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rodriguezintexas
03-10-2008, 11:39 PM
I am posting this for those of you who are still a bit confused on the delegate process and its utmost importance, those of you who may be discouraged, and those of you who would just like to pass on to your sphere of influence a message of hope that the presidency is still within grasp. Cut an paste this into your meetup group emails and messages to your family and friends or just simply be encouraged...

The delegate process can be extremely confusing and the media certainly doesn’t help! In some states the winner takes all delegates, in some states all candidates receive delegates proportional to the votes, some delegates are pledged, some delegates are unpledged…and what about the delegates that belong to those who have dropped out? Well, the folks at thegreenpapers.com have helped clarify the confusion a bit by making a beautiful chart that is both easy to read AND easy to understand. As of March 9, 2008, McCain only has 993 PLEDGED delegates. Those delegates are so far the ONLY delegates that are bound to vote for McCain at the Republican primary in St. Paul this September, and even those are only bound for a time. McCain also has 118 UNPLEDGED delegates. What does that mean? That means he “won” certain delegates and they are counted as his though they are still free to vote according to their will at the Republican National Convention. How can that be? Well, let’s use the state of Texas as an example. Out of the 140 delegates in Texas that will attend the Republican National Convention, 3 of them are NOT BOUND to vote for any particular candidate. Those 3 can vote for Orville Redenbaucher if they want to. They only “belong” to McCain because Texas is a “winner-take-all” state. Got it? So, every state is different in their delegate distribution. Though McCain DOES have a very strong lead, he is NOT the nominee! States are still going through their delegate selection process and there is no way of knowing how the UNBOUND votes will go, especially with the number of Republican Americans who DO NOT support McCain or trust him as far as they can throw him. If a candidate does not receive 50% + 1% at the Republican National Convention, a second vote will take place. At that point, some delegates, depending on their state rules, will become UNPLEDGED and the results could drastically change. Again, if no candidate receives a majority vote, another vote will be cast and more delegates will be UNPLEDGED and able to vote according to their preference. This continues until a candidate receives a majority vote at the convention, each time releasing more candidates from their pledge and changing the outcome. (i.e. Texas delegates, for instance, are bound to three votes. Oregon delegates are only bound to two votes but can also be released after the first vote IF their candidate receives less than 35% of the vote. To see your state, go to www.republicansource.com/primaries.) So, now you know that McCain does not have it in the bag! A brokered convention is still possible and would certainly go down in the history books! Be encouraged! Those of you who are fighting for Ron Paul and going through the delegate process—don’t give up—the war to win our wonderful country back has just begun!!! Turn off your TV and fight! Freedom isn’t free and hope demands diligence!!!! Keep working hard…and certainly keep praying!


Chart: http://www.thegreenpapers.com/P08/R-PU.phtml

The Truth about McCain: www.vietnamveteransagainstmccain.com

Russellk30
03-10-2008, 11:49 PM
I am posting this for those of you who are still a bit confused on the delegate process and its utmost importance, those of you who may be discouraged, and those of you who would just like to pass on to your sphere of influence a message of hope that the presidency is still within grasp. Cut an paste this into your meetup group emails and messages to your family and friends or just simply be encouraged...

The delegate process can be extremely confusing and the media certainly doesn’t help! In some states the winner takes all delegates, in some states all candidates receive delegates proportional to the votes, some delegates are pledged, some delegates are unpledged…and what about the delegates that belong to those who have dropped out? Well, the folks at thegreenpapers.com have helped clarify the confusion a bit by making a beautiful chart that is both easy to read AND easy to understand. As of March 9, 2008, McCain only has 993 PLEDGED delegates. Those delegates are so far the ONLY delegates that are bound to vote for McCain at the Republican primary in St. Paul this September, and even those are only bound for a time. McCain also has 118 UNPLEDGED delegates. What does that mean? That means he “won” certain delegates and they are counted as his though they are still free to vote according to their will at the Republican National Convention. How can that be? Well, let’s use the state of Texas as an example. Out of the 140 delegates in Texas that will attend the Republican National Convention, 3 of them are NOT BOUND to vote for any particular candidate. Those 3 can vote for Orville Redenbaucher if they want to. They only “belong” to McCain because Texas is a “winner-take-all” state. Got it? So, every state is different in their delegate distribution. Though McCain DOES have a very strong lead, he is NOT the nominee! States are still going through their delegate selection process and there is no way of knowing how the UNBOUND votes will go, especially with the number of Republican Americans who DO NOT support McCain or trust him as far as they can throw him. If a candidate does not receive 50% + 1% at the Republican National Convention, a second vote will take place. At that point, some delegates, depending on their state rules, will become UNPLEDGED and the results could drastically change. Again, if no candidate receives a majority vote, another vote will be cast and more delegates will be UNPLEDGED and able to vote according to their preference. This continues until a candidate receives a majority vote at the convention, each time releasing more candidates from their pledge and changing the outcome. (i.e. Texas delegates, for instance, are bound to three votes. Oregon delegates are only bound to two votes but can also be released after the first vote IF their candidate receives less than 35% of the vote. To see your state, go to www.republicansource.com/primaries.) So, now you know that McCain does not have it in the bag! A brokered convention is still possible and would certainly go down in the history books! Be encouraged! Those of you who are fighting for Ron Paul and going through the delegate process—don’t give up—the war to win our wonderful country back has just begun!!! Turn off your TV and fight! Freedom isn’t free and hope demands diligence!!!! Keep working hard…and certainly keep praying!


