Ron Paul Called It: "...wrapped in a flag and carrying a cross"

[The Proservative]

McCain - Wrapped in a Flag - President
Huckabee - Carrying a Cross - Vice-President

Huckabee is still in it not to win, but to take delegates AWAY from Ron Paul. Once Huckabee tallies enough delegates that, if given to McCain, would put McCain over the top, Huckabee will concede and become VP.

This has been the strategy since the WV caucus. The "Huckster" will wheel and deal, as he did with the Paul campaign in WV, with McCain, and offer up all delegates in return for the VP nod.

Currently McCain is at 830, Huckabee at 286 = 1116 total delegates

Once this number between the two exceeds the needed 1191, expect this plan to be executed, with Huckabee conceding and handing over delegates to McCain.

Between McCain and Huckabee of as I call them MC-A-BEE, they only need 75 delegates.

Someone remember to turn off the light and shut the door behind you when exiting the GOP :)

Help us deliver up to Ron Paul a custom built, ready to go, complete political party built from the ground up around ALL of Ron Paul's platforms and our Revolution. Join our Proservative initial interest group now, solidify our ranks, and prepare for battle BEFORE MCABEE turns the corner. We'll be waiting for them in the wings, Constitution in hand.

http://www.proservative.us

If Ron Paul decides to remain Republican, we are behind him 100%. But, let it not be because he didn't have every available option, every opportunity available to him during his decision process.

[kyleAF]

Huckabee and McCain DO NOT have a total of 1116 delegates.

This cannot be emphasized enough. They DO NOT have that! Even if the media says otherwise, or the state GOP says otherwise. They only have the delegates that actually vote for them during the September 1-4 convention, and NO ONE knows how many that will be. "Pledged" means very little unless we let it.

The GOP convention is the only way we can make anything happen. Become a delegate. Lie if you have to. Get yourself into the delegation, then we'll make history by ignoring what we're told by the MSM and getting Paul the nomination.

Additional parties and such will die before they even begin.

[pacelli]

The 830 delegate figure for McCain does not break down how many are bound v. unbound. Does anyone have a source for information on how many BOUND delegates McCain has?

[kyleAF]

The 830 delegate figure for McCain does not break down how many are bound v. unbound. Does anyone have a source for information on how many BOUND delegates McCain has?

To paraphrase Forest Gump:

"Bound is as bound does". Bound or not, vote what you want. You might get sanctioned by your local / state GOP. So what?

[The Proservative]

[QUOTE=kyleAF;1278157]Huckabee and McCain DO NOT have a total of 1116 delegates.

This cannot be emphasized enough. They DO NOT have that! Even if the media says otherwise, or the state GOP says otherwise. </QUOTE]

The entire GOP, the party we (Ron Paul) are actually trying to get the presidential nomination from, is LYING about the number of delegates that will vote for each candidate? This really sounds like a party that not only dislikes Ron Paul, but trying everything in their power to HURT him, and us.

With friends like the GOP, who needs enemies?

[pacelli]

To paraphrase Forest Gump:

"Bound is as bound does". Bound or not, vote what you want. You might get sanctioned by your local / state GOP. So what?

Oh I completely agree. Defy the party rules. It is the only way we can make history.

[ShowMeLiberty]

To paraphrase Forest Gump:

"Bound is as bound does". Bound or not, vote what you want. You might get sanctioned by your local / state GOP. So what?

Yes, it is very interesting that delegates are not bound by law. It is only the "rules" of each state GOP that "binds" delegates.

It is amazing how little most of us know, or used to know, about this whole byzantine election process. We have truly been getting an "on the job" education.

[kyleAF]

The entire GOP, the party we (Ron Paul) are actually trying to get the presidential nomination from, is LYING about the number of delegates that will vote for each candidate? This really sounds like a party that not only dislikes Ron Paul, but trying everything in their power to HURT him, and us.

With friends like the GOP, who needs enemies?

Lying? Maybe. I think in the case of the media it goes like this: "Well, we have to report something... how about assuming that the delegates will vote proportionately, just like they always have?"

"Sure, that sounds about right..."

The GOP really doesn't know the final numbers of who supports whom. Neither do we, either, until the vote is cast.

[The Proservative]

Yes, it is very interesting that delegates are not bound by law. It is only the "rules" of each state GOP that "binds" delegates.


