View Full Version : WTF 900 people in San Diego county stayed Libertarian for primary 40% reported
libertythor
02-06-2008, 02:45 AM
That is significant!
http://www.signonsandiego.com/news/politics/results/sdpresident.html
Malum Prohibitum
02-06-2008, 02:51 AM
believe it or not, many hard core libertarians dislike Paul. Mostly the hardcore anarcho capitalist types. You really dont want them showing up to your BBQs anyway.
Richandler
02-06-2008, 02:57 AM
This is why I advocate against joining the Libertarian Party.
Ron LOL
02-06-2008, 02:58 AM
I hate the LP.
Karsten
02-06-2008, 03:02 AM
I hate the LP.
And I hate the GOP. I know several Libertarian Party members that love Ron Paul, but didn't switch parties for several reasons. Party loyalty is one reason, laziness is another, the fact that WE never really official pushed for a party change movement like I have repeatedly suggested with all the bells and whilstles is another, and another is that if you want to run for an office under the Libertarian Party, you cannot switch parties!
But, I have been to Libertarian Party conventions and they ALL LOVE RON PAUL!!! There is absolutely NO anti-Paul seniment there. RP ran as a Libertarian back in 1988 for goodness sake!! One Libertarian Party member I knew even WROTE IN Ron Paul in the Libertarian Party ballot today!!
And I hate the GOP. I know several Libertarian Party members that love Ron Paul, but didn't switch parties for several reasons. Party loyalty is one reason, laziness is another, the fact that WE never really official pushed for a party change movement like I have repeatedly suggested with all the bells and whilstles is another, and another is that if you want to run for an office under the Libertarian Party, you cannot switch parties!
But, I have been to Libertarian Party conventions and they ALL LOVE RON PAUL!!! There is absolutely NO anti-Paul seniment there. RP ran as a Libertarian back in 1988 for goodness sake!! One Libertarian Party member I knew even WROTE IN Ron Paul in the Libertarian Party ballot today!!
honestly, they just want to sound cool like Reason and Cato cause if they wanted to be libertarian, they'd have voted for the libertarian.
Ron LOL
02-06-2008, 03:17 AM
And I hate the GOP. I know several Libertarian Party members that love Ron Paul, but didn't switch parties for several reasons. Party loyalty is one reason, laziness is another, the fact that WE never really official pushed for a party change movement like I have repeatedly suggested with all the bells and whilstles is another, and another is that if you want to run for an office under the Libertarian Party, you cannot switch parties!
But, I have been to Libertarian Party conventions and they ALL LOVE RON PAUL!!! There is absolutely NO anti-Paul seniment there. RP ran as a Libertarian back in 1988 for goodness sake!! One Libertarian Party member I knew even WROTE IN Ron Paul in the Libertarian Party ballot today!!
That's nice, but the LP will never, ever, EVER accomplish anything really useful.
The only viable strategy is to take back the GOP.
Kalash
02-06-2008, 03:17 AM
Another potential part of the problem - 51% reporting when I clicked on that - so you don't have all the votes...
And there's this video of disenfranchisement;
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zWKxwVZmomc
Apparently there were some issues in Cali that need to be addressed.
V4Vendetta
02-06-2008, 03:20 AM
Most libertarians favor killing babies, Paul does not
Primbs
02-06-2008, 03:21 AM
Looks like thousands in San Diego stayed libertarian. That could add up to bit nationwide.
libertythor
02-06-2008, 03:22 AM
And there's this video of disenfranchisement;
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zWKxwVZmomc
Apparently there were some issues in Cali that need to be addressed.
I wonder if this just happened with new Republicans.
Another potential part of the problem - 51% reporting when I clicked on that - so you don't have all the votes...
And there's this video of disenfranchisement;
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zWKxwVZmomc
Apparently there were some issues in Cali that need to be addressed.
Just watched this - a MUST SEE - to see that there were "lots and lots" of Republican voter registration errors in Cali.
