War on Terror = McCarthyism?

[Banana]

I am not old enough to be personally familiar with events surrounding the McCarthyism, but sometime I wonder if there are any parallels between the fearmongering of eventual communism subversion and the fearmongering of terrorists running amok with bomb in their hands among us.

Some parallels that I can think of:

1) "You are either for us or against us" mentality
2) Recent firing of Fallon & Tucker (? I don't know for sure, though) and other dissidents.
3) "Blame the America" mentality smeared on Ron Paul and other who advocate the blowback theory.

The difference is that there doesn't seem to be a parallel to House Committee on Un-American Activities (could they really have chosen a stupider name? What is it to be "un-American"?) and various public & private "loyalty review board" which ruined many people's lives once they were branded as a communist and very well were regelated to same status as illegal immigrants- unable to find work or live peacefully.



It got me to wondering about how McCarthyism came about, and how it all ended with "have you no sense of decency?" and wondered if it could somehow apply today... Maybe someone who was around that time would be able to enlighten me. :)

[Banana]

And I should say this is oddly prophetic... (on Wikipedia's article on McCarthyism)

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/a/a1/Unholy_three.png

[sophocles07]

"Terrorism" has replaced "Communism"; simple as that. Vague, blurred, half-non-existent enemies used to justify any amount of government interests--from spreading economic control overseas to imposing REAL IDs to marginalizing/persecuting those with different w/different views to whatever. It's the same thing, they've just found a new word--one better because "Communism" could at least be defended from an economic position; "terror" is total abstraction, it means nothing, so any attempt to propose a different answer to questions of national security, etc., can simply be replied to with "helping terror." Which means nothing.

[pcosmar]

A bit simplistic.
McCarthyism turned into a witch hunt, no doubt about it, However he was very correct, in that the US was being infiltrated.
The Two branches of collectivism were present and much of the finger pointing was done by those that were most guilty.

Everyone needs to understand the difference between Individualism and Collectivism.
At the time the Fabians (collectivists) were fully entrenched in our Government, the Media, and Business.They were pointing at the Leninists (collectivists) and saying"look there, a communist."
They have the same goal, but use different means.

The whole concept of Collectivism is Un-American. By pointing out the one group they were deflecting attention from themselves.
Good information here.
http://www.freedomforceinternational.org/

WORK FOR RON PAUL OR FREEDOM FORCE?
That’s a trick question that needs to be explained. Some of our members have asked to be excused from working on Freedom Force projects because they feel it is more important to devote their time to the Ron Paul campaign. I am delighted to know that they are doing that because, as we have stated many times in our Monthly Reports, that is a top priority of Freedom Force. However, this is not an either-or situation. Being active in the Ron Paul campaign IS the number-one project of Freedom Force.

Political campaigns come and go. Every four years, large numbers of people become motivated for political activism because they can see (or hope for) a specific victory with a specific date. When that date passes, most of them drop out. They return to inaction and wait another three years before doing much of anything.

Also
Part 1: The Chasm (http://www.freedomforceinternational.org/pdf/futurecalling1.pdf)
Part 2: Secret Organizations and Hidden Agendas (http://www.freedomforceinternational.org/pdf/futurecalling2.pdf)
Part 3: Days of Infamy (http://www.freedomforceinternational.org/pdf/futurecalling3.pdf)
Part 4: The War on Terrorism (http://www.freedomforceinternational.org/pdf/futurecalling4.pdf)
Part 5: An Idea Whose Hour Has Come (http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=6015291679758430958&q=%22an+idea+whose+time+has+come%22&total=17&start=0&num=10&so=0&type=search&plindex=0)

It is a lot of information. but it is worth ihe time to educate yourself.

[Banana]

A bit simplistic.

Okay, that's probably why nobody compared it then...

While I feel that there are lot of differences between McCarthyism and today's terrormongering, I was wondering if it should be considered odd that nobody bothered to say, "Hey, Bush is acting lot like McCarthy, don't you think?"

Also, I just guessed that if there were indeed similarities, then it could be capitalized on- it's easier to convince people that it's same old all over again than to show them the face of new enemy.

[acptulsa]

Okay, that's probably why nobody compared it then...

