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affa
02-09-2008, 12:25 PM
I think we're doing quite well.

I think Ron Paul's letter was just fine. As I mentioned in that thread, I thought it might help shore up the Republican base - he publicly announced that he would never think of running 3rd party, which gets 'loyalty' points.

It shows that he is loyal to Texas and his position in Congress, also important.

It shows that he is realistic - the media can no longer portray him as a kook for thinking he has a chance (even though we know he does!)

Now, yes, we overreacted yesterday. I think that's in part due to a few well placed 'I quits' in the discussion which set the tone for morale loss. Note that those were also the people vocal in the Third Party Run divisiveness. Divisive and demoralizing posters are not on our team, even if they think they are.

But today? Canvas. Donate. Support his presidential run. Support his congressional run.

Nothing has changed. He hasn't dropped out - he's still running.

That's important so I'll repeat: Nothing has changed. He sent out an email. That's all. We still have a chance of a brokered convention, however slim. It's OUR responsibility to make it happen.

We're in this to win this.

jrich4rpaul
02-09-2008, 12:28 PM
Post of the day!

DirtMcGirt
02-09-2008, 12:28 PM
The more delegates the more time he gets to speak at the convention...whether it's brokered or not... his message will still be getting out...

affa
02-09-2008, 12:33 PM
The more delegates the more time he gets to speak at the convention...whether it's brokered or not... his message will still be getting out...

And brokered conventions have been won with less delegates than he already has - and without the pre-planning we've done which only increases his chances.

dima7b
02-09-2008, 12:35 PM
Bump!

The letter was just fine I think, and I think it's really important we secure his congressional run first since it is happening soon and then once we do that, we can again focus easily on his presidential run.

drexhex
02-09-2008, 12:37 PM
In 1860 Lincoln won the nomination with 22 delegates.

JSutter
02-09-2008, 12:39 PM
Exactly. He finally said "There will be no third party candidacy". He pretty much just said you've got three choices left. Choose Liberal leaning McCain and lose in November. Choose Huckabee, win the South, lose the rest of America. Choose me and with your support and the grassroots we can win this thing. I'm a Republican and not switching so stand with me"

At first I saw it as a message of defeat until I reread it several times and saw it for what it was. It's a good move. There are serious questions arising now about whether McCain is conservative enough and whether he can win in November. People are starting to have "buyers remorse" now that they see what they've gotten and might be feeling like taking it back to get something better.

coffeewithchess
02-09-2008, 12:39 PM
In 1860 Lincoln won the nomination with 22 delegates.

Where is the link to this? I "Googled" for it last night, but couldn't find the original source.

The Good Doctor
02-09-2008, 12:39 PM
QFE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!


In 1860 Lincoln won the nomination with 22 delegates.

NinjaPirate
02-09-2008, 12:40 PM
In 1860 Lincoln won the nomination with 22 delegates.

Out of how many?

Plus, we'd have a better chance of finding a needle in a haystack than RP getting the nod for the GOP ticket. But I've seen stranger things happen. :)

clintontj72
02-09-2008, 12:40 PM
He definitely chose the tough choice...takes cahones to do that...let's get out there and vote for him!

pacelli
02-09-2008, 12:49 PM
Where is the link to this? I "Googled" for it last night, but couldn't find the original source.

I'm not sure about the 22 delegate win, but I found this:


Finally, the third day arrived. One thousand Seward men marched behind a smartly uniformed brass band. They wound their way noisily through Chicago’s streets, playing the song “Oh, Isn’t He a Darling?” and finally arrived triumphantly in front of the Wigwam. To their horror, they found that they could not get in: the Lincoln men, admitted with their counterfeit tickets, had taken their seats.

Still, Seward had his share of support. When his name was offered in nomination, tremendous applause went up from the audience--followed by louder applause for Lincoln. The crowd quickly recognized them as the front-runners when the other candidates received less enthusiastic commendation.

When Seward’s name was seconded, the demonstration was so vociferous that “hundreds of persons stopped their ears in pain.” But when Lincoln’s nomination was seconded, the uproar was “beyond description.”

