PDA

View Full Version : Why has noone mentioned that RP is doing 400-500% better in caucus states?




r3v07ution
02-05-2008, 10:47 PM
Ron Paul is doing so much better in caucus states than primaries...

2nd in Nevada
2nd (some say 1st) in Louisiana
19% in Maine


then all these caucuses tonight, yet I have yet to hear this mentioned...

Ron paul has not placed above last place in primaries. Nor has he placed last place in a caucus. This is fishy since there is a head count in a caucus and is not easily rigged like a blackbox vote primary....

alien
02-05-2008, 10:49 PM
Thank you. Finally someone who doesn't have their head up their ass!

ArrestPoliticians
02-05-2008, 10:50 PM
2 reasons:

#1 he campaigns there more

#2 Voting machines

I honestly think it is a combination of both.

Gadsden Flag
02-05-2008, 10:50 PM
Ron Paul is doing so much better in caucus states than primaries...

2nd in Nevada
2nd (some say 1st) in Louisiana
19% in Maine


then all these caucuses tonight, yet I have yet to hear this mentioned...

Ron paul has not placed above last place in primaries. Nor has he placed last place in a caucus. This is fishy since there is a head count in a caucus and is not easily rigged like a blackbox vote primary....

Come on, the box votes aren't rigged. If that's the case, then I guess the polls are rigged too.

It's because caucuses are more of an event and take more time/dedication to complete.

devil21
02-05-2008, 10:52 PM
People can convince other people who to vote for on-site. That doesnt happen at primaries.

scotto2008
02-05-2008, 10:53 PM
I have no doubt we've been cheated. I think it's a given. Not to say that we've won the hearts of the masses. But we've been cheated out of a big stepping stone.

Well duh. That's why I support Ron Paul.

bcreps85
02-05-2008, 10:55 PM
The difference is that caucuses are the dedicated people who actually do a little research and keep up with what's going on, for the most part. Primaries are idiots voting for whoever CNN/Fox/ABC/MSNBC told them to vote for.

Since we got a virtual blackout over the past few days these results don't surprise me...some people I've talked to actually thought that he had dropped out!!!

Rangeley
02-05-2008, 11:02 PM
Its all a matter of dedication. Primaries are easy, you can go whenever, vote, and leave. Caucuses are a little bit harder, you have to sit through speeches and attend the meeting, at a set time, and cast your vote in this manner. But then there is yet another aspect - delegates, which we have been outperforming our caucus numbers in, because it takes yet another level of dedication.

It has nothing to do with diebold, though I agree with peoples concerns that it is far too easy hacked into and tampered with. But using this as a scape goat to why we do better in caucuses and not in primaries is to miss whats really going on here.

RochesterRyan
02-05-2008, 11:03 PM
cause the campaign knew how to play the caucuses

Molly1
02-05-2008, 11:04 PM
Ron Paul is doing so much better in caucus states than primaries...

2nd in Nevada
2nd (some say 1st) in Louisiana
19% in Maine


then all these caucuses tonight, yet I have yet to hear this mentioned...

Ron paul has not placed above last place in primaries. Nor has he placed last place in a caucus. This is fishy since there is a head count in a caucus and is not easily rigged like a blackbox vote primary....

yeah we noticed this in Iowa and NH.

that's why we're recounting NH, remember?

If only we could keep up with Butch and Hoppy.:rolleyes:

Ex Post Facto
02-05-2008, 11:05 PM
Cuacuses don't have voting machines.

blakjak
02-05-2008, 11:06 PM
Its all a matter of dedication. Primaries are easy, you can go whenever, vote, and leave. Caucuses are a little bit harder, you have to sit through speeches and attend the meeting, at a set time, and cast your vote in this manner. But then there is yet another aspect - delegates, which we have been outperforming our caucus numbers in, because it takes yet another level of dedication.

It has nothing to do with diebold, though I agree with peoples concerns that it is far too easy hacked into and tampered with. But using this as a scape goat to why we do better in caucuses and not in primaries is to miss whats really going on here.

bingo!

TexMac
02-05-2008, 11:09 PM
Ron Paul is doing so much better in caucus states than primaries...

2nd in Nevada
2nd (some say 1st) in Louisiana
19% in Maine


then all these caucuses tonight, yet I have yet to hear this mentioned...

Ron paul has not placed above last place in primaries. Nor has he placed last place in a caucus. This is fishy since there is a head count in a caucus and is not easily rigged like a blackbox vote primary....


http://www.ronpaulforums.com/showthread.php?t=95497&highlight=goldwater+strategy

Pauls' Revere
02-05-2008, 11:09 PM
In a battle with British forces and his ship sinking beneath him, out-gunned, and out-numbered, the British Commander requested a full surrender from Captian Jones. His reply?