One Ron Paul voter's story of being forced to cast a "provisional" vote - like in Louisiana - the registration dude almost gets violent
This is WAR people - they're stealing our country right in front of our eyes
.
SWATH
02-06-2008, 10:56 PM
I find the hard-core Libertarians that hate Ron Paul generally are content to just massively lose so they can sit, do nothing, and complain.
They can all go to hell.
quezkittel
02-06-2008, 11:30 PM
others honestly probably don't know who paul is- people who have decided on libertarian principles long ago but haven't closely followed the election because it's too depressing... I know i've introduced ron paul to several people like that.
skiingff
02-06-2008, 11:42 PM
When I was trying to register delegates to the West Virginia state GOP convention for Ron Paul, I called up a few people who were registered Libertarian or Constitution Party and refused to become delegates, but one offered to help me make some phone calls (gee thanks, you probably just want to recruit them to the LP). They refused to change their party affiliation to Republican :rolleyes:
And also the LP offered to let RP supporters use their phone banking system NOT because they are pro-RP, but because they wanted more names and addresses for solicitations.
Not only is that a privacy concern, it is also unethical information sharing from the RP campaign to a 3rd party.
literatim
02-06-2008, 11:45 PM
And I hate the GOP. I know several Libertarian Party members that love Ron Paul, but didn't switch parties for several reasons. Party loyalty is one reason, laziness is another, the fact that WE never really official pushed for a party change movement like I have repeatedly suggested with all the bells and whilstles is another, and another is that if you want to run for an office under the Libertarian Party, you cannot switch parties!
But, I have been to Libertarian Party conventions and they ALL LOVE RON PAUL!!! There is absolutely NO anti-Paul seniment there. RP ran as a Libertarian back in 1988 for goodness sake!! One Libertarian Party member I knew even WROTE IN Ron Paul in the Libertarian Party ballot today!!
Those Libertarians are hypocrites. They rail against collectivism and then act like collectivist sheep going to the slaughter with the rest of America. Someone who knows what is going on and what direction our country is heading then doesn't do the right thing is far worse than a person who actively takes us in the wrong direction. Those Libertarian Party members are far worse than any GOP war monger.
libertythor
02-06-2008, 11:50 PM
I have maintained my membership with the Libertarian Party ($25 a year!), but electorally for my absentee ballots I am listed as a Republican. One can be both.
The Libertarian primaries have no bearing on who will be the LP nominee anyhow. All is decided at the individual state conventions and then later on at the national convention.
Those Libertarians are not just hypocrites, but idiots! The LP wouldn't have lost a thing if they had switched their registration and voted for Ron Paul.
Remember! There are many Democrats in congress that are also affiliated with Socialist organizations.
I am proud to call myself a Republican with Libertarian affiliations.....and I voted for Ron Paul in the MO primary.
Those Libertarians are hypocrites. They rail against collectivism and then act like collectivist sheep going to the slaughter with the rest of America. Someone who knows what is going on and what direction our country is heading then doesn't do the right thing is far worse than a person who doesn't see. Those Libertarian Party members are far worse than any GOP war monger.
Voodoo
02-06-2008, 11:58 PM
This thread is a race to see who can make the most asinine statement.
Principle (http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/principle). If the GOP had even a little bit of it, Ron Paul would have been the presumptive nominee from the beginning.
electronicmaji
02-07-2008, 12:00 AM
California is one of the only states with a libertarian primary ballot, its unimportant. 25% or so of the LP is made up of Hard Core Anarcho Capitalists, and they are very, scary people. Many times the Media portrays Ron Paul as a kook but hes in the moderate wing of the party, the conservative minarchist side. If they want real kooks they should go see some people like Wayne Allen Root, that guy is fucking nuts.
The only thing that makes me sad is Steve Kubby didnt win the LP nomination in California, hes easily one of RP's Cabinet Members IMO.
JimInNY
02-07-2008, 12:05 AM
That's nice, but the LP will never, ever, EVER accomplish anything really useful.
The only viable strategy is to take back the GOP.
Join The New Revolution (http://newr3volution.com/) and help take back the GOP!
libertythor
02-07-2008, 12:08 AM
Join The New Revolution (http://newr3volution.com/) and help take back the GOP!
I just joined.
RonRules
02-07-2008, 12:09 AM
Are we ready for a poll on this or do we need another couple of hundred postings?
libertythor
02-07-2008, 12:10 AM
This thread is a race to see who can make the most asinine statement.
Principle (http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/principle). If the GOP had even a little bit of it, Ron Paul would have been the presumptive nominee from the beginning.
What I stated about being a Libertarian and Republican at the same time wasn't asinine. It is possible and doable. Ron Paul is an example.
blakjak
02-07-2008, 12:12 AM
That is significant!
http://www.signonsandiego.com/news/politics/results/sdpresident.html
Sorry, but its actually quite insignificant. If Paul takes all 900 of the Libertarian votes, his percentage moves up from 4.05% to 4.39%.
jbuttell
02-07-2008, 12:13 AM
OR, it's like ME and MANY other people who registered FROM libertarian to Republican in PLENTY of time, simply to have the moron's not update our information correctly. I got to the polls on Tuesday (here in southern california) and had to file a provisional ballot because it still said lilbertarian. Yeah, I think someone did this on purpose. Don't blame libertarians, blame the GOP if you want to point a finger at a party. I have no doubt that a MUCH larger percentage of Libertarians voted for Ron Paul than the GOP.
libertythor
02-07-2008, 12:18 AM
OR, it's like ME and MANY other people who registered FROM libertarian to Republican in PLENTY of time, simply to have the moron's not update our information correctly. I got to the polls on Tuesday (here in southern california) and had to file a provisional ballot because it still said lilbertarian. Yeah, I think someone did this on purpose. Don't blame libertarians, blame the GOP if you want to point a finger at a party. I have no doubt that a MUCH larger percentage of Libertarians voted for Ron Paul than the GOP.
That could be part of the problem! Many probably just resigned themselves to accepting a Libertarian ballot after being told that they weren't listed as a Republican.
libertythor
02-07-2008, 12:19 AM
Sorry, but its actually quite insignificant. If Paul takes all 900 of the Libertarian votes, his percentage moves up from 4.05% to 4.39%.
The LP and AIP (California's Constitution Party) had 4416 votes total with 100% of the non-absentee and non-provisional ballots counted in San Diego County. THAT IS SIGNIFICANT.
Joseph Hart
02-07-2008, 12:25 AM
I would of voted for Steve Kubby, you know, since he has my stash.
blakjak
02-07-2008, 12:31 AM
The LP and AIP (California's Constitution Party) had 4416 votes total with 100% of the non-absentee and non-provisional ballots counted in San Diego County. THAT IS SIGNIFICANT.
If Paul receives ALL of the LP and AIP votes his percentage moves from 4.05% to 5.57%.
The LP and AIP are not going to make or break an election.
http://christinesmithforpresident.com
sounds like Paul, even on immigration.
'Thank you, Ron Paul! The American Freedom Agenda Act'
Ron Paul's campaign is one of the most debated & discussed topics among libertarians & Libertarians; since so many of you have asked my opinion, here's what I think:
I am feeling great in 2008! My LP presidential campaign is continuing, it is strong, and I am happy, grateful and encouraged !
We are all allies who sincerely devote ourselves to advancing liberty. Seeing libertarian principles advanced and brought into our society and government must be supported by all of us who love America, and I believe all who advance the cause of liberty deserve our support at all levels - local, state, and national. Each of us have unique gifts to give; it's time to put aside differences, join together, and create the nation we envision of liberty for all.
Each of us must use our voice to educate, enlighten, and inspire Americans to join us in advancing libertarian principles.