Chart: http://www.thegreenpapers.com/P08/R-PU.phtml

The Truth about McCain: www.vietnamveteransagainstmccain.com

So you're saying that there is virtually no chance Ron Paul will be the Republican nominee? Thats what I got from the chart provided. Thanks for the update.

rodriguezintexas
03-11-2008, 12:00 AM
No, that's not what I am saying! What the chart proves is that the numbers the media is giving us is a bunch of crap! Yes, he's in the lead, but he doesn't have a majority of bound delegates, yet. The emphasis of the chart is for people to realize the importance of staying in the fight and doing all they can in their state's delegate process to keep RP supporters moving on to each level. If we can fill those delegate slots with RP supporters, then we win!! It's that simple.

Russellk30
03-11-2008, 12:09 AM
No, that's not what I am saying! What the chart proves is that the numbers the media is giving us is a bunch of crap! Yes, he's in the lead, but he doesn't have a majority of bound delegates, yet. The emphasis of the chart is for people to realize the importance of staying in the fight and doing all they can in their state's delegate process to keep RP supporters moving on to each level. If we can fill those delegate slots with RP supporters, then we win!! It's that simple.

How many state delegates will be at the convention?

rodriguezintexas
03-11-2008, 12:18 AM
2380 total delegates
1191 needed to win the nomination

Russellk30
03-11-2008, 12:31 AM
2380 total delegates
1191 needed to win the nomination

Sorry if im not encouraged by those statistics. There are a few states left with over 550 delegates. Are you saying Mccain wont get a couple hundred more delegates and then not have any other delegates support him at the convention besides his pledged delegates? We have a better shot at a meteor taking him out.

Banana
03-11-2008, 12:33 AM
One thing need pointing out-

The unbound delegates usually are party hacks (State Party Chair, Commiteeman, and Committeewoman), and the traditions always has been to go with whatever the state goes- so if McCain won the primary for a state, those unbound delegates usually just follow the result. I'd imagine they'd be the last people to not vote for McCain.

There are indeed some states where delegates are not bound, or "morally bound" but those should be separated from the 3 delegate slots reserved for the positions I listed.

rodriguezintexas
03-11-2008, 01:12 AM
Sorry if im not encouraged by those statistics. There are a few states left with over 550 delegates. Are you saying Mccain wont get a couple hundred more delegates and then not have any other delegates support him at the convention besides his pledged delegates? We have a better shot at a meteor taking him out.

Well, Mr. Grump, maybe one will. It's not over until it's over!

Russellk30
03-11-2008, 01:14 AM
Well, Mr. Grump, maybe one will. It's not over until it's over!

Haha. Alright.

DealzOnWheelz
03-11-2008, 09:42 AM
keep in mind Lincoln went to a brokered convention with 20 delegates and came out the nominee

acptulsa
03-11-2008, 09:58 AM
If the logic of the original argument doesn't convince you that it's possible, maybe the vehemence of the troll's insistence that we give up will. They aren't here shouting gloom because we're completely deluded. If we were, they'd feel free to ignore us.

Andrew76
03-11-2008, 11:44 AM
BUMP. I told you so.

rodriguezintexas
03-11-2008, 04:57 PM
If the logic of the original argument doesn't convince you that it's possible, maybe the vehemence of the troll's insistence that we give up will. They aren't here shouting gloom because we're completely deluded. If we were, they'd feel free to ignore us.