Leonard Swett, a friend of Lincoln’s, said that “Five thousand people leaped to their seats, women not wanting, and the wild yell made vesper breathings of all that had preceded. A thousand steam whistles, ten acres of hotel gongs, a tribe of Comanches might have mingled in the scene unnoticed.”

Holding their breath

After the first ballot, Seward, as expected, led with 173 votes. Lincoln was next with 102. Cameron received 50; Chase got 49; Bates 48; and the rest received a handful each.

A second ballot was immediately called for, and the Lincoln camp knew that their man would gain strength. Vermont was the first state to make a major shift--all 10 votes went to Lincoln, a significant blow to Seward. As the roll call continued, Lincoln gained a few votes here and a few there, while Seward’s tally remained largely unchanged.

When Pennsylvania’s turn came, the Lincoln men held their breath. Whereas only four votes from Pennsylvania went to Lincoln on the first ballot, a whopping 48 went to him on the second. Seward supporters sank in their seats. Lincoln clearly had the momentum. The final tally on the second ballot was 184 for Seward and 181 for Lincoln.

A hush fell
Ballot three began. Lincoln continued to pick up votes--4 more from Kentucky, 15 from Ohio--while Seward lost votes. When the pencils stopped scratching, Lincoln had 231 and a half votes--one and a half short of those needed for the nomination.

A hush fell, and all eyes turned toward D. K. Cartter of Ohio, who stuttered out: “I-I arise, Mr. Chairman, to a-announce the ch-change of four votes, from Mr. Chase to Abraham Lincoln!” For a moment, the audience was silent--then it erupted. The sound was so deafening that the only way people could tell that cannons outside the Wigwam were being fired was by watching the smoke drift from the barrels.


http://www.greatamericanhistory.net/nomination.htm

Roxi
02-09-2008, 01:15 PM
bump....:cool:

jeff43
02-09-2008, 01:17 PM
You just figured out that things aren't going well? McCain is about 400 delegates away from the win. Paul is over 1,000 away and he's basically quit and is focusing on his Congressional seat. There's absolutely no chance of a brokered convention and Paul even admits it. It's over. Focus on Paul getting re-elected in Congress and others like him getting into Congress. McCain will get closer to the nomination with 3 more victories today.

fabijo
02-09-2008, 01:20 PM
In 1860 Lincoln won the nomination with 22 delegates.

He also gave out tons of counterfeit tickets to his supporters and had them show up early to the convention so that his opponents wouldn't have seats.

affa
02-09-2008, 01:31 PM
You just figured out that things aren't going well? McCain is about 400 delegates away from the win. Paul is over 1,000 away and he's basically quit and is focusing on his Congressional seat. There's absolutely no chance of a brokered convention and Paul even admits it. It's over. Focus on Paul getting re-elected in Congress and others like him getting into Congress. McCain will get closer to the nomination with 3 more victories today.

17 posts. You lose the internet.

affa
02-09-2008, 01:33 PM
James A. Garfield won a brokered convention and he wasn't even a candidate. It went up to thirty something successive votes. He only showed up in the mid thirties.

jeff43
02-09-2008, 01:38 PM
17 posts. You lose the internet.

"Let me tell you my thoughts. With Romney gone, the chances of a brokered convention are nearly zero." -Ron Paul

"I also have another priority. I have constituents in my home district that I must serve. I cannot and will not let them down. And I have another battle I must face here as well. If I were to lose the primary for my congressional seat, all our opponents would react with glee, and pretend it was a rejection of our ideas. I cannot and will not let that happen." -Ron Paul

Delegate count: John McCain 724 Ron Paul 14 Needed to win: 1,191

http://www.realclearpolitics.com/epolls/2008/president/republican_delegate_count.html

Tell me what I said that was wrong and why I lose. Do you think McCain is going to lose Louisiania, Washington, or Kansas to Ron Paul? I don't. Just because I don't have many posts doesn't make me any less smarter than you. People need to start realizing that here or nobody new is going to want to stay here.

break4me
02-09-2008, 01:46 PM
Wow Jeff, could you be any more anti-Paul? Do you work for FauxNews or something?