There is an another name for the GOP...the GOB = Good Ol' Boys. By law, you are correct, the delegates are not bound. But, if this election has taught us anything, the law is like The Matrix :) Rules can be bent, others can be broken.

Any GOP delegate that wishes to remain in good graces with the GOP, interested in any type of a political future within the GOP, will be "encouraged" to vote along party lines. Feel free to fill in the blanks regarding methods of "encouragement" that are used to insure this will happen. Something tells me it doesn't include asking "Pretty please".

[kyleAF]

Yes, it is very interesting that delegates are not bound by law. It is only the "rules" of each state GOP that "binds" delegates.

It is amazing how little most of us know, or used to know, about this whole byzantine election process. We have truly been getting an "on the job" education.

Yes. The only thing we should be wary of, is wanting to run for office at the local level. If anyone plans on doing that, then getting sanctioned by the local GOP is probably not the way to go...

For the majority of us though, it really doesn't matter one iota.

[Revolution9]

McCain<snip spam>

This smells like spam. Stop messing with our people.

Thanks
Randy

[The Proservative]

This smells like spam. Stop messing with our people.

Thanks
Randy

Hey brotha, your people are my people :) It's good to get discussion out there, no? It's all about "what if's" and feedback. If I didn't care, I'd keep my mouth shut and forgo the 20 lashes :)

[Revolution9]

[QUOTE=kyleAF;1278157]Huckabee and McCain DO NOT have a total of 1116 delegates.

This cannot be emphasized enough. They DO NOT have that! Even if the media says otherwise, or the state GOP says otherwise. </QUOTE]

The entire GOP, the party we (Ron Paul) are actually trying to get the presidential nomination from, is LYING about the number of delegates that will vote for each candidate? This really sounds like a party that not only dislikes Ron Paul, but trying everything in their power to HURT him, and us.

With friends like the GOP, who needs enemies?


With friends like you trying to kill off our power wth a tailor made BS party...who needs yadda yadda ..finish that one off youself clown. The Party's name sucks too. It is a pure gimmick that in its structure negates itself.

Randy

[The Proservative]

[QUOTE=The Proservative;1278176]


With friends like you trying to kill off our power wth a tailor made BS party...who needs yadda yadda ..finish that one off youself clown. The Party's name sucks too. It is a pure gimmick that in its structure negates itself.

Randy

Thanks for the encouragement Randy, guess we won't be seeing you at the meetups :)

[FreeTraveler]

With friends like you trying to kill off our power wth a tailor made BS party...who needs yadda yadda ..finish that one off youself clown. The Party's name sucks too. It is a pure gimmick that in its structure negates itself.

Randy

QFT! I think people working in obvious contradiction to Dr. Paul's wishes should be disinvited to the party here. Differing opinions are fine, Treason is a punishable crime.

[Revolution9]

[QUOTE=Revolution9;1278236]

Thanks for the encouragement Randy, guess we won't be seeing you at the meetups :)

Nope. I got a real mission and will remain loyal to Ron's vision and agenda. I ain't gonna get sidetracked with the umpteenth third party popping int0 existence. It makes no strategic sense in light of timeline, what this movement has already accomplished, and I ain't much for gimmickry and blind alleys anyways.

Why don;'t you go start a forum somewhere instead of coattailing this one trying to derail momentum and suck supporters away?? Test your idea in the market and test the druthers of your ability to garner adherents whilst not saddlebagging on this campaign and Ron's mulit-decade positioning of himself within the Republican Party. Betcha ya can't do it.

Best Regards
randy

[The Proservative]

QFT! I think people working in obvious contradiction to Dr. Paul's wishes should be disinvited to the party here.

FreeTraveler, are you a PRO-Life Libertarian, or ANTI-LIFE? I'm asking because Dr. Paul's wishes are to save human life, beginning at conception, and want to know where you stand regarding his wishes?

The entire reason Ron Paul is ruling out a 3rd party run is because of his excruciating dealings with the Libertarian party and their support of murder. Ron Paul even dropped out of politics because his experience with Libertarians was so horrific.

[The Proservative]

Nope. I got a real mission and will remain loyal to Ron's vision and agenda.