Plus, it's all the more proof to show the great importance of RP supporters becoming delegates. Can McCain get a couple hundred more people to vote for him??? Sure! If we sit back and let the neo-cons fill the delegate seats in St. Paul. BUT NOT IF WE TAKE OVER THOSE SEATS!!!!

NEPA_Revolution
03-11-2008, 04:59 PM
We need Chuck Norris. He will whip the McCain delegates.... lets see if we can get an endorsement now that Huck is gone.

Zera
03-11-2008, 05:13 PM
Two thing:

Is that person who said that the unbound delegates usually vote for whoever was bound in their state true?

And what about the other candidates delegates?

kigol
03-11-2008, 05:15 PM
yup

nate895
03-11-2008, 05:29 PM
We have to remember that "pledged" doesn't mean "bound". Pledged you can violate with ease, bound is a much harder process to break.

Banana
03-11-2008, 05:31 PM
Two thing:

Is that person who said that the unbound delegates usually vote for whoever was bound in their state true?

To be honest, I'm just parroting the others, as I've been never to a convention, but I know for fact that 3 delegates slot are given to each state's chair, committeman and committewoman- say so in the Call to Convention, but has been told by others that it's tradition to just follow whatever their state voted.

Because those delegates are also party hacks, they're also the least likely to do something radical. But if we can string McCain with something very serious, they may be convinced to abstain from voting as a form of protest or something. That's a long shot but possible. We can strategize more when things develop but at this time it's very premature.

Does anyone happen to know of past incident where those delegates went the other way?

Mind you, that is just for 3 unbound delegates from per state- there are other unbound delegates, and this would depend on state party's rules.


And what about the other candidates delegates?

If they suspended, the delegates still are bound. If they dropped out, the delegates can vote for anyone they want- they can't be given to other candidates.

Banana
03-11-2008, 05:32 PM
We have to remember that "pledged" doesn't mean "bound". Pledged you can violate with ease, bound is a much harder process to break.

Source?

Zera
03-11-2008, 05:46 PM
If they suspended, the delegates still are bound. If they dropped out, the delegates can vote for anyone they want- they can't be given to other candidates.

freakin' sweet.

defe07
03-11-2008, 05:53 PM
freakin' sweet.

I wonder what you mean by that? :D

nate895
03-11-2008, 06:02 PM
Source?

My source is from the Democratic Party Chairman who said "well, technically, they can vote for whoever they want to." And DNC rules state they are "pledged" and when a term is used, unless if specifically defines it (or provides punishment for not doing so), it means the same thing everywhere.

Banana
03-11-2008, 06:06 PM
Okay, we'll have to make sure that RNC uses the term in same sense. It's not safe to extrapolate DNC's rules over to RNC, I'm afraid.

nate895
03-11-2008, 06:08 PM
Okay, we'll have to make sure that RNC uses the term in same sense. It's not safe to extrapolate DNC's rules over to RNC, I'm afraid.

Well, the GOP has no National rules like the D's do, which would mean we have to go state to state.

menoname
03-11-2008, 06:11 PM
http://www.dailypaul.com/node/36650

Revolution9
03-11-2008, 08:54 PM
So you're saying that there is virtually no chance Ron Paul will be the Republican nominee? Thats what I got from the chart provided. Thanks for the update.

Yer just a bowl of decaying sunshine sonny boy. You want a third party..run for POTUS yerself.. harharhar.. Pure fail. Yer platform will be gripe, piss and moan 101.

Randy

nate895
03-11-2008, 08:55 PM
Yer just a bowl of decaying sunshine sonny boy. You want a third party..run for POTUS yerself.. harharhar.. Pure fail. Yer platform will be gripe, piss and moan 101.

Randy

He has been banned, yeah for non-trolls.

rodriguezintexas
03-11-2008, 11:33 PM
Two thing:

Is that person who said that the unbound delegates usually vote for whoever was bound in their state true?

And what about the other candidates delegates?

It depends on WHO the delegates are. If it is us, then HELL NO! If we sit on our @$$#$ and let the neo-cons keep their seats, then I guess they will.

The delegates of drop-outs are free!!

rodriguezintexas
03-11-2008, 11:47 PM
http://www.dailypaul.com/node/36650

Well done.

Bradley in DC
03-11-2008, 11:50 PM
How many state delegates will be at the convention?

There are no "state delegates" at the NATIONAL convention. :p

Indy Vidual
03-11-2008, 11:59 PM
Doesn't Ron have more than the chart shows? :confused: