A Realistic Strategy for a Brokered Convention

[No1ButPaul08]

A common theme around here is WAKE UP PEOPLE. Not as popular but people also like, "it will be a brokered convention." I say, WAKE UP PEOPLE, there hasn't been a brokered convention since 1952, before most states had people vote in primaries. The convention is not going to broker itself, something has to be done

As it stands, John McCain has ~720 delegates. Many people on here say, "it will be a brokered convention." That's the end of their story as they have no proof of that. McCain is on his way to steamroll to the nomination. The delegate count for the others, even RP at this point, really do not matter, as they do not stand a realistic chance at getting to 1191. If John McCain gets to 1191 it is over, and there will be no brokered convention. Therefore, the #1 goal at this point must be to Stop John McCain.
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The other goal is to get delegates in primary states where delegates are only bound from 1-3 ballots AND where the delegates aren't directly elected because they are supporters of a candidate. We'll call this a good state/bad state breakdown. The Caucus states will take care of themselves.

Good States: 19

AZ, AR, DW, FL, GA, ID, IN, MA, MI, MO, NJ, NM, NC, SC, SD, TX, VT, VA, OR

In these states delegates are elected away from the primary and could potenially be RP delegates in a brokered convention. These are the states where the work must be done on the delegate side. These delegates will initially be bound to other candidates, but if they are true RP supporters, they will turn once the convention becomes brokered.

Bad States: 19 and Puerto Rico (unless we get top 3????????)
AL (this one i'm not so sure, but delegates have already been elected anyway), CA, CT, DC, IL, Kansas (Caucus, but bad), KY, NH, MD, MS, NY, OH, OK, PN(not sure here either, delegates are on primary ballot, not sure if tied to candidate.), RI, UT (not really a bad state, but i figure Romney has got this one locked up), WI, WV (We got 3 delegates here, no more, Thank you Huck), WY

We are not get any delegates in these states. They are locked in until they are released. Most of them are for McCain. They are not getting released.

Caucus States: 13 + 4 territories(Guam, Am Samoa, VI, N Mariana)

AK, CO, HI, IA, LA, ME, MN, MT, NE (non-binding primary doesn't mean squat, similar to LA), NV, ND, WA (delegates are "morally bound" not "legally bound," which mean the primary and caucus don't mean squat, and the real action is at the district and state conventions, similare to LA and NE.

Caucus states can be good and bad. Most of them are still in the process and it's hard to determine who will get the delegates. They are good because RP can win delegates straight up in these states. They are bad because even though most of these states the delegates become unbound after a ballot or two, they are delegates because they support their candidate.
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That was goal #2, back to goal #1: STOPPING McCAIN

This is the part where I lose people by suggesting they vote for Mike Huckabee, read on please.

In Missouri. McNameDropper beat Huckabee by ~8,000 votes for all of Missouri's 58 winner-take-all delegates. Ron Paul got 25,000 votes. If RP's 25,000 votes go to Huckabee he wins and McCain doesn't get the delegates. Simply put, Ron Paul voters would have been much better off voting for Huckabee.

Delegates > votes........at this point.....delegates against McCain > votes for Ron Paul.

How do we do this, state by state we vote for Huck to stop McCain where necessary while trying to secure backroom delegates in the states I listed as good states.

Note some of the WTA are by state or by district/state but here they are pretty much the same as RP has no chance in those

2/9
KS: bad WTA caucus state (a rarity). Votes for Ron Paul are worthless. Vote Huck

Wash: worthless as delegates aren't legally bound, and they don't get elected here


2/12
DC: WTA we must vote for Huck, or McCain gets 18 very pledged delegates

VA: WTA, vote for Huck, become a delegate Very Important 67 WTA

MA: WTA we must vote for Huck, or McCain gets 37 very pledged delegates

2/19
Wash: worthless as delegates aren't legally bound, and they don't get elected here

WI: WTA we must vote for strongest of Romney or Huck, or McCain gets 40 very pledged delegates

3/4
OH: we need this WTA state of 88 delegates to go to Huck

RI: We need 15% to get delegates but in proportional so damage to McCain really can't be done here. Vote for Paul

TX: I can't in good conscience tell the people of Texas to not vote for Ron Paul. This is WTA by district/state. Some districts we might be better off trying to stop McCain. The 14th better go to RP. Another good state to become a delegate in.

VT: WTA, vote for Huck, become a delegate

3/11
MS: Another bad WTA state. A vote for Paul is a vote for McCain. A vote for Huckabee is a vote for Paul.

4/22
PA: A state where the delegate are on the ballot however I'm not sure if they are tied to a campaign (which would make it a bad state.) With that said, our goal should be keeping McCain delegates away from the convention. We have time here to figure that out.

Later States
Most of these RP should get the votes except IN, OR, and KY. I'll go into detail (and look like a genius),if we get to this point


If we can do all that we still have to get by the 5 state obstical. We can worry about that if the convention becomes brokered.

STOP JOHN McCAIN

EDIT: we should also try to convince Romney and Huck supporters to do this also.

EDIT: For the third party people, every email RP sends mentions a brokered convention, yet none mention a third party. He has also relied on the grassroots, this is our last chance for HIS goal

EDIT: Best case scenario might be a convention speech. Do not underrate this. Obama is who he is because of a convention speech
Ron really, really wants to speak at the convention. Not even sure if this is possible however. The more delegate the better

[libertythor]

Don't vote for anybody but Ron. Just become a stealth delegate in these states. Its not like you lose your life if you break and vote for Ron on the first ballot.

[No1ButPaul08]

Don't vote for anybody but Ron. Just become a stealth delegate in these states. Its not like you lose your life if you break and vote for Ron on the first ballot.

Delegates > votes

in some states.....delegates against McCain > votes for Ron

I understand your first ballot thing, but not all the delegates will be for RP. We must make them bound for anybody but McCain

Edit: Like my example in MO, some the 58 delegates could be RP supporters, but not all of them. It would be much, much better had those 58 been pledged to Huck

[m72mc]

Not all delegates the old media is reporting for mccain is binding!

besides, considering all the election fraud, the winner have to prove he won.

[No1ButPaul08]

Not all delegates the old media is reporting for mccain is binding!

besides, considering all the election fraud, the winner have to prove he won.

No, but most of them are, and the ones that aren't bound are very likely to be McCain supporters. There is no other way around it, he has to be stopped. Votes for Ron Paul in Virginia are worthless. Delegates there, can be of great value in a brokered convention. It makes no sense to vote for Ron. In this Southern state, a vote for Huckabee is a vote for Paul. A delegate for Paul is a delegate for Paul in a brokered convention.

We cannot blindly hope for a brokered convention. At intrade.com, the betting line shows there is around 9-15% (last trade was at 9%, people are asking 15%, it was a lot lower before the huckasurge in the south) chance of a brokered convention. Meanwhile here McCain sits at 93%. All of the people saying, "it will be a brokered convention," are welcome to go there and bet so they can clean up because they have knowledge the rest of us don't. Meanwhile, those of who realize it will be very hard, must do everything we can to make that happen. That starts by caucusing for whoever is closest to McCain in KS and voting for Huckabee in VA. Somebody, with logic, please tell me I'm wrong

[affa]

Bump, not because I agree, but because I'd like more discussion.

I completely understand the tactics here, though am unsure if they're practical. Specifically, trying to organize massive voting like this on a forum is unlikely to work. The end result could be enough people change to make Ron Paul's support look even more eroded, but not enough to sway the primary in the way we'd like.

Is it possible these strategic orders could come from up high? Or would that be considered unethical on the part of the campaign?

All in all, it's going to be hard to get any Ron Paul supporter to vote for anyone but Ron Paul.

[No1ButPaul08]

Bump, not because I agree, but because I'd like more discussion.

I completely understand the tactics here, though am unsure if they're practical. Specifically, trying to organize massive voting like this on a forum is unlikely to work. The end result could be enough people change to make Ron Paul's support look even more eroded, but not enough to sway the primary in the way we'd like.

Is it possible these strategic orders could come from up high? Or would that be considered unethical on the part of the campaign?

All in all, it's going to be hard to get any Ron Paul supporter to vote for anyone but Ron Paul.

This will have to done through meetups and any other way possible. People will have to understand a vote for Huck or Romney is a vote for Ron Paul. By voting for Ron Paul you are voting for John McCain. I do see McCain and Huckabee teaming up to stop this by Huck getting the VP. McCain should realize however that any ticket with Huckabee can't win. The guy is unelectable in a general election as P or VP

[affa]

Don't vote for anybody but Ron. Just become a stealth delegate in these states. Its not like you lose your life if you break and vote for Ron on the first ballot.

Is this true? Can bound delegates vote however they want?

How does convention voting occur? Secret paper ballots? Jelly beans? Raising your hand in the air like you just don't care?

[No1ButPaul08]

Is this true? Can bound delegates vote however they want?

How does convention voting occur? Secret paper ballots? Jelly beans? Raising your hand in the air like you just don't care?

They would be breaking a state law (i think). RP supporters would be willing, but in a lot of states McCain has won he picked the delegates.

I don't think the vote is secret.

[No1ButPaul08]

Bump, not because I agree, but because I'd like more discussion.

I completely understand the tactics here, though am unsure if they're practical. Specifically, trying to organize massive voting like this on a forum is unlikely to work. The end result could be enough people change to make Ron Paul's support look even more eroded, but not enough to sway the primary in the way we'd like.

Is it possible these strategic orders could come from up high? Or would that be considered unethical on the part of the campaign?

All in all, it's going to be hard to get any Ron Paul supporter to vote for anyone but Ron Paul.

I'm going to reply to this again. This will be very hard to do, but i think it is our only chance. It would be unethical for orders to come up high, but it would be up to them to make that choice, but i doubt it would happen. People have to understand that in some states votes for RP are worthless. A vote for Mike Huckabee is a vote for Ron Paul. A vote for Ron Paul is a vote for John McCain. If enough people understand this we can get it done. After all, the grassroots got all these supporters, they should be able to convert them to, "huckabee voters," for a day. Meanwhile they are supporting the RP delegate at their district convention. In some states this will not matter, but it can. If we would have converted 1/3 of RP supporters in to Huckabee voters in MO, huckabee would have those delegates and mccain wouldn't, a big net positive for RP and a brokered convention. Virginia is huge, we have to try this

[affa]

There is a lot of time between now and then. A McCain scandal here, a Ron Paul boom here (possibly due to his book), and... who knows how delegates will vote.

[No1ButPaul08]

There is a lot of time between now and then. A McCain scandal here, a Ron Paul boom here (possibly due to his book), and... who knows how delegates will vote.

I agree, but that's blind faith. Like i said, the oddsmakers show mccain having a 93% (I believe money bet over any poll, or 99% of opinions on here.) chance of winning the nomination. Most of the delegates will be bound. McCain is favored in most remaining states. He could, but I really doubt McCain stops himself (scandel/blowup) We have to try and stop him ourselves.

[parocks]

Excellent Post.

It seems like you've thought this through.

The campaign should hire you.




As it stands, John McCain has ~720 delegates. Many people on here say, "it will be a brokered convention." That's the end of their story as they have no proof of that. McCain is on his way to steamroll to the nomination. The delegate count for the others, even RP at this point, really do not matter, as they do not stand a realistic chance at getting to 1191. If John McCain gets to 1191 it is over, and there will be no brokered convention. Therefore, the #1 goal at this point must be to Stop John McCain.
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The other goal is to get delegates in primary states where delegates are only bound from 1-3 ballots AND where the delegates aren't directly elected because they are supporters of a candidate. We'll call this a good state/bad state breakdown. The Caucus states will take care of themselves.

Good States: 19

AZ, AR, DW, FL, GA, ID, IN, MA, MI, MO, NJ, NM, NC, SC, SD, TX, VT, VA, OR

In these states delegates are elected away from the primary and could potenially be RP delegates in a brokered convention. These are the states where the work must be done on the delegate side. These delegates will initially be bound to other candidates, but if they are true RP supporters, they will turn once the convention becomes brokered.

[B]Bad States: 19 and Puerto Rico (unless we get top 3????????)
AL (this one i'm not so sure, but delegates have already been elected anyway), CA, CT, DC, IL, Kansas (Caucus, but bad), KY, NH, MD, MS, NY, OH, OK, PN(not sure here either, delegates are on primary ballot, not sure if tied to candidate.), RI, UT (not really a bad state, but i figure Romney has got this one locked up), WI, WV (We got 3 delegates here, no more, Thank you Huck), WY

We are not get any delegates in these states. They are locked in until they are released. Most of them are for McCain. They are not getting released.

Caucus States: 13 + 4 territories(Guam, Am Samoa, VI, N Mariana)

AK, CO, HI, IA, LA, ME, MN, MT, NE (non-binding primary doesn't mean squat, similar to LA), NV, ND, WA (delegates are "morally bound" not "legally bound," which mean the primary and caucus don't mean squat, and the real action is at the district and state conventions, similare to LA and NE.

Caucus states can be good and bad. Most of them are still in the process and it's hard to determine who will get the delegates. They are good because RP can win delegates straight up in these states. They are bad because even though most of these states the delegates become unbound after a ballot or two, they are delegates because they support their candidate.
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That was goal #2, back to goal #1: STOPPING McCAIN

This is the part where I lose people by suggesting they vote for Mike Huckabee or Mitt Romney, read on please.

In Missouri. McNameDropper beat Huckabee by ~8,000 votes for all of Missouri's 58 winner-take-all delegates. Ron Paul got 25,000 votes. If RP's 25,000 votes go to Huckabee he wins and McCain doesn't get the delegates. Simply put, Ron Paul voters would have been much better off voting for Huckabee.

Delegates > votes........at this point.....delegates against McCain > votes for Ron Paul.

How do we do this, state by state we vote for Huck or Romney to stop McCain where necessary while trying to secure backroom delegates in the states I listed as good states.

Note some of the WTA are by state or by district/state but here they are pretty much the same as RP has no chance in those

2/9
KS: bad WTA caucus state (a rarity). Votes for Ron Paul are worthless. Vote for whoever is stronger between Romney and Huck

Wash: worthless as delegates aren't legally bound, and they don't get elected here


2/12
DC: WTA we must vote for strongest of Romney or Huck, or McCain gets 18 very pledged delegates

VA: WTA, vote for Huck, become a delegate Very Important 67 WTA

MA: WTA we must vote for strongest of Romney or Huck, or McCain gets 37 very pledged delegates

2/19
Wash: worthless as delegates aren't legally bound, and they don't get elected here

WI: WTA we must vote for strongest of Romney or Huck, or McCain gets 40 very pledged delegates

3/4
OH: I would guess Huck is stronger than Romney, we need this WTA state of 88 delegates to go to Huck

RI: We need 15% to get delegates but in proportional so damage to McCain really can't be done here. Vote for Paul

TX: I can't in good conscience tell the people of Texas to not vote for Ron Paul. This is WTA by district/state. Some districts we might be better off trying to stop McCain. The 14th better go to RP. Another good state to become a delegate in.

VT: WTA, vote for Romney, become a delegate

3/11 Another bad WTA state. A vote for Paul is a vote for McCain. A vote for Huckabee is a vote for Paul.

4/22
PA: A state where the delegate are on the ballot however I'm not sure if they are tied to a campaign (which would make it a bad state.) With that said, our goal should be keeping McCain delegates away from the convention. We have time here to figure that out.

Later States
Most of these RP should get the votes except IN, OR, and KY. I'll go into detail (and look like a genius),if we get to this point


If we can do all that we still have to get by the 5 state obstical. We can worry about that if the convention becomes brokered.

STOP JOHN McCAIN

EDIT: we should also try to convince Romney and Huck supporters to do this also.

[parocks]

No, but most of them are, and the ones that aren't bound are very likely to be McCain supporters. There is no other way around it, he has to be stopped. Votes for Ron Paul in Virginia are worthless. Delegates there, can be of great value in a brokered convention. It makes no sense to vote for Ron. In this Southern state, a vote for Huckabee is a vote for Paul. A delegate for Paul is a delegate for Paul in a brokered convention.

We cannot blindly hope for a brokered convention. At intrade.com, the betting line shows there is around 9-15% (last trade was at 9%, people are asking 15%, it was a lot lower before the huckasurge in the south) chance of a brokered convention. Meanwhile here McCain sits at 93%. All of the people saying, "it will be a brokered convention," are welcome to go there and bet so they can clean up because they have knowledge the rest of us don't. Meanwhile, those of who realize it will be very hard, must do everything we can to make that happen. That starts by caucusing for whoever is closest to McCain in KS and voting for Huckabee in VA. Somebody, with logic, please tell me I'm wrong

You are 100% right.

If McCain isn't stopped, and soon, we lose. Period.

[parocks]

I'm going to reply to this again. This will be very hard to do, but i think it is our only chance. It would be unethical for orders to come up high, but it would be up to them to make that choice, but i doubt it would happen. People have to understand that in some states votes for RP are worthless. A vote for Mike Huckabee is a vote for Ron Paul. A vote for Ron Paul is a vote for John McCain. If enough people understand this we can get it done. After all, the grassroots got all these supporters, they should be able to convert them to, "huckabee voters," for a day. Meanwhile they are supporting the RP delegate at their district convention. In some states this will not matter, but it can. If we would have converted 1/3 of RP supporters in to Huckabee voters in MO, huckabee would have those delegates and mccain wouldn't, a big net positive for RP and a brokered convention. Virginia is huge, we have to try this


Some other theories, tactics, to try to achieve the same result.
1) In states we've identified as Huck states -work for Huck, Romney states, work for Romney.
2) Negative ads on McCain. Push polling against McCain. Anything else against McCain.

[No1ButPaul08]

You are 100% right.

If McCain isn't stopped, and soon, we lose. Period.

It starts in KS, then VA. We have no chance in these states to win delegates through votes. I could never see myself voting for Huck or Romney, but then i looked at the Missouri results and saw that Huckabee lost by 8500 votes and we got 26k. The 26k votes don't mean anything. The 58 delegates to McCain sting. They would be much better off with Mike Huckabee, a man without a prayer of winning the nomination, haha

[No1ButPaul08]

Some other theories, tactics, to try to achieve the same result.
1) In states we've identified as Huck states -work for Huck, Romney states, work for Romney.
2) Negative ads on McCain. Push polling against McCain. Anything else against McCain.

Yes, RP can attack McCain. That should be his job. We can fund push polls or whatever. Dirty tricks stopped McCain once, let's see if we can do it again.

We need Romney supporters to vote for Huck in Huck states and vice/versa. It benefits them too.

[parocks]

Yes, RP can attack McCain. That should be his job. We can fund push polls or whatever. Dirty tricks stopped McCain once, let's see if we can do it again.

We need Romney supporters to vote for Huck in Huck states and vice/versa. It benefits them too.


As a Republican, I'd be a bit concerned about covering McCain with mud. If it's McCain vs Hillary, I'm certainly voting for McCain.

But, you've outlined the only reasonable chance for a Ron Paul victory at this point.

Goal #1 - STOP MCCAIN

If you knew that McCain started dating his current wife when he was married to his old wife, would that make you more likely to vote for McCain, less likely to vote for McCain or about the same?

[No1ButPaul08]

As a Republican, I'd be a bit concerned about covering McCain with mud. If it's McCain vs Hillary, I'm certainly voting for McCain.

But, you've outlined the only reasonable chance for a Ron Paul victory at this point.

Goal #1 - STOP MCCAIN

If you knew that McCain started dating his current wife when he was married to his old wife, would that make you more likely to vote for McCain, less likely to vote for McCain or about the same?

McCain's going to get covered with mud regardless, he already is. Which reminds perhaps we can get Rush and friends in on this. After all, they want to stop McCain. For the GOP, speaking in the long term, it might be better if they drop this election to Hillary. Let the Dems do their thing w/ the war, come back with a fresh start and nominate say, a Mark Sanford, a staunch fiscal conservative who isn't viewed as crazy, fair or not. Obviously that's assuming RP doesn't win the nomination.

[luvthedoc08]

this is a good thread, discuss this more, we need a very specific and well thought out strategy, if some of the senior members can agree upon something and write a comprehensive guideline that will go a long way

[No1ButPaul08]

this is a good thread, discuss this more, we need a very specific and well thought out strategy, if some of the senior members can agree upon something and write a comprehensive guideline that will go a long way

Yeah i expect the strategy to evolve as it goes. I think this should be an all-out effort. Meet-ups, websites, youtubes, talk radio, the works. McCain has to be stopped.

[parocks]

McCain's going to get covered with mud regardless, he already is. Which reminds perhaps we can get Rush and friends in on this. After all, they want to stop McCain. For the GOP, speaking in the long term, it might be better if they drop this election to Hillary. Let the Dems do their thing w/ the war, come back with a fresh start and nominate say, a Mark Sanford, a staunch fiscal conservative who isn't viewed as crazy, fair or not. Obviously that's assuming RP doesn't win the nomination.

Hillary is the devil. I wouldn't vote for Obama, but he's acceptable.
They're about tied right now, and Obama won Super Tuesday.

I'm sure that Huckabee would be in favor of the idea that Romney and Paul supporters vote for Huck in those states where Huck is #2. Why wouldn't Rush?

They could go on air and explain situational voting within the context of STOP MCCAIN.

It's a fairly simple concept. Look at the polls in your state. Vote for whoever of the top 2 guys isn't McCain.

[dkim68]

3/11 Another bad WTA state. A vote for Paul is a vote for McCain. A vote for Huckabee is a vote for Paul.
^
Which state are you referring to here?

[No1ButPaul08]

^
Which state are you referring to here?

Mississippi, thank you i'll edit

[qwerty]

Learn how to win, click the link in my signature!

:cool:

[No1ButPaul08]

Learn how to win, click the link in my signature!

:cool:

Please read this thread before posting that. I've read that thread and IMO that thread is worthless without this thread.

[No1ButPaul08]

bump

[No1ButPaul08]

bump for unblind faith

[qwerty]

my Point Is That, I Trust The Campaign And Will Stand Behind Their Decicions, Not Behind Some Internet Guy...

This Campaign Is Not Here For The First Time, They Have Had The Same Plan From The Beginning And It Think They Know What They Are Doing, So I Stand Behind Them.

If You Think Your Idea Is The Best, You Should Contact The Campaign With It, Not Spread It Around Here Anonymously...

[No1ButPaul08]

my Point Is That, I Trust The Campaign And Will Stand Behind Their Decicions, Not Behind Some Internet Guy...

This Campaign Is Not Here For The First Time, They Have Had The Same Plan From The Beginning And It Think They Know What They Are Doing, So I Stand Behind Them.

If You Think Your Idea Is The Best, You Should Contact The Campaign With It, Not Spread It Around Here Anonymously...



The campaign can't do this. Talk about unethical/shady/something RP would never do. But, It's the only option. Blindly believing there is going to be a brokered convension is crazy. CRAZY

[No1ButPaul08]

If You Think Your Idea Is The Best, You Should Contact The Campaign With It, Not Spread It Around Here Anonymously...



Says the self bumping king

[qwerty]

Says the self bumping king

I´m not from America, i can´t do much....So, instead of attacking me, contact the campaign...


:rolleyes:

[qwerty]

Ron Paul delegates to the state convention swung their support to Huckabee – putting Huckabee over the top – after Congressman Paul was eliminated in the first round of voting. With three national delegates, Ron Paul secured 17 percent of the 18 delegates that were decided at the State Convention.


http://www.ronpaul2008.com/press-releases/235/ron-paul-secures-three-delegates-in-west-virginia-state-convention

Campaign has a strategy....


:cool:

[No1ButPaul08]

http://www.ronpaul2008.com/press-releases/235/ron-paul-secures-three-delegates-in-west-virginia-state-convention

Campaign has a strategy....


:cool:

Please that was three delegates where that was acceptable. The campaign cannot ethically back this. The convention will not be brokered unless we stop John McCain.

[No1ButPaul08]

Read my Missouri example. Do you think Ron Paul wanted John McCain or Mike Huckabee to win that 58 delegate prize. Easy, Huck. If 1/3 of our voters go to Huck, he wins. This loss hurt very bad.

[No1ButPaul08]

unblind self-bump

[parocks]

This will have to done through meetups and any other way possible. People will have to understand a vote for Huck or Romney is a vote for Ron Paul. By voting for Ron Paul you are voting for John McCain. I do see McCain and Huckabee teaming up to stop this by Huck getting the VP. McCain should realize however that any ticket with Huckabee can't win. The guy is unelectable in a general election as P or VP

Another way to try to spread the STOP MCCAIN strategy is with Huckabee's supporters, Romney's supporters, any political messageboard where Republicans who don't want McCain gather.

The first stage of this process
1) STOP MCCAIN by situational voting
applies equally to everyone.

[No1ButPaul08]

Another way to try to spread the STOP MCCAIN strategy is with Huckabee's supporters, Romney's supporters, any political messageboard where Republicans who don't want McCain gather.

The first stage of this process
1) STOP MCCAIN by situational voting
applies equally to everyone.

Looks like the real first stage is removing the blind faith the convention will broker itself...thanks for the help

[No1ButPaul08]

strategy/the only way we can win/we must stop McCain BUMP

[Bradley in DC]

Just become a stealth delegate in these states.

Did you even understand the post you criticize? Stop the "stealth" crap.

[No1ButPaul08]

Did you even understand the post you criticize? Stop the "stealth" crap.

Bradley your thoughts. This is way over most people's heads

After all, it was you who told me to learn the rules. I did, I think this is the only option. Realistic is a stretch, i know. But it has to be tried

[RageAgainstDC]

there is no such thing as a realistic brokered convention strategy. huck and romney both have enough delegates to be kingmaker. you all seem to forget this...

[No1ButPaul08]

edit: bump accidently replied twice

[No1ButPaul08]

there is no such thing as a realistic brokered convention strategy. huck and romney both have enough delegates to be kingmaker. you all seem to forget this...

Can't hurt to try. McCain knows Huckabee as his VP would be an instant loss. A McCain/Romney ticket is laughable. These delegates aren't forced to go for who huck or romney likes. We have to try and stop McCain. It can only help Ron Paul.

McCain is a love/hate relationship. I imagine some delegates feel this way. We have to try this as a last ditch GOP effort.

[RageAgainstDC]

Can't hurt to try. McCain knows Huckabee as his VP would be an instant loss. A McCain/Romney ticket is laughable. These delegates aren't forced to go for who huck or romney likes. We have to try and stop McCain. It can only help Ron Paul.

McCain is a love/hate relationship. I imagine some delegates feel this way. We have to try this as a last ditch GOP effort.

yes, it can hurt to try. every day we waste on this pipe dream is a day we aren't moving forward with an independent candidacy. every gop primary we lose, we lose support with it. it could hurt. a lot.

[parocks]

there is no such thing as a realistic brokered convention strategy. huck and romney both have enough delegates to be kingmaker. you all seem to forget this...

What do you suppose the strategy should be?

The most reasonable, well thought out strategy at this point seems to be

1) STOP MCCAIN / DELEGATES / BROKERED CONVENTION strategy

What, again, are the other strategies?
They seem to rely on ignoring known facts.

2) Just keep on canvassing, telling people about Ron Paul, buying ads, blimps, billboards about Ron Paul, etc. and hoping for the best

Hello, we're about to lose to McCain.

It seems like strategy #2 seems to be relying on ignoring "we're about to lose to McCain" or hoping for something like McCain dying.

Also, strategy 2 was super tuesday strategy, and it didn't result in any victories.

If you want to continue strategy 2, focus on Idaho.

The thing I like about brokered convention strategy is that if there is a brokered convention, we won't know until the convention how well we did with the delegates, so we'll have hope going into the convention. (If we're successful in stopping McCain).

Is there a strategy 3? If so, what is it?

[No1ButPaul08]

there is no such thing as a realistic brokered convention strategy. huck and romney both have enough delegates to be kingmaker. you all seem to forget this...

And then we threaten the third party run. The GOP has spent 25 years to trying undermine Ron Paul. It's time for his supporters to step up and undermine the GOP. We would fail Ron Paul if we don't do this

[parocks]

yes, it can hurt to try. every day we waste on this pipe dream is a day we aren't moving forward with an independent candidacy. every gop primary we lose, we lose support with it. it could hurt. a lot.


Ron Paul is running for the Republican Nomination.

Until that option is foreclosed, we are all here to help him win the Republican Nomination.

[No1ButPaul08]

yes, it can hurt to try. every day we waste on this pipe dream is a day we aren't moving forward with an independent candidacy. every gop primary we lose, we lose support with it. it could hurt. a lot.

Is the independent candidacy not a pipe dream? I don't need to go into what RP has said here. Almost every email he sends mentions a brokered convention, although with no back up.

Maybe RP is expecting his supporters to broker the convention. After all, its the supporters that have been running the campaign.

[parocks]

Is the independent candidacy not a pipe dream? I don't need to go into what RP has said here. Almost every email he sends mentions a brokered convention, although with no back up.

Maybe RP is expecting his supporters to broker the convention. After all, its the supporters that have been running the campaign.

If Ron Paul wants a brokered convention, we should do everything we can to get to a brokered convention.


***************************
Goal #1 - Stop McCain

http://www.ronpaulforums.com/showthread.php?t=114659

Excellent detailed analysis of Brokered Convention / Situational Voting / STOP MCCAIN

[Bradley in DC]

Bradley your thoughts. This is way over most people's heads

After all, it was you who told me to learn the rules. I did, I think this is the only option. Realistic is a stretch, i know. But it has to be tried

Sorry. Yes, yours is a thoughtful, informed and intelligent analysis. I'm not saying I endorse it without giving it some more thought--for example in DC, I except McCain to win but for us to beat Huckabee. It is thought provoking as a starting point, but I think people in each respective state need to take a good look at their respective situations and act accordingly. If there are old hands in our camp in each state who understand the local people, local ways, I'd defer to them (and not the official campaign staff).

That said, I'm getting really tired of the "secret strategy", most of McCain's delegate really support Dr. Paul, and all of the other baseless excuses to divert attention from both the real need to work now in states approaching and from HQ incompetence.

[RageAgainstDC]

a brokered convention is going to go like this:

first ballot... no majority.

second ballot... huck or romney kingmake mccain.

that's if we even HAVE a brokered convention to begin with. do you really think that the GOP is going to allow ron paul to be it's nominee after everything they have done to stifle him... for 25 years as you point out?

and yes an indy run is a pipedream. but atleast it offers hope. it stops the bleeding. it keeps up from losing more and more support with each gop primary loss. it gives people a reason to campaign again, knowing he'll be on the ballot in november. it's about the message, not the presidency. i think we all came into this knowing that.

[IDefendThePlatform]

a brokered convention is going to go like this:

first ballot... no majority.

second ballot... huck or romney kingmake mccain.

that's if we even HAVE a brokered convention to begin with. do you really think that the GOP is going to allow ron paul to be it's nominee after everything they have done to stifle him... for 25 years as you point out?

and yes an indy run is a pipedream. but atleast it offers hope. it stops the bleeding. it keeps up from losing more and more support with each gop primary loss. it gives people a reason to campaign again, knowing he'll be on the ballot in november. it's about the message, not the presidency. i think we all came into this knowing that.

Right on the money. Especially the part about the message being more important than anything.

[No1ButPaul08]

Sorry. Yes, yours is a thoughtful, informed and intelligent analysis. I'm not saying I endorse it without giving it some more thought--for example in DC, I except McCain to win but for us to beat Huckabee. It is thought provoking as a starting point, but I think people in each respective state need to take a good look at their respective situations and act accordingly. If there are old hands in our camp in each state who understand the local people, local ways, I'd defer to them (and not the official campaign staff).

That said, I'm getting really tired of the "secret strategy", most of McCain's delegate really support Dr. Paul, and all of the other baseless excuses to divert attention from both the real need to work now in states approaching and from HQ incompetence.

Yeah, most of McCain's delegates are like DC, locked until he releases them, or his slate, or both. It is a state by state, day by day operation. Polls will change, we might have to go for Romney instead of Huck. It has to get to the people on the ground in the relevant states

[Michael Ingram]

Why wouldn't Huckabee just give Mccain his delegates to put him over the top, thus securing his spot as VP?

[No1ButPaul08]

Right on the money. Especially the part about the message being more important than anything.

Do not underrate a convention speech. Would do more than any third party run. And he can still run third party after the convention.

[No1ButPaul08]

Why wouldn't Huckabee just give Mccain his delegates to put him over the top, thus securing his spot as VP?

For one that's a losing ticket and McCain might take a chance in a brokered convention.

[RageAgainstDC]

If Ron Paul wants a brokered convention, we should do everything we can to get to a brokered convention.


***************************
Goal #1 - Stop McCain

http://www.ronpaulforums.com/showthread.php?t=114659

Excellent detailed analysis of Brokered Convention / Situational Voting / STOP MCCAIN

so we're a cult now? i missed that memo....

[No1ButPaul08]

so we're a cult now? i missed that memo....

Ron Paul's message is a brokered convention. Do you support the message?

[RageAgainstDC]

Ron Paul's message is a brokered convention. Do you support the message?

ron paul's message is not a brokered convention. the brokered convention is just the latest version of the billionaire, or the "secret plan", so on so forth. the message is liberty. we're treating this like a campaign, and it's not. it's a movement. the campaign was just the launching point. nothing we can do will make ron the next potus. he knows this. you know this (whether you've admitted it to yourself is a whole different point). all this billionaire, secret plan, brokered convention, "stealth delegate" talk is undermining the movement. we need to go indy to keep hope alive, to keep people JOINING and not LEAVING the movement. how do you not see this?

[No1ButPaul08]

ron paul's message is not a brokered convention. the brokered convention is just the latest version of the billionaire, or the "secret plan", so on so forth. the message is liberty. we're treating this like a campaign, and it's not. it's a movement. the campaign was just the launching point. nothing we can do will make ron the next potus. he knows this. you know this (whether you've admitted it to yourself is a whole different point). all this billionaire, secret plan, brokered convention, "stealth delegate" talk is undermining the movement. we need to go indy to keep hope alive, to keep people JOINING and not LEAVING the movement. how do you not see this?

Do you get any email's from Ron Paul. His message is absolutely a brokered convention, although he has a little more faith than I

From Ron himself

For one thing, for the first time since 1952, we are headed towards a brokered convention. Instead of a coronation of one of the establishment candidates, the delegates, influenced by the people, will decide. And I am afraid that this will take place in a time of heightened economic crisis. That means even more Americans will be ready to hear our message. But it also means I am really going to need your help.

Until Ron drops out of the GOP nomination, we are obligated to support this strategy

[RageAgainstDC]

ron paul is not the movement. WE ARE THE MOVEMENT. if ron wants to go to a brokered convention, watch huck or romney kingmake mccain, and run this movement into the ground in the process, then i for one will be pretty pissed off. you know god damn well a brokered convention isn't going to make ron potus. he knows that. no shit he's going to push the brokered convention miracle bullshit, he's a politician. he needs to make things look at least remotely possible, and you all are buying it hook line and sinker. he isn't going to stray from that until he announces an indy run, as that would be political suicide. it doesn't take a genius to put it all together.

[dkim68]

ron paul's message is not a brokered convention. the brokered convention is just the latest version of the billionaire, or the "secret plan", so on so forth.
The brokered convention idea is mentioned in the official campaign training videos.

[Bradley in DC]

Do not underrate a convention speech. Would do more than any third party run. And he can still run third party after the convention.

AFTER? I think it would be way too late by then--it would be a logistical nightmare. The third party conventions are BEFORE the Republicans meet.

[No1ButPaul08]

I'm going to bed as I was up all night doing this.

It's either this, third party, or sit back and watch. Currently Ron is running for the GOP. If Ron doesn't like this he can send a message to have it stopped.

If anything, this should be debated. If anyone has any questions PM or post them here.

[No1ButPaul08]

AFTER? I think it would be way too late by then--it would be a logistical nightmare. The third party conventions are BEFORE the Republicans meet.

I'm talking about using his delegates to weasel his way into speaking at the GOP. This is the thing I'm least sure about, not even sure if it's possible. But if it happened it would be monumental

I think i misunderstood with that reply, it will be pretty clear very soon whether this will work or not. If McCain sweeps the Chesapeake primary, it's over. We can do this and have a third party run going in a month or two, if it fails. McCain will either wrap it up or he wont

[No1ButPaul08]

going to bed bump, please consider

[Bradley in DC]

I'm talking about using his delegates to weasel his way into speaking at the GOP. This is the thing I'm least sure about, not even sure if it's possible. But if it happened it would be monumental

I think i misunderstood with that reply, it will be pretty clear very soon whether this will work or not. If McCain sweeps the Chesapeake primary, it's over. We can do this and have a third party run going in a month or two, if it fails. McCain will either wrap it up or he wont

Yes, I'm very much looking forward to his speaking at the convention--the question is whether we can get prime time or not!

I'm not sure it's over after our Chesapeake primaries here--I give him more time for a meltdown. :) But yes, before the LP, CP, Reform, Independent conventions, we should have a better idea of the Republican delegate counts.

[affa]

ron paul's message is not a brokered convention. the brokered convention is just the latest version of the billionaire, or the "secret plan", so on so forth. the message is liberty. we're treating this like a campaign, and it's not. it's a movement. the campaign was just the launching point. nothing we can do will make ron the next potus. he knows this. you know this (whether you've admitted it to yourself is a whole different point). all this billionaire, secret plan, brokered convention, "stealth delegate" talk is undermining the movement. we need to go indy to keep hope alive, to keep people JOINING and not LEAVING the movement. how do you not see this?

No, I don't "know" he won't be president.

What I do know is that I believe Ron Paul needs to become president in 2008.

Not for him.
Not for us, his supporters.

But for the world.

He's the only candidate left that intends to not only end the occupation and the war, but will directly address the reasons we go to war (the petro-dollar).

meanwhile, the dollar is tanking. without him the federal reserve keeps on keeping on. we invade iran, and maybe even pakistan or syria.

if not him, then who?

Your name is RageagainstDC, and I agree with that. But what are our options? Wait another 4 years? Another 8? Another 12?

We let this slime into office every damn election. And then people start their 'oh, just wait, we'll fix it in 4 years'. No. We won't. At some point we need to accept that. It's always now or never. We need Ron Paul to be President.

I don't know how this will come to pass, but I'm following his lead.

[Suzu]

Here in Missouri we have a solid grassroots team working with the delegate process. Lots of people here voted for Huckabee simply because they thought RP "can't win", so if Huck drops out we'll have a lot more RP delegates than perhaps other states will.

[Suzu]

If we do make it to a brokered RNC, I hope a well-prepared and slightly toned-down John Killian (or someone with as much charisma and oratory skill) will be speaking on Ron Paul's behalf. Can that be arranged?

[MrZach]

Don't vote for anybody but Ron. Just become a stealth delegate in these states. Its not like you lose your life if you break and vote for Ron on the first ballot.

No, you just lose your seat and right to vote at the convention... possibly for you entire state. GREAT idea... not...

[dkim68]

So now this strategy is meaningless because Romney just dropped out.

[Bradley in DC]

So now this strategy is meaningless because Romney just dropped out.

Nonsense, the strategy is much more relevant: a Paul-Huckabee alliance against McCain is much easier and more viable!

[No1ButPaul08]

Nonsense, the strategy is much more relevant: a Paul-Huckabee alliance against McCain is much easier and more viable!

I agree, Huck and Romney ate at each other. Helping McCain. I'm going to edit the original post to reflect Romney's exit

[Bradley in DC]

Perhaps with Mitt out, you and Krippy could pull resources and an updated strategy. I'll be out of the loop for a bit with a Congressional race.

[austinchick]

The campaign can't do this. Talk about unethical/shady/something RP would never do. But, It's the only option. Blindly believing there is going to be a brokered convension is crazy. CRAZY

op, how do we know you are not a mole?:)

[No1ButPaul08]

op, how do we know you are not a mole?:)

Well i spent 12 hours detailing a strategy where RP can win and McCain can be stopped. There was a reason i put goal #2 first in the OP, that is getting delegates for RP in the good states.

But none of this matters if we do not complete goal #1, stop John McCain.

None of this in anyway undermines RP in anyway, besides some meaningless vote totals in some states

[Peace&Freedom]

Nonsense, the strategy is much more relevant: a Paul-Huckabee alliance against McCain is much easier and more viable!

No, less viable, in that Huckabee was McCain's stalking horse to split the non McCain vote. Take Huck out before FL and Romney would have won it and many of the Super Tuesday races. McCain will likely offer him VP and a promise he'll only serve one term, clearing the way for Huck in 2012. If McCain loses (let's say WHEN he loses), Huckabee will be in the same position to run come 2012.

The brokered convention is less likely as of this week, but still feasible. It just needs to be tweaked per each state in light of the different rules per GOP organization. The brokered scenario has been discussed for months, not just sprung up yesterday like the billionaire junk (the Tate/HQ video explaining the delegate pickup process dates from NOVEMBER). I don't think HQ (or the grassroots) anticipated just how draconian the media blackout was going to be, but the stealth delegate plan doesn't depend on media coverage to work. Paul just needs to supply the inspiration to the grassroots (say, announcing he'll take a 3rd party line?) to keep them energized.

[dkim68]

Here's a newbie question. Does McCain get all of Romney and Giuliani's delegates?

[No1ButPaul08]

Here's a newbie question. Does McCain get all of Romney and Giuliani's delegates?

Romney suspended his campaign, he's not releasing his delegates yet. Giuliani got a whopping 0 delegates for his 49.9 million he spent

[dkim68]

Can he give them to Ron Paul or Mike Huckabee if he endorses either of those two? I mean I doubt this is going to happen considering his "terrorism" statement... he's obviously endorsing McCain.

[Ricochet]

op, how do we know you are not a mole?:)

I trust Bradley's judgment.

[No1ButPaul08]

Can he give them to Ron Paul or Mike Huckabee if he endorses either of those two? I mean I doubt this is going to happen considering his "terrorism" statement... he's obviously endorsing McCain.

He can't really give them to anyone, he can recommend them. Romney won't publicly endorse McCain until he's the nominee, they hate each other. And like i said he's suspending (not ending, big difference in wording) his campaign, romney would like to be a player in a brokered convention scenario

[dkim68]

I don't know. To me, Romney's "in this time of war, I simply cannot let my campaign, be a part of aiding a surrender to terror" comment clearly translated to support for 100-years-in-Iraq-McCain or opposition to any anti-war candidate.

[No1ButPaul08]

I don't know. To me, Romney's "in this time of war, I simply cannot let my campaign, be a part of aiding a surrender to terror" comment clearly translated to support for 100-years-in-Iraq-McCain or opposition to any anti-war candidate.

He hates McCain. He didn't mention his name in the speech. Plus he still has his delegates, they are not released, nor do i think they ever will until McCain locks the nomination

[CorkyAgain]

He hates McCain. He didn't mention his name in the speech.

Are you sure about that? The report I read said the audience booed when Romney mentioned McCain's name.

Romney was saying that he disagrees with Sen McCain disagree on some things -- and this is where the crowd booed -- but that the war is of paramount importance.

In effect, he was telling his supporters to put aside their misgivings and get behind McCain.

[No1ButPaul08]

Are you sure about that? The report I read said the audience booed when Romney mentioned McCain's name.

Romney was saying that he disagrees with Sen McCain disagree on some things -- and this is where the crowd booed -- but that the war is of paramount importance.

In effect, he was telling his supporters to put aside their misgivings and get behind McCain.

Not 100% sure on the name mention. But very few people on Earth believe John McCain and Mitt Romney like each other

[dkim68]

You can't possibly believe he'll release his delegates to Paul or Huckabee. If by some miracle either of those two becomes the nominee this fall, will Romney be forced to release his delegates?

[No1ButPaul08]

You can't possibly believe he'll release his delegates to Paul or Huckabee. If by some miracle either of those two becomes the nominee this fall, will Romney be forced to release his delegates?