That is exactly what we're doing, no gimmicks. All I ask, is you save the judgment, at least until we've had time to prove our conviction, support of the Ron Paul Revolution with solid, loyal action.


[QUOTE=The Proservative;1278245]
Best Regards
randy

At least you're warning up a little, jeez.. Rough crowd.

[CJP]

Someone remember to turn off the light and shut the door behind you when exiting the GOP :)

Help us deliver up to Ron Paul a custom built, ready to go, complete political party built from the ground up around ALL of Ron Paul's platforms and our Revolution.

Third parties will never win any significant election, due to our plurality-take-all electoral system. This plan has already been tried -- it is (was?) called the Libertarian Party. 30-odd years to reach 0.5% could get it to a majority before the sun burns out, though.

The only way is to take over a major party, and the GOP is our best shot. Yes, it is controlled by idiots now, but if we direct our massive energy to the task, we can take it. I'm sure we can.

This is, in fact, the great lesson from this campaign -- we should learn from it. Ron Paul has had massive, unexpected success in less than a year by going with the GOP. (Compare this to anything the LP has done in over 30 years). This would have never happened with a third party.

Starting a new party may be exciting, but mark my words: you will succeed only in preaching to the choir, and you will make near-zero impact on the nation's politics. (Please don't take this as a personal attack -- I'm trying to help.)

The re-taking of the GOP by the Revolution is just beginning. So of course the GOP is still going to nominate a McCain in this presidential election -- you don't expect up to complete take over the party in a few months do you? It takes time by working from the local level up.

Please reconsider and direct your energies to a battle plan that can actually win.

[The Proservative]

Third parties will never win any significant election, due to our plurality-take-all electoral system.

I completely understand the history and ramifications of your argument, but, I quote from one of our favorite movies, The Matrix:

Trinity: Neo... nobody has ever done this before.
Neo: That's why it's going to work.

Our Ron Paul Revolution HAS NEVER BEEN EXPERIENCED BEFORE. I'm sure I don't need to expound on what we've accomplished already (raising $6M in one day, etc). You all talk about breaking status quo, and yet subject to it at every turn. MSM, GOP...let's change it all on our terms, not theirs.

I'm not at all going after "shock and awe", or doing something just to be exciting. I'm all about doing something different.

We ARE NOT Libertarians, and there is reason they fell flat on their face. If Ron Paul for whatever reason decided to run third party, on his own terms, full platform of HIS OWN, he honestly has the BEST shot of winning the first third party Presidential election in our nation's history. The Internet and technologies to rally the troops wasn't around in previous elections. Text messaging, cell phones, email, You Tube even...we've got more organizing capability and resources THAN EVER BEFORE. The Proservative Movement will utilize all of them, knows how to use them effectively and efficiently, in support of ANY AND ALL Ron Paul / Ron Paul platform initiatives, grassroots, campaigns, etc. We're not saying we are THE ANSWER, but we sure as hell are not the problem. We are one answer, among many correct answers. Even this forum is blazing trails, providing us to even have this discourse. KUDOS to RonPaulForums.com , keep on keepin on ;)

Eventually, a third party has to win a presidential election. Just like the New England Patriots had to lose someday (sucks it was the Super Bowl, but...). Every dog has it's day, and our day IS TODAY.

So suck it up, and get on board. We are taking this country back.

[CJP]

Trinity: Neo... nobody has ever done this before.
Neo: That's why it's going to work.

Our Ron Paul Revolution HAS NEVER BEEN EXPERIENCED BEFORE. I'm sure I don't need to expound on what we've accomplished already ...

The Revolution has never been like this before precicely because we brought a principled, uncompromised message of liberty to a major-party electoral process. That is what hasn't been done before in our lifetimes.

The ideas, in their modern (post-New-Deal) form, have been around virtually unchanged for many decades and have been incarnated into a party (the LP) since the 1970s. So it's not the ideas that are new, it's the possibility of the ideas actually winning. And this possibility exists because we aren't wasting our time with third parties.

[The Proservative]

The Revolution has never been like this before precicely because we brought a principled, uncompromised message of liberty to a major-party electoral process. That is what hasn't been done before in our lifetimes.


This is definitely a possibility, and I'm open to it. First and foremost, being a proservative is about supporting Ron Paul and his entire platform, no matter what party he is in. We never talked out of the gate about becoming a third "Proservative" party, and in fact, I currently tell people I'm a Proservative Republican.