I HAVE NOT YET BEGUN TO FIGHT!

Captian John Paul Jones won the battle sinking the enemy man-o-war!

Never give up the ship!

Dr.3D
02-05-2008, 11:12 PM
Come on, the box votes aren't rigged. If that's the case, then I guess the polls are rigged too.

It's because caucuses are more of an event and take more time/dedication to complete.

Who says the polls are not rigged?
Oh yeah, I forgot, the main stream media reports they are not rigged.

ord33
02-05-2008, 11:14 PM
Its all a matter of dedication. Primaries are easy, you can go whenever, vote, and leave. Caucuses are a little bit harder, you have to sit through speeches and attend the meeting, at a set time, and cast your vote in this manner. But then there is yet another aspect - delegates, which we have been outperforming our caucus numbers in, because it takes yet another level of dedication.

It has nothing to do with diebold, though I agree with peoples concerns that it is far too easy hacked into and tampered with. But using this as a scape goat to why we do better in caucuses and not in primaries is to miss whats really going on here.

My name is .......... and I approve the message above.

Also, to the original poster. Dr. Paul is not in 4th or worse in all the states that have primaries. We've got 3rd in Utah because of their extreme dislike of Mike Huckabee...Although it is a measely 3% for Paul and 1.75% for Huckabee

Ronin
02-05-2008, 11:14 PM
Take Romney out of the picture and...

1st Nevada
1st Maine (most likely)
1st Louisiana
1st Montana
1st Alaska (TBD)

I would argue that we and Romney have the best organization. I think THIS is/was the master plan to get the needed 5 states.

Edit: I'm talking delegates and not straw poll

steve005
02-05-2008, 11:18 PM
bump, i was thinking the same thing

sharkcity
02-05-2008, 11:40 PM
I'd like to hear the FECs explaination why Ron gets more vote in paper ballot and caucus states. Clearly there's fraud!!

AmericanWayne
02-05-2008, 11:57 PM
Is it wrong that I am discouraged right now? I don't want to be a bad seed because I am truly committed to this but I'm a bit bummed out. :(

ValidusCustodiae
02-05-2008, 11:58 PM
Come on, the box votes aren't rigged. If that's the case, then I guess the polls are rigged too.

It's because caucuses are more of an event and take more time/dedication to complete.

If the polls aren't rigged, then how does a no name like Mitt Romney start out so high in them while Ron Paul starts out so low? Compare their name recognition before this race. Rigged is a nice way of putting it.

Grandson of Liberty
02-06-2008, 12:01 AM
Is it wrong that I am discouraged right now? I don't want to be a bad seed because I am truly committed to this but I'm a bit bummed out. :(

I would say it's okay to be disappointed, but don't be discouraged. Buck up, little camper, this is only the beginning!

As to the original question about caucus states, RP's success will probably just bring about an end to the caucus system! :eek: Can't have these "fringe" candidates finding success! :cool:

raiha
02-06-2008, 01:17 AM
If only we could keep up with Butch and Hoppy.
:D:D

I might go out and buy two rabbits for my grandson just so's i can call them Butch and Hoppy.
They might end up in a stew..but hayle, all's fair in love and war.

LibertyOfOne
02-06-2008, 01:19 AM
2 reasons:

#1 he campaigns there more

#2 Voting machines

I honestly think it is a combination of both.

Oh Jesus

Ex Post Facto
02-06-2008, 01:43 AM
I'd like to hear the FECs explaination why Ron gets more vote in paper ballot and caucus states. Clearly there's fraud!!

I think that is the best indication of at least vote mishandling, if not fraud.

ArrestPoliticians
02-06-2008, 01:45 AM
Oh Jesus

???

Molly1
02-06-2008, 01:50 AM
Is it wrong that I am discouraged right now? I don't want to be a bad seed because I am truly committed to this but I'm a bit bummed out. :(

Don't be discouraged.

Mccain and red states are like water and oil. They don't mix.

Huckabee won't get far lying and frying his squirrels in the northeast.

And, Romney is less conservative than Ron Paul when they are put side by side.

We are holding our own while the rest battle themselves to oblivion.

Maintain course. Hold her steady.

Ex Post Facto
02-06-2008, 01:51 AM
Some people hate hearing that there is a conspiracy. I define a conspiracy as anything that isn't the truth and is covered up. I don't know why the votes don't make sense, they just don't. And there are indicators that show when machines are used RP's votes are very low, versus paper voting or caucuses.