He's hasn't released them yet, he might not ever. And he can't release them to anybody. If he releases, they can vote for whoever they choose, not who romney tells them to

[Liberté]

He's hasn't released them yet, he might not ever. And he can't release them to anybody. If he releases, they can vote for whoever they choose, not who romney tells them to

I admire your zeal, but there will be no brokered convention and Ron Paul will not be getting the GOP nomination. :(

We have made some great progress with the movement. Any Romney delegates will go for McCain, afterall Romney is stepping down for the good of the Party. I expect Huckabee will hang it up soon as well. Heck, McCain was giving his psedu-acceptance speech today at the C-Pac.

[No1ButPaul08]

I admire your zeal, but there will be no brokered convention and Ron Paul will not be getting the GOP nomination. :(

We have made some great progress with the movement. Any Romney delegates will go for McCain, afterall Romney is stepping down for the good of the Party. I expect Huckabee will hang it up soon as well. Heck, McCain was giving his psedu-acceptance speech today at the C-Pac.

Do you expect Huckabee to drop if he cleans up in KS, VA, MD, and DC, I don't. These odds were increased greatly with Romney suspending his campaign. Demographically he can win these states

[Liberté]

Do you expect Huckabee to drop if he cleans up in KS, VA, MD, and DC, I don't. These odds were increased greatly with Romney suspending his campaign. Demographically he can win these states

Good or ill John McCain will be the GOP candidate. I am not being negative, just realistic. I think RP should stay in right up to the last primary, and walk into the Convention with 90+ National Delegates.. now that would be a Statement!

If Ron Paul wants to speak at the Convention I know he could, but he would probably have to give a feel good, GOPish, Go-McCain type speech and I just don't think that would happen.

McCain or Obama/Hilary.... what a choice.. Socialism Lite vs. Socialism. Hard decision. I will probably vote for McCain in the hope that he will be a 1 term President that will do less damage than Obama/Hilary and put my faith in the 2012 Liberty Candidate.

[dkim68]

Huckabee isn't going to "clean up" anywhere. Romney's support will transfer to McCain. Both of them are strongly pro-War.

[scandinaviany3]

A common theme around here is WAKE UP PEOPLE. Not as popular but people also like, "it will be a brokered convention." I say, WAKE UP PEOPLE, there hasn't been a brokered convention since 1952, before most states had people vote in primaries. The convention is not going to broker itself, something has to be done

As it stands, John McCain has ~720 delegates. Many people on here say, "it will be a brokered convention." That's the end of their story as they have no proof of that. McCain is on his way to steamroll to the nomination. The delegate count for the others, even RP at this point, really do not matter, as they do not stand a realistic chance at getting to 1191. If John McCain gets to 1191 it is over, and there will be no brokered convention. Therefore, the #1 goal at this point must be to Stop John McCain.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
The other goal is to get delegates in primary states where delegates are only bound from 1-3 ballots AND where the delegates aren't directly elected because they are supporters of a candidate. We'll call this a good state/bad state breakdown. The Caucus states will take care of themselves.

Good States: 19

AZ, AR, DW, FL, GA, ID, IN, MA, MI, MO, NJ, NM, NC, SC, SD, TX, VT, VA, OR

In these states delegates are elected away from the primary and could potenially be RP delegates in a brokered convention. These are the states where the work must be done on the delegate side. These delegates will initially be bound to other candidates, but if they are true RP supporters, they will turn once the convention becomes brokered.

Bad States: 19 and Puerto Rico (unless we get top 3????????)
AL (this one i'm not so sure, but delegates have already been elected anyway), CA, CT, DC, IL, Kansas (Caucus, but bad), KY, NH, MD, MS, NY, OH, OK, PN(not sure here either, delegates are on primary ballot, not sure if tied to candidate.), RI, UT (not really a bad state, but i figure Romney has got this one locked up), WI, WV (We got 3 delegates here, no more, Thank you Huck), WY

We are not get any delegates in these states. They are locked in until they are released. Most of them are for McCain. They are not getting released.

Caucus States: 13 + 4 territories(Guam, Am Samoa, VI, N Mariana)

AK, CO, HI, IA, LA, ME, MN, MT, NE (non-binding primary doesn't mean squat, similar to LA), NV, ND, WA (delegates are "morally bound" not "legally bound," which mean the primary and caucus don't mean squat, and the real action is at the district and state conventions, similare to LA and NE.

Caucus states can be good and bad. Most of them are still in the process and it's hard to determine who will get the delegates. They are good because RP can win delegates straight up in these states. They are bad because even though most of these states the delegates become unbound after a ballot or two, they are delegates because they support their candidate.
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
That was goal #2, back to goal #1: STOPPING McCAIN

This is the part where I lose people by suggesting they vote for Mike Huckabee, read on please.

In Missouri. McNameDropper beat Huckabee by ~8,000 votes for all of Missouri's 58 winner-take-all delegates. Ron Paul got 25,000 votes. If RP's 25,000 votes go to Huckabee he wins and McCain doesn't get the delegates. Simply put, Ron Paul voters would have been much better off voting for Huckabee.

Delegates > votes........at this point.....delegates against McCain > votes for Ron Paul.

How do we do this, state by state we vote for Huck to stop McCain where necessary while trying to secure backroom delegates in the states I listed as good states.

Note some of the WTA are by state or by district/state but here they are pretty much the same as RP has no chance in those

2/9
KS: bad WTA caucus state (a rarity). Votes for Ron Paul are worthless. Vote Huck

Wash: worthless as delegates aren't legally bound, and they don't get elected here


2/12
DC: WTA we must vote for Huck, or McCain gets 18 very pledged delegates

VA: WTA, vote for Huck, become a delegate Very Important 67 WTA

MA: WTA we must vote for Huck, or McCain gets 37 very pledged delegates

2/19
Wash: worthless as delegates aren't legally bound, and they don't get elected here

WI: WTA we must vote for strongest of Romney or Huck, or McCain gets 40 very pledged delegates

3/4
OH: we need this WTA state of 88 delegates to go to Huck

RI: We need 15% to get delegates but in proportional so damage to McCain really can't be done here. Vote for Paul

TX: I can't in good conscience tell the people of Texas to not vote for Ron Paul. This is WTA by district/state. Some districts we might be better off trying to stop McCain. The 14th better go to RP. Another good state to become a delegate in.

VT: WTA, vote for Huck, become a delegate

3/11
MS: Another bad WTA state. A vote for Paul is a vote for McCain. A vote for Huckabee is a vote for Paul.

4/22
PA: A state where the delegate are on the ballot however I'm not sure if they are tied to a campaign (which would make it a bad state.) With that said, our goal should be keeping McCain delegates away from the convention. We have time here to figure that out.

Later States
Most of these RP should get the votes except IN, OR, and KY. I'll go into detail (and look like a genius),if we get to this point


If we can do all that we still have to get by the 5 state obstical. We can worry about that if the convention becomes brokered.

STOP JOHN McCAIN

EDIT: we should also try to convince Romney and Huck supporters to do this also.

EDIT: For the third party people, every email RP sends mentions a brokered convention, yet none mention a third party. He has also relied on the grassroots, this is our last chance for HIS goal

EDIT: Best case scenario might be a convention speech. Do not underrate this. Obama is who he is because of a convention speech
Ron really, really wants to speak at the convention. Not even sure if this is possible however. The more delegate the better

Does huckabee want to be pres or vp?

If he will chance it a lot of traiding on states could give huckabee victory and ron victories lowering mccains numbers and helping rons.