Many of you throughout my campaign have asked what I personally think about Ron Paul's campaign for the presidency. As an individual who is committed to advancing libertarian principles of individual liberty and personal responsibility, I support his campaign for the GOP nomination. And during this early primary season (a time irrelevant to Libertarian Party politics nationally) I certainly am pleased to see so many who believe in libertarian principles supporting him and discussing his platform (he is obviously and by far the most liberty focused candidate, or should I say the only liberty focused candidate, amongst the two major political parties.)
I think Ron Paul He has done more for the cause of liberty in our nation than any other politician in our lifetime. I am grateful to see libertarian principles finally being widely discussed on a national level, and I am grateful for Dr. Paul's courage to speak and work tirelessly for the truth.
Thus, I take this opportunity to thank each of you, who due to your love of liberty are supporting Ron Paul, but who also are simultaneously supporting my LP campaign. Your beautiful emails and generous help have meant much to me! We are all supporting the same cause - liberty! I am grateful.
Christine Smith
libertythor
02-07-2008, 12:37 AM
If Paul receives ALL of the LP and AIP votes his percentage moves from 4.05% to 5.57%.
The LP and AIP are not going to make or break an election.
But that would have made a difference in Alaska and Montana. I am curious about the number of people in those states that decided not to affiliate with the GOP. Lets not forget Minnesota and Colorado.
5.57% looks a hell of a lot better than 4.05%! Imagine what an extra 1.52% would have done for us in Iowa. It could have meant some more delegates for the state convention....and then one or two more for the national convention.
I heard of several Libs in Raleigh, NC that wouldn't swith to Rep. to vote for Ron - EVERYONE of them could have been a precinct delegate
where I live - there wasn't even close to enough people to fill all the spots - the one time they get a chance to make a REAL difference,
and they won't even change partys to do it. It's Idiotic.
slantedview
02-07-2008, 01:12 AM
believe it or not, many hard core libertarians dislike Paul. Mostly the hardcore anarcho capitalist types. You really dont want them showing up to your BBQs anyway.
yea but what these douchebags don't realize, or won't admit to themselves, is ron still is a hell of a lot closer to their ideal candidate than anyone else, and probably the only real shot they'll have at getting a remotely libertarian president in the white house in their lifetimes.
libertarian4321
02-07-2008, 04:27 AM
I hate the LP.
I've been a Republican most of my life.
I've also been a Libertarian for several years.
To tell you the truth, I feel a LOT more comfortable in the Libertarian party. Sure, some of them are radical. They may lack pragmatism. However, I NEVER get enraged when I'm at a Libertarian gathering.
I can't say the same about the modern Republican Party- when I get around the neocon nutjobs who now dominate the party, I can only tolerate the "war, Jesus, war and more war" message for so long before I want to puke.
This is not the Republican Party that I grew up with- its a sick, sick bunch, totally out of touch with reality and with the American people.
I've rejoined the Republican Party ONLY to support Ron Paul. But I've got to tell you, if Ron Paul drops out of the race, I'm going back to the LP.
libertythor
02-07-2008, 05:35 AM
Straddle both. Try to get constitutionalists nominated for the Republicans in the various offices, and when one isn't on the ballot for a particular race.....vote Liberatarian or whoever fits the ideal.
I've been a Republican most of my life.
I've also been a Libertarian for several years.
To tell you the truth, I feel a LOT more comfortable in the Libertarian party. Sure, some of them are radical. They may lack pragmatism. However, I NEVER get enraged when I'm at a Libertarian gathering.
I can't say the same about the modern Republican Party- when I get around the neocon nutjobs who now dominate the party, I can only tolerate the "war, Jesus, war and more war" message for so long before I want to puke.
This is not the Republican Party that I grew up with- its a sick, sick bunch, totally out of touch with reality and with the American people.
I've rejoined the Republican Party ONLY to support Ron Paul. But I've got to tell you, if Ron Paul drops out of the race, I'm going back to the LP.