But, this is mostly "a chicken and the egg"...which came first, the party or the man, Ron Paul. I agree Ron Paul has been solid with his platform, ideals, and his message since the 1980's, and that has NOT changed. But my opinion is that its not the Republican party that has taken his message and broadcast it into the ether.

The Ron Paul Revolution is a direct result of taking a true American, loyal, patriotic man's unwavering platform of strict Constitutional adherence and broadcasting it, not via a political party, but by our new Internet method of communication.

The Internet (new) + Ron Paul's unwavering message (old) = Ron Paul Revolution. I'd have to disagree is has anything to do with his party affiliation, Republican or otherwise.

[Thomas Paine]

McCain - Wrapped in a Flag - President
Huckabee - Carrying a Cross - Vice-President

Huckabee is still in it not to win, but to take delegates AWAY from Ron Paul. Once Huckabee tallies enough delegates that, if given to McCain, would put McCain over the top, Huckabee will concede and become VP.

This has been the strategy since the WV caucus. The "Huckster" will wheel and deal, as he did with the Paul campaign in WV, with McCain, and offer up all delegates in return for the VP nod.

Currently McCain is at 830, Huckabee at 286 = 1116 total delegates

Once this number between the two exceeds the needed 1191, expect this plan to be executed, with Huckabee conceding and handing over delegates to McCain.

Between McCain and Huckabee of as I call them MC-A-BEE, they only need 75 delegates.

Someone remember to turn off the light and shut the door behind you when exiting the GOP :)

Help us deliver up to Ron Paul a custom built, ready to go, complete political party built from the ground up around ALL of Ron Paul's platforms and our Revolution. Join our Proservative initial interest group now, solidify our ranks, and prepare for battle BEFORE MCABEE turns the corner. We'll be waiting for them in the wings, Constitution in hand.

http://www.proservative.us

If Ron Paul decides to remain Republican, we are behind him 100%. But, let it not be because he didn't have every available option, every opportunity available to him during his decision process.

If McCain/Huckabee get elected as President/VP, then we had all better start getting used to hearing "Sieg Heil!"

[The Proservative]

If McCain/Huckabee get elected as President/VP, then we had all better start getting used to hearing "Sieg Heil!"

Exactly...Ron Paul, the man, the president, the soothsayer? :)

[pacelli]

Ron already ruled out a third party run. The matrix is a movie.

[The Proservative]

Ron already ruled out a third party run. The matrix is a movie.

Ron ruled out a third party run...so I've read, everywhere. And in effect this country has ruled out a third choice between Hillary Clinton and John McCain...sad day.

Please read my plea/open letter to Ron Paul:
http://www.proservative.us/dearronpaul.htm

Pearl Harbor was also a movie...

[CJP]

The Internet (new) + Ron Paul's unwavering message (old) = Ron Paul Revolution. I'd have to disagree is has anything to do with his party affiliation, Republican or otherwise.

The libertarians (big & small "L") and other like-minded pro-liberty folks have been all over the 'net or over 20 years. (Yes, I was on the 'net in the 80's). And we've even had good-quality video on the web for the past couple election cycles. The 'net is an essential tool, but it in itself was not enough. We need the tools, but we have to reach out to the world of the mainstream political process to both reach large numbers of people and have a chance of winning.

The use of a major party by a credible candidate is what has made the difference. The 'net is what you'd call "necessary, but not sufficient."

[The Proservative]

The use of a major party by a credible candidate is what has made the difference. The 'net is what you'd call "necessary, but not sufficient."

I strongly disagree on that point. I've also been on the "net" since 1985, Compuserve to be exact, with my C64, and have seen dramatic changes in its structure, technology.

The problem is that the Internet has not been utilize efficiently in previous/current efforts. And it's a problem that is currently being addressed.

In my estimation, we're at about 35% utilization regarding Internet/communication technologies, time to go full throttle. YouTube/MySpace is the throttle, and as any car mechanic knows, overclocker knows, the machine is capable of way more output.

Time to "overclock" this Ron Paul Revolution. I understand this is all talk until something tangible emerges...therefore, stay tuned. Until then, I'll have to cede you this argument in saying you are right...thus far.