to be truly constitutional, it must deal only with federal matters, not with state matters. Therefore, it'd have to be passed by a majority of X (popular vote? state election?) to be ratified.