Every one here, except you, knows Paul has more than 14 delegates. You have a little reading up to do, I guess.

jeff43
02-09-2008, 01:50 PM
Wow Jeff, could you be any more anti-Paul? Do you work for FauxNews or something?

Every one here, except you, knows Paul has more than 14 delegates. You have a little reading up to do, I guess.

I'm just going by what I see on the rcp website. RCP seems like a decent website wouldn't you say? Where does Paul have more delegates at this very moment? I know he has at least 3 more from the WV Huckabee deal, but where else is RCP wrong and prove it with a verifiable source please.

MrAustin
02-09-2008, 01:58 PM
This is a great post....sad to see it getting off topic.

Nothing has changed, Ron has just CLARIFIED for us what we can do to help him. Carry on! It's up to us!

OferNave
02-09-2008, 02:02 PM
I'm here till the end.

Liberté
02-09-2008, 02:04 PM
Wow Jeff, could you be any more anti-Paul? Do you work for FauxNews or something?

Every one here, except you, knows Paul has more than 14 delegates. You have a little reading up to do, I guess.

yes, paul has about 42 to 44 National Delegates. Now that Romney is out McCain actually has about 900 National Delegates, a lot of those unpledged Romney, Fred, Rudy, and even Huckabee delegates will close ranks around McCain.

LukeNM
02-09-2008, 03:04 PM
I feel Ron's message hit the mark... It is almost as if he reads these forums. The two big issues here were the possibility of a 3rd party run and a brokered convention. He addressed both these issues in his message. He may not have said what we want to hear, but I believe he is being realistic and trying to look out for our well being while urging us to keep moving forward.

goldstandard
02-09-2008, 03:09 PM
You just figured out that things aren't going well? McCain is about 400 delegates away from the win. Paul is over 1,000 away and he's basically quit and is focusing on his Congressional seat. There's absolutely no chance of a brokered convention and Paul even admits it. It's over. Focus on Paul getting re-elected in Congress and others like him getting into Congress. McCain will get closer to the nomination with 3 more victories today.

Why are you here????:rolleyes:

jbuttell
02-09-2008, 03:09 PM
yep!! :)

jeff43
02-09-2008, 03:11 PM
Why are you here????:rolleyes:

I'm here because I'm focusing on Paul getting re-elected to Congress, just like he is. And because I want to get more people like Paul in the Congress. His Presidential bid is over and it's time to move on. I have and I will continue to promote the message.

quezkittel
02-09-2008, 03:11 PM
Why are you here????:rolleyes:

No need for snarking! I don't agree with that poster either, but I assume he'd be ecstatic to be wrong :)

affa
02-09-2008, 03:19 PM
I'm here because I'm focusing on Paul getting re-elected to Congress, just like he is. And because I want to get more people like Paul in the Congress. His Presidential bid is over and it's time to move on. I have and I will continue to promote the message.

How about you go to the forums that say 'Grassroots support for Ron Paul's 2008 Congressional Campaign' at the top then.


"Let me tell you my thoughts. With Romney gone, the chances of a brokered convention are nearly zero." -Ron Paul

Go look up the word 'nearly'. You may be surprised at what it means.


The rest of your posts are misinformation. You were incorrect on your delegate counts and still refuse to admit you are wrong. Bye.

jeff43
02-09-2008, 03:23 PM
How about you go to the forums that say 'Grassroots support for Ron Paul's 2008 Congressional Campaign' at the top then.



Go look up the word 'nearly'. You may be surprised at what it means.


The rest of your posts are misinformation. You were incorrect on your delegate counts and still refuse to admit you are wrong. Bye.