While I feel that there are lot of differences between McCarthyism and today's terrormongering, I was wondering if it should be considered odd that nobody bothered to say, "Hey, Bush is acting lot like McCarthy, don't you think?"

Also, I just guessed that if there were indeed similarities, then it could be capitalized on- it's easier to convince people that it's same old all over again than to show them the face of new enemy.

One difference I can think of is that the current regime isn't telling anyone who it has locked up. Makes it hard to see if there's any good reason to do so.

[Banana]

One difference I can think of is that the current regime isn't telling anyone who it has locked up. Makes it hard to see if there's any good reason to do so.

That's a good point...

[Mesogen]

Here's what kills me about the whole McCarthy era.

The scare was that we were being infiltrated by Communists, but the people doing the scaring were the Communists.

[acptulsa]

Here's what kills me about the whole McCarthy era.

The scare was that we were being infiltrated by Communists, but the people doing the scaring were the Communists.

Or, at the very least, just as totalitarian.

[abruzz0]

"Terrorism" has replaced "Communism"; simple as that. Vague, blurred, half-non-existent enemies used to justify any amount of government interests--from spreading economic control overseas to imposing REAL IDs to marginalizing/persecuting those with different w/different views to whatever. It's the same thing, they've just found a new word--one better because "Communism" could at least be defended from an economic position; "terror" is total abstraction, it means nothing, so any attempt to propose a different answer to questions of national security, etc., can simply be replied to with "helping terror." Which means nothing.

Perfection

[acptulsa]

"Terrorism" has replaced "Communism"; simple as that. Vague, blurred, half-non-existent enemies used to justify any amount of government interests--from spreading economic control overseas to imposing REAL IDs to marginalizing/persecuting those with different w/different views to whatever. It's the same thing, they've just found a new word--one better because "Communism" could at least be defended from an economic position; "terror" is total abstraction, it means nothing, so any attempt to propose a different answer to questions of national security, etc., can simply be replied to with "helping terror." Which means nothing.

The sad part of this is the phrase helping terror does have meaning in the English language--and the administration and DHS are doing more of it than anyone else I can think of.

[ARealConservative]

A bit simplistic.
McCarthyism turned into a witch hunt, no doubt about it, However he was very correct, in that the US was being infiltrated.
The Two branches of collectivism were present and much of the finger pointing was done by those that were most guilty.

This is an area of history I need to read more up on, but my understanding is McCarthy was only concerned with rooting out communist sympathizers that held political office.

His investigation was eventually joined by angry mobs and it then turned into the witch hunt we all know of, but he never agreed with it going that far.

[Banana]

One more difference I thought of that may have had impacted the attitude-

McCartyhism was inherently looking inward- accusing your neighbor and co-worker for being a communist.

War on Terror is usually external- accusing Middle East Muslims for hating us and want to blow us up.

The idea of Muslims infiltrating our ranks isn't quite as strong as during McCarthyism, where the paranoia was so high, everyone even remotely connected to national security were usually subject to "loyalty review" by public or private entities. I'd imagine it eventually had to blew up when enough of people get accused falsely, and other people starts to ask questions why is he and she a communist; I've known them all my lives and they're anything but communists. But with terrorists, it's much more abstract as sophoclos07 succinctly pointed out; nobody raises a eyebrow when their neighbor wearing a turban suddenly disappear in middle of night.

[acptulsa]

This is an area of history I need to read more up on, but my understanding is McCarthy was only concerned with rooting out communist sympathizers that held political office.

His investigation was eventually joined by angry mobs and it then turned into the witch hunt we all know of, but he never agreed with it going that far.

That's where you're wrong. Maybe Nixon held that view, and maybe Nixon was just smart enough to restrain himself. McCarthy, however, was in it for self-aggrandizement and carried it--and himself--right over the cliff.

[Banana]

ARealConservative,

acptulsa's post reminded me- if you have a chance, pick up Pogo (I can't recall which book..) to get a feeling of how McCarthy was perceived.

http://ape-law.com/jonmorris/alien/malarkey01.gif
Simple J. Malarkey (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pogo_(comics)#Simple_J._Malarkey)