That is good no matter how you look at it for us in the states we lost. Once the the brokered convention happens all delegates in the deal should release to allow everyone to via for the presidency.

[Charles Wilson]

Folks, now is not the time to give up hope and make a deal. Many things can happen between now and September that will thrust Ron Paul in the spot light. For example: The economy will most likely continue the slide toward a major depression between now and September. The current glamour of the front runners will wear off when people start hurting and they will take a closer look at where the candidates stand on the economic issue. Up until now the issues have not been a deciding factor when selecting a candidate otherwise Ron Paul would be ahead in the delegate count

I really liked his speech before CPAC today. Ron Paul is da man!

There are only a few sure things in this life. God is in control. Ron Paul cannot lose this race until someone wins, unless he gives up. I will support him to the bitter end, who knows, he may win!

[No1ButPaul08]

Folks, now is not the time to give up hope and make a deal. Many things can happen between now and September that will thrust Ron Paul in the spot light. For example: The economy will most likely continue the slide toward a major depression between now and September. The current glamour of the front runners will wear off when people start hurting and they will take a closer look at where the candidates stand on the economic issue. Up until now the issues have not been a deciding factor when selecting a candidate otherwise Ron Paul would be ahead in the delegate count

I really liked his speech before CPAC today. Ron Paul is da man!

There are only a few sure things in this life. God is in control. Ron Paul cannot lose this race until someone wins, unless he gives up. I will support him to the bitter end, who knows, he may win!

This is not giving up or making a deal. It realizes some states and delegates are unwinnable. Ron Paul would be much better had he, "gave up" in Missouri and his votes magically went to Huckabee. To say otherwise is flat out a false statement.

[Crickett]

Folks, now is not the time to give up hope and make a deal. Many things can happen between now and September that will thrust Ron Paul in the spot light. For example: The economy will most likely continue the slide toward a major depression between now and September. The current glamour of the front runners will wear off when people start hurting and they will take a closer look at where the candidates stand on the economic issue. Up until now the issues have not been a deciding factor when selecting a candidate otherwise Ron Paul would be ahead in the delegate count

I really liked his speech before CPAC today. Ron Paul is da man!

There are only a few sure things in this life. God is in control. Ron Paul cannot lose this race until someone wins, unless he gives up. I will support him to the bitter end, who knows, he may win!

Good post. I am just completely demoralized by both RP getting literally blackballed off the televised talks today, and how he was not on certain ballots AND how the FCC is not responding to this manipulation. I am bummed.

[Leroy_Jenkems]

bump

[cindy25]

wouldn't the threat of a 3rd party be useful in a brokered convention?

in NY Rep would routinely get the Conservative party line, and Dems the Liberal party line; this would help to force the major party leaders to support those candidate rather than risk a 3 way split.

[Sandra]

The campaign can't do this. Talk about unethical/shady/something RP would never do. But, It's the only option. Blindly believing there is going to be a brokered convension is crazy. CRAZY

The campaign has asked us to conduct our end of the campaign the way Ron Paul would. Once you start with the tricky, you get in the sticky.

[blakjak]

Has anyone cross-posted this at HucksArmy?

[Orat]

FYI, OK is not a "bad state". The selection of its delegates is completely separate from the primary process, and so long as enough Paul supporters turn out at the district and state conventions, they could take the national delegate seats.

Secondly, Romney's voters are not likely to swing McCain. Romney's voters are, in large part, strong social conservatives. They're much more likely to swing Huckabee. Perhaps this differs with geography, I don't know. But honestly, I think the best outcome right now would be if Huck hangs it up and Republicans are then forced to make a very explicit choice between:
1) Getting everything they've ever claimed they wanted - low taxes, smaller gov't, etc, in exchange for peace , (Ron Paul) or
2) Giving up everything they've ever wanted just so they can have their war (McCain)

I want them to have to make that choice. So far, they've fooled themselves into thinking they could have both by deceiving themselves that Romney and Huck were real conservatives on the other issues. They know for a fact that McCain is not.

[No1ButPaul08]

FYI, OK is not a "bad state". The selection of its delegates is completely separate from the primary process, and so long as enough Paul supporters turn out at the district and state conventions, they could take the national delegate seats.

Secondly, Romney's voters are not likely to swing McCain. Romney's voters are, in large part, strong social conservatives. They're much more likely to swing Huckabee. Perhaps this differs with geography, I don't know. But honestly, I think the best outcome right now would be if Huck hangs it up and Republicans are then forced to make a very explicit choice between:
1) Getting everything they've ever claimed they wanted - low taxes, smaller gov't, etc, in exchange for peace , (Ron Paul) or
2) Giving up everything they've ever wanted just so they can have their war (McCain)

I want them to have to make that choice. So far, they've fooled themselves into thinking they could have both by deceiving themselves that Romney and Huck were real conservatives on the other issues. They know for a fact that McCain is not.

Oklahoma's delegates are bound until they are released. McCain will never release them. That's why they are a bad state. The delegates could be RP supporters, but they will be bound forever to McCain

[Charles Wilson]

wouldn't the threat of a 3rd party be useful in a brokered convention?

in NY Rep would routinely get the Conservative party line, and Dems the Liberal party line; this would help to force the major party leaders to support those candidate rather than risk a 3 way split.

I hate to say this but the idea of a viable third party in 2008 is a pipe dream. The two major party's have a lock on the political process in this country -- their overwhelming power runs wide and deep. I believe that Ron Paul has said as much, that is why he does not intend on running third party. A third party can be successful but it will take years to over come the power of the two headed one party monster we have today.

Ross Perot came darn close in the early 90s of establishing a viable third party but, following a huge surge of support, he shut it down after receiving and offer he could not refuse (you can interpret that anyway you want to).

Ron Paul has been extremely successful in planting the seeds of liberty and prosperity. If he does not get another vote, the seeds that he has sown during this election will grow, and just as the mighty oak that grows from a small acorn, this movement for freedom will take root and the end result will over shadow the other two party's -- if we supporters continue to do our part..

[MindStalker]

A MUCH better strategy in all of this is to form a pact with Huckabee supporters.
In States where Paul appears to be polling well Huckabee supporters vote for Paul, in States where Huckabee is doing well Paul supporters vote for Huckabee. We should work as a team to insure that we together have more delegates than McCain, then come convention whichever of Paul or Huckabee has the most votes wins, while McCain gets to sit on the corner and cry.

[BlueCalico]

THE CONVENTION DOES NOT HAVE TO BE BROKERED! We can overturn Rules at the State Conventions. Google - [your state] Republican Convention. Look for your state information at ronpaul2008.com, States.

STUDY and LEARN!

[Matt Collins]

Blast from the past

[spacehabitats]

Blast from the past

"Brokered Confusion" (http://www.ronpaulforums.com/showthread.php?t=118538)

[No1ButPaul08]

I see the Republicans are adopting my strategy from 2008

[jmdrake]

Blast from the past

For real. But after 8 LOOOOONG years it's finally relevant! .....right after Rand drops out.... :( Sucky timing.

[Aratus]

I see the Republicans are adopting my strategy from 2008

yes they are. i'm with jimdrake on this, but if we get about 50 to 100 of our people to the convention
and act as a voting block that is hard to get and politically virginal, we get to write the party platform,
which will make it easier for someone like Justin Amash to run in '20 on stances that are almost Liberty.

[RonPaulGeorge&Ringo]

With all this coming down the pike, dropping out was a bullshit move on Rand's part.