How was I wrong on the delegate counts? SHOW ME HOW I'M WRONG!!!!! Everyone keeps saying this and nobody can provide PROOF! RCP says he has 14, plus he has 3 from the WV Huckabee deal. This is what I said. SHOW ME HOW THAT'S WRONG! GIVE ME PROOF! Which one of my posts are misinformation? SHOW ME! This forum is for people who believe in Ron Paul's message. Once his Presidential campaign is over it doesn't just cease to exist. A lot of people, INCLUDING RON PAUL HIMSELF, are focusing on his Congresional campaign and getting others in Congress. You're basically saying that Ron Paul wouldn't have a place in this forum if he wanted to join. It's the message that's important and Paul has said that we should continue the revolution beyond his Presidential bid.

kyleAF
02-09-2008, 03:25 PM
You just figured out that things aren't going well? McCain is about 400 delegates away from the win. Paul is over 1,000 away and he's basically quit and is focusing on his Congressional seat. There's absolutely no chance of a brokered convention and Paul even admits it. It's over. Focus on Paul getting re-elected in Congress and others like him getting into Congress. McCain will get closer to the nomination with 3 more victories today.

You mean a thorough trouncing in Kansas??

It's not over yet. McCain will be shot down once again. It's his MO.

Fields
02-09-2008, 03:25 PM
Bump.

affa
02-09-2008, 03:32 PM
How was I wrong on the delegate counts? SHOW ME HOW I'M WRONG!!!!! Everyone keeps saying this and nobody can provide PROOF! RCP says he has 14, plus he has 3 from the WV Huckabee deal. This is what I said. SHOW ME HOW THAT'S WRONG! GIVE ME PROOF! Which one of my posts are misinformation? SHOW ME! This forum is for people who believe in Ron Paul's message. Once his Presidential campaign is over it doesn't just cease to exist. A lot of people, INCLUDING RON PAUL HIMSELF, are focusing on his Congresional campaign and getting others in Congress. You're basically saying that Ron Paul wouldn't have a place in this forum if he wanted to join. It's the message that's important and Paul has said that we should continue the revolution beyond his Presidential bid.

From Ron Paul's official website, his posting on 2/06.

Entitled: Ron Paul National Delegate Count Now 42 or More.

Are you calling Ron Paul a liar?

You and your 30 something posts are NOT helping.

kickzman
02-09-2008, 03:32 PM
In 1860 Lincoln won the nomination with 22 delegates.

Good Lord, that must've been when we still had a democracy.:eek:

jeff43
02-09-2008, 03:35 PM
From Ron Paul's official website, his posting on 2/06.

Entitled: Ron Paul National Delegate Count Now 42 or More

You and your 30 something posts are helping.

I see. Thank you for correcting me. Finally someone posted something that said Paul has more than 14 delegates. He's still 700 behind John McCain though and Paul has said himself that he's focusing on his Congressional run. Those are facts. I've been defending Paul in a thread against a white supremacist and I've vowed to continue spreading the message beyond his failed Presidential run so how am I not helping? I'm here for the long haul and I will defend Paul's message as long as I live.

kyleAF
02-09-2008, 03:39 PM
I see. Thank you for correcting me. Finally someone posted something that said Paul has more than 14 delegates. He's still 700 behind John McCain though and Paul has said himself that he's focusing on his Congressional run. Those are facts. I've been defending Paul in a thread against a white supremacist and I've vowed to continue spreading the message beyond his failed Presidential run so how am I not helping? I'm here for the long haul and I will defend Paul's message as long as I live.

Good. Thanks. We'll keep doing what we've been doing for quite a while now... work for the Presidency. The Congressional campaign is also important, and many of us have donated to it, as well as contributed in other ways.

Forgive us for not shifting the entire direction of our massive front after reading one letter, which IMO was actually very encouraging and subtle. It is clear that we will not sweep the nation from here on out, but we will continue to make our presence known and work toward that "nearly" zero chance.

jeff43
02-09-2008, 03:41 PM
Thank you Kyle! Finally someone that didn't call me names or criticize me for supporting Ron Paul's Congressional re-election. You do what you think it best and I'll do what I think is best. We're both working for the same man so I don't see what the problem is here. I understand your viewpoint and am glad that you understand mine. Maybe there are some good people here afterall.

dblee
02-09-2008, 03:43 PM
all we need to do, is derail john mccain. If he does not win a single state from this point forward, i will have considered it a huge victory.

to me, as a conservative, this is more about not letting the conservative movement die, and letting the neo-con's know that they aren't about to hijack our movement, our party, or our country.

jeff43
02-09-2008, 03:45 PM
You mean a thorough trouncing in Kansas??