Voodoo
02-07-2008, 08:34 AM
Yesterday morning I had breakfast in Phoenix with the Chairman of the AZLP Platform Committee (who was wearing a Ron Paul hat, shirt, and campaign buttons and serves as the de facto manager of the Ron Paul HQ in Phoenix) and the former Chairman of the Maricopa County LP (who was wearing a Ron Paul Revolution t-shirt and has arguably done more nationwide for Ron Paul than anyone other than Ron Paul).
The topic of discussion was the fate of the Ron Paul HQ in Phoenix and what to do with the materials and capabilities assembled.
The unsurprising decision was to keep the HQ open at least through the general election both to serve as a national resource for the Ron Paul campaign and to support both Libertarian and Ron Paul Republican candidates for local, state, and federal offices.
I've been working out of this office for the last week and a half and the level and variety of activity in support of Ron Paul has blown my mind. I didn't bother to ask anyone's party affiliation as it was clear that the most active of this very active group were all long-time associates in one way or another with the LP.
These people have centered their lives around the Ron Paul campaign, and now that Super Tuesday is over you could expect that they would go back to another life and close their operation much as campaign offices have done in Iowa, NH, NV, and elsewhere where they are run by Republicans.
I can speak for, at least, the two gentlemen I had breakfast yesterday in response to the views in this thread that they are "dumbasses", "hypocrites", "stupid", or otherwise not doing everything their personal circumstances and principles allow them to do. It's the same response urged to Frank Luntz.
scooter
02-07-2008, 08:42 AM
If Ron Paul does run outside of the GOP, I hope it is either independent or for the Constitution Party. There are parts of the LP that I don't like and there are parts that don't like Ron Paul.
xerxesdarius
02-07-2008, 09:06 AM
Yesterday morning I had breakfast in Phoenix with the Chairman of the AZLP Platform Committee (who was wearing a Ron Paul hat, shirt, and campaign buttons and serves as the de facto manager of the Ron Paul HQ in Phoenix) and the former Chairman of the Maricopa County LP (who was wearing a Ron Paul Revolution t-shirt and has arguably done more nationwide for Ron Paul than anyone other than Ron Paul).
The topic of discussion was the fate of the Ron Paul HQ in Phoenix and what to do with the materials and capabilities assembled.
The unsurprising decision was to keep the HQ open at least through the general election both to serve as a national resource for the Ron Paul campaign and to support both Libertarian and Ron Paul Republican candidates for local, state, and federal offices.
I've been working out of this office for the last week and a half and the level and variety of activity in support of Ron Paul has blown my mind. I didn't bother to ask anyone's party affiliation as it was clear that the most active of this very active group were all long-time associates in one way or another with the LP.
These people have centered their lives around the Ron Paul campaign, and now that Super Tuesday is over you could expect that they would go back to another life and close their operation much as campaign offices have done in Iowa, NH, NV, and elsewhere where they are run by Republicans.
I can speak for, at least, the two gentlemen I had breakfast yesterday in response to the views in this thread that they are "dumbasses", "hypocrites", "stupid", or otherwise not doing everything their personal circumstances and principles allow them to do. It's the same response urged to Frank Luntz.
Truth. The meetup coordinator in San Diego is a long-time Libertarian that DIDN'T SWITCH PARTIES BECAUSE HE IS RUNNING FOR OFFICE AS A LIBERTARIAN. Nevertheless, he has put more time, money and sweat into the Ron Paul campaign than anyone in the county.
And for those that think Ron Paul supporters would not be comfortable in the Libertarian party, you need to rethink your party prejudices. I would join the goddamn green party if they advocated liberty.
Now I personally ache every minute that my registration remains Republican, but I think that the strategy of taking back the party is sound, so here I remain. GET OVER THE PARTY LABEL THING.
And sorry for the shouting, we are all good people, I know.
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