Molly1
02-06-2008, 01:55 AM
Some people hate hearing that there is a conspiracy. I define a conspiracy as anything that isn't the truth and is covered up. I don't know why the votes don't make sense, they just don't. And there are indicators that show when machines are used RP's votes are very low, versus paper voting or caucuses.

well we're trying to get to the bottom of that in NH, if only butch and hoppy would slow down to 80 mph....

ionlyknowy
02-06-2008, 02:41 AM
You dont have to write your name on the ballot... is it possible for the voting station people or someone else up the food chain to take a ballot, trash it, then fill out another in it's place for another candidate?

J Free
02-06-2008, 03:21 AM
Ron Paul is doing so much better in caucus states than primaries...

2nd in Nevada
2nd (some say 1st) in Louisiana
19% in Maine


then all these caucuses tonight, yet I have yet to hear this mentioned...

Ron paul has not placed above last place in primaries. Nor has he placed last place in a caucus. This is fishy since there is a head count in a caucus and is not easily rigged like a blackbox vote primary....

The reason he does better in caucus states than primaries is because primary states reinforce a top-down structure and caucus states are grassroots and bottom-up.

Primaries - Media coverage drives the sheep to the polls. And quite simply, it overwhelms everything else. No RP coverage means no RP sheep.

Caucus - Small organized groups can take over their neighborhood and work their way up the ladder - openly or stealthily.

RP never had a chance this year in any primary state - though they tried in NH. Nor will RP supporters make much headway in changing their state GOP in those states.

If you live in a primary state, find out when your county jobs/meetings are and when those elections occur. THOSE jobs will be caucus or convention driven. And next year or in 2010, well-organized supporters will overwhelm them - much as we did the straw polls last year.

IMO, one of the biggest problems with our grassroots was that we obsessed about the money bombs and sign waving. Thinking that that would buy us media coverage and name recognition. And we neglected the work of neighborhood canvassing/organizing, stealth politics, etc.

Ultimately, the RP message may be complicated for that portion of the population that is simply sheep. The answer is not to try to educate a sheep about monetary policy. The answer is to become the sheepdog.

Highstreet
02-06-2008, 03:29 AM
The reason he does better in caucus states than primaries is because primary states reinforce a top-down structure and caucus states are grassroots and bottom-up.

Primaries - Media coverage drives the sheep to the polls. And quite simply, it overwhelms everything else. No RP coverage means no RP sheep.

Caucus - Small organized groups can take over their neighborhood and work their way up the ladder - openly or stealthily.

RP never had a chance this year in any primary state - though they tried in NH. Nor will RP supporters make much headway in changing their state GOP in those states.

If you live in a primary state, find out when your county jobs/meetings are and when those elections occur. THOSE jobs will be caucus or convention driven. And next year or in 2010, well-organized supporters will overwhelm them - much as we did the straw polls last year.

IMO, one of the biggest problems with our grassroots was that we obsessed about the money bombs and sign waving. Thinking that that would buy us media coverage and name recognition. And we neglected the work of neighborhood canvassing/organizing, stealth politics, etc.

Ultimately, the RP message may be complicated for that portion of the population that is simply sheep. The answer is not to try to educate a sheep about monetary policy. The answer is to become the sheepdog.

Not to be negative, but watch them tie up those Caucus "loose ends", and change many of them to Primary states. The GOP and the DNC don't want a Populist getting thru the lines.

J Free
02-06-2008, 03:18 PM
Not to be negative, but watch them tie up those Caucus "loose ends", and change many of them to Primary states. The GOP and the DNC don't want a Populist getting thru the lines.

This is IMO one of the two biggest issues post-Ron Paul. And is a reason we must continue to canvass our neighborhoods even after the primary/caucus is over. The issue of primary v caucus is rather arcane for most people. But there is no question that the media will spin it so that primaries are "best" (while caucuses are "corrupt").

A few years ago here, both parties wanted to get rid of our caucus and move to a primary. They had the media coverage and managed to get it in a referendum. It was defeated by precinct captains - in both parties - walking around their precinct advising their neighbors that this proposal would destroy their individual voice.

Even so, most "primary" states still have some bottom-up grassroots party relic in place. Whether it is county conventions or off-year caucuses, there has to be SOME way for individuals/activists to gather officially because that's the only way you can run a party organization.

Those relics are rusty. So dust them off with some friends - and figure out how to up-end your state party from the bottom-up. Go local. The benefit is that you won't have to deal with the overt hostility that you get when "Ron Paul" is mentioned. It is hard to oppose "bringing active people into the party".