It's not over yet. McCain will be shot down once again. It's his MO.

Yes, I was a little surprised that McCain didn't sweep today. I still expect him to take the other two states. I think McCain was already declared the winner of Louisiana. I know Paul was screwed and is contesting the results though. When you look at it realistically though, Huckabee is only strong in the midwest and south east. When you get to states like Maryland, Vermont, Pennsylvania, and Ohio it's going to be tough to beat McCain. A lot of the remaining states are proportional delegates which he doesn't even have to win to get delegates, so it's pretty much guaranteed that he'll get enough delegates to win, as Ron Paul himself admits.

wgadget
02-09-2008, 03:47 PM
You just figured out that things aren't going well? McCain is about 400 delegates away from the win. Paul is over 1,000 away and he's basically quit and is focusing on his Congressional seat. There's absolutely no chance of a brokered convention and Paul even admits it. It's over. Focus on Paul getting re-elected in Congress and others like him getting into Congress. McCain will get closer to the nomination with 3 more victories today.

Well, McCain has just lost 1 of those "victories" in Kansas...Way to go, John!

:D

affa
02-09-2008, 03:51 PM
I see. Thank you for correcting me. Finally someone posted something that said Paul has more than 14 delegates. He's still 700 behind John McCain though and Paul has said himself that he's focusing on his Congressional run. Those are facts. I've been defending Paul in a thread against a white supremacist and I've vowed to continue spreading the message beyond his failed Presidential run so how am I not helping? I'm here for the long haul and I will defend Paul's message as long as I live.

The problem, Jeff, is that everyone here knows we have two goals:
1. Get Ron Paul reelected as Congressman.
2. Get Ron Paul elected as President.

We need to do BOTH.
Anyone telling us that #2 is an impossibility when it is NOT an impossibility is a demoralizing detriment to the cause. His presidential run is not over and he has not dropped out. Posting otherwise is not helping.

jeff43
02-09-2008, 03:54 PM
I never said he dropped out. His Presidential campaign isn't officially over, but it's pretty much over as he completely ruled out a 3rd party run and said that the chances of a brokered convention were nearly zero. I've moved on and I hope we can change the Congress this election. Ron Paul does too. If you want to keep trying to get Paul elected as President, go ahead. I think it's a lost cause, but I support your decision. We're both working for the same man and same message here.

affa
02-09-2008, 04:03 PM
To quote you, Jeff,


You just figured out that things aren't going well? McCain is about 400 delegates away from the win. Paul is over 1,000 away and he's basically quit and is focusing on his Congressional seat. There's absolutely no chance of a brokered convention and Paul even admits it. It's over. Focus on Paul getting re-elected in Congress and others like him getting into Congress. McCain will get closer to the nomination with 3 more victories today.

This was supposed to be a GET MOTIVATED thread. You know, get morale up. You hijacked it for your own purposes, and in the process continuously posted misinformation about delegate counts.

If you do not see what is wrong with that, then I don't know what to say.

jeff43
02-09-2008, 04:05 PM
I said he had 14 delegates plus 3 for the WV Huckabee deal. This is what is being reported on various political sites so excuse me for being wrong on that one. I'm sorry that I'm supporting Ron Paul beyond his Presidential bid. I guess there's not a place for people like me on this forum.

affa
02-09-2008, 04:18 PM
I said he had 14 delegates plus 3 for the WV Huckabee deal. This is what is being reported on various political sites so excuse me for being wrong on that one. I'm sorry that I'm supporting Ron Paul beyond his Presidential bid. I guess there's not a place for people like me on this forum.

You started today with something like 10 or 13 posts.

"I'm sorry that I'm supporting Ron Paul beyond his Presidential bid."

Nice try.

EDITED TO ADD: I just read all your posts since the first... only a few days ago. I can safely say: busted.

jeff43
02-09-2008, 04:25 PM
I defended Ron Paul in a thread against a white supremacist today. I said that I would support the revoultion as long as I live. I said that I was going to focus on Ron Paul getting re-elected to Congress and getting others like him into Congress to create an important Republican voting block. What exactly am I busted for?